Do narcissistic people know they are like this?

[Theydontwantme]

Do they think that they are the same as everyone else? Do they realise that they are always thinking about their needs and how and who to get them from? They appear to meet some people’s needs so they know they should but it’s always because they get something in return. I just don’t understand how they don’t know what they are???? Surely after a while you’ll realise you are selfish.

explains why they are totally confused when you don’t respond in the way they anticipated

My mother is the same. Even when I have written proof that something happened - her own fucking diary from the time, FFS - she will still deny it!

Like others on here, she has never said sorry in the whole 57 years I've known her. She has zero empathy for other people, has zero self knowledge and is incredibly difficult to be around.

I think all you can do is put as much distance between yourself and the narc as you can comfortably deal with. In my case it was 13000 miles! I'm very low contact with my mother, haven't actually seen her in nearly 17 years.

@OnlyOnAFriday

How tragic that all her children were so selfish they couldn’t be bothered with her, how unfortunate she was to have had awful neighbours at every home she ever had, awful bosses at every job. She would rewrite history. I told her once how awful my childhood was and I do think for a second she looked shocked….but she was only shocked that I could think something so untrue. No recognition or awareness that actually i might be right. She had no empathy, truly didn’t care about others, was just incapable of that sort of thought process.

I've had the exact same experience. My mother now wonders why none of her 3 children have given her grandchildren...

Very good. Good for you! 👍

My dad is almost definitely one. I’ve had many years to reflect on his behaviour, and some counselling to boot. He was convinced he would become an actor so moved down south to achieve this when I was a young child. It never happened, obviously because pretty much no one makes it and to be frank he isn’t very talented. He had a few extra parts and crappy adverts but even those dried up when he hit his 40s. He seriously thought he was going to be Morgan Freeman and make it in his mid 40s. Huge, huge ego. Loved talking about himself. The world 100% revolved around him.

I couldn’t see this as a child and thought he was amazing. Why wouldn’t I really, he was the fun weekend dad who bought me absolutely everything I asked for. When I was 18 he started making excuses not to see me- various random illnesses and injuries. Eventually I snapped and asked what on earth his issue was and I insulted him for running away from his responsibilities to follow a pipe dream. Well, lo and behold he wouldn’t speak to me again.

I reached out to him when I was about 23/24 because DH said I should reconcile for DC’s sake, who he had never met. He spent the whole time talking about himself, how his acting hadn’t gone to plan so he was now directing but thinking about doing a masseuse course too. Fuck off. He’s recently self published two really shit books in quick succession which have clearly been written by AI. I’m a lecturer, I read AI garble all of the time so know.

They are centre stage at all times. They cannot handle any criticism whatsoever and think the world owes them something. They crave limelight and literally don’t care about anyone unless they can extract something from them- even if that’s just an ego boost.

Why did he make excuses to not see you after buying you everything you wanted. Why change? Do they not like kids as they age?

I've noticed with mine, they can't take criticism at all. They criticise others relentlessly. But if you take issue with something, or say something back they turn really shitty and discard you.

But like mine then. I started to ask why don’t you visit and expect everyone to go to you. Why are you always talking about other people and what they have and saying nasty things about them.

Can anyone explain why there are people out there who absolutely think that my family are amazing because my mum will do good things for other people just not us? I haven’t really heard of anyone saying she is bad, in-fact I think they are very well renowned in the community in a positive way. But when it comes to her children and grandchildren it’s like we don’t exist. I don’t get it? It’s the best attention and the warmest love from your family.

Everything is for show. They are desperate to be admired. They care more about how things look to others than how things feel for their own dc. IME they're often in health jobs and often help charities. It isn't about wanting to do good or help people. It's all about being admired. Having status in a community. They couldn't care less what their own dc think of them. Which is so strange really. Some people see through it I think.

Spot on. That was my grandmother.

By the time I was in my mid 20s I had an understanding of what she was. Although there was no label for it.

I married young to escape a toxic environment and wouldn’t you know, I was to find that I had married a man much like my grandmother.

Doesn’t everyone do things because in a way it makes them feel good? You would think that spending time with your children and grandchildren who would absolutely admire you would tick that box wouldn’t it? Or is that not enough people? Honestly I have found it so confusing because yes mine helps the community housing charity amongst other things but when it comes to us, nothing. I used to admire her, but I don’t anymore. She is all for everyone and wants to be know in the community before anything else.

I think it was because I was older so more inclined to see through his bullshit, which I did. He’d noticed it as I was a teen more and more so reduced contact slowly until it was just birthdays and Christmas (when he could just throw lots of gifts my way and hope that was enough to keep me quiet). When I became an actual adult, I guess he was afraid I would call him out and wanted to dodge it. Remember they can’t handle criticism whatsoever so any inclination somebody is going to do this and they cut and run. Then I did call him out so he did exactly that. He even wrote the pipe dream criticism in his AI book. Didn’t credit me with it but you know, it still gets to him 15 years on!

It’s all about protecting their ginormous egos. They’re also only interested in people if they serve them in some way. I served him as a child because I was young, naive and thought he was amazing so kissed his arse a lot.

I am wondering if one of my closest friends has traits of narcissism. Not to the extent of a disorder (like some people have traits of ADHD without meeting diagnostic criteria I’m sure one can have traits of narcissism).
She has fallen out with so many people over the years, and always blames that person rather than maybe look to see what she has done. She def expects a lot from others without putting in the leg work herself (my dh gets annoyed she asks for lifts all the time even though she drives, esp as I cant drive due to medical reasons - he is kind to me and he’ll drop me off if he’s around but I also like to be independent). It’s hard to explain and it makes me look like a bitch, but she is the common denominator in these scenarios. I spoke to my then-therapist about it and she said I should be boundaried and I’ve def tried to do that. It’s great when I see her most of the time, but at other times I feel a sort of anxious dread.

Like other posters have said, it's all for show. My mother is what I call a 'performative parent' - she will act the Perfect Catholic Mother if she has an audience ... for the first 9 years of my life it was her family she was doing it for. We then moved abroad with my father's job and she basically just stopped.

Even when she was in 'performative' mode it was very limited - myself and my two brothers were actively discouraged from taking part in any ex-curricular activities, we weren't allowed to bring school friends home (or go to their houses) or have hobbies. School holidays were insanely boring, it was either sitting around the house or roaming the neighbourhood - the only place my stay at home mother took us was to do the weekly supermarket food shopping, and that was only so we could carry the bags. We all loved swimming but my mother couldn't so that was out. She also didn't drive (made out my father wouldn't 'let' her learn).

"You would think that spending time with your children and grandchildren who would absolutely admire you would tick that box wouldn’t it"

It doesn't, because frankly, to them our admiration is taken for granted - they don't 'need' to do anything to earn it, it is automatically their God given right...their mere existence in our lives has earnt them that. So they don't need to do anything that to them is 'extra' - like actually spending quality time with us.

So really they aren’t interested in being parents and grandparents and never were. Why bother having children if they want it all about themselves? I did used to think mine were people to be admired because other people admired them. But then I saw other families and realised mine do absolutely nothing with us. They go away on their own, they don’t do day trips or days out, they never come to our house. What is there to admire……the fact she can plant community flowers or help the local residents??? I mean those things are nice but then why neglect your actual family!

My mother had children because that is what the Perfect Catholic Woman does....and that's the image she wanted/wants to portray.

But the reality is that I don't think my mother actually likes children much - I don't, but I have self knowledge (and the guts) to admit it. I wasn't going to have children to impress anyone, I didn't feel the need to...so I didn't. Neither have my two brothers, btw.

The hardest thing for me as adult has been accepting that my whole (rotten) childhood was a facade (and a farce). My father hadn't actually wanted children in the first place, and my mother was filled with anger and resentment that he 'escaped' working abroad when the 3 of us were so young.

Narcissism with a small 'n' is a spectrum like any other human trait - it is quite common. Actual diagnoses of clinical narcissism are more unusual.

It is sad. I have children and yeah it’s hard and yeah there are things we can’t do anymore but there are so many new things we can do. They never asked to be born and I absolutely love spending time with them.

I really do think we were just my mum going along with what she should do. She just wants our admiration for what a stand up human she is (to everyone else). She must appear to everyone to be such a selfless amazing person but to us she is absent. We all left in our late teens to support ourselves. She was too busy supporting her image in the community. I bet to lots of people I sound like a terrible daughter for not thinking she is great.

I think that’s because it’s quite easy to hide in a society like ours and of course because it’s everyone else’s fault. If they have a problem then just find someone else, they don’t worry about what they have done to anyone.

Yes, we live in a society that actually rewards negative traits like narcissism

If there's one thing I've learned it's that what other people think is totally irrelevant - only the child knows what it was like to be parented by their parent. Bad parents are often thought to be wonderful by everyone else.

Could resonate with your entire post. So sad . Sorry this has happened to you too.

This is true in my opinion.

As these parents come to the end of their lives most, if not all, of the ‘admirers’ have dropped away. Then the children are expected to step in and care for them in old age. If the children don’t, the parent will bemoan their loneliness and complain about their children neglecting them.

Narcissism doesn't necessarily mean mentally ill though - it's a human trait on a spectrum, just like empathy. Some people have more of it than others. Clinically diagnosed narcissism of the kind involved in a personality disorder is more extreme and wouldn't apply to most people.