He just found my copy of 'Why does he do that'

[Needingadvice05]

In my bag... how do I handle it?

Well he acts like an abuser so you know, he's not wrong.

He sounds absolutely horrible, OP.
Hope you're safe, and that the children are too.

I suspect he'll be one of those men that make lots of threats but don't actually follow through because it'd mean actually having to do something.

Your descriptions have plenty of red flags. I'd consider abusive. He is furious as he has been rumbled and doesn't want to be called out / feel threatened and therefore lose control of the situation/you.

'you live in a fantasy land.. if you think I'm controlling, I don't want to be with you.. if you think I'm a gaslighter.. I don't want to be with you.. if you think I'm aggressive.. I don't want to be with you... '

So he doesn't want to be with you. He doesn't want to be with you. He doesn't want to be with you. That means he's made the decision to leave, right?

But no, later quote says he isn't actually leaving.

What's going on there? Why is he repeatedly saying he doesn't want to be with you, but not leaving?

What does he want you to do? That's obvious, he wants you to do whatever he says, subserviently, and never criticise him again.

From the quotes above, this guy isn't even marginal, just straight-out manipulative and controlling. Your other post describes a lot of controlling behaviour also.

Please follow the advice about assuming he may be dangerous. This guy believes he has the right to dictate what you do, and even what you think. That's scary.

Yes. OP is deep in it though, she can’t see this yet. She’s too worried about appeasing and prostrating herself to apologise for having such a book…

The man is a monster.

It would probanly be wise to split up. You've been thinking about it and now your partner has said he does't want to be with someone who thinks of him or sees him as an abuser.

If there was absolutely no doubt re your relationship he would not react like this. I'm thinking of previous relationships I've been in. If either of my partners had asked about this they would have been surprised but not sulking. I have not been in an abusive relationship but I have thought about reading it myself to try to avoid possible abusive behaviour in the future. Your safety is paramount OP

Hey @Needingadvice05.
how care things today?
Has he apologised? Promised he’s going to change?
I get the impression that you don’t appreciate the situation you are in.
You seem to pity those of us who have been through similar to what you’re going through now.
What are your thoughts? Will you stay? Hope he will see the error of his ways?

Thankyou for checking in @user12345678901234
my head has been all over the place.

We had couples therapy yesterday which was awful and has just left me second guessing myself. I feel like I'm just obsessing now about everything and what's ok/ not ok- I'm too sensitive...?

I also spoke to a very good friend today who has one of the strongest relationships with a partner that I know of...they love each other deelply...I asked 'what's the worst things you've ever said
to your partner' She said 'I have called him a fucking idiot' but she said it in a 'no big deal' kind of a way... I'm so confused... my friend is very far from an abusive person...so maybe my own DH wasn't abusive for calling me a f*ing moron...

I know it's one thing among other things but my head is spinning and I'm finding it very hard to understand, make sense of what's ok, what's not and if I'm just making a big deal of everything...

The bottom line OP is are you happy? Forget wondering if you're too sensitive just worry about are you happy with the way he treats you? It's clear he's never going to change and you deserve to be happy. So are you happy?

@Tam285when things are good between us I am x

Why was couples therapy awful?

@subwaystop I've been trying to think how to explain it but maybe this helps better - this comes from a recent email from the therapist : 'it's a negative cycle that takes over. The cycle itself is the problem, not either of you individually.'

'The key is not proving who is right or wrong — but working together against the cycle'

It looks like he seems to think his behaviour is ok...

From the couples therapist?

I'm sure I'm Why Does He Do That, the author explains why couples therapy is unsuitable in an abusive relationship.

Here we are.

https://marriagerecoverycenter.com/couples-counseling-doesnt-work-for-emotional-abuse/

Thankyou @NettleandBramblethis is very helpful to read xx

@Needingadvice05 bloody good job in recognising that dynamic in the counselling.

Sorry @NettleandBramble not sure what you mean??

@Needingadvice05 your OH is abusing you, which is why you’re so confused. It’s part of the abuse. @NettleandBramble points out that couples’ counselling shouldn’t be undertaken in cases with abuse, because they can manipulate the counsellor and make the counselling work against you.

I was where you are now. It’s a horrible place to be and so damaging. I do hope you can get out and find a peaceful life for you and your children.

He sounds absolutely terrifying.
Counselling with an abusive partner is never recommended.
Please contact Women's aid.
He sounds so nasty and unstable.
Tell your family the truth.
We are here for you.

Thankyou @DoubtfulCat I'm sorry to hear you experienced it also. I'm so glad to hear you are in a better place now xx

When you'd said the counselling was awful and gave this as an example "it's a negative cycle that takes over. The cycle itself is the problem, not either of you individually.'

'The key is not proving who is right or wrong — but working together against the cycle'"

You had already picked up that it wasn't appropriate. Which is really healthy to have recognised.

Did you consider the context?

Her therapist, a professional with actual insight to this person’s life has recommended that book.

And you’ve come on here gaslighting that person that may be her partner, who’s clearly not interested in communicating, is not that abusive and it’s her fault she didn’t confront him before reading a book. You’re too keen to defend men, as a man. At what expense- there’s a real person, who is already being punished with silent treatment, on the other side of this!

I can only hope you’re not a farther of a girl.

Having caught up with the thread, I’ll say a wife calling her husband names is completely different to a man doing it (and regularly) - she’s not scared of her husband, she feels truly equal.

Could you call your dh ‘a f idiot’?

Editing to add, did you share with your friend about the other things (they do sound classically abusive) and if you did, what was her reaction?

@Needingadvice05Based on what you’ve said I am surprised that your counsellor has agreed to continue seeing you as a couple. Have I understood that correctly?
As soon as I talked about my ex H abusive behaviour in our first Relate session, the counsellor wouldn’t see us as a couple again.
As for being happy. When my ex was behaving himself and not treating me badly, I was deliriously happy . But with hindsight I think I was just relieved that he wasn’t abusing me. The periods of calm in between his rants/moods were often great. I stayed because I thought he’d changed, realised how bad his behaviour was. Then he would start the abuse all over again. And so the cycle continued.
The verbal abuse you’ve described is not the same as your friend called her husband a “fucking idiot”. If I’d have said that to my ex, all hell would have broken loose. I once rolled my eyes at him and he punched me. That will be you.

This is the danger with couples counselling when abuse is involved. I have been through it myself. No wonder you are confused. Be careful as it might be used by your partner to manipulate and gaslight you further. And many couples counselors surprisingly have not been trained to spot the signs of abuse and the signs of unequal power in a relationship. I don’t think so much it’s ever the cycle that is a problem as your couples counselor said (that’s very basic thinking) but the moral compass of a person. What is the other person’s limit in terms of what they view morally as right or wrong? In my ex partner’s case, when he wanted to win an argument, he lost all sense of right and wrong. Whereas I wouldn’t. I always wanted to do the “right” thing.