Would a drop-off nanny make me a bad parent? Huge argument with wife

[ExhaustedFather]

One of the big advantages of my current job is that I get more flexibility than most, so I do all the school drop offs, and I can almost always attend all the school events, sports days, school plays, etc.

Unfortunately my job is at risk and there is the risk that I may be fired.
Many other jobs in my sector would have less flexibility.

I approached the matter with my wife.
I explained the possibility of ending up in a less flexible job.
I clarified that I would of course do all I can to retain flexibility and to continue doing the drop offs, but there's the chance I may be unable, in which case I would like to consider a childminder or nanny for the drop offs (breakfast club is full).

She went ballistic.
She started accusing me that I don't even want to try to ask for flexibility in a new job, that I'm a bad parent for even considering letting a stranger do the drop offs, that she's incredibly disappointed in me, that we have different priorities, that family is her priority but not mine, etc.

I was honestly left speechless.

I gave her numerous examples of people we know who took a very long time to find another job, or who use grandparents and childminders for the drop offs, and her only reply was: "but then why can such and such do it"

She then accused me that I am greedy because I don't want a lower-paying job with more flexibility, and that we could also live in a smaller house. (My income is multiple times hers)

I told her she was being unfair, offensive and out of touch.

She seems to think that, at the touch of a button, I could choose any job I want with any combination I want of pay and flexibility. It's not like that at all.

It doesn't help that she has chosen to delegate all things financial to me. No, I don't mind, yes she does a lot of other things, but this means she literally has no clue how much our mortgage is, how much we spend every month on groceries, how we much spent last year on holiday, when we have to renegotiate the mortgage and if it will be a higher or lower amount, etc.
No, I don't hide anything from her, it's all in a joint account she never checks.

My point is that she's not in the position to make informed comments on how much we spend, what we could cut back on, and what salary we would therefore need.

She seems to have this idealistic, out of touch idea that money is never important and that I can always find a job that lets me drop the kids off and pay the bills.

Am I such a bad parent for even considering a drop off nanny?
Should I have approached the matter differently?

THE TYRANNY OF THE MORNING SCHOOL RUN. Your wife sounds absolutely bonkers.

@Witchling you cannot figure out my job (and seem inclined to believe I may be lying or exaggerating? ). May I please ask you how much you know about high paying careers?

I tend not to be opinionated on topics and sectors I am not familiar with. But that's just me.

My husband earns very well. He's responsible for my daughter between wake-up and 9am. If this had to change, I'd be very upset and happy to downsize home or do whatever to make sure he still had her in the morning. I'd sound unreasonable too. The reason I'd be willing to die on this hill is that other than those 2 hrs in the morning, my daughter is basically my sole responsibility. His work always comes first. Is this the case for your wife?

On the face of it obviously YANBU but her reaction seems so disproportionate that it does feel like something substantive is behind it.

I am thinking that maybe the drop off is the one regular time you have with the DCs during the day. This path you have created where you earn as much as possible in the next 5-7 years ( which coincides with your DCs being young) , is your DW actually bought into this ? Sounds like you plan to focus on your career first now and then take a step back roughly when most of the hands on caring needs go away. I am sure it’s coincidental but it’s hard on your family.

As others have said, put them down for breakfast club waiting list . I am sure the deposit isn’t huge if you end up not using it and it gives you options.

Then arrange babysitting and go out for a meal with your DW. Ask her how she sees the future, what changes she would like to see and try to listen to her answers to arrange a future you can both agree on.

That still doesn't explain why you wont engage with your wife in any discussion of work life balance. It's obvious that the use of childcare in the morning isn't the issue. It's that you fully anticipate diving into another (I'm assume current flexibility is a relatively recent thing, correct me if I'm wrong) demanding job, and she has to put up and shut up. She's telling you that the current balance is more important to her than you maintaining your big salary.
You need to have a proper, open minded conversation with her about both of your goals and priorities and work on a joint plan. That usually means some compromise from both of you. You maintaining your BIG job whether it works for the family or not, is not that.

It is not as extreme as in your case.
She does more but I don't do only the drop offs.
I don't even want to get into the details because many posters have shown they will crucify me regardless, so what's the point.

Yes, there is a risk I may in the future have less flexibility than now.
Yes, that sucks.

But what can we realistically do about it is the proper question.

I get the impression that too many posters have a romanticised view of how easy it is to find the job you want. It's not like there is a direct relationship between hours and pay. It's not like you can choose: OK, 15% less pay for 15% fewer hours.

In fact, many jobs further down the food chain have fewer hours but are less flexible, especially in the morning. Not to mention that "downgrading" your job is always hard, because people will think you won't stay around long.

You realise we are mostly women here right? We know all about putting careers on hold for the sake of the kids. You just don't want to.

You’ve ignored / haven’t responded to the main thrust of my post so it appears you’re more interested in being right, and achieving compliance from your wife, rather than resolving your issue in a company able way. “Would you rather be right or be happy” springs to mind.

You put words in my mouth, accuse me of falsehood I have never said nor implied, and when I point it out you continue to attack me.

Please ignore me and leave me alone.
Thank you very much.

Come on OP, this is a mother's forum and you're mansplaining how difficult it is to get a flexible job. Mothers in the UK are paid less or unable to find full time employment because of childcare responsibilities. No one has a 'romantisised' view of it in our pretty little heads.

Perhaps lower-paid jobs will have less flexibility and you won't be able to do drop-offs, but overall I'm sure you'd be able to participate more in parenting and house upkeep as there will be less pressure on you.
If your wife is willing to give up an affluent lifestyle to have you doing more with kids, there's a reason for this. Money really isn't everything.
My husband runs his own business. It makes him a lot of money but demands a lot of time. I'd genuinely prefer if he took a 9-5 in his field knowing he'd earn only 15-20% of what he currently takes home. My day-to-day would be so much better. We'd still be able to afford a decent home and pay the bills but more importantly, we'd be parenting in more of a 50/50 way and getting to enjoy raising our daughter more.

Can you get her to post her view on the issue here and we will referee because her attitude sounds crazy i wonder what she has to say for herself

Men and women both get a hard time on here when they’re so intractable and refuse to engage with constructive criticism. Posters are attempting to show you other perspectives and suggest other paths to resolution. Simply digging your heels in is unlikely to be the answer.

She rarely spends money on herself.

I can well imagine the reverse of this post.

OP: My husband earns 10 times my salary and expects me to do the great bulk of the housework, childcare, and mental load despite me also working full time. I have three young children, two of them have SEN and I am almost at breaking point as I am working shifts in an understaffed NHS ward on top of almost solely caring for the children and house for the past 10 years.

After reaching crisis level last year my husband agreed for a cleaner once a week however this is the tip of the iceberg of the work that needs doing. My husband doesn’t lift a finger around the house, he says he just doesn’t see mess in the same way I do. After paying my share of the bills all of my salary goes on clothing and things for the children. My husband says he wants all his salary to go towards the mortgage however he is happy to finance expensive holidays and gadgets for himself. When I’ve attempted to discuss finances with him previously he ridicules the suggestions I make and says I don’t have a clue about how things work so I don’t bother anymore.

We had an awful argument this morning and I feel awful as I lost my temper. It felt like the last straw as he says he is planning to look for a new job even if it means he loses his current flexibilities in the morning. He currently does the school run with the kids which is the only set childcare he does all week. He is suggesting getting a nanny to cover this task. He is worried about prospects with his current employer but I don’t understand why is considering jumping ship prematurely. This is pretty much the only time he has with them as he usually works late and gets home after their bedtime. What should I do?

Mumsnet: LTB

To be blunt @ExhaustedFather ignored my earlier post that while he's on this finite gravy train overpay the mortgage, save, save, save so there's a good cushion when he gets the boot.

Frankly he's unable to budget too.

@MiloMinderbinder925

That's exactly what I have been doing!
I don't need a high paying job because I change my Porsche every 3 years. Our car is 10 years old. I want a high paying job because we have a big mortgage and because I am saving as much as possible for the entire family. This includes junior ISAs for the family and pension contributions for my wife.

We have certainly saved more than most families can, but it doesn't mean this money is enough for us to retire now nor to live on minimum wage.

Of course it's not unreasonable to have a pre and post school nanny / arrangement with a reliable person to take the kids to school . Thousands of people do this.
If your wife wants all child related care done only by the two of you, then the reality is that it is not possible.
I'd be asking why she is having such a strong reaction given they are presumably able bodied and verbal children able to articulate any issues. Has she huge trust issues where the kids are concerned?

You confirm all the worst stereotypes of mumsnet.
The fact that you felt compelled to write a short fiction story, which has nothing to do with my case, but that creates a hypothetical scenario where the man is always to blame and the woman is the unsung heroine of the situation really says everything about your prejudices.

Thank you for confirming that it is impossible to post on this forum about a situation where a woman might be in the wrong, because the few sensible comments which will be posted will be hugely outnumbered by the snarky, judgmental, angry comments of bitter women who know nothing about the situation but will a propri judge that the man is always to blame.

I can only feel sorry for you and for whatever in your life may have led you to this.

No need to feel sorry for me. I have a great relationship with my partner, we don’t have blow up arguments about potential job / life changes. We’re able to discuss and hear each others perspectives. I’m also able to take critique from others when I post on mumsnet and adjust my perspective in response to others input.

I suppose you are similarly defensive and combative and not listening with your wife. It's making more and more sense to me why she "went ballistic".

Most of us here are rightfully very wary of men popping up with stories about their apparently unreasonable wife. Because we've learned that what they really want is a head-pat from other women and a bunch of poor-OP posts that they can show their beleaguered wife. They don't want to hear about the wife's possible POV - which could improve communication between the OP and their wife - no, they want to be validated in their victimised feeling and to weaponise that validation against their wife.

We see this all the time here, you are not the first.

I advise you to go back to the posts that irked and stung you the most, quench your immature instinct to defend yourself, and really listen to what those PPs are saying.

Scrap the junior ISAs. Pay down your mortgage. It's the biggest monkey on your back. It's a legal obligation your wife's employer to pay into her pension. If they don't, report them and find a better employer.

My son earned like this in the oil industry, bought a house, carried on saving, bought another. Oil industry went kaput but between he and his wife they have three homes.

I still think @ExhaustedFather is financially illiterate. The mortgage rate is what it is. You're free to change mortgage providers, they'll love him on his present salary. Not so much when his income drops.

Sorry all but it does make me cross when people don't shop around more.

There's an interesting post from OP back in 2018, where he says "Maybe if I were a stay at home dad things would be different, but neither that nor getting a 9-5 job closer to home are realistic options for now.".
So clearly this recent flexibility has been fairly short lived and his wife, quite reasonably I think, doesn't want to go back to a life where him working 9-5 is unrealistic. I can't say I blame her. It sounds exhausting all round.

Her attitude sounds crazy? What attitude, being extremely money conscious, spending nothing on herself and preferring to downsize their home to something more modest if it meant her DH missing out on family life and being an involved father?

If I were financially illiterate I wouldn't be in the job I have now. Scrap the junior ISAs? What does that even mean? You can stop contributing more in the future but you cannot "scrap" existing ISAs

There are various schools of thought on paying down the mortgage vs investing the equivalent amount.

Thinking that having "3 homes" and paying down your mortgage is always the best option is typical of those who are financially illiterate.

I'd be most curious about the thought process that has led you to conclude ao must be financially illiterate, though...

Shopping around more? What does that even mean? What would be my fault with not shopping around more and where would you have inferred it from?

If you have read the thread, you will have seen that I acknowledged and thanked the poster who commented on how my wife is probably worried that her burden will increase, especially if my job hasn't always been this flexible. That's not exactly my definition of not listening.

But being accused of absolute nonsense and falsehoods?
Being accused of calling her ignorant (never done that!), of being financially illiterate etc???
If you have the patient of a Buddhist tibetan monk and don't bat an eyelid when people accuse you of falsehoods (which is different from disagreeing) I applaud your character.

It grates because it is quite offensive to be accused of doing tlthe exact opposite of what you're doing and not to see all your efforts recognised.