Leaving DH to get a break or stick it out? Going a bit mad!

[arealliveknight]

Hopefully this won’t be ridiculously long.

DH and I have two children, aged four and coming up for two (twenty months.) He works full time and is usually away Tuesday morning to Thursday night, but he is sometimes away all week. I work three days a week. I’m a teacher so I do have some work outside of school as well.

I have tried to talk to DH about this so many times and nothing changes. Now spring is coming he decides essential jobs need doing around the house. I honestly don’t know anyone else with this age of children who takes them out solo as much as me at weekends. If I go through last weekend for example, we all went out for the day on Saturday as I’d won tickets to a lambing event at the local farm. Then on Sunday he did take DS to a sports class he did but I had DD all morning. This invariably happens when we divide and conquer: he gets DS who is four and pretty easy and I get DD, who just by her age is much harder work, then home for lunch and then I took them out for the afternoon. We were about from one o clock until about twenty to four so nearly four hours. However, it’s still not enough so I’m left to bath them and get them into bed solo. Finally do this, get downstairs about half seven and I start clearing up (I know people will say not to but you do have to sometimes and I hate mess) and then have to start marking some books and planning some lessons for the next day.

If this was a one off OK, but it isn’t, it’s how things are. Last weekend I had DD all morning and took her to Costco and then I took them to a party in the afternoon. Then Sunday again I had DD in the morning while DH had DS and in the afternoon took them on a nature walk the local wildlife trust organised. Weekend before that I had them all day Saturday and all day Sunday, to a farm on Saturday and then on Sunday to a park and to feed the ducks then for new shoes. I won’t go on, I’m sure everyone gets the picture. That’s on top of the fact I do all the cooking, washing, nursery runs and pretty much everything child related.

It is grindingly relentless. DD woke twice last night and I’ve got them all day today and it’s wet. I’ll probably take them out to soft play or something but it’s still a long day.

I know people will say to talk to DH and I’ve tried, so many times. It’s impossible; you don’t get anywhere. He focuses on the minutiae of the situation rather than the bigger picture (‘yeah well the grass really needed mowing and that hedge was out of control’) rather than the bigger picture. I don’t have the energy to keep trying to be honest.

So - do I stick it out? Or do I say sod it. I know that’s only a question I can answer. I keep thinking things will be easier in a few months; DS will be at school. The two years after that DD starts and maybe things will get better. But I’ll still have them all school holidays and all weekend and all the time, no break. I love them, I don’t not want them here but I have absolutely no time for me at all. Any free time I do get when they’re in bed I just spend charging around doing jobs or school work.

DH isn’t a bad man although I get I haven’t sold him here. He is lazy and a bit selfish. But day to day we get on well; he does love the children and they love him. I don’t want that to change. But something has to, I’m just not sure what.

Does he know, have you said explicitly, that you're considering leaving over this? Have you thought about relationship counselling, or would you?

No, he’s never agree to it, we can’t afford it and we don’t have anyone to have the children.

He doesn't WANT to do stuff with the children and you. He doesn't WANT to do stuff with the children

He doesn't WANT or CHOOSE to be a proactive and involved husband and parent

There's nothing you can do about this ^ because he is actively choosing not to be involved in family life

You could take a day on the weekend for you and spend 8 hours away from the house, forcing him to step up as a father....although not as a husband

But this ^ isn't what you want

You want HIM to change and become an interested, motivated, involved, joining in husband and father

He won't because he doesn't want to

What can you do about this?

Well......you can't change HIM unless he chooses to change. And he won't.

So.....you've got to make choices for you, KNOWING he wont change

Ex DP also insists I don't appreciate the amount of work he did. The problem is that while I didn't know exactly what he was doing I did know exactly how long it was took him, as I was looking after two young children on my own for all that time. Plus the time it took him to go for a lovely hot shower or went for a nap, or went to the DIY shop and stopped for a coffee on the way home. And when he was too exhausted to get up early on a Sunday or go out with us after all his jobs on the Saturday, because that was so much harder than my looking after two pre schoolers.

Well - that is what I’m trying to do @sugarspiceandeverythingnice12 and that’s what the threads about.

I get it.

unfortunately you have to focus on what you CAN control. You can’t control his behaviour, you correctly recognise a little chat won’t help.

so what can you do:

cut down your own tasks (don’t do his washing or iron his shirts, find easy meals for the kids)

book the 4 year old into Saturday morning classes where you don’t have to stay & can take the younger one to Costa.

TAKE your time out. Don’t wait for him to give it. Get up on Sunday morning, plop the baby on his pillow and LEAVE THE HOUSE. Run, walk, gym, library, breakfast with a friend - doesn’t matter what you do. Even a solo supermarket trip would be better than nothing as you get into the zone. He will step up when you’re not there - it’s when you’re there that he knows he doesn’t have to. Make sure youre gone long enough to have a break and then go back home happy to take the kids to the park or whatever. Do it every week.

Find a Monday evening class to do before he leaves for the week? Arrange to go the cinema on Friday night with a friend.

overall just disengage. Do fun stuff without him, with or without the kids. But most importantly, leave him to handle the kids more often. And it will only work if you actually leave the house

Exactly. I know.

So knowing all that (that I've said) what are your options?

It's almost as though you're asking for permission to end the marriage

If you can't afford relationship counselling you certainly can't afford divorce. You might tell him that, and suggest he book a babysitter.

(I know I may sound as though I'm against you here. It's that your frustrations are so, so typical and nothing you've said so far makes your DH sound like a bad man - just a typically clueless one. Is it sad that so many men are clueless? Yes. However, I think MN can be too keen to recommend women leave and it isn't always the best thing, for them or for their children.)

I disagree. I have 2 under 2 and my husband isn't always landing them on me, while he does some random not very essential job. We negotiate who does what around the house and who cares for the children. Plus what is the priority of jobs

I think a lot of men find excuses to do other things when the dc's are little as they don't want to cope with them alone. Dh used to go off golfing every Sunday morning, this was as well as being in the office 12 hours a day. I made sure I went off for girls nights out and left them with him when I went shopping etc.

Also if you leave him there's no guarantee he'll have the kids - it often tails off to nothing especially when they meet someone new. And there's nothing you can do about it. Have seen this happen loads of times.

Whatever the task are, its clearly an avoidance tactic by him to get out of doing more with the kids.

One of my favourite Mumsnet posts ever was by a woman who decided not to get up one morning. She usually took full responsibility for their DC in the morning, running around like a fly, but had a day off one day and just…didn’t. Apparently her DH was wandering around bewildered, pleading for help.

Your DH gets the mental break of going away most weeks. I think you need to take a full 24 hours off, every month or so. Book into a hotel, eat, sleep and just recharge your batteries. Expensive, yes, but far, far cheaper than divorce.

It does get easier so you ideally just want to find a way to get through these hard years.

You said something had to change but you aren’t sure what. People made suggestions and you narrowed the point of your post down to your heading. Fair enough but if you’ve read similar posts you know a lot of posters will tell you to leave him. You have said you are thinking of doing that, the alternative being just accepting this is how your life will be and settling for that. I don’t think anyone can make that choice for you. I just think the second option will quickly make all of you unhappy including your children. They might not know any different but unhappy parents can’t keep the pretence up the whole time and children pick up on it

No, I’m just talking it through. That’s literally all I’m doing.

The sort of making my own life easier by not doing his washing etc doesn’t work. I barely really see him as it is.

and @Lurkingandlearning I do agree and that’s what will probably keep me here. I just feel like such a fucking idiot.

Also, sometimes when I have a problem I ask myself: ‘What would a man do here?’

I don’t necessarily do it, but it’s a useful way of querying my female social upbringing.

The answer is that a man would simply take the time and rest that he needed.

The best thing I did was take up.a weekly hobby on maternity leave outside of the home. Those 3 hrs a week are mine. But not even just that. I don't make dinner or do bedtimes. I just get in from work to a dinner plated up, eat, grab my hobby stuff and go. I don't do dishes or bedtimes either. When I come home I have a glass of wine, even now when DS is still up when I get back home, I'm off duty.

Can you do something local an evening a week. Even if it's a walking group or yoga or a book club. As long as its outside the house.. and don't fall into the trap of having it all done, like the kids in pjs and dinner done, the most I do is tell dh what's planned for dinner and even that I started to outsource to Alexa 😂

I hear what you're saying. It's like.. the assumption that childcare is entirely your job and it's literally never ending. It DOES get easier, but it sounds hard that he's not prioritizing you and the children over jobs that aren't always that urgent. What if you said, "actually I think it's my turn to take DS to his sports this morning, you can watch DD at home" And for yourself, booking in a weekly exercise class/craft group/ whatever will fill your cup, as a booked and scheduled time so that he knows, on Friday evening (or whenever) you are out? it definitely does get better when they get a bit older and more independent.

The best thing I ever did was learn from DH to give myself a little male entitlement. He was baffled if u mentioned needing new shoes for work but the ones I wanted were dearer than I "allowed" myself. He just thinks - if you like them and need them and can afford them...just...get them?

I've jettisoned off a lot of female conditioning by thinking more like a man. so for OP situation, I'd be telling him I've signed up for a thing, it's on this night, and he needs to sort dinner and bedtimes.

I think he needs to take the kids out a bit for you do some tasks so that evenings after kids are in bed are for you both to unwind. So of you take them out for the morning to allow him to cut grass he takes them out after lunch for you to tidy up and do school work.

I see a man who doesn't want to look after both children, and if he has to look after a child, he picks the eldest because he's easier. All the tasks, yes need doing but they aren't so important that he has to do them immediately. He's using his endless list of tasks to avoid looking after the children. Spending time as a family, isn't so bad for him, because he's not expected to have both children on his own. Have you asked him why he's reluctant to look after both children? He can deny it until he's blue in the face, but it's glaringly obvious. Is he worried he won't cope? Bear in mind he's not at home for a large portion of the week, so isn't actually used to looking after them. He's not particularly used to doing much for them, and I think that's half the issue. Whilst you are 'available', he's never going to take on more parenting, it's easier for him if you do it. You are essentially going to have to force him to step up, by being less available. Plan a few hours away from the house, go for a walk, coffee, gym, see a friend etc, anything but leave the house. Will he like it? No!! Will he panic? Most likely! However, they are both HIS children, not just yours. Once home, take the children out for a few hours.

Yes, do think like a man, I did that when I was going througha particulaly horrendous time, health wise - I threw money that I could ill afford at it and we had to trim our budget accordingly.

My husband worked away when the kids were small - he "had" too. Now that they are grown men - he works from home - how convenient! I've had to drop the resentment that I feel on that one - but it's a common practice to abdicate during the week, either by being away or coming home after bedtime. If I'd known then, what I know now - I would have been more vocal.

I started leaving the kids with him on Sunday mornings - I was touched out and exhausted from the week. I started with a couple of hours and then streched it into lunchtime - I used to come home in the afternoon. I didn't do breakfast or anything. That worked for me. You do need to take that time for yourself - you do need a break. You may also want to start unpicking all those habits that you have that deprioritise you at the expense of your own wellbeing.

It sounds like the things he’s doing are for the house - for your home, I’m assuming DIY or gardening or something. He’s not kicking back relaxing while you’ve got the kids all the time- he’s contributing to the household? The issue is, he can’t / won’t take the kids while he’s doing this work, and you can’t / won’t do your tasks while you’ve got the kids.

I guess the questions I’d be asking are:
• Can you take a more hands-off approach with the kids and get some of your tasks done while they’re around?
• Can you check in with him about what he’s working on and whether he could take one or both kids while doing his tasks?
• Could you agree in advance on what tasks each of you will tackle over the weekend and plan childcare accordingly so you both get time to work uninterrupted?
• Do you always need to go out? Could you stay home, let the kids play, and work on your tasks there?

You sound both cynical about what he’s doing and like you don’t value his contribution, therefore you’re resentful of him.

In a year or two the DC really won’t need entertaining / supervising as much as you are now, so it will be easier to do the tasks you need while you’ve got them.
And if you separate - who is going to pick up the tasks he does for the house?

If you don't want to actually pull the plug and leave him, start going out once a weekend, for as long as you can bear. You are probably knackered and it's the last thing you want to do, but it's the only way to force your DH to get the perspective of being "default parent". The objective is not to recharge yourself (if you can though obviously great) or to use your own time productively, it's to get him to experience your life. Regularly.

If he's decent, then he'll realise that you are getting shafted by current arrangements and he'll change. If he's not, then at least you know and can prioritise yourself accordingly.

To be honest, this.
Houses and gardens need to be maintained. If he is away with work during the week, he has to do it at the weekend, because you are also tied up with little kids in the week. I know MN can be dismissive of the concept of love languages, but I know this is how my husband shows he cares, by wanting to make sure we have a lovely living environment. Whereas, it sounds like time together is more important for you.

It also sounds to me it sounds like you are trying to do too many out of the house activities and maybe need to scale back on that for a bit. You don't have to go to multiple things every weekend. At under 2, shoe shopping is an event in itself, no need to also the park.

At least your DH is doing chores and trying to make your environment nicer - cutting grass, trimming hedges etc. mine used to bugger off golf both days at the weekend for hours each day, leaving me with both kids, and I worked full time too.

You need to have a discussion and a plan. Maybe one day at the weekend is a family day for the four of you and the other day you alternate. One weekend he gets a day to do chores while you mind the kids and the following weekend the other day is yours to do chores (or whatever) while he minds them. Alternatively you have half a day each on the second day and then swap. It's generally true, there is a never ending list of things that need doing around a house and garden, and unless you can afford a handy person/gardener then someone has to do them. It will get easier once the children are older.

That aside, whatever you're doing during the day, he needs to step up and take turns with cooking, bathing kids, bedtimes etc. That's parenting, not wife work.