We had the marriage and kids talk - not sure how I feel.

[Stanwyck]

Been together 18 months and never had this talk. I recently brought it up and he was like a deer in headlights - said let me think and come back to you.

So he started by saying this has been the best relationship he’s ever had so far. I told him the same. He was previously married, she divorced him 5 years ago.

In terms of marriage, he said he’s undecided about doing it again. Doesn’t see the overall benefits, but not against doing it again either - clearly not in a frame of mind for proposing so at least now I know.

He also said he wants kids and I do too. He said this was more important to him than marriage part initially.

He also added that I’m the well off one so he’d want me to get a pre-nup as he’s not after me for money!

He then said we have a lot more to agree and talk about before taking those steps - he clearly has issues in mind although he didn’t verbalise them.

A small voice inside me is worried that I’m a placeholder and there’s someone else he would marry. In theory I don’t feel marriage is crucial but I also feel sadness about never doing or having that ritual in front of our loved ones. Or never calling him husband.

I love him very much but I feel if I’d chosen a man without the baggage of divorce he might be more positive and excited!

Marriage is business; it’s a legal and financial contract, not a romantic fairy tale.

Have you educated yourself about all of the contractual ramifications? That might be the place to start. I understand his reluctance. Don’t mix that up romance or make it a test of his feelings.

This really - we were much younger still in education but knew though it took a decade to get in position to try for a baby.

I'd give it a few more conversations but if nothing changes I'd say move on sooner rather than waste more time.

This!

i cant believe people are saying get rid…its only 18 months and yes hes quite rightly saying i need to think about that, especially as hes already been divorced once.

it might have only just come into his realm when you said it, what did you expect? Yes there and then and no reflection time

https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/family/living-together-marriage-and-civil-partnership/living-together-and-marriage-legal-differences/

This is a start - but marriage is a legal partnership - civil partnership is similar in many ways but there are legal and tax implications to it. I image he's more aware of this than you having done it and then divorced.

Or he’s being realistic…

it sounds like you are hurt its not all “romance”

@Arthurprachette I appreciate it’s only been 18 months.

it’s not about what I expect. I have been thinking about marrying him and imagining that life together and being a family. To hear he has not has been emotional for me.

I understand I have a lot to consider and look into including legal ramifications.

Your not even living together????

I can hear your hurt…i think he may be a bit more like you if he hadnt been divorced already. He has had an experience already of feeling however you feel about each other and it ending in divorce

divorce is painful…my husband winced at the word being said out loud still (previous marriage) and we were together 16 years! (Im a widow)

i cant believe people are saying get rid…its only 18 months

OP 31 - so she gives it a bit more time and if still no - she'll need time to find someone else then date and then see if he wants kids then start trying.

I think Op has time nearly a decade left for kids - but if she waits round for years on maybe that time will quickly pass and also get lingering was he settling vibes.

I think too many people drift - if OP clear she wants marriage and kids then making that a priority is okay for her to do rather than wait round for a man to make up his mind at some point maybe - means it's more likely to happen for OP.

It's not does he want them, it's does he want them with you. In my experience, when a man meets the woman he wants children with, it suddenly stops being a difficult decision.

I think he told you, unfortunately, OP.

You might be financially better off now, but they all changes with kids. You’ll want to take maternity leave presumably, and then perhaps go back to work part time (or not at all for a while). So how will that work financially? I’ve seen tine and time again, women on here saying they’re using up all their savings bcos they’re on Mat leave or working part time and still need to pay ‘their half’, with no reference to the fact they’re now a family and consideration of all the childcare, home stuff and family admin etc. they’re doing.
My advice - get married first. I’m not talking about a big wedding, I’m saying marriage. It’s the best foundation for a family.

“Wants kids.”

You need to go deeper than that. Who will do day to day care, is he aware of actual nursery costs, how will you keep both careers afloat, parenting philosophy, how will he feel about child-related restrictions on hobbies, travel, sleep, finances. What if the child is disabled? What if either of you are? Support network, etc etc.

Not a vague “yeah i want kids.

@TheHerboriste i agree we need to dig much deeper.

he’s from a Scandi country where men usually take on equal responsibility and he has stated he’d easily take on half or more than that of overall parenting.

He said that nursery costs are a concern. This is partly why we are discussing a move to my home city where my parents are. Not to be 100% reliant but because they are both retiring and have said ‘If grandkids’ they’ll help.

I think he underestimated the impact on hobbies which for him I think would be a factor.

Op do you live together now in the property you own if not surely marriage and kids is a huge step? You haven’t said what his status is only that you have a property. I assume he got a divorce settlement. 18 months when you don’t live together seems a rush to push him into big decision presumably lead by you.

There have been some very harsh remarks. I think he's being sensible. You admit this has been on your mind so you were fully prepared for the conversation - he wasn't. You've only been together for 18 months and you admit he was really traumatised by his divorce. You haven't said if you live together, which would be quite a big factor.
Let him think things over now he knows where you stand. Then revisit the topic. He'll understand how important it is to you.
I think he sounds like a really good guy, not some idiot who jumps from relationship to relationship.

I also think he's being sensible. I also understand your reasons for not wanting to wait around but it think sme of the ealoty has got caught up in the lack of romance for you.

Marriage isn't romantic. It's a legal contract.

I've been divorced for many years and been with my partner for nearly 4 and engaged for 13 months. I'm 50 and I'm in no hurry to get married if I'm really honest about it.

It's not because I'm 'just not that into' him because I'm the most settled in a relationship that I've ever been and have absolutely no reservations about being with him but I'm a bit 'been there; done that' about marriage itself.

I was like your DH, married very young divorced by the time I was 22 as my ex had been cheating on me. My now DH had never been married, we had a very quiet registry office wedding, I know that he and his family would have liked a bigger celebration but he was happy to go along with my wishes, I just couldn’t have done it again in front of all the relatives who had attended the first one! That was over 30 years and 3 children ago, The most important thing is whether he’s in for the long haul or not and only you can figure that out. Good luck

"18 months is plenty of time to have had the talk about what your ideal future looks look to both of you and to know that this person is the right one."

I disagree. 18 months isn't enough time to properly know someone, especially when not living together. It's too soon to know whether someone is on their best behaviour or whether it's truly who they are.

"Dogs/no dogs
children/no children
outdoorsy/indoorsy
family oriented/isolated
materialistic/nonmaterialistic
sexually compatible/not compatible"

This list is all very well, but they're just words. How does he behave? What are his views on how you divide finances and childcare?

Is he lazy or does he do his fair share?
Is he a sulker or does he reflect on things and try to resolve arguments?
Is he willing to compromise or will things be on his terms?
Will you have a joint account or keep money separate? If joint, what will come out of the joint account?
If one earns more than the other, will they contribute more?
If you have a child, will you both continue to work full time?
How does he treat you when you're unwell?
How much space do you each need? How much time will you spend together vs doing your own thing?
Will he have habits that annoy you when you can't escape from them?
How does he behave when he has a bad day or the shit hits the fan?
How does he behave when you have a bad day?
And so on.

this!

As a women who has been 31 and known woman who have gone through this i think your instincts are spot on and you are a placeholder

i have been engaged a few times, married once. Each time i have been engaged i have known very quickly the guy is into me, i have alot of dating expierence and equally knew very quickly if they were wasting my time 😂😂 sometimes i liked them alot abd didnt want to believe it though 😂😂😂

I have food in my freezer older than 18 months.

Giving it another exploratory year isn’t going to undermine your options.

OP, after 18 months of dating, he should know if he wants to marry you or not. Don't let him string you along and waste your most fertile years.

Read The Rules. And also Why Men Marry Some Women and Not Others. And Why Men Marry Bitches. They're retro, but they do have good advice about avoiding wasting your good years in this holding pattern.

The second title above actually says that men who have been married before are a better bet than men who have never committed.

I don't know if it helps, OP but as someone who went through a dreadful divorce, I am clear that I will not marry again. I am upfront about it when meeting new potential partners. The issue isn't some kind of concern or worry about whether or not it will work out from a romantic point of view, it is simply the very unromantic cold hard cash point of view. I've worked hard to be where I am today (and it's not amazing, but I'm OK) and I will not run the risk of any future husband taking a penny of that away from my children. I am all they have - their father is useless and will likely spite them and leave whatever he has to his latest wife - I want them to have whatever I have been able to accummulate because I have sod all else to give them. It's a serious concern.

And please don't think it's personal - he probably doesn't think you'll fleece him or be awful or anything else. But the simple fact of the matter is, people are capable of terrible behaviour in a divorce. You'll never understand it till you experience it.

Jaw jaw is better than war war. If you are asking him to move countries and tie himself to the uk that may also factor into his reluctance. So keep talking and try to figure this out. He can be wonderful but still not able to give you what you want.

I would end things, you have a lot going for you and deserve someone who wants to marry and have a family with you. You are more of a ‘catch’ than him, you are a home owner and haven’t previously been married.
He does know what he wants but he’s stalling telling you.