Shall kick out my ds?

[SugarPlumpFairyCakes]

He's 20 in March. He's done nothing since he was 16.

I don't know where he would go though.

He doesn't work. Doesn't study. He's asleep every day until 3 or 4pm.

He went to private school all his life. Had two extra years there because he failed his As levels twice. We live abroad. International private school that was quite flexible.

Says he applies for jobs. I don't believe him.

Does absolutely nothing around the house to help. Actively makes an awful mess in the kitchen. Consumes vast quantities of food.

His dad (my ex) took him and paid for him to do an access course. He did none of it.

I've made appointments for him in the past with doctors. He just didn't go to the appointments so I don't do that anymore.

I am getting very snippy, almost nasty to him when I come home from work and the kitchen is a total mess again or he's blocked the toilet and then he asks me for lifts to the gym.

I feel irritated at the sight of him. Would kicking him out not knowing where he would go an act of severe unkindness?

He seems to think he's entitled to be financially supported because he is my son.

I cannot see our relationship ever recovering from this as once he's out, I would never let him back in to live with me again whatever his problems. He denies he does nothing. Denies the evidence before both of our eyes. It's bizarre.

Congratulations, your son sounds like a cocklodger.

Are you on reasonable terms with his Dad?
If so, it is time for the 2 of you to stage some sort of intervention and agree between yourselves on how you are going to force him to start making a life plan. This may involve some sort of ultimatum, as suggested in the post above. But it is important you are united in your approach

Put a calender on the wall, mark a date e.g. March the 31st and say If you dont have a job by that date your moving out.

Mean it.

Yes it would be an act of severe unkindness. I don't know what the answer is though. Are you sure he isn't ND? My DS is the same and he does now have a diagnosis.

He's not an adult btw. That's just something women with younger children/no children think about nineteen year old boys. Boys mature at about 25.

I’d take the stricter advice you’ve gotten here a bit more seriously than the more gentle ones. In fact I actually commend you for thinking about the moving out suggestion because it shows you are taking this seriously.

Growing up my father was and is a complete deadbeat and my brother was following his path. Didn’t lift a finger, never cooked, never cleaned, gamed all day, never applied for jobs although he claimed he did, used the bank of mum to fund his lifestyle. The only thing that helped in the end was him moving out with a friend of his but I was aghast at the situation and felt bad for my mother. But she enabled him so my sympathy was limited.

He needs a big shakeup - if you live at home pay for some of the bills. To do that you need a job. Any job will do. Otherwise you can’t live here.

You have to be cruel to be kind sometimes OP.

Kick him out of his home......... No no no... Imagine watching your parents split and then you end up being forced out... Wtf.

This could be a phase- a prolonged teenage phase. I feel eventually he will snap out of it. Don't underestimate the legacy of divorce either.

I wouldn't just kick him out. It isn't easy finding somewhere to live.
Not sure what the situation is where you are.
Where do you think he'd go? Rent a flat? Live with friends?
Even on a starting salary would that be doable?

Reminding him that having a job is not optional, unless he is ill he should be working would be more than reasonable though. And also to say you'll want him to move out eventually, and he should at 20yo be working towards that.

So sit him down, explain that if he doesn't get a job in the next two months then he needs to move out. Give him an actual moving out date. If he does get a job explain he can stay but has to pay rent and also contribute to the family home in the way of cooking meals and tidying up etc.

If he doesn't do it, stick to the date

If he doesn’t have a job he won’t be able to rent a place. Where do you think he will go?

When behaviour is so different like this I always think are you sure he isn't ND.

Because just knowing and then accessing appropriate support is going to be important here.

This is so much to deal with endlessly for you. Where's the dad. Can't he help out here and give you some respite.

He needs to start contributing.
I would be giving him a list of five jobs a day (gardening, manual work) and insisting he cooks three times a week to secure lifts to the gym.
The WiFi would be turned off at 9pm each night to 9am and codes changed.
I would take him down to the homeless hostels and ask him how he feels about living there for the rest of his days. Shock treatment is required.

He has become too lazy and indulgent.

I don't know if he is ND.

He has not attended the appointments I made for him with a psychologist. He went for about six sessions in 2023 but then stopped saying all was fine.

He sleeps a lot. Says he physically feels like shit. Doesn't socialise anymore.

He goes to the gym. Works out. Very strong and powerful. I suggested he pursue that in terms of work. Nothing. I suggested the Royal Navy. I suggested pilot training - various airlines appear to be recruiting trainees at the moment. I suggested completing his access course.

I don't think he's spoiled. My other dcs all toe the line with school and chores. I am really pissed off with him though. I don't think anything ND he might have leads to being a dirty pig.

I avoid him now. I've had so many conversations with him. Encouraging. Stern. Etc.

He isn't fond of his dad. His dad is a weird guy.

@FoolishHips Legally he's an adult, albeit an immature one. That's what puts parents in a difficult position, because we can't legally interfere in their lives, for example, see their medical notes or their attendance records/marks if they're in education, but we still support them in many ways. It's maddening sometimes.

OP, I think you need to set some clear expectations as others have said. He may think that you have to support him while he does nothing, but you don't. Perhaps you need to really spell it out to him - I'm not going to continue paying all the bills while you do nothing, you need to make a plan.

I have told him what is expected of him. Dishwasher. Hoovering. Bed made. Dogs walked.

Nothing changes.

I haven't just been hoping he will recognise these things need doing through osmosis.

It's so hard for you. My son is a teen and I just don't like him most the time. He's ND.

The room mess, it's really common. It's often part of the struggle with ADHD / executive functioning. The attitude too. He probably does have issues with physical symptoms - really common in ND people as co morbids often come along, EDS and POTS and digestive problems.

You call the dad weird - it's painting a picture here. Weird is what people often say about ND people without realising.

This doesn't help you I know but there are flags. You can't force him to go to the psych but have you ever asked him if he has thoughts he's ND? I'd ask him. If he's intelligent and has access to the internet he might already be looking this up himself.

As he is over 18, he is legally an adult. His behaviour may make him seem younger and OP may treat him as though he is younger but in the eyes of the law, he is an adult.

do not listen to the people saying to ask him if he’s ND, he doesn’t need any more excuses for being lazy, entitled, and disrespectful.

there needs to be consequences to him for bad behaviour just like a child, since he is acting like a child.

if he has the energy to go to the gym and he can stick to what sounds like a complicated workout regime then he is not physically ill and he does not have issues with executive functioning.

he can take all that energy and put it into getting a job. as others have said tell him he has a deadline to get out. do not let him stay if he gets a job because he won’t magically start helping with the chores either. change the password for the wifi and don’t let him use it at all. stop paying for any of his food or giving him meals.

you basically have a cocklodger, but he is your son. also if he refuses to get a job and move out there is morning wrong with sending him to his dad’s! he is not showing you, the dogs or the other children any consideration why does he deserve yours?!?

People will witter on about he is always your child and you will ‘lose him’ if you kick him out.

The reality is that sometimes tough love is the way ahead and he needs a proper life lesson.

Kicking him out is the best thing you can do for him. He will have to get a job and start taking responsibility for himself. And, if he decides to not contact you (highly unlikely), it will be his loss. Far more likely he will gain respect for you and you can develop a far healthier adult-to-adult relationship.

@Vegandiva you do know one can be a cock lodger and be ND?

You know that being ND would not stop anyone issuing consequences for behaviour that's no longer tolerable to her as mum.

Do you know, you can have an ND kid and still feel that this shit is too much for me.

That does not negate any of the necessary boundaries OP clearly needs. Including getting the seemingly useless father to help and hopefully house him!

You do understand these 2 thought streams can co exist? Why would anyone ignore a bloody elephant in the room is exactly what I'm saying when facing that elephant might help meet OPs needs!

If there's no chance he is, then hey nothing lost.
Personally, I'd be all over getting him to take ADHD meds to make MY life easier if he was proven to have something like this.

Very shortsighted post.

@Wishyouwerehere50 not shortsighted, a difference of opinion with regards to this issue. the OP asked for opinions and she is receiving a range of them 🙂

stop giving him lifts

When will his trust fund run out? It will be good when it does as he’s using (and you) it to coast through life

Sometimes you do need to put your foot down. One of my friends has a DD (nearly 25) who's been dropping out of courses and generally being flaky since she was 18. Her parents pay for everything and I'm afraid that I've mentioned her to my DD (19) as an example that she can't follow. I know that's unkind, but DD knows that we wouldn't tolerate that level of flakiness. At least do something while you work out your next steps. DD has a friend (also 19) who's working in hospitality while she decides what to do next, for example.

As your DS is into fitness, what about applying for jobs at gyms and/or looking into training courses related to this interest?

Well, Im not a mother so I have no advice to give you on that but I wanted to give you some hope. I personally know A LOT of people (always boys, tbh, dont know what happens to men at that age) that in their late teens, early 20[s went through a phase like that, that they are just being lazy, they dont work or study and, all of them, eventually, ended up shifting their beahviour (dont know if thats because they see everyone else doing something with their lives and they feel behind). I dont know your son but I wouldnt worry too much, I dont think he is gonna be like that for much longer. But I also dont think you should be okay with his lazyness and act like his maid...

Put his rent up so the money he has can't cover it. Force him into work and if he won't pay then ask him to leave as a natural consequence

I'm confused OP. You say he's 19 and done nothing sine he was 16 - but then you say he's done A-levels twice? How did he do A-levels twice before he was 16?

A-levels aren't for everyone, they are a major step up from GCSE's and pretty damn difficult even if you are academic. I certainly found them much more difficult and much less interesting than my MA(Res).

But failing your A-levels twice has got to be pretty soul destroying, I'm sure his self esteem is probably through the floor. He's a bit lost and not sure what direction to go in, everything feel like too much and he doesn't want to fail again.

The last thing he needs is kicking out. His self esteem is already rock bottom. He needs some really decent support because he thinks he's a complete and utter failure.