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Original poster

Unemployed husband totally oblivious to my stress

546 replies

DeepViper · 31/01/2025 09:57

My husband hasn't worked for more than three years. I am at the end of my tether with trying to get him to understand our financial situation and how stressed I am. We have two DC aged 11 and 10, one of which has special needs and needs significant care and I have to pay private special school fees. I am British but we live abroad.

I have seen a lawyer about getting a divorce but they advised I might need to pay him alimony given his long-term unemployment and I really can't afford this, already I am going into debt every month trying to cover expenses. We have downsized as much as possible. No car, smaller house, we rent, no assets. He cleaned out all our savings and he sold investments without telling me. I am absolutely distressed about making ends meet each month, not to mention our future. I am starting to hate him. He sits on the sofa all day and watches soap operas.

He tells everyone he's a stay at home dad, but he does nothing. Nothing at all. No cleaning, laundry, school admin, homework. I do it all. He refuses counselling. I have a good job but I work 60-70 hour weeks and can't take on a second job.

How can I get through to him and make him get a job? He refuses counselling. He's 51.

My only option is to take the kids and move home to the UK, but my lawyer advised against doing this without consent. when I mention it, he says absolutely not. And yet... he won't work.

I have spoken to his mother and his friends and they all tell me I should be more sympathetic to his situation because it must be tough for him. I am sorry but my patience has run out.

What on earth do I do?

OP posts:
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5
Noras · 31/01/2025 11:28

Spousal maintenance is determined by one spouse’s reasonable needs and the other spouse’s capacity to pay, which takes into account earning capacity (not just actual current income). So, courts will look at what your ex was earning right before they quit their last job and their efforts to obtain employment since. Making a deliberate, strategic decision to quit a job—as opposed to being made redundant or being terminated due to factors such as poor performance (which can of course also be deliberate)—does not magically reduce an individual’s earning capacity. What’s more, if your spouse did have a job when proceedings started, they’ve already established to the court that they have earning capacity. The courts would still expect your ex to look for another job.
What steps can you take?

Ceecee2422 · 31/01/2025 11:28

bibliomania · 31/01/2025 11:23

Yes, the Hague Convention applies and you can't take the children away from the country of habitual residence without his consent or a court order. (Some people get away with it if the other parent doesn't bother with a legal challenge, but if he's likely to challenge it, he has the law on his side).

You need to follow legal advice. You may be able to get a court order to move with the children - if he's there as a trailing spouse and you leave, then potentially he doesn't have the right to remain in the country without you anyway, so the court couldn't insist that the children have to stay there. This will come down to the specifics of visas and local laws, so you need the right local legal advice.

Not being funny but how is he challenging anything with no money? Not to mention the fact he clearly cannot support the children and she has 3 years of factual evidence to prove he has not supported them in any way in the past 3 years……a court would have to be completely mad to hand over children to a male that hasn’t supported anyone……..

Original poster
DeepViper · 31/01/2025 11:28

Noras · 31/01/2025 11:26

Section 75(2) of the Family Law Act 1975 (Cth) sets out numerous factors that may be taken into account by the Court in property settlements when determining whether there are any special circumstances that require adjustment to the property settlement amount.
The factors are:

  • The age and state of health of each of the parties Income, property, finances and ability to earn an income.
  • Whether either party has the care or control of a child of the marriage who is under 18.
  • Commitments relating to support of themselves, a dependent or other person.
  • Eligibility for a pension, allowance or benefit.
  • Whether the parties have separated or divorced.
  • The extent to which payment of maintenance could enable further education and therefore increase one of the parties earning capacity.
  • The effect of any proposed order on the ability of a creditor of a party to recover a creditor’s debt.
  • The extent to which one party has contributed to the income, earning capacity, property and financial resources of the other party.
  • How the length of the marriage affected the earning capacity of the party seeking maintenance.
  • The need to protect a party who wishes to continue their role as a parent.
  • Financial circumstances of any current cohabitation by either party.
  • Orders made under Section 79 of the Family Law Act, if any. This section regulates how assets are to be divided.
  • Any child support that one of the parties is liable for.
  • Any fact or circumstance which the court feels needs to be taken into account for reasons of justice.
  • The terms of any financial agreementbinding on the parties to the marriage.
What Do They Mean for You? If you are going through a separation, it is important to understand what these factors mean for you. These factors are important for the court’s consideration and assessment of what each party’s ‘future needs’ are likely to be. This requires the court to anticipate what each party’s life is likely to look like in the future and award a percentage uplift to the party with the greater ‘need’. As seen above, there are many factors that the court will take into consideration when deciding who gets what portion of the assets. It is therefore important to understand that property settlements can become quite complex.

thank you this is very useful

OP posts:
Noras · 31/01/2025 11:29

It’s not what he earns it’s what he could earn and also earn with re training. No one would expect you to fund him indefinitely. The kids don’t need him at home and you are exhausted doing everything.

Get a decent lawyer.

user243245346 · 31/01/2025 11:30

FartSock5000 · 31/01/2025 11:27

Would you have to pay him anything if you and the kids just moved out?

I would. Take the kids and move into your own place. Life would be easier without the man child who is causing you extra work and stress.

I'd also claim child support from him since the kids are with you!

Emmm what about the mortgage?

Negroany · 31/01/2025 11:31

Maybe you give up your job, then you won't have to pay alimony, then look for jobs in the UK and persuade him that way - if he won't work and your only job is in the UK, he's have to agree to you going to the UK.

Then, leave him once in the UK.

Original poster
DeepViper · 31/01/2025 11:31

Ceecee2422 · 31/01/2025 11:28

Not being funny but how is he challenging anything with no money? Not to mention the fact he clearly cannot support the children and she has 3 years of factual evidence to prove he has not supported them in any way in the past 3 years……a court would have to be completely mad to hand over children to a male that hasn’t supported anyone……..

Show quote history

he's not challenging anything yet. I have only seen a lawyer to figure out my options although I have talked to him about divorce and moving back to the UK and he said he won't give up the children. I am worried it might end up in a messy legal battle. I suppose I am venting here for my own sanity. I can't believe it's the same man I married.

OP posts:
Noras · 31/01/2025 11:32

To be eligible for spousal maintenance in Australia, an individual must demonstrate an inability to adequately support themselves due to caring for children, age, health issues, or a lack of income-generating capacity relative to the other party.

Original poster
DeepViper · 31/01/2025 11:32

Negroany · 31/01/2025 11:31

Maybe you give up your job, then you won't have to pay alimony, then look for jobs in the UK and persuade him that way - if he won't work and your only job is in the UK, he's have to agree to you going to the UK.

Then, leave him once in the UK.

This is an option I am considering.

OP posts:
Noras · 31/01/2025 11:33

The longer you leave it the more likely he can use age as an inability to work so act sooner or else it will only get worse the longer he is unemployed and older he gets.

bibliomania · 31/01/2025 11:33

Ceecee2422 · 31/01/2025 11:28

Not being funny but how is he challenging anything with no money? Not to mention the fact he clearly cannot support the children and she has 3 years of factual evidence to prove he has not supported them in any way in the past 3 years……a court would have to be completely mad to hand over children to a male that hasn’t supported anyone……..

Show quote history

Depending on the local legal arrangements, he might be entitled to legal support or support from a charity that deals with child abduction; he might be able to seek a court order as a litigant in person; his family members might cough up financial support. It's taking a massive gamble for her to break the law and just hope to get away with it. Really dangerous advice.

Kitchensinktoday · 31/01/2025 11:34

Anon1274 · 31/01/2025 10:24

And btw he’s very much aware of your stress. He just doesn’t care

True

Original poster
DeepViper · 31/01/2025 11:34

Noras · 31/01/2025 11:32

To be eligible for spousal maintenance in Australia, an individual must demonstrate an inability to adequately support themselves due to caring for children, age, health issues, or a lack of income-generating capacity relative to the other party.

He's an able-bodied healthy man with no reason not to be able to work. Probably some depression and a lack of confidence after being fired 3 years ago. I suppose I haven't wanted to admit to myself that he's just turned into a lazy bum.

OP posts:
bibliomania · 31/01/2025 11:35

I feel your frustration, OP. It's extremely unfair.

ILY123 · 31/01/2025 11:35

Dont kidnap the children thats horrible advice. If you cant afford it how would you pay allimony? The advice you got sounds generic. You need proper legal advice .

Original poster
DeepViper · 31/01/2025 11:36

Noras · 31/01/2025 11:28

Spousal maintenance is determined by one spouse’s reasonable needs and the other spouse’s capacity to pay, which takes into account earning capacity (not just actual current income). So, courts will look at what your ex was earning right before they quit their last job and their efforts to obtain employment since. Making a deliberate, strategic decision to quit a job—as opposed to being made redundant or being terminated due to factors such as poor performance (which can of course also be deliberate)—does not magically reduce an individual’s earning capacity. What’s more, if your spouse did have a job when proceedings started, they’ve already established to the court that they have earning capacity. The courts would still expect your ex to look for another job.
What steps can you take?

this is very reassuring thank you. He used to earn quite a good salary, never more than me but he was able to contribute. I think I need a second legal opinion.

OP posts:
Tiswa · 31/01/2025 11:38

DeepViper · 31/01/2025 11:36

this is very reassuring thank you. He used to earn quite a good salary, never more than me but he was able to contribute. I think I need a second legal opinion.

Show quote history

Yes I agree with this - if he can get a job he will be expected to rather than you support him

it will be a court battle but one I think you need to begin - remember as well in 8 years time yiur children will be old enough to decide themselves

Daisyvodka · 31/01/2025 11:39

Do you have any proof that he doesn't do any childcare or help around the house? I guess I'm sort of wondering if you can start keeping a record of everything you do and he doesn't do that you can later present in court. Maybe try and subtly refer to it in text messages or email. Lay an evidence trail that he isn't actually doing any stay at home parent or house work. Do the school your kids are at need someone to sign them out for example? Record who takes your children to appointments etc. I'm not sure how much this would actually help. But maybe something to talk over with a solicitor. How can you build your case, starting now, on the chance he tries to make things difficult.

Ceecee2422 · 31/01/2025 11:39

DeepViper · 31/01/2025 11:31

he's not challenging anything yet. I have only seen a lawyer to figure out my options although I have talked to him about divorce and moving back to the UK and he said he won't give up the children. I am worried it might end up in a messy legal battle. I suppose I am venting here for my own sanity. I can't believe it's the same man I married.

Show quote history

No but I don’t see how he ever can if he has zero income, how is he going to fund challenging anything? Were the kids born there or in the UK?

MsMarch · 31/01/2025 11:39

I second the suggestion to get a different lawyer - yu need a shark frankly. Someone who wil help you make a case that you leaving him is in you and your children's best interests and who can advise you on both the practical and legal implications of any decisions you take.

And I would also overlay the legal advice with the reality of what is likely to happen should you just leave/ move back to the UK etc.

GreenTeaLikesMe · 31/01/2025 11:41

Likewhatever · 31/01/2025 11:18

I think you need to treat splitting from him and moving back to the UK as two different issues. Trying to do them both together might make both difficult. You need proper legal advice exploring all your options.

You also need to consider if he suddenly got a job and was able to contribute fully would you actually want to be married to him.

This, very much.

Alimony is really unusual in the world of today. I'd be getting a second opinion on the alimony thing. Surely an ex-spouse does not pay alimony to a bloke who was working for 25 years and then decided to loaf around since COVID?

If you can get a divorce, you may be able to use his passivity in your favor. A few British women I know slowly trickled back to the UK with their kids after splitting from their useless twat husbands.

In each case, she acted sweet and smiling and were oh-so-cooperative with the husband when it came to his spending time with the kids, but let him do the actual initiation of all contact. Pretty soon, his attempts to see the kids fell off a cliff as he slumped into a nice comfy bachelor life of gaming, late nights, possibly seeing other women. She began very quietly making preparations to take the kids back to the UK permanently, but did nothing as yet. He began to see the benefits of never having the kids around and his messages and contact dried up more and more. She took the kids back to the UK for holidays. After the first couple of holidays, the "holiday" started to be dragged out and their return to the foreign country was delayed for one reason, then another reason. The guy didn't seem bothered. At some point, she approached her ex husband about the possibility of her staying long term with the kids. By then, he was with another women and was happy to have the ex family out of the way. It's really sad, but a lot of men quickly lose interest in their kids when they are no longer seeing the regularly. I have seen some variation of the above happen in at least three cases.

So there is that route. But the OP needs to play the long game here and be very careful.

ExercicenformedeZ · 31/01/2025 11:42

What was his previous occupation? Also, his mother sounds hopeless. Australia is unfortunately very old fashioned when it comes to men, they are very coddled and women are expected to put up and shut up (I'm not saying every Australian family is like that, but it is even worse than the UK in that respect) I wouldn't bother trying to talk to her, she will just side with him although if she has to have him living with her and not contributing anything, she may be singing a different song.
I agree with others that you need to leave, I think that the idea of a legal separation is a good one. I don't really understand why you would be on the hook for spousal support, and I think that you need another legal opinion: however, please do not just flee the country. That is very, very bad advice and could land you in hot water.

Ceecee2422 · 31/01/2025 11:44

bibliomania · 31/01/2025 11:33

Depending on the local legal arrangements, he might be entitled to legal support or support from a charity that deals with child abduction; he might be able to seek a court order as a litigant in person; his family members might cough up financial support. It's taking a massive gamble for her to break the law and just hope to get away with it. Really dangerous advice.

Show quote history

But what legal system will give children to a man who doesn’t support them nor look after them? None plus I’m pretty sure the UK has some hefty support in the matter too so all she would need to prove is he has not earnt a penny in the past 3 years, she cannot afford to support him and he also does not look after the children, he wouldn’t have a leg to stand on………

bibliomania · 31/01/2025 11:48

Yes, the court might decide that the children should live with their mother, but in the country of their habitual residence as defined under the Hague Convention. So she has to stay on or else leave the children with their father. If you're not familiar with court judgments under the Hague Convention, you really need to be careful about speculating on what a court would decide. Courts apply the law.

Original poster
DeepViper · 31/01/2025 11:49

Beelzebud · 31/01/2025 11:26

Can you start having your salary paid into a bank account with only your name on it? Cancel credit cards he uses? So he has to work if he wants anything but the bare minimum of food and clothing from you? This would mean you would have to food shop but it sounds as if you do that anyway. Cancel Netflix, change the password on the router. At least then you would be able to control where your money goes

(you must try to track where the money you thought you had went, so you can evidence the need for this process if a court should ask. )

I have actually done all this. I pay most of the bills out of our joint account and put some money for food and insurance, etc, that's it. But I have almost nothing left over. I thought it would encourage him to get a job but he seems to just use it as an excuse to do absolutely nothing at all.

When I say he watches soap operas all day, that's literally all he does. He doesn't go out or buy anything.

Then at Christmas, I got absolutely nothing from him or his family - not even a cheap bottle of wine from our joint account, or even a small handmade card from the children. That's when I realised it's totally over and he couldn't give a flying f*ck about me at all. I feel like a complete idiot. but I also realised I can't go on.

OP posts: