Ethical non monogamy WTF?

[Whatisthisdamnednonsense]

I’m back on the dating apps after a two year relationship so been out of the dating scene. I’ve come across men saying they are looking for “ethical non monogamy” and also men saying they’re “polyamorous”. This wasn’t a thing in 2021 when I last had a dating profile! It’s just code for “I like shagging around” isn’t it? I’m open minded about dating but am baulking at how common it seems to be, I would say it’s every one in six or seven profiles!! Anyone else noticed this?
ps I’m back on bumble as it worked for me last time, what are the recommended apps these days? I don’t want hookups or one nighters! Just a nice boyfriend!

I nor anyone else has less of a life or worse for not feeling a need to examine.

Socrates and I think differently :)

Thinking about whether you want to shag someone or not or be faithful or not in a soul searchy way for years is overkill I agree! It doesn't take a lifetime of angst.

But it's pretty dumb to do something all the time and not occasionally think "Why? What's the purpose and value of doing it this way? Who benefits?" Could apply to the way you work, eat, support the military industrial complex, watch a Marvel film, take action on climate change, set screen time for your kid, whatever.

I know some people don't want to do this and I guess if you don't then my point of view is irritating. I am not goading and I don't think I am superior. I am not judging people but practices- I think it's better if everyone takes a questioning approach to the received wisdom they are presented with.

It’s just code for “I like shagging around” isn’t it?

Yes it is. Men now have these terms to make it sound like they aren't sleazy, ego-driven bastards who just like to have several women on the go at once, but instead that have a 'lifestyle' or ' identity', which we are supposed to respect.🙄

@Accidentallyrude but you're assuming those of us choosing monogamy haven't done this soul searching. Maybe we have and decided it wasn't for us, have you considered that?

I overthink and question everything I do in far too much detail and obsess about it (which I admit is unhealthy). So don't assume we haven't done a lot of introspection just because we don't think ENM isn't for us.

@jazzjazzjazz Showing this level of disgust and revulsion is quite suprising and intense.

Disgust is a highly culturally conditioned emotional response, out of all of the emotions.

Personally when I feel the scorn and disgust you show, about stuff that isn't really to do with me, I ask myself why I'm defensive.

@Accidentallyrude can I ask how your DH and you began your journey to ENM? Who brought it up?

Yes I agree! My posts literally say that if you examine things it doesn't matter where you net out- poly or monogamy!

Think about it, decide what you want, then go all in! I bloody love monogamy and have had years of enjoying it. Might have years more of open relationships, might flip back.

I think there's a bias towards people adopting the path of least resistance culturally so there will be plenty of monogamy folks who just haven't thought about it. But then again there will be a lot of lazy people going I fancy lots of sex without working out how to have ethical relationships in that context, I will just pretend to be poly. Both are poor show, the latter on balance worse.

Any yet my post was potlite, but just contained a few home truths, and I knew it would get to your unenlightened self, as I’ve mentioned the couple I knew splitting up and him living monogamously with his younger woman, and mentioned the fact that polygamists clearly haven’t met their one person that fulfils them. You know it’s true. I’ve only mentioned disgust to state that different individuals have different levels of disgust to different set ups, for most people polygamy is morally repugnant, it is not me getting personally repulsed in my little bubble, it’s a part of human nature to value fidelity and faithfulness

After we had difficulty having children we then had a baby who was quite ill for a while and some difficult stuff to process around our parents as well. And some financial problems. We did well with our own relationship but felt it hard to really enjoy having sex with each other and there were practical reasons why we did not feel able to "let go" without someone being there to be on call for the baby and that had to be one of us really.

We didn't want to have affairs and we had so much counselling and therapy both together and separately we found it possible to raise ideas that we wouldn't have raised before. This was one of them. It wasn't easy but by the time we actually did it the level of communication had improved so much between us,we felt weird, but OK.

And now it's made sex less taboo. less of a big deal. Less of a sense of failure that we can't achieve everything in life and an amazing exclusive sex life too as a partnership.

I think the only other path would have been divorce as the lack of honesty about our needs, not the lack of sex, would have driven a wedge.

I have been vulnerable saying this. I ask people to respond kindly rather than triumphantly picking holes like "aha, you had problems already, that's why you couldn't hack monogamy!!" I mean yeah, that's true! It's vastly easier to tread the beaten path.
For DH and I, the rest of life was particularly hard and it affected our bond. So we reset our bond and brought joy back to our lives and marriage by doing this. We could have made our sex life the thing we compromised on. We'd still be together, probably, but with some resentment.

I have no doubt that we will retire together and die together. That's where it becomes hard to explain why these things are good - if I say it's great now, people say I'm shallow. If I say it's great because we have a deep underlying bond and he is my soul mate, I'm sort of taking the values of monogamy to justify why it works. So I don't think I can. I only know we are happy and I assess there is more honesty and authenticity between us. DH would say the same, but obviously you only have my word for it!

oh mate

polygamists clearly haven’t met their one person that fulfils them Evidence that we all have one person that fulfils us?

home truths narrow bigotry. There I fixed it for you.

also I really like the gotcha that I'd be sensitive about DH leaving me for a younger model... dammit @jazzjazzjazz you got me again!!! When you take apart what sexual desire is and decouple it from status and needing to live with someone that stuff just doesn't have meaning any more. DH is an enlightened enough man (Im only saying enlightened to annoy you) that he doesn't put his own value in snagging a younger trophy wife. Because he knows the different dimensions of what he's actually, psychologically, needing from pair bonding.

@Accidentallyrude I can see how it came about from what you've said. If you get tonnes of AHA posts I'd consider asking MN to remove your reply to me. Thank you for replying, I just wondered how it came about really. It's like it unfolded organically nearly.

Right , I really am off to name change now, having family round in a minute! Have completely derailed the thread. Thanks for bearing with me everyone. All the best and sorry to have given in to the temptation to be impatient. Maybe my user name is right!

It’s not about finding a trophy wife, or a younger wife, it’s about the fact you’ve opened up the relationship in a way that he may find someone else he’d prefer to do life with, and settle down with, as you’ve both acknowledged thag in this current relationship, there are things unfulfilled that you would seek with other people. It can be hard to imagine someone meaning everthing to you and fulfilling you in all those ways until you’ve had it, so if you or your husband found that with someone else, what would be the reason to stay with each other? Only kids, finances, retirement etc, which you both may well decide is worth staying for , especially when you can have your romantic and sexual outlets with other people. I just couldn’t imagine settling for that kind of situation. I understand what you’ve said about how it all started, I think those kinds of suggestions wouldn’t be made by people who didn’t already have those desires within them, or it was a trauma response to stress and wanting to run away from the situation. Either way this is the life you have together now, not everyone finds their soulmate and has that desire for commitment, I still don’t know where people find the time to shag multiple people in a busy life. I’d also worry about how children will perceive this as they get older, and the effect it may have on them. I’m assuming you’d be happy for your children to adopt and live out this lifestyle.

FYI. Poly = polyamory not polygamy.

I'd like to thank @Accidentallyrude for calmly explaining her choices. Personally poly is not for me, although I have spent time looking into it. I find nothing about poly disgusting. It's just an alternative way to live. I don't really understand the puritanical approach taken by some posters. There isn't just one way to view sex and relationships.

Thanks, AR. I can understand why you got testy after insults were thrown your way.
I also agree that it's unfair to compare the best of monogamy to the worst of polyamory and vice versa.

I wouldn't be concerned about others thinking it's not a legit way to live. What matters is that it's legit to you and you're happy with it.

How is it bigotry, a common trope from poly people is that one person cannot fulfil all those needs, you even gave examples of that yourself stating various things from wanting to try out new things with people with similar interests, talking about common interests (although I didn’t understand where sex came into that), it’s very evident thag your partner doesn’t fulfil you or enamour you to the point where you would rather spend time with him and having sex with him,than spending time with others and having sex with them. It’s not bigotry, it’s from your own mouth, and evidenced by your actions.

You’ve even said if you didn’t go down the poly route you’d probably have broken up instead, that’s what most people do when they are in an unfulfilling relationship, so it seems convenience keeps you together rather than genuine desire. It’s sad because you could be with someone where you would never consider spending time and having sex with someone else to be a more desired option than spending time with and having sex with your partner

Socrates and I think differently :)

It's not a great comparision if you want to tell people how much you don't judge them, Socrates did judge people, frequently, it was one of the things his contemporaries really hated about him.

Edited to add - Socrates had a terrible marriage and frequently excused hiself for remaining in that marriage by using terms around personal growth.

I am not goading and I don't think I am superior.

Yet you have said it is dumb to not examine. Who made you the arbiter of anyone elses personal growth but your own?

You are every bit as judgemental as anyone else, nothing wrong with that, we each of us hold opinions, no one has a superior opinion to anyone elses but they are just opinions.

I am not judging people but practices- I think it's better if everyone takes a questioning approach to the received wisdom they are presented with.

Some of us know what we think and feel about stuff without questioning it and some of us don't. Neither is right or wrong it's whatever works for you is right for you.

But remember in order to uphold her lifestyle as being more than just narcissistic, and wanting to shag around, she has to put a spiritual spin on it and act as though it is some kind of evolution rather than having a low moral bar and face the fact that her relationship isn’t all that

To be honest I think the poster is just arguing for arguments sake rather than trying to make sense.

Socratean in and of itself but not necessarily to make sense of anything.

There are polygamous cultures, yes. That does not prove jealousy doesn't exist in those cultures. It could be they just repress it because it's not considered socially acceptable.

Genuine human emotions are not learned. How we react to them and what actions we take as a result of them is learned behaviour.

I'm not saying poly is abnormal or inherently wrong or that monogamy is better for everyone. I've been quite clear about that. I only think one aspect of it is wrong, which is the greater risk of spreading STDs. Other than that, and as long as monogamists don't have to deal with polys hitting on them, I don't actually give a shit about what poly people do. It's just an interesting subject for discussion.