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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

He bought her diamond jewellery - Follow on thread

522 replies

Spikyseason · 29/10/2024 09:24

I was in two minds as to whether to make a follow-on thread, but primarily I wanted to thank everyone who supported me on the previous thread. I am so grateful for such comprehensive and sound advice, and for those who were brave enough to share their own experiences with me. I do at least feel less alone.

I have an update as I spoke to DH when he got home yesterday, about everything. I’ll try to summarise.

He was still cagey about his feelings for OW. He did admit he missed her and he said he had communicated that to her since. He also said he was only human and had wanted to make sure she was ok, ‘what happened’ was his fault and he hadn’t intended to hurt her or me. He apologised for it, said it wouldn’t happen again. That ultimately he had made the decision to commit to his family and the promises he made. Usual. Wanted the opportunity to prove that.

The furthest he would admit to was that it was an emotional thing (couldn’t really deny that given the jewellery - he promised it was not a ring) but ultimately being in his children’s lives was more important, that clearly there are problems in our marriage that he should have addressed, he didn’t blame me, but overall he felt we could work on any problems between us for the sake of DC and he understood it would take a long time for me to trust him.

I do feel very much like he wants to just get back to normal asap. I also feel like he is maybe either lying to me about feelings for OW or in denial. Perhaps he thinks with time any feelings will fade. I think though if you genuinely loved someone that never goes away. I don’t suppose I’ll get any true answers on that front. I mean worst case he did and I suppose we just carry on and hope for the best and he forgets all about her, if he genuinely is committed to that?

On some level of course I worry this would never have happened if he genuinely loved me. I read something somewhere once that if someone falls in love outside of the marriage then it’s almost always irreconcilable. But if we’re both determined to make it work then I hope eventually the memory and pain will fade? I don’t know - I would welcome thoughts from those who tried but ultimately had to call it a day 😕 I don’t know if I’m kidding myself. My primary concern is DC but also aware I have a fear of change.

I was having therapy before, I’ve rebooked some sessions to help get my head straight as I don’t feel strong enough to leave yet. Part of me feels like time will test his actual commitment. Then there’s the angry part of me that doesn’t see why he should just be able to walk out on his wife and family into a shiny new life…

Anyway, I just wanted to provide a little update and thank you all again x

OP posts:
pikkumyy77 · 24/11/2024 22:38

Well said @NoisyDenimShaker !

MidnightMilkman · 24/11/2024 23:17

Spikyseason · 24/11/2024 21:29

Well that was what was weird he confessed to all this stuff but the not about the earrings and not about his feelings for her. Why? It really makes no sense.

Because to the outside world you'd look reasonable to leave him, and he'd be the bad guy.

In his head if you leave him then the marriage breakdown is your fault. He can spin the narrative that he wanted to stay and was remorseful but you've left and taken his kids away from him.

The added detail of expensive gifts and feelings makes him look unreasonable.

He's wrong, and a total prick.

I'd also worry how much of his behaviour is money motivated. If in his head the expensive gift is a worse crime than the affair, then he values money over the relationship. Is he just stealing your life so he doesn't have to pay maintenance. Stealing your time so he can have free time whenever he feels like it, but if he was sharing custody he'd actually have to do some parenting.

I hope that this time next year you'll be looking forward to Christmas, and looking back and be glad you left him x

NoisyDenimShaker · 24/11/2024 23:37

Spikyseason · 24/11/2024 21:29

Well that was what was weird he confessed to all this stuff but the not about the earrings and not about his feelings for her. Why? It really makes no sense.

I suppose he was leaving his options open, knowing he was headed for divorce if he told you about the feelings and the 20k jewellery. Which I can’t even believe she accepted, by the way. It’s far too much, and such a gift from a mere paramour would have made me feel a bit claustrophobic, I think.

friendlycat · 25/11/2024 00:12

I think it’s going to be just too hard to be happy with someone who has done this to you and all the subsequent conversations, confessions, lack of remorse etc etc.

Then when you add in the ONS prior to your marriage and knowledge of cheating on previous girlfriends when he could simply have broken up with a girlfriend and afterwards embarked on a new relationship, it’s not adding up to a picture of a man with many morals.

Understandably you’re looking for answers, but sometimes you just won’t find them. You know that financially you’re completely fine going forward. I understand you want to get Christmas out of the way, but I really hope however sad and scared you are that you promise yourself that 2025 is the year to focus on you and the future.

Rainwind65 · 25/11/2024 08:47

Spikyseason · 24/11/2024 21:29

Well that was what was weird he confessed to all this stuff but the not about the earrings and not about his feelings for her. Why? It really makes no sense.

Because OP, he loved (loves) her. He wants to protect her at all costs even though this means you might have to live in doubt and agony to figure out...

Sorry OP, there is no coming back from this. Be strong, go through Xmas but build the life that works for YOU, don't live as his support animal. Life is too short. Sending hugs xxx

Plastictrees · 25/11/2024 09:29

I think he is ‘trickle truthing’ - giving you breadcrumbs of the truth to placate you, whilst not disclosing the full story. Again this serves the function of controlling the narrative and means he can try to lie to himself that he’s been honest with you, and continue his faux dutiful family man act. He deliberately keeps back the details that he knows would illicit a response from you that would not be favourable to him. Such as seeing the upset that he has caused, being put on the spot to answer questions.

Sometimes our desire to understand keeps us stuck. It is only natural to want to understand but I think one day soon the ‘why’s’ will matter to you less OP.

pikkumyy77 · 25/11/2024 12:49

Yes—the resson why Lundy Bancroft’s book on abuse is called Why Does He Do That? Is because women frequently get stuck trying to puzzle out their abuser’s behavior with their rational and analytic mind. But this is dangerous and can lead to freezing and capitulating (both trauma responses) and are also energy sucks that divert energy away from escape.

I am so, so, sorry. I kind of eish OP could tell her dh she wants cash under the tree in the equivalent of what was given to the mistress. Then just take it and leave Christmas morning.

KaleQueen · 25/11/2024 13:45

@Spikyseason i know this is minor in the scheme of things, but is he now saying it was earrings? When he first said it was a necklace?

Spikyseason · 25/11/2024 13:51

KaleQueen · 25/11/2024 13:45

@Spikyseason i know this is minor in the scheme of things, but is he now saying it was earrings? When he first said it was a necklace?

No he said it was a necklace but I generally have no idea. I just realised I said earrings in an earlier post - sorry, brain gone…! 🤦‍♀️ it was jewellery of some kind, that’s all I really know for sure. Other have speculated it was a ring, but I think that’s doubtful.

I haven’t read the book from Lundy Bancroft. I will do that, I think I just need to stop ruminating over it, it’s exhausting. Thankfully DC are caught up with Xmas plans to notice too much is wrong at the moment.

OP posts:
LivelyMintViper · 25/11/2024 13:54

Wouldn't being in receipt of such expensive gifts from an older man make you feel you were being paid for your attentions? Such a cliche. I'd be inclined to think his peers would see him as rather pathetic and embarrassing

Spikyseason · 25/11/2024 13:58

LivelyMintViper · 25/11/2024 13:54

Wouldn't being in receipt of such expensive gifts from an older man make you feel you were being paid for your attentions? Such a cliche. I'd be inclined to think his peers would see him as rather pathetic and embarrassing

She probably was in kind, I don’t know, I guess that was probably all he felt he could offer…!
I don’t know what her intentions were, or how she felt, or what she knew and when. I am trying not to think about her too much to be honest, and just try and focus on what a complete prick he’s been. She could have been anyone at the end of the day. Men with money will always be able to attract objectively attractive women.
whether it was real is another matter and I guess he’ll find out soon enough if he tries going back!

OP posts:
KaleQueen · 25/11/2024 14:27

Don’t beat yourself for thinking about it. It will be all consuming and it’s your brains way of processing the utter trauma of it all. I would be destroyed so you’re doing well managing to function and get on with life.

Dollybantree · 25/11/2024 14:28

Spikyseason · 24/11/2024 21:29

Well that was what was weird he confessed to all this stuff but the not about the earrings and not about his feelings for her. Why? It really makes no sense.

I'd say bc he wants to control the narrative and his outward image. Did he tell you about the ONS when you were in discovery/confessional mode and you asked him why he even married you? Possibly he told you as a kind of "look, even then I had my doubts and had a pre-marital shag but ultimately I'd committed to marry you so went ahead with it"(because I'm such a great guy!)

Whereas he didn't tell you about the diamonds or his true feelings for her as at that point he wanted you to shut up about it so he could brush it under the carpet - again so he can play his part of the "decent guy doing the right thing despite it not being what he really wants". These men will only tell you what they have to in the moment and will obviously leave everything out that doesn't play into their version of the truth.

Garlicpest · 25/11/2024 17:37

In my mind it was a tiara 😂Way back at the beginning of your previous thread, I mentally scrolled through some options and picked the most frivolous.

Do read the Bancroft book, @Spikyseason! For me, its greatest value at the time was that it afforded some detachment. Rather like the effect of reading 'The Script' while you're living it, the discovery that these behaviours belong to archetypes so common that they can be defined in a fairly slim volume helped to lift me out of the sense that I was mired in a uniquely personal mess.

Mumsnet's brilliant for this, too, of course!

Londonmummy66 · 25/11/2024 19:09

MidnightMilkman · 24/11/2024 23:17

Because to the outside world you'd look reasonable to leave him, and he'd be the bad guy.

In his head if you leave him then the marriage breakdown is your fault. He can spin the narrative that he wanted to stay and was remorseful but you've left and taken his kids away from him.

The added detail of expensive gifts and feelings makes him look unreasonable.

He's wrong, and a total prick.

I'd also worry how much of his behaviour is money motivated. If in his head the expensive gift is a worse crime than the affair, then he values money over the relationship. Is he just stealing your life so he doesn't have to pay maintenance. Stealing your time so he can have free time whenever he feels like it, but if he was sharing custody he'd actually have to do some parenting.

I hope that this time next year you'll be looking forward to Christmas, and looking back and be glad you left him x

THis is an excellent and hard headed look at his behaviour

Spikyseason · 25/11/2024 19:22

Londonmummy66 · 25/11/2024 19:09

THis is an excellent and hard headed look at his behaviour

I completely agree and I value the insight. I kind of suspect a lot of his behaviour has been to push me into making the decision but I just don’t get why he is staying then!! Like just leave. Why do I have to do it. So cowardly.

OP posts:
TipsyJoker · 25/11/2024 19:33

Spikyseason · 25/11/2024 19:22

I completely agree and I value the insight. I kind of suspect a lot of his behaviour has been to push me into making the decision but I just don’t get why he is staying then!! Like just leave. Why do I have to do it. So cowardly.

So he can play the victim. And also so he doesn’t have to pay you a big chunk of money.

Londonmummy66 · 25/11/2024 19:36

Spikyseason · 25/11/2024 19:22

I completely agree and I value the insight. I kind of suspect a lot of his behaviour has been to push me into making the decision but I just don’t get why he is staying then!! Like just leave. Why do I have to do it. So cowardly.

It's not cowardly - never tell yourself that - but these things take time to plan and prepare and I think you are right to get Christmas over first - otherwise every future Christmas for you and your children will be overshadowed by the split. Make some happy memories for the 3 of you.

I also agree with @LivelyMintViper that feeling he had to buy very expensive diamond jewellery for the OW suggests he had to pay for the sex and jewellery was less transactional than cash. Begs the question what sort of woman accepts such a gift for being someone's shag on the side.

I still think you should get him to put £80k into accounts for each of the DC before you tell him you want a divorce - play on the guilt and then that is their uni fees taken care of even if he does a total abscond to work abroad and avoid maintenance at some point in the future.

AlertCat · 25/11/2024 20:33

Spikyseason · 25/11/2024 19:22

I completely agree and I value the insight. I kind of suspect a lot of his behaviour has been to push me into making the decision but I just don’t get why he is staying then!! Like just leave. Why do I have to do it. So cowardly.

Because he needs you to be the bad one here. His self image can’t take being the one to end your marriage (his behaviour notwithstanding- he doesn’t count that, he counts the act of ‘formally’ ending things) so if you do it, he can blame you for it.

Garlicpest · 25/11/2024 21:03

TipsyJoker · 25/11/2024 19:33

So he can play the victim. And also so he doesn’t have to pay you a big chunk of money.

I'd just like to point out that, in the UK, 'fault' has no bearing on any financial settlement. The only ground for divorce is 'irretrievable breakdown': the parties' behaviour isn't even mentioned on any legal document. Financial adjudications start from a presumption of 50/50 ownership and prioritise the needs of school-age children.

Someone's view of their personal reputation is their own issue, of course.

TipsyJoker · 25/11/2024 22:12

Garlicpest · 25/11/2024 21:03

I'd just like to point out that, in the UK, 'fault' has no bearing on any financial settlement. The only ground for divorce is 'irretrievable breakdown': the parties' behaviour isn't even mentioned on any legal document. Financial adjudications start from a presumption of 50/50 ownership and prioritise the needs of school-age children.

Someone's view of their personal reputation is their own issue, of course.

I’m in the UK. I was more talking about having to pay maintenance for the children and of course, his wife will be entitled to half of everything.

5475878237NC · 25/11/2024 22:28

Garlicpest · 25/11/2024 21:03

I'd just like to point out that, in the UK, 'fault' has no bearing on any financial settlement. The only ground for divorce is 'irretrievable breakdown': the parties' behaviour isn't even mentioned on any legal document. Financial adjudications start from a presumption of 50/50 ownership and prioritise the needs of school-age children.

Someone's view of their personal reputation is their own issue, of course.

These are relatively recent changes many people probably don't know about.

goingdownfighting · 25/11/2024 22:28

Yes but it's not just about finance is it?

He'll be telling their children that OP is breaking the family up by leaving. That it's her fault for not forgiving him, that she's being selfish and punishing the whole family because of some tiny little mistake (cue sad face).

That's the narrative.

Then will come the finance. He will give her as little as possible because she's the one who's leaving so it all will have to be done around his needs and conveniences.

pikkumyy77 · 25/11/2024 22:34

Yes. If you leave him, even “for cause” he will feel retroactively purged of guilt and will be able to launch his next affair guilt free.

Garlicpest · 25/11/2024 22:54

I'm confused by the last few posts. OP doesn't need to physically vacate the home to start a divorce. If she was thinking of moving out, apologies - I must have missed that.

I thought @Spikyseason was mulling over reasons why her H hadn't left her for Ms Diamonds, not saying she herself would leave. (Probably because their relationship wasn't 'real'. It's a mistake to invest much effort in mind-reading, though!)