How to decline working with the OW

[VelociraptorsVelociRapping]

Sorry - just realised that my phone autocorrected the title and I can't edit now I've posted. It should read OW, not OP.

I have posted before about STBXH and OW, who work in the same industry as me. I work in a different organisation to them (they met at work) but the sector is relatively small and there is a lot of inter-organisation networking and collaboration. All of this is voluntary and external to our employers so there is no HR or similar. In my last thread I pretended that we were all in plumbing so I may as well stick with that.

The current issue is this - there are various plumbing-related events in our area, and before STBXH left me I was starting to make a bit of a name for myself as a speaker in local networks. I want to continue to do this if at all possible. OW is a very effective self-publicist and although she is younger and more junior than me she is quite well-known and established as a voice for ‘women in plumbing’. She has some very influential friends in the industry. She is also from an ethnic group which is under-represented in the sector and vocal in networks for this group.

There are a few big events coming up and I have been approached to speak. At one of the events, to which I have already said yes, I’ve now been asked if OW and I would co-facilitate. I cannot work with her. It is as simple as that. The question is what I tell the organisers. If I simply say that I won’t work with her, and refuse to elaborate, I leave myself open to accusations of prejudice (our sector is VERY sensitive to the appearance of any discrimination). If I back out of the event altogether I risk an influential group of people thinking that I am flaky or unreliable, and frankly I don't think I should have to miss out on this opportunity just because she is shagging my STBXH.

I want to tell them very simply that I cannot work with her because she was involved in the break-up of my marriage, with no further details. Is this a terrible idea?

I work in events with conference producers. I completely disagree with honesty in this case.

Select another topic/panel/session and say there is a conflict of interest with the subject matter/your preference is to be on another panel better aligned with your current focus/interest/expertise.

On a side note, I cannot believe this woman would have the brass neck to accept a place on the panel. If she has any remaining integrity (doubtful, I know) she'll decline and leave you free to do it.

If this becomes an ongoing issue I'd then consider being more open - not the first time.

Just be honest OP. I work in HR and we’ve had staff confide that they can’t do xyz for similar reasons. It’s fine. We owe them a duty of care too.

This is not an employer event, it's not an HR situation. It's a voluntary event in a small industry where profile raising and public speaking is important.

The affair is nothing to do with work. If a panellist (a woman of colour) is dropped because of her sex life, it presents a risk for the organisers.

I know the fantasy is that the OP names and shames the OW and owns the event triumphantly to huge acclaim while the OW licks her wounds in private. This is not a Hollywood film. This will not happen.

Literally most people give zero shits about who sleeps with who. The OP will suffer the fallout - at least in the short term.

I'm not being negative - I just think the OP has to consider her position long and hard (the PP suggesting a change of panel/subject is a good idea) in terms of her career and ability to make money. Not just in moral high ground / catharsis.

Hey @VelociraptorsVelociRapping you are amazing working your way though this & there is no doubt that you will be able to pick the wheat from the chaff in suggestions for the most appropriate wording upthread. Remember to practice saying it a few times to help let go of some of the emotion attached to the event.

Trying to encourage sympathy from others doesn't really work but your response can create empathy.

It must be hard. We are all behind you.

It might be wise to view this as an opportunity to demonstrate your exemplary level of professionalism.

This is perfect.

OP here checking in after a late night of plumbing.

Thank you for all of your thoughts. I am reading them carefully and taking them on board. I will update!

Rooting for you OP, and well done for doing so well in your industry. I do agree w pps that some of this advice is naive. I have experience of v manipulative people in my family, & setting a trap is exactly the sort of thing they would do. So your ex & OW announced something on LinkedIn? I worry that if you tell the truth, they will both spread lies, & the end result will be that you may be painted as the villain. Others may feel they don't want to get involved, & those who know the OW but not you may be prejudiced against you by her.
If industry is small this is more of an issue. If you withdraw that's bad for your career, & if OW withdraws then she has more incentive to spread untrue rumours. Is there any way you could co-facilitate w her if pluckyday's suggestion isn't accepted? Or would it be too upsetting? I get if it would be impossible to do the work w her, it's just that I'm worried the other alternatives could be turned against you. Or, in the worst case, you could be taken ill the day of the conference?

I should probably clarify the LinkedIn thing as it wasn't quite a 'launch' as such. They attended the event as a couple and it was commented on by a number of mutual contacts. I posted this on my other thread a few weeks ago by way of explanation:

"No-one posted content to launch the relationship explicitly, eg 'I'm pleased to announce that I'm taking up a new position shagging Velociraptor's STBXH.' It was a big event in our industry which had its own hashtags and which attendees were encouraged to post about, and because we're in the same region and industry we have a lot of mutuals so it dominated my timeline on LinkedIn, X and Bluesky.

"So say for the purposes of illustration that we're all plumbers. Most of my feed was posts along the line of 'Had a great time at #PlumbFest2024. So exciting to hear about the new developments in u-bend technology from STBXH', etc etc. Everyone then comments on each others' posts and this is what I saw, as I have both STBXH and OW muted on all platforms. So OW would comment on a mutual's post, and I would see their reply along the lines of 'so great to see you there OW, and looking so happy with Mr Velociraptor!' etc etc. What is REALLY galling is that OW is a big voice in 'women in plumbing' so there were loads of sycophantic posts from various other women in this network: 'so great to hear from OW about the importance of parental leave in plumbing. Simply the most compassionate and wise voice in women's plumbing at the moment'. You get the idea."

I am listening to all points. The suggestion that it might be a trap did occur to me. I think on balance it is quite unlikely and I suspect she is probably just as horrified as me to have been asked to co-facilitate, but I can't be sure and I will keep my guard up nevertheless. I am seeing one of the conference organisers tomorrow and will find an opportunity to speak to them privately. Thanks to those who gave the very good advice not to put anything in writing.

If she were just as horrified as you then she would have done the right thing and politely refused, taking the hit instead of you.

Yeah, but would someone who's had an affair with a married man have that kind of understanding of ethics and doing the right thing ...?

ah I understand about the LinkedIn now. That was def unpleasant that you had to see all those posts about supporting other women!
Perhaps I & others are being oversuspicious about the trap, but I agree it's best to be on guard. She may indeed be as unhappy w it as you are, but you can't be sure. Ambition can be good ofc, but combined w deceiving people in such a horrible way suggests she could be quite ruthless if she felt threatened. & your industry being close-knit & a bit 'old boys club' doesn't help the situation.

Yeah -the truth.
Always the truth.

Well, quite.

Hmm yes - the truth, with your voice on an actual phone call is probably the best way. I am revising my suggestion of an email from previously - you don't need it documented in writing that you can't stand to work with her just yet. .

As an aside, you are very VERY restrained and dignified. I don't know any of you from Adam, but I am seething at her 'Look at me advocating for women in plumbing - all that 'I'm a girls girl' and 'Women standing together' bullshit when she is absolutely, anything but.

If you'd like us all to stage a protest at #PlumbFest2025 next year, just say the word and we are there. Who the fuck says in a LinkedIn comment 'lovely to see you looking so happy with Mr Velociraptor'? Shouldn't they have been behaving professionally - in public at least? I wonder if that was actually a coded comment meaning 'we all saw you draping yourself over him FFS'.

Wise and compassionate my arse.

Some posters are suggesting you should be the bigger person and suck it up and work with her. I know you're not intending that but in case you are re-considering I'd be wary of her taking the opportunity to "booby trap" you in some way that it blows up in your face and she comes up smelling of roses.

I'd go with the consensus and say, face to face or on phone, along the lines of
"This is rather delicate and I'd appreciate if you would keep this confidential within the organising committee but Jennifer is involved in the break-down of my marriage and as divorce proceedings are ongoing it would be inappropriate for us to collaborate on this occasion".

"However I know a young up and coming plumber, Allara Tapsaraff, who I think would work well with Jennifer" etc

Then, by declining gracefully and giving someone else an opportunity you come across as magnanimous rather than malicious/sour grapes.

I didn't read the last thread but the linked in is good (if painful, I'm sorry for the whole shitty experience but you're better than them). It's better in that it makes what you're saying verifiable.

You can call or meet the organiser- I wouldn't start putting things in writing- say ' I was hoping you might be able to rearrange the speakers at PlumbCon. Susan Leaky-Bog was involved in the breakdown of my marriage. It's of course a small industry but it is early days to be comfortable working closely with Susan. Is there any way we could be assigned to different parts of the schedule?'

I would say don't torture yourself by forcing yourself to push through or back down without trying, just go about it acknowledging that it's an awkward thing for you to have to ask and you hope to be able to manage similar situations in future, it's just too soon. I think most people would understand.

I'm loving the names, would definitely attend a conference co-facilitated by Susan Leaky-Bog and Allara Tapsaraff. They should have a podcast.

I love you @Catandsquirrel. OW will forever more be Susan Leaky-Bog in my head.

I have an update. I will throw some food at my children and return.

Agree

OK, so I saw one of the conference organisers today at a meeting. I knew she would be there and had worked out how I was going to catch her alone, what I was going to say, and thanks to your suggestions had two names to suggest as replacements.

People were milling about getting coffee at the beginning and she took me aside to tell me that Susan Leaky-Bog had dropped out of the conference without only the vaguest of reasons and would I mind facilitating on my own? She started wondering out loud why SL-B might have dropped out so I stopped her and said that I thought I knew why. I gave her a very brief factual account and used some of your language - you might have heard that Mr Velociraptor and I have separated, what you might not know is that he is in a relationship with SL-B and that this was a factor in the end of our marriage, so I had actually been planning to withdraw today as it would have been inappropriate to co-facilitate while the legal practicalities of the divorce are being thrashed out, etc. She was horrified and very sympathetic. I gave her the two names that I had prepared and she is going to approach them to see if one or both would be willing to replace SL-B.

Then about an hour ago I got a text from another conference committee member, who I know reasonably well but not really enough to approach directly about this, asking if she could call me. She had spoken to the other organiser and wanted to apologise for putting Susan and me on the same event. She said that she knew Mr V and I had separated and that SL-B was in a newish relationship but she hadn’t joined the dots.

So, it would appear that Ms Leaky-Bog was as blindsided as me by the organisers’ plans. Both the organisers are women who take no shit (which would be particularly useful if we were actually plumbers) and were very unimpressed to learn of SL-B’s recent choices (and, indeed, by Mr Velociraptor’s). This was heartening as I was a bit concerned that I might not be able to count quite as much on the level of sympathy and support that I have had from you all in the real world.

So it looks like I will do the event after all, hopefully alongside Allara Tapsaraff. It feels like a tiny bit of karmic justice after an absolute shit of a year.

Thank you for the support and kind words (including the blunt ones), you lovely vipers 🐍.

Well done OP. This is a brilliant result. You've handled it really professionally (and so actually have the conference organisers). Good news too for Allara, who will never know why this fantastic opportunity to take the world of plumbing by storm came her way.

Leaky Susan sounds as if she has run off to hide - the right move on her part.
Try not to call your co-facilitator Allara in the actual session won't you and best of luck with the conference 😀

Pleased to read your update OP. And OW won't be there at all, which is even better! Hope it all goes well when the conference comes round.

Great stuff OP

What a fantastic result! Well done OP! Having been fucked over by an OW (known as Cruella in our house), I have taken some joy from this! I hope that you do a fantastic presentation and the whispers spread far and wide. Susan Leaky-Bog may come to regret her choices in life. Touché!

Absolutely brilliant, this problem has officially been flushed away.