Does anal sex need explicit consent?

[TellingFriends]

2 month relationship.

Man and woman have consensual PIV sex. Is it acceptable for him to have anal sex with her without asking first?

Woman would not have consented if asked beforehand but did not stop him.

Is it fair for him to assume the woman will say no if she doesn't want it?

Woman had never had anal sex before. Woman is also a CSA survivor but he didn't know this.

If he didn't ask, it's rape.

Definitely.

He should absolutely have asked first, verbally. I hate that some men think this is the norm to do this to women and we're expected to just suck it up. Ideally, the woman would speak up and say " stop" but you never know how someone might be feeling and they way they'd react. They might freeze up, be frightened, accept it as normal, etc. So yes, it's rape.

I think some men do try to see how the women react/push their luck- if she will go with it or say something. If she says something then he goes with oops it was a mistake bulls##t

surely 'accident' = he has groomed her into thinking she has to do whatever he wants and because she's been traumatised by childhood experiences she freezes
And of course it wasn't an accident, he knew exactly what area of her body he was penetrating 🤬

Agree. It requires about three times more lube than you think. There is no natural lubrication down there. And what about communication from him? When did he ask if she was okay?

I don’t know where to even start with this ‘advice’. He didn’t ask - he didn’t check. It’s rape. She can call rape it because that’s what any kind of sex without consent IS.

I'm sorry you've been through this, OP. Have you got a friend you can talk to? (I mean, other than the Mumsnet Vipers, excellent though we are)

It doesn't matter what he says or how much of an "accident" he claims it was, he had no right and there should always be enthusiastic consent.

Freezing is not consent.

Take care of yourself.

As I frequently say, rape is nothing to do with consent. The rapist doesn't care whether a victim consents and the victim is usually stuck in a freeze response because it's done with a degree of violence. Please if you don't know what you're talking about then DON'T COMMENT.

OP, the real question here is how this has made you feel. You might be in a mindset at the moment of feeling really confused and just not had the time to process what has happened. Give yourself time to figure it out and when you're feeling up to it, please consider reporting it to the police. Hope you're okay.

Did they continue?

OP, I'm sorry this has happened to you. Do you have a good support network? Would it be worth reaching out to organisations that offer support? e.g. Victim Support, The Survivors Trust, Women's Aid

This organisation has a 24 hour helpline:

https://www.nationaldahelpline.org.uk/

Absolutely not. Anal sex is not ‘conventional’ sex so you wouldn’t assume when you go to bed with someone you are going for anal. This needs to be discussed in whatever form that discussion takes (you don’t have to say ‘I don’t want anal’ beforehand, it shouldn’t be assumed it’s on the table by your partner)

Everything is about consent, and consent is a hell of a lot more complex than saying yes or no out loud. I saw your post on first page about if this could happen by accident… nope. Vagina and anus feel very different, there’s no mistake here.

I haven’t read the whole thread but I’m sorry this has happened to you and you should seek support x

My exh used to 'accidentally' try it regularly. He used to be coercive. Try and tell me women like it and I was weird for not wanting to do anal.

He used to use me like a doll. It was horrible.

I didn't know at the time but I think he assaulted me many times when I just didn't realise it was assault. I was 'consenting' to stop him being angry or because he would sulk or guilt trip me.

I obviously stopped trusting him in bed. We only had our child because he removed the condom without me consenting more than once and then wore me down to do this without contraception.

He told me angrily that sex with me was like a simulated rape. I was a 'nun' and needed a sex therapist because of my issues.

It was an awful abusive relationship. Please end your relationship before he really hurts you, mentally or physically. He has no respect for you or your boundaries.

No, it's rape. Plain and simple. If you consented to oral sex and he then did PIV sex and you hadn't consented, I don't think you'd be in doubt it was rape. Just because you consent to one thing, doesn't give him the right to do whatever he wants.
I hope you're OK x

Any sexual act must be consensual. No sexual act is accidental.

Someone did this to me once it was horrible and really bled. He said he 'thought I wanted to' no idea why anyone would want to do that with no lube or warning. Prick. He said he stopped as soon as I told him to and he was sorry.. I was trying to work out after if it was rape too. In any case I never saw him again.

As a lover of anal, absolutely not, it is an explicit conversation even when you regularly do it, it requires consent every time.

It can be accidental for half a thrust at most, the two holes are close and slippery.

Yes, it needs explicit consent.

Sorry this happened you.

Nope. You’re wrong. It has to be explicit ‘yes I want to do this’. People freeze. This is known and this is still rape.

If you've ever tried to shove a finger up a mans arse mid shag, you'll know they perfectly understand the concepts of ongoing consent, withdrawal of consent and sexual boundaries. They only act confused about it when it's women's bodies.

Don't put up with their bullshit. All sexual acts must be consensual.

I think even these days there are men who will hide behind it being accidental - even though it can't be, as many pp have said, and say "whoops sorry" (or whatever. What proves the point is if it keeps happening.

However, what there is no excuse for these days is what my ex used to do - just used to try and slip it in whilst in the midst of piv sex. So his penis would "slip" out and then try to "slip" in the back door. I'm talking about 25+ years ago though - and I was fairly green and hadn't heard of heterosexual anal sex. He tried this a few times and eventually I realised that it wasn't accidental so I started crying out "NO" as soon as he tried to do it (which is what I suggest you try to do if it happens again). TBH he didn't seem much interested in piv sex now I think about it, and as I wasn't up for anal, no wonder it was doomed.

However, this wasn't a young inexperienced man, so I did wonder how he thought it wouldn't hurt me - no prep or anything, just wham bam thank you ma'am (or would have been). Surely he must have realised that if someone shoved something up his jacksy it would fucking hurt. Selfish bastard.

Absolutely explicit consent (and usually a fair amount of prep!???) is needed. Only caveat would be if it was something you did regularly together and it was a frequent part of your sex life - maybe then implied consent would be fine. But that clearly wasn't the case here. I'm so sorry - what a prick.

This is awful,I hope you are safe from him now xx

I wonder if he was crying because he knew he'd committed rape and he could go to prison for it.

Bastard rapist.