Gaslighting H but I’m not sure he knows he’s doing it? Was I wrong today?

[MrsHelenHuntingdon]

My H is a nice person but had an abusive upbringing which affects a lot of his behaviour.
I have posted before. He has promised to change and that things will be better. I am giving it 6 weeks to see if things improve. If not I’m finally leaving.

I have recently been in therapy. My self esteem hit rock bottom and I was incredibly depressed. The therapist has helped me see that I’m not the awful person I thought I was, but that there’s been gaslighting to make me think this. I’m getting there now and much better than I was.

This morning - was I wrong??

I returned to work yesterday after 5 months off. This morning I was very tired and just wanted to stay in bed for a while. At 8am the kids came to say the dog had weed all over the toys in the living room and on the carpet. H had been up and downstairs for over an hour but hadn’t put his dog out.
This is typical of life in general. If I’m not there to oversee/do, then most house and child tasks will not be done.

I got up and I was annoyed. I said ‘why didn’t you put the dog out? I don’t understand it!’ he rounded on me instantly with ‘well your dog has shit in the house before, what about that then!?’ I said ‘well, yes if she’s ill or when she was a puppy’ and he really angrily turned on me with ‘well you can’t say anything, your dog has done it, how was I to know’ etc etc and ‘why do you always do this?? Why do you get up and start arguments and have a go at me?’

I answered that I hadn’t, but it was really annoying when I wanted to rest and he couldn’t even just let the dog out without me there to do it. He said he did open the door but he didn’t go out so wtf did I expect him to do? He’s had enough of me having a go at him etc.

Im now sat in my room crying (again) feeling like some awful nagging wife who just has a go at everyone all the time. The kids have gone with him.

I’ve been doing so much work on this and I was getting so much better, but now I’m just thinking it’s all the therapist being nice to me and that really it is me that’s constantly at fault.

Is it? I was really annoyed with him.

He massively overreacted and tried (successfully) to deflect the conversation away from something he did wrong to something you supposedly did wrong. This isn’t gaslighting.
It sounds like a horrible relationship to be in if this is typical of your interactions.

Agree with pp. Sounds like a miserable relationship and you don't like each other very much.

The my dog / your dog thing seems rather reflective of the fact that you don't really work as a partnership.

It's not going to change. I don't know if it's ever been good, but I'd put the plans in motion to split now.

If you genuinely think he’s not doing it on purpose, look up rejection sensitivity.

However, it’s very hard to be in a functioning relationship with someone who simply can’t admit that they could have handled the situation differently. It’s not okay for you to be the scapegoat and blamed for everything.

It doesn't sound like it's working , he didn't respond well to you but if my husband was up and my children said the dog had done this to me while still in bed, I'd have said go and tell dad as he's up and can sort it. If he can't be trusted to clean up a mess like this without you stepping in first I'm not sure you are going to resolve the issues in 6 weeks.

I use to use the phrase

" but that's not the discussion here":

I'm talking about the dog weeing on the floor this morning and you not letting it out.

Keep to the facts, don't get drawn into, but you did this 6 months ago or whatever.

The fact that the kids came to you to sort it out speaks volumes. Why didn't he leap into action to sort out the dog wee?

I don't know if I'd call it gaslighting but he obviously unable to handle any criticism and lashes out as a result.

Why is it my dog/your dog, aren’t they family dogs?

His reaction is infuriating and irrelevant, why not just say yeah sorry I was doing xyz I forgot, and why was the kids first reaction to come and tell you, when he was the one up with them? That says a lot about who they know gets stuff sorted :(

Its not really gaslighting but it’s trying to find blame elsewhere rather than just admitting something has gone wrong and needs sorting out.

Yes. No need to wait 6 weeks for things to improve. Get rid now.

Its not your fault, no

Not gaslighting, just common or garden deflection. It's very common.

First person: Could you please not do [thing] which creates more work for me?

Second person: Well what about that time when you [similar sounding act, but removed in time and not relevant to this conversation]?

Usually followed by escalation/shouting/stomping off, because of lack of emotional regulation on their part

It's just people who can't accept fault, nothing to do with you bring in the wrong for validly bringing up an issue, but they want to shut it down and stop you doing it, so the above is an effective technique.

I returned to work yesterday after 5 months off
what's been happening in the last 5 months? What was he doing this morning? Was he up and actually dealing with dc?

Why are you waiting for 6 more weeks of this shit? :(

Thank you. I suppose it’s the fact that it makes me feel like the most naggy, horrible, confrontational person in the world. The way he talks makes me think that he’s amazed that I’ve brought it up, because anyone else would just not mind and say nothing. Whereas I’m always ‘having a go’ at him.

I have been having similar abuse from his family for many years as we live next door to them in one of their houses. A whole other thread. I suppose I just feel like I really am this awful person, or why would they all treat me like this.
He disagrees with his family but then treats me the same way. I don’t think he’d accept this as true but it is.

I’ve been off work with stress and depression.

He was up but he’s always up early. The children don’t need anything doing they are at a pretty self sufficient age.

@MrsHelenHuntingdon i spent 20 years in marriage where conversations like this happened ALL the time.

I told myself there must be a reason for it and maybe it was his upbringing etc and if it were one of our kids were behaving the same in their future relationships, i'd want them to be given a chance.

But there are only so many chances, and nobody deserves to be treated the way you are. Its clear from the words you've uses you're already decided you're splitting up.

So take these 6 weeks to get all your ducks in a row. Gather as much of you family financial info etc as you can, because he doesn't sound like he's going to take it well

My ex was like this, you'll never get him to see what he's doing to you because it works for him. I was never allowed to express any sort of annoyance at him even when he had, for example, left the hob on for 6 hours, I was never allowed to have a discussion about anything I was having an issue with without it immediately being turned back on me then he would end up shouting at me that I was a fucking cunt and always causing problems etc. I got so anxious living with him I would have heart palpitations and shake if I knew I had to mention something. Leave him.

I’m waiting to see what happens with a job he’s applied for. The job has a tied house and is about 250 miles away from his family and in the county I want to be in.

If he gets it, we can move as a family and see if things are better once away from his family. If they’re not, I can leave him but at least we’ll all be in the same county.

If he doesn’t get the job, I am leaving on my own with the children.

It's not normal to sit there and let the dog pee over the toys and living room.

Did he let it and then tell the kids to go and tell you or did they tell him and he said tell your mother it's her dog. He doesn't sound like he is a nice person.

It sounds like it will be a long 6 weeks if this is day 1. Is it worth the extra 41 days or should you just finish it now and get on with life especially if you are back at work. Why not make it a completely fresh start and remove the probably cause of your depression?

He won’t change.
It isn’t you it’s him.
Being generous to him you could look up rejection sensitivity dysphoria

Why didn't he sort it out if he was up. Why did the children not just tell him. When the children came in why didn't you say to them go and get dad to sort it out.

Leave. Men like this are just deeply unpleasant and will never, ever change. Because they don’t think they’re the problem.

A new job won't give him a personality transplant, it'll probably make his behaviour worse as he'll have a lot of new stressors but I can understand wanting to know you tried absolutely everything. I don't know why you want to stay with someone who treats you like that though, you deserve better x

Adding that rejection sensitivity dysphoria doesn’t explain why he didn’t take responsibility for making sure the dog went out nor why he didn’t clean it up

I'm going to be blunt but I'm worried re your level of dependency on him, a house tied to his family now, and moving to a house tied to his job 250 miles away. What will you do for work? How are you planning to leave with the dc in 6 weeks and where to? As mn says, get your ducks in a row!