Broke up as he was planning to propose, what to do?

[Toolittletoolatehmm]

Long relationship but never lived together (both have kids majority of time, now nearly all adults), always intended to be long term with merging homes sometimes in the future. Recently spurred by several 'life's too short' moments have had several discussions about how I'm unhappy I'm still effectively single, zero plans to formalise anything.

This weekend I wound myself into a ball and blurted out how unhappy I was and didn't see us moving forward and couldn't stay a moment longer in an uncertain unhappy future-less relationship.

Turns out he's spoken to my parents and his about proposing (they confirmed this) and a jeweller, was waiting for the right time over the summer.

Fuck. What now? I really spoiled any sort of surprise but still, having some sort of sparkly trinket does not change the domestic situation, or his apparent reasons for not being prepared to merge things up to now - is it just a 'keep her sweet for another few years' gesture?

This.

Also, OP, you describe it as an ‘unhappy’ relationship. Are you saying that the only reason it was unhappy was because he hadn’t proposed??? I find that hard to believe. You have near-adult children. If you’d thought the relationship was good bar marriage plans, surely you’d just have said ‘Let’s get married’?

It's been a tricky few years with my eldest - coming out of the other side now though and tbh might not have got like that if we'd have been together. My kids don't see their dad (his choice, don't get me started) so he's been a relatively stable if standalone part of their lives for some time. Mostly good though - or as good as the majority of other parents of teens tell me.

He has always talked of a long term future - buying a house together, eventually, retiring together, travelling etc, all very long term plans. We've been through a lot together - illnesses, close family deaths, redundancy and a fucking global pandemic where as separate households we didn't see each other for weeks - so it's not like a knee jerk reaction.

He was burned a bit by his ex - not a traumatic divorce like mine but omnipresent due to kids who are almost flown the nest - did he want to end that chapter fully before moving on?

Who knows.

Exactly!! He “spoke” to a jeweller means nothing!!

Sounds like it would have been a “shut up” ring to placate you and mean he didn’t need to offer any other commitment. Men often do this as a get out clause so any time you complain about him not moving in/making plans etc he can say “but I proposed!”.

No bloody way would I be accepting a proposal from someone I hadn’t lived with. He needs to be moving in and proving he’s decent around the house before he can be considered husband material.

I thought this was how everyone on Mumsnet wants things to be done? No blending families, ideally no dating until kids are grown up, definitely no moving in “strange men” with your kids or “imposing your sex life” on them. Why are people picking on this guy for effectively doing what is what everyone constantly says is best for the children?

i can’t believe anyone, however immature, would think that was ok. Imagine actually marrying someone who thought you were so juvenile your parents needed forewarning.

Rather like the current thread about helicopter parents who won’t let their teenagers go to a friend’s house unless they’ve vetted the parents.

It may be the case in some cultures but it was considered very old fashioned even when I was young and I'm nearly 70 now. It's also incredibly sexist and harks back to the time when women were treated like the property of men and couldn't lead fully independent lives without their father or husband's approval.

On top of all of that, these people have have got adult children themselves, so unless it's something that the OP personally valued and expected, it's just odd.

Its the summer now OP

Future faking is the phrase I used this week.

It's not an unhappy relationship per se, just I've been unhappy at his lack of commitment. And he's got form for putting stuff off - fixing the car, fixing a tap, booking holidays - usually with expensive consequences. He wouldn't argue with that.

Gonna have a chat about what the future would actually need to look like beyond some fancy bit of jewellery.

Funnily enough I'd not even thought about a proposal - my divorce was awful and I've fought hard to get where I am now. The thought of signing half of everything over to him by marriage is actually terrifying (although we are about even re assets etc). I just want a partnership where one of us cooks tea while the other cuts the grass, or we make one bed in the morning instead of two, and we can unload about our days without it impeding on 'date night' - I don't want to pack a bag every time there's a potential overnight. (And it's not about sex, just nodding off on the sofa and heading up without worrying about it I've got clean pants tomorrow)

@AnneLovesGilbert Totally agree.

When I got engaged to my first husband my mother told me my father was upset that my fiance hadn't asked him for permission. I went fucking nuts, reminded her it was 1986, not 1886, that I was over the age of 18, an adult, and the only 'permission' my fiance needed was from me, not my fucking father, and that I wasn't a piece of fucking household furniture that 'belonged' to my father. I also told her that if he had asked my father first I would have said no.

Nearly 40 years later it still pisses me off that there are women and men who buy into that bollocks...

Also, the idea of him asking my dad's permission to marry is laughable - they both know I'm too bloody independent for that!

If you’re long distance, who will have to move? How will that impact the kids? It’s not quite as easy as “if he wanted to marry you he’d have married you already” when there are children involved.

What! Ask permission to marry a daughter who herself has adult children? That's just bizarre and infantilising.

It was a tradition when women were considered property and chattels. It was also a "tradition" that men could physically chastise their wives

So how's it been left OP?

If the reason for break up was lack of commitment, and he was planning a surprise proposal or whatever, then essentially you do want the same thing.

You're grown ups so forget bruised egos because your fuse ran out before his big gesture. Don't feel guilty - sounds like he knew very well what you needed & has been reluctant to provide it, so it was only a matter of time.

If he genuinely wants to commit to you and you want to commit him, then now is the time to move on from this, move in and - if you want - marry.

If he's all shitty because you dumped him then it was all bullshit & his ego is more important than you.

Could not agree more with you.
I would have been very pissed off if DH had asked for parental permission.
It's MY choice, not theirs.
'Showing respect' means that you still buy into the concept that the bride really is owned by parents. And the men that do this 'respect' will probably want it done to them as they also 'own' their future daughters.

Sounds as if you have good reason not to want to marry, which is entirely understandable — but why doesn’t he know that about you? Communication sounds poor, or is this a man who still, somehow, doesn’t understand what you want, despite you telling him?

I think the big question is how has the situation been left. Now he knows how upset you are making and he was apparently just about the make the proposal, has he made it? If not has he told you why? Is there are special event in the next few weeks that he is planning on attaching it to? Or have you now "spoilt it" in his eyes and he has a new excuse to put it off and do nothing?

"He spoke to a jeweller" - about what? And the parents thing is just ridiculous.

I know it's old fashioned to ask for your daughter's hand in marriage, but maybe he was trying to do a nice thing and spoke to them to let them know his intentions for you.

Despite everything short-term, do you think you could be happy long-term if you can sort things out? If so, have a long hard talk with him and make it clear that if you are to be together, you want to get things moving right now working towards that and either way, you'd like to be married by a certain time. Also, the surprise hasn't totally been ruined, you have no idea when he's going to do it.

My mother said exactly the same thing when I got married in 1989 - I was angry at the time, for the same reasons as you. I was 24 and had been living away from home since I left for Uni at 18.

Years later, having wised up to her Narc ways, I realised that my father would have given zero fucks about it - it was just her usual jealous strategy of trying to spoil a nice time for me... 🙄

You know, I have been known to decide that in order to avoid cleaning something I'll do anything else first.

I'll do my grocery shopping, I'll review paperwork, I'll go for a jog, I'll call a friend. What I won't do is clean!

I don't think it is any suprise whatsoever that you've blown your lid, and as for him dithering around discussing things - well... see above.

You say it's a long relationship, I don't see how long anywhere sorry - might have missed it. But either way, get the f on with it man.

If you want something you make time, if not you make an excuse.

You're not in the wrong for this, i don't know what he thought was going to happen here. Good for you actually, I'd blow my lid as well.

If a man wants to marry you, and be with you, he makes it happen. It doesn't take years of 'nagging' him.

If you decide to accept the ring, it should be on the condition that you also set a date.

Lots of men get a ring to placate any commitment/marriage talks and kick the can down the road for a few more years. A ring doesn't mean anything.

This, did you ever propose or say 'let's just do it'?

Fuck. What now? I really spoiled any sort of surprise but still, having some sort of sparkly trinket does not change the domestic situation, or his apparent reasons for not being prepared to merge things up to now - is it just a 'keep her sweet for another few years' gesture?

Did he just meant an engagement? Did you ask him did he want a expect a long engagement or had he thought about when you should get married?

Anyway, I think speaking to your parents before speaking to you is disrespectful, patriarchal, infantilising and probably just a bullshit ploy - something to have in his back pocket to pull out the next time you brought it up. Stupid games, stupid prizes...