I’m a British female going abroad with fiance and will marry him Islamically- anything I need to consider?

[Greyrabbit24]

My fiance and I are in our 20s. We are planning a visit abroad to his home country, which is Arab. We’ll be spending a day in his family’s home before travelling around the country on our own.

My fiance is not religious but his family is. We will be having a nikah, the Islamic wedding, it will be a small family thing where the imam comes to the home to give a short ceremony.

My fiance is not religious at all and this is more of a thing done to please his family.

We will be arriving late at their home so they’ve said it’s ok if we sleep together for this night as it’s one night before the nikah. I’m also aware that I’ll have to be very covered and my fiance suggested I cover my hair during the ceremony.

Just wondered if anyone had any experience with this? I’m expecting it to be a small easy thing- is there anything else worth considering? I want to be respectful to them but at the same time I don’t want to lose myself trying to please them. Thanks all!

Why would you cover up? I'd strongly suggest you involve your family in this and discuss. If he isn't a believer why would you go to an Arab country where you will not be viewed well and take part? I think this is dangerous and don't believe what he's telling you.

It is a lie though if she has a Muslim marriage without having the faith.Red flags to have this marriage abroad without her own friends or family and does not speak the language.This makes her vulnerable.

@Greyrabbit24 I would suggest reading up on the cultural norms and even basic legal rights and requirements around marriage in the country and culture that you would be marrying in(to)...

Can you share which country it is?

I'm mid 30s and in a mixed marriage. I wouldn't do what you're planning. Not in 100 years. Please think carefully. This could be disastrous for you.

psa, Egypt and UAE are two different places and have different cultures.

But reverting to type could happen with anyone really regardless of religion…? More so because most people probably associate as being non practising Christian/Muslim/Jew/Hindu etc and come from non religious practising families, I guess that’s a risk as certain life events can make someone become more or less religious?

Also think this is better posted on a board where people have more familiarity and one on one experience with Muslim people, countries etc as I think a lot of people’s experiences in the UK with Muslim culture comes through the media so by default you will be viewed as being in immediate danger by a lot of people just be being associated with someone linked to the Muslim culture and faith.

Also everyone I know who moved to Dubai with plans of just staying for a year or so never came back 🤷🏻‍♀️ and they were both male and female and of diverse backgrounds - although were born and raised in western countries.

We stayed a year and a half, hated it, quit our jobs and returned to London. I never experienced any sexual harassment, unless you count oddities like elderly Pakistani men turning their backs on me in a lift (not immodestly dressed, wearing loose linen trousers and a t shirt) or labourers (who could have been from anywhere on the Indian subcontinent) standing staring at a clothes shop window with unclothed mannequins (which were quickly whisked away).

Which is not to say it’s not a loathsome spot — a surveillance-heavy dictatorship calculated to appear superficially Westernised and which, when I left, was already starting to clamp down on even its own citizens who wanted more democracy or transparency.

You know the one woman I knew who moved to Dubai for a year and never came back? She did this as she was newly married and with DC and it was for her DH’s career.

She ended up staying for approx 25 years and was unhappy at times whilst there.

She’s now back living in London but said when she moved to Dubai she was put under immense pressure to wear hijab, not study more, concentrate on childcare and then only got a job in a children’s nursery as this was a “safe” job to do for her. She told me she felt like she was living in a gilded cage a lot. She also said that though she likes becoming more Muslim and got used to it over time, before she went she was a typical 80s Muslim girl who wore western clothing and even did western things like go out and drink alcohol, and being told and criticised to cover up so much was a big culture shock for her.

There’s photos of her on holiday in Spain before she moved to Dubai and she’s in the hotel pool, in a plain black swimsuit, hair uncovered with her DC (then a baby).

She admits she used the malls in Dubai for the shopping experiences, designer gear and spent money there as she was upset (she was bored). She even told me, if she knew when she was 18 and getting married (arranged) and moving to Dubai, how her life would change, she wouldn’t have done it, or would’ve made more demands so it suited her. Basically she went to college, wanted to go to uni and then her parents said, no you’re getting married.

I went to see her a few times in Dubai and she was actually lovely as were her family but the first time I saw her in person with her hijab and modest clothing I was quite shocked (as opposed to seeing her like this on Facebook).

But this pressure presumably came from her DH? What nationality is he? It doesn’t sound anything at all like the Emiratis I came across, where the practice of Islam was often pretty tokenistic, hijab was very blingy (dramatic makeup and manicures, visible hair, insanely expensive shoes and bags, and the abaya parting when walking to reveal often revealing designer gear underneath — in all-female environments, the look was more ‘designer-clad pole dancer’ than modest hijabi) and there was a huge push for Emirati women to study and take up front-facing government posts (fairly tokenistic ones, given the nature of the government, but part of the superficially ‘progressive’ narrative).

Is he already married to someone in his home country ?

Will you be his second wife ?

Or in future, will he have more than one wife ?

Have you ever been to his country before marrying him ?

You do know that you do not have to go to his country ?

You do know that you do not need to marry him in his country or UK ?

Beware !

I’ve been to Dubai as a typical western woman, did all the high life living, camel and horse racing and boozing and yes it was amazing (went a few times) but I wouldn’t live there knowing what I know about the subculture especially their horrific treatment of immigrant workers from eg Philippines and Bangladesh.

That’s not to say that in the past in Arab countries workers haven’t been treated well, as they have. My stepdad worked for a year in Abu Dhabi and throughly enjoyed his time here and worked with both Arabs and workers from around the world on a building site (and with fibre glass) back in the 70s.

Well, their treatment when I lived there was grim. I got involved with a charity that had (periodic) access to some of the camps the labourers lived in, out in the desert, and, even leaving aside the withheld passports and pay from some employers, poor working conditions etc, the conditions were grim — vermin, bedbugs, overcrowded, unsanitary, inadequate washing and cooking facilities armed guards and barbed wire around the perimeters. The government always claimed it was inspecting and fining employers, but I’m not convinced a lot has changed.

Her DH is Indian. And no, she’s nothing like the blingy Emiratis you describe though I did see some like that when I visited.

That’s why I was shocked when I saw her because she’d done a complete about turn in looks and character. But I also think she hid stuff from me when I visited, you’re highly unlikely to say when your DH is present that he controls you. In hidden Facebook posts she’d say stuff like “things aren’t as they appear, smoke and mirrors” etc because all her friends here (we were at school together) thought she was living this amazing designer clothes/bags/shoes lifestyle over in Dubai and yes, some probably were envious. We all went to private school together so there was an undercurrent of “who’s doing the best” amongst us all.

They are still married though, kids at uni or graduated here now and in jobs.

Her friends whom i met weren’t like that either, though they did know some women like you describe and I probably saw some like that there.

I don’t know if it makes a difference if the woman goes there with a well paid job perhaps, which is how it worked for my female friends. The only issue was that their partners couldn’t go with them to Dubai unless they also had a job whereas if it was the other way round and the man had a job the woman wouldn’t have needed one if that makes sense which I personally think is unfair. However none of the people I know have to cover their hair or faces etc they just all seem quite glam and well put together and very financially comfortable and wealthy! I agree the Labour issues are more of a concern, some terrible things about the conditions with that, but it’s a tale as old as time, those with less options, money, financial power are always taken advantage of!

Several responders have tried to point out to you that you are being hopelessly naive, and that you are being lied to by your fiance. If you go ahead with your fiance's wishes, there is a very high probability that you will come to regret it.
In most majority-Muslim countries the Nikkah IS the legal marriage, not just a religious ceremony. Because it would be a legal marriage, you would then be considered married in the UK, so you could not then go ahead and have a marriage in the UK, only some type of non-legal "marriage blessing" ceremony.
Since you seem determined to ignore advice on MN, at least seek legal advice (and listen to it!) before going abroad.

Unless you name the country, everyone will give potentially wrong advice. Some Muslim countries won’t let you stay in a hotel unless married, but maybe some do 🤷‍♀️

If you don’t trust your fiancé to explain everything down to the last detail, why on earth are you getting married to him? This is where everyone is getting you being naive from. You don’t know enough about a massive commitment you’re making, one that could be more than just a romantic mistake. The discrepancy between your soon to be in laws needing to be lied to about you living together, needing a religious ceremony that you know little about, but not caring if you sleep together the night before, is bizarre. If they’re arranging a religious ceremony, they’d be able to arrange a makeshift bed in the living room. I advise saying the country, you’ll get much more specific advice. It’s like coming on here and saying “what will happen in Europe?” It’s too broad to answer helpfully. Anyway I hope some of the answers are helping you get to a place of questioning whether this is a good idea.

well is not a lie as Islam accepts Muslim male to marry women whose faith is from the book. Which is Christian and Jewish. She does not need to be Muslim to be married religiously. As I said she should have a male representative from her family if they want to do it right. Anyway many Muslim people do things to please their families and respect traditions even if they don’t believe in them . If you grew up in a western family maybe you cannot comprehend as the dynamic is really different

My partner hadn’t told to his parents we live together either . When I visited before getting married we were sleeping in different bedrooms but the same house. So I think this is the best to do . What people say is if they are so religious and want to follow the rules they wouldn’t be happy for you to sleep in the same bed the day before the wedding. As this is like telling them openly you are intimate with each other , which they may suspect but out of respect and customs you shouldn’t share a bedroom with your partner.

it seems a bit dodgy for them to be ok with that situation so either your partner is just assuming or he means you will stay in the same house but not in the same room and bed. Could be you misunderstood what he said. Please ask him to clarify. Though again without knowing the country is hard to advice anything

I do not agree with this you are bias ed.Maybe she could please her own family and have a christian wedding in this country.I wonder how his family would react to this ? It is still a lie to marry with a muslim religion when you are a christian .Obviously you do not understand this factor as you do not follow the christian faith.

I am Christian and my church doesn’t allow me to marry non Christian orthodox not even catholic. What do you mean is a lie to marry with a Muslim when you are Christian? It is allowed and if you don’t pretend to be Muslim I don’t see where the lie is. Anyway if her parents insisted she gets married in Christian wedding I guess she would do that and find a partner that belongs to her church or is willing to convert.

I know many couples where the partner got baptised to get married in the church without believing in that. Unfortunately our church doesn’t allow anyone to get married religiously if not baptised Christian orthodox.

In any case you speak about Christianity like is one uniformed religion and everyone practicing the same customs. Which is not the case.

everyone has the right to follow their religious practices or not. OP most probably doesn’t care marrying in church and she hasn’t mentioned her religion so I guess she is not following.

Just to make clear I personally do not agree with marrying religiously when in a couple people have different religions if is not going to happen in both faiths, I.e Christian wedding and an Islamic wedding. As my religion doesn’t allow non baptised people to get in union with Christian orthodox we decided not to have any religious marriage and just have a civil marriage. This got recognised in UK and our countries of origin.

However I am not judging the couples deciding otherwise, is their life and there are some decisions you make for the family good. As far as there is not a negative impact on you.

That was different. The parents were married and living in America. The husband tricked the wife to going to his home country for a “holiday” but no intention of leaving. He confiscated both the wife and daughters passports once there.

in the end he didn’t care if the wife left but she would not be taking her daughter. That’s where the name “Nit without my daughter” comes from.

If his family is as religious as he says, then it is a little strange. My parents had a child together so quite clearly having sex. They even lived together but neither set of grandparents would allow a non married couple sleep in the same room under their roofs, even if they were getting married the next day. It was a bone of contention with my mother.

Just be careful, everything you have said is based on what you have been told by your fiancé, what research have you done yourself? Also, people lie, sometimes it’s blatant lies, sometimes subtle just to let you think something to make life easier and sometimes it’s by omission.

If they're that religious that they are asking for a religious marriage, they're highly unlikely to let you spend the night before the wedding together. It's just not done. I was raised muslim (atheist now) and also had a nikah to keep my dad happy. But that was in the UK, it held zero legal weight, my family all knew i was living with my husband already so there was no point insisting we spend the night apart before the nikah. The next summer we got married anyway.

As part of the ceremony, you'll be asked to name your 'mehr' which is what the bride is entitled to ask for from the groom, and he has to oblige. This can be anything, money, jewellery, flowers, etc. Like a reverse dowry but the bride requests it from the groom. I didn't want a mehr but the imam insisted, so I asked for a symbolic 50 euros from my husband to which the imam asked 'Is that all? Are you sure? Nothing else? Think about it! It's your mehr!'

Here's a story about a woman from Iran who took her husband to court over his refusal for her mehr of 124,00 roses: https://english.alarabiya.net/articles/2008%2F03%2F04%2F46454