Coping with Silent Treatment

[baffleddays]

When DP and I have a disagreement he often gets annoyed and shuts down the conversation, by refusing to talk, physically leaving the house, going to sleep etc. If he does leave when he returns he'll often be distant with me, give one word answers, stare at his phone etc. He says he just doesn't want to have to always talk things out, but I feel like I'm getting the silent treatment.

The problem is - I really struggle with the silent treatment. It feels so uncomfortable that often I end up being the one trying to offer olive branches, smooth things over etc. (even if I was the one raising a grievance at the start of it all) just to get the awkwardness to go away. If I do try to tolerate it rather than caving into it it still consumes my thoughts, stops me being able to concentrate on work etc. I often end up replaying the conversation in my mind and trying to work out how it all unravelled.

My worry is that I think I need to be able to tolerate the silence better to avoid the risk of it being used against me... so I was wondering if anybody has any good tips or suggestions?

I go into myself when I’m upset and it’s in no way intended to manipulate and upset anyone else. I just need time to process stuff. I still talk though, I might just talk a bit less.

Thank you so much to everybody for your replies. It’s really helping me to get my head around what I need to be setting as my red line over the coming weeks - that DP can take time outs if he needs to but we need to be able to discuss things at some point. And when he comes back from the time out he needs to be calm and respectful – not angry, sulking etc. I’m gradually facing up to the reality that he may never be able to do that – I think I’m just also at a point where I want to be able to look back and know for sure that I gave it chance (after being explicit about what needs to happen).

As I’m reflecting on all of this stuff I think I am realising how big of a problem it is that DP gets stressed so easily, as he ends up being selfish and / or easily angered and just wants to do whatever it takes to keep things simple and stress-free for himself.

Looking at zeppelintits comment – “having a partner who is able to handle feedback, who is absolutely bombproof levels of reliable at coming back to a discussion as agreed after taking a short break if one is needed, because they WANT to discuss it further. They want to get it cleared up, because they know it matters to you, they care about you and want to understand your perspective.” – I can only answer that no, that doesn’t sound like my DP. He doesn’t want to discuss things further, even if it matters to me, as his priority is keeping a simple, stress-free life for himself – regardless of how that feels for me.

When he’s got that stress-free life then he can be fun and caring. When he hasn’t then he gets overwhelmed and angry with whatever is causing the stress – which unfortunately is often me. And unfortunately I seem to be able to trigger that stress over simple things – like asking things of him around the house, “complicating” things by having a different opinion, letting him know that I’m not happy with something in the relationship etc. Which explains why I quite often hear that I’m turning things into a big deal or making things too complicated (although yes @perfectcolourfound the irony of that wasn’t lost on me either!).

Interestingly I’ve noticed that he can listen about my feelings much better if I’m talking about work, family or something else rather than if my feelings are something to do with him so I think sensitivity to criticism is an issue too.

I am rapidly seeing though that whatever the cause of his emotions – that doesn’t make it okay for him to stop me from talking and it doesn’t make it a realistic long term solution.

I’m going to watch / look at all of the links shared – thank you to everybody who has shared them. I already watched the short Jimmy video shared and you were right that it did make me laugh but also summed the situation up perfectly! “You either shut down or explode or tell me that nothing you do is ever good enough” - 100% recognise all 3 of those things.

**@GingerIsBest – Thank you for your reply and for giving me some questions to think about. To give some additional context around the work point… the nature of my job means that there have been a lot of times when I’ve been home late in the past unfortunately and so I’ve
been able to empathise with why DP could be feeling frustrated or disappointed. He’d said that he was stuck waiting for me when he could have made other plans if he’d known earlier that I was going to be late. So we agreed that I would let him know what time I was going to be home so that he would know whether to just go ahead and make plans without me. That has helped to solve a lot of the problems as if he knows in advance then it’s mostly okay (as long as I’m not saying I’ll be late every day)… where we hit
a problem is when I’ve said a time but then last minute that’s not looking possible. In that situation I do feel very anxious, as I feel stuck between leaving something unfinished at work (and then worrying about it) or being late back and DP being disappointed that I’m late again. In fairness to DP I don’t really understand why I let his disappointment bother me so much as it’s not a full silent treatment, he’s not nasty about it etc. – I just feel guilty and like I’m being unfair or doing something wrong.

For seeing friends - when we first got into a relationship he did say that he wanted me to stay in touch while I was out so he’d know I was safe. Fortunately I refused that one from day one!

Making excuses he’s a control freak

disappointed that you’re at work? Wants to keep tabs on you when you’re out? He needs to grow up

There are SO many issues with all the things you've posted that you probalby don't even notice.

how big of a problem it is that DP gets stressed so easily and increasingly, he's making it YOUR problem, and YOUR responsibility to reduce that stress. That's not okay.

He doesn’t want to discuss things further, even if it matters to me, as his priority is keeping a simple, stress-free life for himself – regardless of how that feels for me. You see this as him trying to reduce stress. I see this as him trying to ensure everything is always the way he wants and likes it.

And unfortunately I seem to be able to trigger that stress over simple things – like asking things of him around the house, “complicating” things by having a different opinion, letting him know that I’m not happy with something in the relationship etc. You don't even realise it, but he's in your head here. YOU are not triggering anything. Asking someone to pick up their socks is not, in any realistic world, something anyone could be triggered by.

Interestingly I’ve noticed that he can listen about my feelings much better if I’m talking about work, family or something else Of course. Because a) you're not expecting him to change/reflect one his own behaviour and b) you are likely asking for his advice and doing what HE wants you to do. It wouldn't surprise me if he is subtly (or not so subtly) using these moments as an opportunity to make you question your relationships at work and from your past - family, friends etc.

Re work - I get it can be annoying if someone is consistently late, but in a long term relationship, does it really matter if you're not eating together and watching Netflix 6 days a week? This is your job! Does he want you to stop working?

It’s not a full silent treatment, he’s not nasty about it etc. – I just feel guilty and like I’m being unfair or doing something wrong. - because ANY silent treatment and "subdued" behaviour is designed to make you feel guilty. Which is unacceptable.

For seeing friends - when we first got into a relationship he did say that he wanted me to stay in touch while I was out so he’d know I was safe. Fortunately I refused that one from day one! This is SUCH a massive red flag. You say you refused from Day 1 but I bet there are still some subtle impacts. Perhaps you go out less? Or he comes to collect you? Or you laugh nervously when discussing a spontaneous drunken trip to a club with your girlfriends and say, "ooh, DP isn't going to like that... giggle giggle" but secretly you're a bit nervous. How often do you choose NOT to go out because you know he'll be "disappointed" because actually, that week you already had to work late one night?

Unfortunately, I can tell you from experience it will only get worse. SIL got to the point that he sulked if she didn't greet him enthusiastically enough when she came through the door. She wasn't allowed to be distracted or stressed or say hello to their DS or to a guest first....

Exactly 👍

Thanks for taking the time to send such a detailed reply @gingerisbest. I’m sure you’re right that’s there a lot of things I don’t notice as I feel like I’ve lost sight of what’s normal - to the point that right now I’m scared of over-reacting and scared of under-reacting at the same time.

You’re right that him being stressed is becoming increasingly my problem – as I know that I have let the things I say or do be influenced by trying not to cause stress or “complications”.

I agree that he wants things the way he wants them ("simple") - when things aren't going to that plan that's when he gets "stressed". That not going to plan can be something his family have done, the cat has done etc. (not just me) – and I think that’s why I’ve seen it as a general stress issue rather than just a relationship issue so far.

You don't even realise it, but he's in your head here. YOU are not triggering anything. Asking someone to pick up their socks is not, in any realistic world, something anyone could be triggered by. Thank you – I guess it’s hard not to feel like I’m triggering it when if I hadn’t said something all would have been well. I can absolutely see what you mean in the clothes example not being enough to trigger someone… at the time it just didn’t feel that clear. It was when I asked him not to roll his eyes that it started to spiral, as he said then that I was turning things into a big deal. And by this point he’d said lots of other times in the past that I was turning things into a big deal, so it becomes a bit more believable.

Because a) you're not expecting him to change/reflect one his own behaviour and b) you are likely asking for his advice and doing what HE wants you to do. It’s only just occurred to me while reading this that it’s perhaps not normal for somebody to get “stressed” by being asked to reflect on their own behaviour. I kind of just accepted it as reasonable that he’d find that a harder conversation. I’ve also felt like at the beginning of the relationship I talked “too much” about feelings, things bothering me etc. too and that stuck with me then that maybe I’d caused this feeling of making things a big deal and it had stuck from there.

Does he want you to stop working? He knows there’s no way I’d ever stop working, so it’s never come up. He does keep pushing conversations about us making financial investments that I couldn’t afford on my own though – getting a new car for example.

because ANY silent treatment and "subdued" behaviour is designed to make you feel guilty. I can totally see that somebody being disappointed is enough to make me feel guilty so I can see how it could be used deliberately. It just feels so hard to know when somebody could be doing it deliberately vs just experiencing genuine emotions. There’s other times that I’m now thinking of too, like when we took the same week off work and then he was disappointed because I ended up spending some days on my own. He said if I’d told him in advance he could have gone to work and saved his time off.

Perhaps you go out less? Or he comes to collect you? I don’t go out for a full “night out” very often as it genuinely isn’t something I’m that interested in (normally see friends for dinner etc. instead). So going out less hasn’t come up. On the times I have been out though then yes he has always come to collect me. I can see why there could be some control there… as it does mean I have to communicate a pick-up time with him. I just thought he was being kind as he was at home doing nothing and seemed silly for me to pay for a taxi.

It looks like I've got a lot to think about...

OP, I think yes, you do have a LOT to think about. I know it can be really overwhelming. One thing I would say is while we use phrases like, "sulking is designed to make you feel guilty" don't get too hung up on this concept of him doing it deliberately. I think many people who behave this way are not sitting there thinking, "right, if I sulk now, then x will happen". It would be easier if they did because then we could just see that these are not good people.

Rather, they are unconsciously employing tactics that will get the outcome they want - less "stress", more time with their partner, complete control over what happens at home etc etc. Unfortunately, the chances are they will never see it, which, of course, is a core part of the problem - they cannot and will not reflect on their own behaviour.

as he said then that I was turning things into a big deal - my argument would be that him not picking up his socks and underpants, ever, even though he has been asked to please do so, is what has turned this into a big deal....

That not going to plan can be something his family have done, the cat has done etc. (not just me) – and I think that’s why I’ve seen it as a general stress issue rather than just a relationship issue so far. but th point is that he wants YOU to take it on (or, I suspect, his family). So if the cat's vet management is too stressful... ta da, you take it on and suddenly he doesn't have to worry about it?

There’s other times that I’m now thinking of too, like when we took the same week off work and then he was disappointed because I ended up spending some days on my own. He said if I’d told him in advance he could have gone to work and saved his time off. This one is clever because it's tricky. He's suggesting that if he'd KNOWN you were doing other things, he wouldn't have taken all the time off. So it becomes YOUR fault and you agree. But let me turn it around for as second - DH and I could go on holiday to another country for a week and I can promise you, neither of us would ever assume that we're spending 100% of our time together. I mean, sure, if its a staycation then perhaps some chit chat about the fact that you want to meet your Mum for shopping and lunch and are planning to finally get stuck into that big art project would be good, but think about this for a second - is it really realistic to expect to spend all day, every day together? Would you even want that?

On the times I have been out though then yes he has always come to collect me. I can see why there could be some control there… as it does mean I have to communicate a pick-up time with him. I just thought he was being kind as he was at home doing nothing and seemed silly for me to pay for a taxi. I totally understand that and in theory, of course that's true - pre kids, DH would always be willing to pick me up if I needed it.

But at some point, it might well impact other aspects of your decision making whether that's where to go, what to drink, what time to leave etc. If it's not, that's great, but it's definitely a consideration. And what happens if you say no? There was a woman on here years ago who found that over time, the result of this "kindness" was that she wasn't allowed to go out with work mates or in the city because that was too difficult/late for him to collect her. It all came to a head one day when she told him she was going on a big work nights out and was going to stay over at a colleague/friend's house in town.... he had a complete meltdown and she suddenly realised that her life had shrunk hugely over the previous however many years.

I'm really sorry to keep flagging all this. It's just that these are all pretty common early signs and it's also completely normal not to see them. I recently found a thread on here about SIL and her (now) ex that I started 10 years ago. What struck me was how many red flags I mentioned without even realising they were flags and, when I look back now, there were so many things I didn't even add in my original post because I genuinely had no idea that they were things I should be concerned about.

There’s other times that I’m now thinking of too, like when we took the same week off work and then he was disappointed because I ended up spending some days on my own. He said if I’d told him in advance he could have gone to work and saved his time off.

Saved his time off for what? Another time you were off, so you still spent it with him?

Thanks @GingerIsBest and definitely don't apologise for flagging things - I'm so grateful to you and everybody else for taking the time to help me think things through.

Overwhelmed and confused is a good description for how I'm feeling! Sometimes over the last few days I really feel like the way DP is behaving can't be right... but then not long later I can feel like I'm reading into things too easily because of all the things that are on my mind. The self-doubt is very real in my life right now!

don't get too hung up on this concept of him doing it deliberately. - Thank you for reminding me of this as I remember that was raised by a pp too but I do keep falling into that trap of thinking of it as deliberate (which I then struggle with).

unconsciously employing tactics that will get the outcome they want - less "stress", more time with their partner, complete control over what happens at home etc etc. That is easier to see as possible and I'm starting to notice more the times when his behaviour gets him the outcome he wants - for example this week DP asked me if I was going to go somewhere with him and I could see was getting a bit impatient when I wasn't making a decision quickly. I ended up just making a snap decision to keep things simple, whereas really I'm someone who prefers time to think and talk things through.

th point is that he wants YOU to take it on (or, I suspect, his family). So if the cat's vet management is too stressful... ta da, you take it on and suddenly he doesn't have to worry about it? It can even be things where nothing requires being taken on... the cat has knocked something over and it's smashed for example and next thing you know DP is stressed and shouting at the cat.

He's suggesting that if he'd KNOWN you were doing other things, he wouldn't have taken all the time off. So it becomes YOUR fault and you agree. Yes, pretty much - I remember at the time I felt part guilty (like I'd done something wrong) and part annoyed (as I didn't really think I was doing anything wrong). He hadn't asked me before the time off to let him know what my plans were, indicated that he was considering going to work etc. if I was busy.

Since then I have had weeks off where I've done my own thing still on some of the days - but it's like the work situation where I always feel like I need to let him know in advance if I'm going to be late or make other plans. I even let him know in advance now if I'm planning on having a lie-in as there was a couple of times when he commented on it being frustrating that he'd had to wait for me all morning when he could have made other plans.

I'm seeing that there's a definite pattern in this area. Part of me can see his point as I'm sure it is nice to know in advance if things aren't going to line up with how you think they are in your head. And my life is a lot busier than his so he probably does end up feeling like he's waiting around for me a lot. And I think I accepted it as a reasonable compromise because as long as he knows in advance there tends not to be an issue. The more I think about it now though it does feel a bit suffocating for me always having to plan in advance or risk feeling guilty. I'm a bit worried that I've let some boundary creep happen here that I need to address.

Is it really realistic to expect to spend all day, every day together? Would you even want that? No, I don't want that. I actually miss having more alone time than I have right now. Whereas I think DP would be happy to be together all the time - which is probably contributing to the issue of him wanting to know if I'm making other plans.

at some point, it might well impact other aspects of your decision making whether that's where to go, what to drink, what time to leave etc. If it's not, that's great, but it's definitely a consideration. And what happens if you say no? I can see your point that it's definitely something for me to consider further... DP and I happen to be compatible in the sense that I don't like to go on big nights out often anyway and I don't like to get drunk... but when I have had a few glasses of wine he has a couple of times said jokingly "how many have you had?". It did seem to be light-hearted teasing but it still made me feel self-conscious. I don't think I'd feel comfortable being drunk in front of him, from a fear of being judged perspective, although I'm not sure why I feel that way. There was one time when I said to DP that I didn't think I'd need a lift home as I'd be travelling with friends - he accepted it but did seem disappointed (plans changed nearer to the time and he did pick us all up in the end).

It's so strange as I even as I write all this and know it to be true I feel guilty for even saying it! Perhaps because things are normal and "calm" here at the moment.

@Nanny0gg Saved his time off for what? Another time you were off, so you still spent it with him?
Pretty much… I think he was saying that he would save it for a time when he was actively doing something rather than thinking he was spending time with me and then being stuck waiting for me. Looking back though we hadn’t actually discussed his thought that we’d be spending every day of our time off together – he’d just made that assumption.

It's so strange as I even as I write all this and know it to be true I feel guilty for even saying it!

That's a bad sign, you know. Unless you happen to be a secret raging T-Rex when you don't get your own way ... none of what you have written so far indicates that you're being demanding, inflexible, unreasonable.

Why are you feeling guilty for struggling with some of his more difficult behaviours?

There doesn't have to be blame / shame / guilt in separating. Sometimes the inevitable friction that arises in long-term relationships sour things enough so that the sweet times doesn't feel uncomplicatedly good any more, and it's okay to say "we tried, but weren't compatible in the long term"

I'm seeing that there's a definite pattern in this area. Part of me can see his point as I'm sure it is nice to know in advance if things aren't going to line up with how you think they are in your head. And my life is a lot busier than his so he probably does end up feeling like he's waiting around for me a lot. And I think I accepted it as a reasonable compromise because as long as he knows in advance there tends not to be an issue. The more I think about it now though it does feel a bit suffocating for me always having to plan in advance or risk feeling guilty. I'm a bit worried that I've let some boundary creep happen here that I need to address.

I think this is interesting. Some people really need to know in advance what's happening etc, and can get quite twitchy if they don't. But the bit that doesn't quite ring true for me in the context of this man is he is so un-proactive about it? I am actually one of those people who quite likes to know what's happening next - not with military precision, but broadly. DH is more of a "let's just see how it goes" kind of person. The compromise for US then is for NEITHER of us to make assumptions. If I want to have a bit of certainty for the following day, I will raise it the night before, "Right, I need to get a few chores done and we've got DS' football, what do you have planned for the rest of the day tomorrow so that we can figure out when is best for me to head into town?". Similarly, if DH doesn't discuss plans with me and then he lands up being put out because I've taken the car with the DC, he accepts that's his problem as he shouldn't have just assumed that I'd be sitting around waiting for him to do something.

This is different to how your DP would do it I suspect in that he'd, in his head, decide that he wants to go into town, with you, at 10:00 then be all resentful that you weren't ready to go at 10:00 because you didn't magically know what he expected.

And where it becomes more concerning, is I suspect that if he DOES ask you in advance, you very quickly agree to his plan unless you have something very specific planned. So, if he asks you about the following morning, you wouldn't say, "Ooh, I'm not sure, I'd like to keep it fluid, perhaps have a lie in and see how I feel" because that suggests you have no plans and therefore you can accommodate his plans. Then you are forced to make that snap decision, probably the one he WANTS you to make.

here was one time when I said to DP that I didn't think I'd need a lift home as I'd be travelling with friends - he accepted it but did seem disappointed Re-read this... how bizarre is it? He was disappointed because he didn't have to go out in the middle of night to pick you up?! My DH is always happy to collect me at any time... he's never disappointed if he can stay in watching a movie instead because I've made a different plan. And vice versa.

@DancesWithDucks Why are you feeling guilty for struggling with some of his more difficult behaviours?

That’s a good question - I think there’s a few reasons why I feel guilty when I’m posting.

From a talking on here perspective, I feel like I’m being two-faced because at the moment I’m not directly saying all this to DP (while I think things through) which makes me feel guilty as I know he'd be hurt if he knew.

More generally about breaking up though - I would feel guilty about that too, even though I know what you’re saying is right. Despite all of the times I seem to annoy DP or stress him out… I don’t think he wants the relationship to end. So I'd feel like I was doing it "to him" and hurting him. This week he keeps talking about buying a joint car and even asked me if I’d ever want to get married! I don’t understand why he’d even want to think about that when he seems so stressed (and I've said I'm not at that point to even talk about it) - I have wondered if I’ve unintentionally been quieter and this is more his way of testing where my heads at.

There was a time previously when the possibility of breaking up came up and DP said so many things about how he’d lose everything, have wasted years, have nothing to show for it (I own the house we live in), how that’s the risk he took when he came into the relationship (but said in a way that was so sad) etc. So I don't think that helped. While I know rationally that’s not all my responsibility to take, seeing / hearing those feelings wouldn't be nice.

@GingerIsBest - Some people really need to know in advance what's happening etc, But the bit that doesn't quite ring true for me in the context of this man is he is so un-proactive about it?
Interestingly I’m actually like that too – in the sense that I prefer to know if something is planned rather than it being sprung on me at the last minute. But you’re right that if I hadn’t explicitly made plans I would assume that meant nothing was planned – and if I wanted to make plans, I would ask. Whereas DP seems to assume that we’re together unless I’ve stated otherwise. He has got a bit better at asking rather than assuming but…

I suspect that if he DOES ask you in advance, you very quickly agree to his plan unless you have something very specific planned. So, if he asks you about the following morning, you wouldn't say, "Ooh, I'm not sure, I'd like to keep it fluid, perhaps have a lie in and see how I feel" because that suggests you have no plans and therefore you can accommodate his plans. Then you are forced to make that snap decision, probably the one he WANTS you to make. This is definitely true. He would hate the “limbo” of me saying that I’m not sure even though he could go and make other plans. Plus if he asks me to do something with him then I feel like I’m doing something wrong if I don’t agree without a good reason. And “I want to rest” or “I want to see how I feel” doesn’t normally feel like a “good enough” reason (not helped by the fact that he has a much lower need for alone time or time to rest so I think that makes it harder for him to understand why those things are important to me). He’s told me in the past that he feels like I never want to do his suggestions or that he feels like we don’t spend enough time together so I think that’s contributed to the feeling of pressure to say yes too.

I really don’t think the fact that my life is a lot busier than his has helped as it gives a “justification” in my mind for DP’s comments as I start thinking maybe I don’t spend enough quality time with him and that’s where the criticism comes from. So it’s harder to see then whether he’s being reasonable or unreasonable. As part of all my thinking over the last couple of weeks I’m considering whether I should plan dedicated time to try and clear that though up in my mind… I’d be interested to hear how many nights a week other couples spend with each other as quality time?

There was one time when I said to DP that I didn't think I'd need a lift home as I'd be travelling with friends - he accepted it but did seem disappointed Re-read this... how bizarre is it? He was disappointed because he didn't have to go out in the middle of night to pick you up?! I can see what you mean. It’s almost like he gets offended by not being needed? And that feels like the underlying vibe when I say I want time to myself too…

My ex did this it was torture. And I agree it's abusive.

The only mitigating thing might be - is he able to talk about this behaviour when you're not mid argument? Could he agree something to say to reassure you eg 'I love you very much I need some thinking space please can we come back to this in an hour /tomorrow when I feel calmer'

He sounds emotionally about 8. Picking up your clothes is a very normal behaviour and getting mad because your partner doesn’t think it’s their job to pick up your clothes is behaving like a fucking child. Sorry, I’m out at that very first example. ‘Wait a minute, YOURE mad because I asked you to pick up YOUR OWN CLOTHES?? you can go sulk all you want, any clothes left on the floor for 24 hours will go in the bin. I live here too and while you don’t think I deserve any respect, I know I do deserve a clean house without having to pick up after a grown man.’

I know someone who was in a relationship very similar to what you describe which is probably why i keep.comimg back jere! 😆😆😆

Many years, and dc, later, the straw that broke the camels back for her was the end of a really busy period at work, she had some time off a few weeks before christmas. He was mostly off but had a couple of shifts. The first few days of her time off, they spent together and/or as a family with their dc. She was pretty clear about how much she ws looking forward to a day alone when he was at work and the dc at school pre Christmas madness.

On the day, he left early for work, she took dc to school. She says she had just settled down with a coffee and her book.... and he walked in the door. Claimed his boss had offered to let him have time off (she suspects he asked or even said he was sick). Ans then, when she was furious, he walked around like a kicked puppy sulking for 3 days.

It took a few more months for her to finally kick him out, but she told me that was the day she realised this couldn't continue.

(She once took a cab rather than wait for the next train after train delays... because he was sending her furious messages about her being late when they had planned an evening together. That was when I realised that this man was batshit.)

I’ve just read through this whole thread OP and it makes for very sad reading. What’s coming through very clearly, is you’ve allowed yourself to think you’ve done something to deserve the silent treatment, and you’re low on confidence and/or self-esteem. You’re in no way being unreasonable asking a grown man to tidy up after himself. And a grown man doesn’t give his partner silent treatment / eye rolls when being picked up on it. That’s incredibly immature. He also managed to convince you that leaving the conversation when he didn’t want to participate was an acceptable way to deal with things. It isn’t! It isn’t acceptable.

I know it’s not easy to make these life-changing decisions, particularly on Mumsnet when it seems every other post is someone saying “Just leave him!” when in reality it’s not always that simple. But having read through this whole thread and seeing you naively trying to explain away his behaviour with the “he can be nice sometimes, when I haven’t upset him or he’s not angry about something” is giving real, real red flags. He doesn’t care about your feelings. A real partner would try to understand from your viewpoint and participate in a discussion - this guy sounds completely shut off from difficult conversations and that’s just the way he likes it.

Your recent post about what he’s said previously when you talked about breaking up was really, really sad. And it also had lots of telltale red flags in there. None of it made me feel he would be sad the relationship was ending and he didn’t want to lose you because of you - it was all about him. And maybe, just maybe, he’s afraid he won’t find someone else who is equally as submissive to tidy up after him unchallenged.

OP I think you need to look long and hard at this relationship. It’s not normal behaviour. Don’t waste any more time trying to adapt yourself to fit with someone who isn’t willing to even talk through things. Your future self won’t regret seeking a better life for yourself and will thank you taking these courageous steps by starting over.

@Unexpectedlysinglemum - thank you for sharing your experiences. Unfortunately I've found in the past that even if I wait for things to calm down to try and talk to him about his behaviour, the trying to talk to him is likely to set it all back off into an argument or silent treatment again. So it's almost impossible to raise things that bother me without coming away feeling unreasonable and / or very frustrated. When I previously suggested time out's and coming back to the conversation he said that means we still have to come back to it and he might not want to talk at all. But if I choose to speak to DP about all this again I agree that focusing in on this time out strategy would be the best idea and probably only hope.

@Codlingmoths - Wait a minute, YOURE mad because I asked you to pick up YOUR OWN CLOTHES?? you can go sulk all you want, any clothes left on the floor for 24 hours will go in the bin. I live here too and while you don’t think I deserve any respect, I know I do deserve a clean house without having to pick up after a grown man.’ I almost wish I'd reacted like this from the outset instead of getting myself into this silly place where it's now harder to raise it again, feels like a bigger deal etc. I think my natural setting is to try and keep the peace, consider other people's POV etc and actually sometimes that probably means I'm not getting angry or standing up for myself enough.

@GingerIsBest - well I'm very grateful to you for coming back, thank you! Funnily enough, despite the fact I haven't lived this example, I can imagine and feel it so clearly. I absolutely think this is something DP would do - he would take the day off without asking because he knew I was off and then treat me like I was in the wrong if I wasn't grateful. He'd come back and assume that meant we could now do something together and be offended / disappointed if I said I didn't want to as I still wanted time alone. I can feel it so clearly that I assume something similar must have happened here but I can't think what it is!

@inthetrenches1 - you're absolutely right that when there's a silent treatment, my instinctive reaction has been to consider what I have done wrong as it was clear to me that I'd upset DP or made him angry. But I can at least see now that even IF I have done something wrong then that doesn't make the silent treatment a solution. And that there are times when I haven't actually even done anything wrong and he's just reacting in a big way to something minor.

He doesn’t care about your feelings - this is the bit that still requires a mindset shift for me. I think you and pp's might be right as looking at objectively the way he's behaving, it doesn't fit at all with somebody who cares about my feelings. But I've spent 4 years believing and assuming he does (and he a couple of years of that he really seemed to)... so this is definitely an area that's a pretty big mindset shift needed. But you're right when you say that he's completely shut off from difficult conversations and that’s just the way he likes it - we don't discuss anything difficult. Partly because I've given up and partly because if I try he shuts the conversation down.

Don’t waste any more time trying to adapt yourself to fit with someone who isn’t willing to even talk through things. - This also just struck me as looking back it does seem to be me doing 90% of the attempting to adapt. I think now I need to get clearer on what I want and what my boundaries are - and stand by them first and foremost rather than by trying to adapt to get the relationship to work.

Thank you again so much to everybody for all of your replies and for all of the resources that you've signposted me to during this thread. It's been so helpful. I think my plan now is to read back through them all and carve out some alone time where I can really think about what that means and what it is that I want. I already know that'll either be leaving the relationship or letting DP know where my thinking is and giving him one last chance to respond before deciding what happens with the relationship.

I know now that I need to be able to express my opinions and feelings without it causing a problem otherwise the relationship is destroyed anyway. I know that if DP needs to have a time-out he can, but that when he comes back we need to able to discuss things otherwise he's just stone-walling and giving the silent treatment - in which case the relationship is destroyed anyway. If I speak to DP I would want to raise the clothes issue again too as I know now that I'm not being unreasonable or overly critical to ask that he doesn't leave his own clothes on the floor (I'm not currently picking them up out of principle, but that means there's constantly clothes out bothering me). I think we'd need to agree to clear dedicated alone time and quality time together, so that DP doesn't feel like we don't have enough time together but I don't feel suffocated.

There's a lot in that list - so it's may be that I or we decide there's too much to salvage. I think one of the trickiest bits would be around DP's "stress" - as if I start to see him getting impatient or frustrated it's going to be hard not to let that influence how I respond or behave. But I am starting to feel clearer and stronger to tackle some of this so thank you all 💐

It seems to me, lovely @baffleddays , the biggest problem here is you handling your own feelings of guilt / responsibility towards him.

You seem to be placing the possibility of him being hurt over the reality of you been really unhappy?

Stonewalling and training you to be quiet is in danger of working, whether he's doing it consciously or not.

At this point, lovely lady, I think you need some therapy to learn how to value yourself and your own happiness as much as you value his.

You can't communicate with someone who doesn't want to.

He doesn't seem to be interested in conflict resolution, either because -

• The concept it alien to him. For these type of people, it's normal for two people get really angry or upset with each other, stay away until they are less annoyed and then start talking again. The thing never gets talked about, never actually resolves, just swept under the mat.
• He's not interested in conflict resolution because the only interaction he's interested in having, is one where he wins. He is either genuinely angry that you have any grievances at all and expresses this through anger, or he's doing it deliberately to punish you, and to train you to never advocate for yourself, ever.

In the latter situation, you will never have your needs in the relationship addressed, and he doesn't care about them either. The relationship is mainly all about him and what he wants & needs. He just doesn't want to be held accountable for anything he does, doesn't want there to ever be a situation where you actually disagree with him. He wants to be an inflexible rock and have you flapping around him, you having to lessen your own needs and be the flexible one because you're trying to avoid the silence.

If that's true of him, he's going to get a sharp shock if or when you leave.