Meet the Other Phone. Flexible and made to last.

Meet the Other Phone.
Flexible and made to last.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Is this abusive? H and DC

245 replies

westofnarnia · 19/01/2024 01:09

Got home tonight after the millionth episode of 'd' H sulking on a nice outing with the dc and i feel incredibly bleak. I would really appreciate a sense check on what happened. I have been in therapy for a while trying to decide whether our marriage is over for several reasons. One of the main ones being how he cannot rein in his moods around dc, and how I have become accustomed to walking on eggshells.

We went out for dinner at his suggestion after dc had a long school day (start at 8, finished afterschool at 5.30). dc is 9 and i suspect becoming a little bit hormonal as she is more emotional these days). Everything seemed fine then we started talking about the Narnia audiobooks dc is listening to that she got for xmas, and i inadvertently gave a 'spoiler' that involves some death, about the last book (sorry-- i dont want to give a spoiler again!) Dc got upset that this death happened and got a little bit teary, i felt terrible, but it opened a good conversation about how CS Lewis was religious and so believed in God and the afterlife and this inspired many of his books, and also that children's books were a little different in the old days perhaps because they were written during/after WW2 when children had to be more comfortable with scary ideas like death (I'm a historian and dc loves history so we do tend to get into these chats.)

Meanwhile H is there and i can tell a sulk is coming on. He's pissed off dc has acted this way, wont get involved in the conversation, tells dc to stop crying and 'acting ridiculous' and says she's being 'a baby'. When her food comes he's still pissed off and tells her she is eating 'like an animal' (she wasn't.) Then in front of her he said to me 'she's ruining this'. I stuck up for her which tends to make it worse. He walked off in front of us all the way home and has just told me that he's not pissed off and I'm the one acting weird.

Writing it out, i know it sounds bad. And it is. But it is also very normal for him. He's had scenes like this on holidays and meals out and at home and when his mood takes over he can't rein it in for dc or me. Often leads to a blowout argument which i try and diffuse if dc is there but he will then shut the door to our room and raise his voice/swear anyway. He cannot tolerate normal dc behaviour. When she was a toddler he would get angry if she was afraid of the dark or if she acted crazy during a long movie. We have clashed over it so many times. He has no patience. Even his mum tells him 'she's just a kid'. He is too strict when i'm not around and i dont really like leaving them together for that reason sometimes. I was out for 2hrs working the other day and by the time i came back he had confiscated her nintendo because she didn't get dressed fast enough.

He has a lot of resentment toward me because i had a short emotional affair which i confessed to quickly, in a very dark time in our marriage during covid when we had a separation, and i know this and i have apologised so many times but i now just think we might be done. I am tired of him ruining a nice evening out or whatever. Me and dc had the chat about the book, moved on, and had a nice dinner. He chose to seethe and get more worked up.

This isn't right, is it?

OP posts:
Lancia72 · 19/01/2024 15:49

If you stay with him, please explain to us why, because it's something I've been trying to get out of my own mother all my life.

westofnarnia · 19/01/2024 15:52

@Lancia72 why have i stayed so far? abandonment issues and other MH stuff, codependence/trauma bond (something i have been working through with my therapist in the past few months), financial reasons tied to wanting a good life for dd in terms of material things and experiences, shame about having been a young single mum. they may not be 'good' reasons but they are reasons. its weird as things arent even the worst they have ever been with H by far, but right now feels like my tipping point. i just dont want dc to have to deal with something like this ever again.

OP posts:
Lancia72 · 19/01/2024 15:55

I'm starting to get kind of pissed off on behalf of your daughter. You seem to have been watching her being treated as the whipping girl for years and you're still not really doing anything about it.

hevs03 · 19/01/2024 16:00

Christ, he is awful I feel like I want to rattle him until his teeth shake, and tell him how fucking lucky he is to have a wonderful daughter and a wife who tries to keep the peace because of his sodding behavior. This is not a life, it sounds miserable and lonely and the damage being done to your daughters self esteem because of her Dad is so very sad. I would leave, because long term you and your daughter would be so much happier.

Twolittleloves · 19/01/2024 16:05

Have you thought that maybe she isn't emotional due to hormones, but due to the impact an emotionally abusive and critical father is having on her?
This has gone on too long already, please put her first and leave.
I work with lots of girls aged 10-12 who have significant issues, due to parent/s belitting, criticising, mocking them or dismissing the importance of their feelings throughout their lives.Often these girls end up being vulnerable and easily influenced, with very little self esteem or self worth, and it can be really hard to build that up again.And they often self harm as a coping mechanism.

I'm not saying your daughter would definitely go that way, and it sounds like your trying your best to counteract things, but whilst he is still around that may not be enough... please act now to stop things getting any worse.If he wants contact he can go through court, and if you have worries about your daughters safety or emotional wellbeing around him, you need to voice those to social services.

YetMoreNewBeginnings · 19/01/2024 16:12

westofnarnia · 19/01/2024 15:13

People will think i am nuts to leave him. He isnt physically abusive, he comes over ok to friends (though my family dont like him as have witnessed his sulks), he has a good job and we have a nice life. Im the one who had an affair, im 'the difficult one' and people will think im crazy to leave as a single mum in my 30s who gets no support from dc bio dad. And im afraid i will have a breakdown if i leave which is what happened when we separated before. Im afraid i will just blame myself and regret it, or go back. It feels safer to do nothing. But i am just so stuck on thinking about dc last night. He still maintains it was abnormal for her to be upset at the meal. He said 'she acts like a baby all the time'. She doesnt, she is a sensitive kid who tbf has to live with his moods. She wet the bed last year when we were having an argument in the other room and i should have left then. I am terrified of being a 'bad mum' and failing her ever since she was born, but it has come true anyway. And i still feel like, if i smoothed things over, if i 'listened' to H more about her, or was less passionate about sticking up for her every time, my marriage would be OK, and he would be nicer to us. But thats not true, is it? He controls his own behaviour.
I know i sound a bit mad.

If the man you had the EA with could see he was abusive then you'll probably find other people can as well, so they won't think you are nuts at all.

It isn't safer to do nothing. You are teaching your daughter that this is what life should be, that this is how men should treat their wives and children.

She wet the bed last year when we were having an argument in the other room

Anytime you think leaving is the wrong thing to do remember that moment. She was so scared she wet the bed. She was that scared in her own home, in her own bed.

Life with just you two might be a bit more skint, but as a child the feeling of safety in your home is utterly priceless

Chaiandtoast · 19/01/2024 16:13

On wow all i can think about is her growing up and expecting to be treated like this by the men she dates. Dating men who show obvious disdain for her and hoping she can fix them, or dimming herself so as not to annoy them, as she’s been taught to do

she will expect to be criticised and expect to be bullied, her self esteem will be low because she’s always been told how awful she is, how she ruins things, how she’s not normal.

you said you stay together because it’s important she has a father figure at all costs, well that’s the cost.

westofnarnia · 19/01/2024 16:15

If i leave, can i turn this around for her? Is it possible?
I am crying reading these. ive been so selfish.

OP posts:
Lancia72 · 19/01/2024 16:15

People will think i am nuts to leave him.

What, and that's more important than the impact he's having on a nine year-old human being? In your own way you're as bad as him. I'm out.

Pumpkindoodles · 19/01/2024 16:17

People will think i am nuts to leave him
and?

we have a nice life
your dd is wetting the bed she’s so scared of him, so I’d say this seems like a stretch

Im the one who had an affair
its not an affair if you were not together. Which you weren’t.

and people will think im crazy to leave as a single mum in my 30s
why is this more important than anything else?

you need to be strong for your dd. It’s ok to find it hard, but you need to try. Worrying about what other people will think about that, over what she needs, isn’t fair to her.

Chaiandtoast · 19/01/2024 16:19

westofnarnia · 19/01/2024 16:15

If i leave, can i turn this around for her? Is it possible?
I am crying reading these. ive been so selfish.

Yes. Of course you can.

YetMoreNewBeginnings · 19/01/2024 16:19

westofnarnia · 19/01/2024 16:15

If i leave, can i turn this around for her? Is it possible?
I am crying reading these. ive been so selfish.

Yes. If you do it while she's young enough.

I was removed from my violent home by my grandparents when I was 7.

Lots of therapy. Lots of tough times.

But I have a good life with a good husband, my children and good boundaries with people the majority of the time.

My siblings are all 7+ years older than me, so teens when we were taken, and they haven't fared half as well.

Quitelikeit · 19/01/2024 16:29

Op

You mentioned your own father and how he was abusive - why do you think you attract abusers? Because that was your role model growing up.

Our personalities are intricate and we pick up on subtle things without even knowing and these things growing up shape us in all sorts of ways.

Your dp was highly likely to have grown up suffering or witnessing abuse hence his character now

The longer you stay and expose your child to this dynamic the higher the risk becomes to her future wellbeing

If she was dating a man like this would you tell her to stay?

It’s pointless arguing with him. Yes of course he’s not all bad. Most abusers aren’t.

You do have a responsibility though imo to now do the right thing by your child as you have now had the situation you are in interpreted in a new light. So denial is no longer an option going forward

If you had a breakdown before then make sure where possible you take steps to prevent that happening again.

good luck

ScabbyHorse · 19/01/2024 16:33

It's shocking that you are making your daughter live with a man who seems to hate her. I would be very concerned about her future mental health.
I have been in your position and I managed to get out with my ds. It is the best thing for you both.

GreatGateauxsby · 19/01/2024 16:36

westofnarnia · 19/01/2024 16:15

If i leave, can i turn this around for her? Is it possible?
I am crying reading these. ive been so selfish.

It’s not about being selfish.
abuse and trauma is complex - do not be hard to yourself.

youve come on here posted and taken on board what others are saying which is the first step (& a big one)

the ABSOFUCKINGLUTELY amazing news is he is NOT her biological father so has no rights to access.
🎉🎉🎉🎉

the extra piece of good news is your job is remote so you can live anywhere! if you look on here there are a lot of post about relocating to more rural northern coastal towns (I’m trapped in London for life and semi jealous of these posters!)

start making a plan to leave and please ignore anyone dumb enough to tell you that you were onto a good thing with this arsehole.

keep posting on here if it helps
if not I wish you and your daughter all the best
💐💐💐

diddl · 19/01/2024 16:41

People will think i am nuts to leave him. He isnt physically abusive, he comes over ok to friends (though my family dont like him as have witnessed his sulks), he has a good job and we have a nice life

Your family will support you, so who are these people who will think your are nuts & why does it matter if they do?

Those who matter don't mind & those who mind don't matter!

You don't have a nice life as he is abusing you & your daughter!

MrsCarson · 19/01/2024 16:42

westofnarnia · 19/01/2024 16:15

If i leave, can i turn this around for her? Is it possible?
I am crying reading these. ive been so selfish.

Yes, you will show her this is not how you are treated in a marriage and this not how you treat children. You will show her you are strong enough to make a better life for the both of you. Reading the original post you made me feel quite anxious, it must be a million times worse for a young child going through it.
She is better off with a good single mum, than a wreck of a mum and a bully abusive man as her father figure.

westofnarnia · 19/01/2024 16:43

Is it definitely abuse, if i have hurt him in the past, eg with the emotional affair? I know deep down he has always been like this sulky and angry, but i also know i made him worse and he resents me and doesnt manage those emotions well. I keep thinking: is it definitely abuse?

OP posts:
Dotty87 · 19/01/2024 16:45

westofnarnia · 19/01/2024 16:43

Is it definitely abuse, if i have hurt him in the past, eg with the emotional affair? I know deep down he has always been like this sulky and angry, but i also know i made him worse and he resents me and doesnt manage those emotions well. I keep thinking: is it definitely abuse?

Two separate issues. Yes it's definitely abuse, nothing justifies his behaviour.

RiaOverTheRainbow · 19/01/2024 16:46

Even if it weren't abuse, your daughter was so scared she wet herself. The effect on her is far more important then the label.

But yes, it is definitively verbal and emotional abuse.

mumtumok · 19/01/2024 16:48

You’re not alone OP. I also have a partner like this - with regards to the kids being kids stuff. Not sure if he would walk all the way home but oh hang on as I write that I remembered he has done from relatives homes or family walks. If it’s a regular occurrence then you need to have it out with him . Maybe send DC to a friends or family members for the night so you can talk without you worrying dc will get upset. All my best love x

HeBeaverandSheBeaver · 19/01/2024 16:50

Sounds familiar

Quitelikeit · 19/01/2024 16:50

So you are only prepared to go if it’s abuse?

Honestly I’d chop my arm off before I let someone subject my child to that treatment

Give your head a shake

StrawberryFizz27 · 19/01/2024 16:55

Please leave him OP, for your daughters sake. I grew up in an abusive household, my dad was & still is an absolute horror, violent, drunk, he used to call me horrible names and tell me people didn't really like me, they only felt sorry for me.

I cannot tell you how much it affected my self esteem and confidence, its only now at 41 after many years of therapy that I'm comfortable in my own skin.

My mum is still with him & I cannot understand why, I wish more than anything in my life she'd left him, he cut my hair off at 9, why would anyone stay with a man that did that. Therec are 5 of us and we're all fucked up in our own way.

Do not even give a thought to what anyone else thinks, the only person who's opinion matters is your daughters and I promise you, she will thank you for getting her out of such an awful situation.

Don't enable his behaviour, protect your daughter & yourself. He is vile.

@Turtletunes , it reads that we had very similar childhoods. I'm sorry & I'm sorry about your DB.

FruitBowlCrazy · 19/01/2024 16:56

Oh God please get your lovely child away from this despicable man.