Fiancé just told me he no longer wants to get married?

[LittleCactus]

I'm so confused. Been engaged 4 years (to the day, in fact) and he. Just told me he doesn't want to get married a anymore. Doesn't see the point and thinks it's too much faff/expense if it all goes to pot. He still wants to be with me, apparently, but not as a married couple. I love the idea of marriage and have always envisioned myself being someone's wife.
What would you do?

I would take this as a red flag. What else is he going to do a u turn on? Kids? Moving house? You get the gist.

I had a bf who brought up marriage and was always yapping on about us getting engaged. Then he started to get cold feet about getting engaged. I thought as above if he does a u turn on something that HE BROUGHT UP would he do the same when it came to having kids?

After I broke up with him he said he never wanted kids and was only saying it for me. 😂

I broke up with him cos the trust was gone and I was right to. Devastated at the time but married now. He proposed and we were married 4 months later and he was active in planning it.

Nope. They're not married. She's not on the deeds. And even if she was, the house could still be sold and the proceeds split

It depends on a lot of things.

@LittleCactus needs to quietly go and get good legal advice before she does or says anything else

also OP to add - I am v sorry this has happened. If marriage is v important to find a man who is (truly) marriage minded or open to it

Yes, it really is letting the child down as well. I hear this from men, "I wouldn't marry because when it inevitably ends I don't want the ex to get her hands on my money - but I'm a decent guy, I'd look after the kids!".

Firstly, yeah right, as if they are likely to step up and do the daily grind, not just the fun stuff.

Secondly, where will these kids live - surely either mainly with their mother, or half the time. And where is the mother going to live, in the poor financial position she's been left in?

If these men really prioritised their kids (actual or hypothetical), they would also look after and respect the mothers of their children. Because that has a huge impact on the children in many ways.

OP - To give this prick the absolute benefit of the doubt and try and salvage this, it might be that he's insecure about the relationship (e.g. feels left out now that baby's here), and instead of communicating this constructively like an adult, he's just decided that the relationship might end and therefore he needs to protect his interests. You shouldn't have to pander to this level of immaturity, but given the alternatives, it is worth having that conversation with him. Tell him he's clearly less happy in the relationship than he was when he proposed, and you would like to approach this together as a problem to be solved. Don't let him fob you off. If he won't engage honestly and constructively, then you have your answer.

Engaged for four years is a huge red flag in itself and now the inevitable has happened

You are so vulnerable here with no rights to a home you’ve been paying into if you split.

Perhaps you need to tell him marriage is a dealbreaker - you are engaged and it doesnt have to be an expensive faff - a small one will do… then you’ll know his real intentions.

Either way, I would suggest looking for a full-time job asap. You need your independence.

Doesn't see the point and thinks it's too much faff/expense if it all goes to pot

So this is all complete BS then? He just doesn't want the legality of the wedding and financial ties. Think that would actually be enough for me to end it. Also doesnt sound like he has much faith in the relationship

Op. Do not say another word to him about this.
It's not looking good. But process it, sleep on it, get legal advice on it- and do it all stealthily. Start saving as much as you can without him noticing.

You can own a house jointly regardless of the mortgage. You own it as "tenants in common" or "joint tenants". When you are TIC it means you have a share (which can be 50%) whereas if you own it as JT then you own it jointly meaning it goes to the other when one of you dies. Joint tenants is the usual way married couples own property but it sounds like he wanted you to have a share which was representative of your contribution. That might have been right when you were first in a relationship but it won't be right now. Go and see a lawyer in the background now so you can work out your strategy before you have all this out with him.

The money you have paid into the house could be classed as rent. Forget about it. Think instead how you are going to secure your financial future going forward so that you're not still in the same position in 5 years. Marriage is out so you need a plan b.

Does he pay you for childcare? No, then no more money from you towards rent and bills. Start saving every penny you earn and look at how you might become financially independent. Don't get suckered into paying all the childcare so you can work either. For half the week give him the baby first thing in the morning and leave the house. Let him figure it out.

I am completely with the stealth approach

I'm sorry sweetie but I don't think he wants to marry YOU.

Where would he get it from, the money to pay you back? Easy for him to say that in principle he doesn't currently object, but where is that ringfenced sum with your name on it? You cannot leave yourself dependent on the goodwill of an ex.

Also, would he give you the current value of what you'd paid in (if the house value has increased)? Do talk to a lawyer and one question can be about whether you can have a specified share of the house at least. I know an unmarried couple who have done that, I think it's bloody unfair as she has given him three children and works PT, but she accepts it as he was older and wealthier when they met.

“Giving you back what you paid in” is not enough. The £ you paid in are now worth less than they were when you paid them due to inflation. You have also paid in to an appreciating asset so are entitled to part of the gain in value too.

Have you financially contributed towards any repairs/replacements in the home?

Just to add, your coming to this conclusion on your vulnerability only just as your maternity has ended. Better this has happened now and not 10 years in the future. Whilst it may feel overwhelming this isn't life ending and you can get yourself back to a comfortable position.

OP isn't entitled to anything back, certainlynot for the pre-child years. Unless you think Prince Charming should have been housing her for free.

"We have one child and we live in a house together that only he is on the mortgage for yet I have paid a lot into."

Why oh why oh why do women do this 😩

I'm sure everyone else has already pointed out that you're in an extremely vulnerable position.

You need to start prioritising your financial security; this probably means increasing your working hours and looking for a higher paid job. You need to do this now.

If he won't marry you then you need to change the ownership of the property so that you're joint tenants. If he won't do that then you should stop contributing anything towards the mortgage. And you should start saving for a deposit so that if the relationship goes wrong and he kicks you out (which he can legally do with nothing but 'reasonable notice' - which isn't much) you can at least find a private rental.

Do you have any savings?

Yep. It's the same story we read here all the time. Get legal advice OP and start saving to leave.

Ask him to put that in writing. I'm sick and can't work, that didn't stop me going on the deeds and mortgage with then DP. We're you with DP when you were given this information or was it something he told you? Given there's an existing mortgage the mortgage provider would have to agree to you going on the deeds as well as the mortgage, this could involve a reassessment which might not be favourable given increase in interest rates. An easy way to assess this for yourself would be how much % of your joint income goes on paying the mortgage.

My point is that paying back only the amount she paid in (let’s call it £20k for sake of argument) would not be fair as the £20k is now worth less than it was then, almost certainly as a percentage of the value of the house at the point it was paid compared to the value of the house now.

I think its ltb territory tbh.

He's essentially saying he's only with you till something better comes along. I find that whole 'marriage is just a piece of paper' considering he proposed to you an utter fucking insult tbh.

I'd wonder if it was a 'shut up ring' to begin with. Eg: before you got pregnant to stop you leaving. Or to get you to move in and start paying towards his mortgage/being a house maid.

I'd ask for my money back now if he isn't going to marry you. Why should it have to only be if you leave. You paid him under false pretenses, now you know that, you want it back.

Unless he's paid a higher percentage of his earnings than you then he still hasn't paid more. If for example he earns £2000 and you earn £1000 monthly. 50% each is £1000 and £500 per month for example. Making a pot of £1,500 for joint expenses of £1000 mortgage and £500 bills.

Not £1,500 joint expenses and then split it £900 £600 for example.

Do NOT suggest anything, tell him anything, make threats to leave or give him ultimatums until after you have seen a solicitor and had proper legal advice. They will advise you the best way to go about getting your name on the deeds. That is the priority now. Don't warn him about it! Keep calm, do nothing, say nothing until you know where you stand and what to do.

I despair every time I read about women getting themselves into these situations time and time again. Why on earth would you pay a mortgage on a house that you have no rights to, or when you're not married to the homeowner? You may as well just be pissing money straight down the drain. And why would you then have a child in that situation when the man could literally leave you both penniless and homeless if he feels like it?