Page 9 | How to split things in a new relationship when one earns masses more than you?

Trisolaris · 19/08/2023 20:40

I was in this position when I first started dating my husband. We would just take turns planning and paying for dates - that way we could each spend what fitted our budgets. I was clear with him that I couldn’t spend loads but I was happy for him to plan dates that were a similar budget to mine and didn’t expect anything fancy. E.g he could choose a fancy restaurant if he fancied for a date and then I might book some cheap theatre tickets but equally if he wanted to book a chain restaurant to match what I’d spent that was up to him.

Jem123456789 · 19/08/2023 21:25

You really need to have an honest conversation with him. Tell him that you’re feeling the pinch with going out so much and over spending and maybe you could stay in watch tv, go to the cinema etc instead of going for expensive cocktails and meals out? Next time he buys tickets for an all day event just tell him that you can’t afford the extras and to take a friend instead. I honestly wouldn’t expect more than 50/50 at this early stage tbh but if it does go further then you will definitely need to have a talk on finances. My DH and I earned almost the same when we met however he had a shed load of debt and a couple of years down the line I decided to help clear his debts so we could buy a house and get married. I also paid for the house deposit. Once we lived together we pooled our finances and everything went into one pot. Over the 20 years we’ve been married sometimes he’s earned more than me and sometimes I’ve earned more. It’s never mattered. I’ve been promoted much more than him and currently earn about 50% more than him. he’s also been out of work a few times and I never had. Again finances didn’t change in terms of what each of us could spend as we shared the same pot of money. We live in the same house. We holiday together and the majority of our socialising is done together. We don’t see one salary when it’s in our account, we just see OUR salary. If your situation is still the same in a couple of years then I’d say that this was a major issue especially with him earning a huge amount more than you.

Eskimal · 19/08/2023 21:30

beastlyslumber · 19/08/2023 16:01

I don't think that paying on a date, or not, relates to workplace inequality. It's sex and relationships and the way we interact in that context sends messages about how we feel. If a man won't buy me a coffee on a first date, it suggests to me that he's selfish. I'll happily buy his coffee but I won't see him again because he's told me through his actions that he is not a generous person. A date is a chance to impress the other person and show them who you are. If a man won't at least offer to pay, that shows me he is not generous. I think men want to be chivalrous amd kind, and women usually find this to be desirable. We want to feel safe with a man and him being generous without any kind of weirdness or expectation is a way he can show us he's a safe person.

This is obviously based on my personal experience but I think it's pretty normal and traditional for men to expect to pay on the first few dates. Maybe it's different if you ask the man out and arrange the date? I don't know; I've never done that. I imagine I would in that case be expecting to pay for the whole thing.

do you see how confusing you make it…. You expect a man to pay for coffee on a first date because they’re a man but you also expect equal pay in the workplace because you’re both human beings.
wouldn’t the world just be easier if we didn’t make it about being a man or a woman… but we just expected equality and acted with equality in all situations? I.e. either one of you pays for the coffee on the first date and you (beastlyslumber) don’t hold silly opinions about what a man should or shouldn’t do in dating situations when you expect the opposite in the workplace. You do all people striving for equality a disservice.

beastlyslumber · 19/08/2023 22:23

Eskimal · 19/08/2023 21:30

do you see how confusing you make it…. You expect a man to pay for coffee on a first date because they’re a man but you also expect equal pay in the workplace because you’re both human beings.
wouldn’t the world just be easier if we didn’t make it about being a man or a woman… but we just expected equality and acted with equality in all situations? I.e. either one of you pays for the coffee on the first date and you (beastlyslumber) don’t hold silly opinions about what a man should or shouldn’t do in dating situations when you expect the opposite in the workplace. You do all people striving for equality a disservice.

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No, because dating is not work? We're talking about two completely different situations.

As I said, I would pay for the first date, sure. But the guy not offering to pay would let me know he's not a generous person and that's why I wouldn't continue to date him.

It's not silly. It's understanding that different situations with different aims call for different approaches. I suppose that could be confusing if you are a very rigid thinker who needs the same set of rules applied to all situations and can't cope with nuance. I do think most people can tell the difference between going to work and going on a date, though.

Kisskiss · 19/08/2023 22:38

beastlyslumber · 19/08/2023 22:23

No, because dating is not work? We're talking about two completely different situations.

As I said, I would pay for the first date, sure. But the guy not offering to pay would let me know he's not a generous person and that's why I wouldn't continue to date him.

It's not silly. It's understanding that different situations with different aims call for different approaches. I suppose that could be confusing if you are a very rigid thinker who needs the same set of rules applied to all situations and can't cope with nuance. I do think most people can tell the difference between going to work and going on a date, though.

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I think you’re the one who is completely missing the point. He’s right, either we are equal or we are not. I’m equal at work and I’m equal in my personal relationships- what you stated ( paying = chivalry) shows your personal bias , that in this day and age you still value a man more as a partner if he shows an inclination to be ‘generous’ and provide

beastlyslumber · 19/08/2023 23:03

Kisskiss · 19/08/2023 22:38

I think you’re the one who is completely missing the point. He’s right, either we are equal or we are not. I’m equal at work and I’m equal in my personal relationships- what you stated ( paying = chivalry) shows your personal bias , that in this day and age you still value a man more as a partner if he shows an inclination to be ‘generous’ and provide

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Yes, I absolutely value generosity in a partner and look for it when I'm dating. If a man isn't generous I don't continue to date him because I don't want a relationship with someone who isn't generous.

When someone is generous they show it by offering to pay for things. I also offer to pay for things, host things, buy gifts etc, because I'm a generous person too.

It's got nothing to do with equality. What does that even mean in a relationship anyway? In a straight relationship a big part of attraction is that you bring different qualities and play different roles to one another. I'm looking for someone who I can be authentic and vulnerable with - not someone who is selfish or obsessed with adding up the cost of everything.

If you dont want someone generous, that's fine too. I'm not here to tell you you're wrong. If it works for you to treat your relationship the same way you'd treat a working relationship then great, I'm happy for you. I definitely wouldn't be happy to date someone who was more concerned with us being financiallt equal than he was concerned about being kind, generous, thoughtful etc. But that's me.

aloris · 19/08/2023 23:14

Reading over your posts, I see a guy who is very attentive to making sure that he is not taken advantage of by gold diggers, but who is not himself respectful of your financial limits. He said he would pay you back for takeout but didn't, even though he earns much more than you. That in itself is a huge red flag imo. He invited you to an event and then dropped a whole bunch of expenses on you at this event. Second red flag. You are working much too hard to rationalize his behavior. Really decent guys dont need this much mental gymnastics to make their behavior seem ok. I am very dubious about this man.

reallyconfusedmostofthetime · 19/08/2023 23:34

I think you just know really how you feel about it. Like it just feels ok or it doesn’t. Ultimately he won’t change so if he’s expecting you to cough up now prob you’re always going to feel like he’s expecting you to contribute when you have to suffer more for it. I think prob talk to him about it but if it feels a hard convo it’ll prob always be an hard subject in your relationship somehow and do you really want that?

purplehair1 · 20/08/2023 00:58

The comment about the ex - that is a real red flag for me as I have heard similar - and you are responding as he maybe would like in not wanting him to pay more in your relationship. However I am in the reverse situation where I have a partner who earns a lot less than I do. I would like to go away on holiday (ski-ing or scuba diving) with him and have offered to pay. He has turned me down as he can’t afford to pay his part, which has been frustrating as I now can’t have the holidays I enjoy because of his male pride!

Eskimal · 20/08/2023 09:08

Kisskiss · 19/08/2023 22:38

I think you’re the one who is completely missing the point. He’s right, either we are equal or we are not. I’m equal at work and I’m equal in my personal relationships- what you stated ( paying = chivalry) shows your personal bias , that in this day and age you still value a man more as a partner if he shows an inclination to be ‘generous’ and provide

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Beastyslumber has completely missed my point every time I make it. She wants to pick and chose where equality exists in life as it suits her. She thinks because work and relationships are different things, it’s ok to expect equality in one but not the other. She’s so obsessed with the word generosity that she can’t pause to understand the point I’m making. I’m going to give up.

IWantOutDoI · 20/08/2023 09:17

You are not financially compatible. It is early days and he already wants to go halves regardless of your much lower income. Halves would be good if you were earning the same but cannot afford to match his expenses standards as they should be much much higher (this goes from nice restaurants to expensive regular holidays)

He may want to avoid being seen as a free dinner but you don’t want to be with a wanker that makes you spend money you don’t have just to prove him you are not with him for his money.

Who knows? He may have been with a gold digger or, more likely, he might be very very tight and complaining about an ex who couldn’t keep up with his level of expenses.

TLDRfuckers · 20/08/2023 09:19

he doesn’t sound like someone who earns a high salary and you found completely incompatible anyway.

IWantOutDoI · 20/08/2023 09:23

https://belonging.berkeley.edu/equity-vs-equality-whats-difference

How to split things in a new relationship when one earns masses more than you?

beastlyslumber · 20/08/2023 09:24

Eskimal · 20/08/2023 09:08

Beastyslumber has completely missed my point every time I make it. She wants to pick and chose where equality exists in life as it suits her. She thinks because work and relationships are different things, it’s ok to expect equality in one but not the other. She’s so obsessed with the word generosity that she can’t pause to understand the point I’m making. I’m going to give up.

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I understand you fine. You're the one who insists that I mean something different to what I'm actually saying. I mean what I say, not what you decide you think I mean based on your own ideas about me/relationships/work. I'm happy to agree to disagree - but would appreciate the respect of you actually listening to what I'm saying rather than making it up to suit your argument.

billy1966 · 20/08/2023 09:38

IWantOutDoI · 20/08/2023 09:17

You are not financially compatible. It is early days and he already wants to go halves regardless of your much lower income. Halves would be good if you were earning the same but cannot afford to match his expenses standards as they should be much much higher (this goes from nice restaurants to expensive regular holidays)

He may want to avoid being seen as a free dinner but you don’t want to be with a wanker that makes you spend money you don’t have just to prove him you are not with him for his money.

Who knows? He may have been with a gold digger or, more likely, he might be very very tight and complaining about an ex who couldn’t keep up with his level of expenses.

I completely agree.

The OP will figure it out, but my money is on money being a big issue for him.

He has shown himself to be very thoughtless around their different salary levels.

The opportunity to sort that was each doing paying for a date, but he didn't want that because in his mind it just MIGHT cost him a more because of HIS tastes.

He's tight IMO.

The Chinese from a restaurant is a perfect example.

Anyone decent would have insisted on paying but he allowed you to do it.

Money being such an issue so soon, with so many examples to draw on is a huge red flag.

Oh an not returning the £30 is off.
He doesn't get to decide HOW he returns it.

Posters are determined to give you a kicking as per usual, but listen to your gut.

There is little as unattractive as a tight money obsessed man.

Ick inducing.

StillWantingADog · 20/08/2023 09:46

It sounds quite tough Tbf and the fact he hasn’t refunded you for stuff he said he would is very irritating.

you need to have an honest conversation with him, I think it’s reasonable that he pays a bit more into the relationship but having previously been messed around by a woman after his money I’d forgive him for being conservative

my dh earns a lot more than me but we’re married so the pot is pretty equally shared (other than him paying for the fancy car that he wanted). But I can totally see how it would be awkward early on in a relationship if earnings differed a lot

Justacouplemorethen · 20/08/2023 10:10

I agree with previous posters that you don’t seem very compatible - he sounds like he is happy for you to spend over your means and either doesn’t realise it is too much or is being overly tight, and you are trying to be equal but actually spending too much and getting resentful. You’ve made a good suggestion going forward to pay for alternate dates, but he rejected that - why? Why wouldn’t he want to arrange and pay for a whole date, and get the same back from you? Is it because he doesn’t think he’ll like the dates you’ll arrange, or does he like you paying for things on the dates he arranges?
If someone has the means to treat you (especially if they got you tickets for a thing you probably wouldn’t have gone to yourself and it turned into an expensive day) why wouldn’t they? Would they not derive pleasure from that? If I wanted to treat my partner to a date or a day out, it gives me pleasure. You can treat him back on another day that you arrange (and is within your budget).
I think he doesn’t sound a good match for you. I too am used to dates paying for more than me if they earn more, and I think the generosity is a good trait and one you are used to and seem to value. He is either tight and ungenerous or unaware and unappreciative of the financial disparity between you, either way, it seems like it is unlikely to get better.

RedDedRedemption · 20/08/2023 10:28

@beastlyslumber I don't see the point in men paying for the 'first few' dates. That's when both sides have the lowest investment - he could spend a lot and either of them could walk. What a waste of money.
Traditionally, men paid. But they also then expected to do none of the 'women's' work. If your ultimate goal is to be a SAHM then I can see this would impress you but otherwise.
It implies financial generosity, yes, but as a modern woman that's not the main thing. I want a man who will do his share of the housework.

IME the 'traditional' men who insisted on paying tend to expect something in return. The ones who, once we were properly together treated me from time to time were much more balanced.

Phoenix2022 · 20/08/2023 10:33

datingred · 16/08/2023 14:17

So I know the general consensus on here is if you are married/committed with kids that everyone should either put their money in the same pot, or you should split things in proportion to what you earn, but what about early on in a relationship?

I'm struggling to decide how I feel in a new relationship (3 months) with a wonderful man but he's not as obviously generous as I'm used to and it's sort of grating on me (yes, I'm prepared to be flamed..!)

I think he earns 3 or 4 times more than me (perhaps even more than that) and he's on a minimum of £150k...maybe more like £200k or more.. I know he also has masses of disposable income and is planning on remodelling his house (nothing wrong with it - just choosing to turn it into his ideal house).

He's made a comment in passing about having had one ex that was after him for his money so I feel like he's made it a delicate subject - although I appreciate money always is!

Generally (because of the above, and also because generally I always offer) we have been taking it in turns or splitting things when we go out. A couple of times I have paid and maybe 4 times he has paid. He has probably paid for things slightly more than me - i.e we have 3 rounds of drinks and he's paid first and I've paid 2nd so he's paid 3rd and last though. So it's not like he's not generous at all..

I'm just struggling to decide if I'm being totally unreasonable to expect, at this early stage, him to consider the fact that he earns multiples of my salary and therefore ought to perhaps pay a bit more often or not? I guess I feel like if you're in a committed, loving relationship with someone and you're doing something that week that costs one of you, say, 60%-70% of your fun spending money for the week and the other one, say, 10% of the spending money, that perhaps you'd think more often that you should pay? I would if the situations were reversed...but of course I earn a LOT less and have a LOT less disposable income.

There have also been a few times were he has let me pay for something (say a takeaway at his place) where he said he would pay me back and he hasn't and it's grating me.. I know it'll be because he earns a lot and so £30 here and there means nothing to him but it does to me! But then it feels awkward/mean to ask for it.

What are people's thoughts? At what stage does what each other earns come into play to adjust things away from 50/50 split?

No kids on either part...

Maybe I am a bit old school, but even though he's great, for me it would be a massive issue if a guy who earns that amount of money gets so close to his money. On the first dates, I always prefer to do 50:50 although I appreciate being covered on the first one and I would pay on the second date. But for me, the low point is taking you out to an event that you would not necessarily go normally because of the price and expecting you to pay half. If he takes you out, then I think he should cover most of the things on that day and you can take him out on another date where you can afford things. If you like each other, it should be the intention that count. To me, the fact that he tells you that he got hurt because of an ex is one easy excuse for the way he behaves. If he tells you he would pay you back the delivery but doesn't - then does he fell the right to take advantage of someone else unconsciously?
But again I'm pretty old school

Mostlyoblivious · 20/08/2023 14:13

You need to have a gentle / calm conversation to say that activities need to be pitched around your income point. Don’t ask him to spend more etc. just point out your fun budget and go from there. It’s been 12 weeks, it’s early days. I was in a similar situation with my now husband and he heard me and we tailored our activities

beastlyslumber · 20/08/2023 14:48

RedDedRedemption · 20/08/2023 10:28

@beastlyslumber I don't see the point in men paying for the 'first few' dates. That's when both sides have the lowest investment - he could spend a lot and either of them could walk. What a waste of money.
Traditionally, men paid. But they also then expected to do none of the 'women's' work. If your ultimate goal is to be a SAHM then I can see this would impress you but otherwise.
It implies financial generosity, yes, but as a modern woman that's not the main thing. I want a man who will do his share of the housework.

IME the 'traditional' men who insisted on paying tend to expect something in return. The ones who, once we were properly together treated me from time to time were much more balanced.

I'm happy to pay or go halves. I just think the man should always offer. That tells me he's generous and that's important to me.

I do take your point about early dates being low investment - I'm talking about coffee, maybe a glass.of wine. If he won't even offer to buy a coffee, he's not for me.

chopc · 20/08/2023 15:36

I think if you are in a new relationship you both agree to dates you can afford to go on. Three months is hardly any time ......

RedDedRedemption · 20/08/2023 15:44

beastlyslumber · 20/08/2023 14:48

I'm happy to pay or go halves. I just think the man should always offer. That tells me he's generous and that's important to me.

I do take your point about early dates being low investment - I'm talking about coffee, maybe a glass.of wine. If he won't even offer to buy a coffee, he's not for me.

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Why should the man offer and not the woman? It's not a given that he's the higher earner.
Of course I'm saying this as someone who's dated both sexes. Even with friends sometimes I just pay for them and they do the same.
It's a person, not a sex-based thing though.

I suppose people say 'well the woman ends up doing more housework' etc etc but I am the opposite. I cannot see mess, am massively disorganised and the only thing I'm halfway decent at is cooking. And making money...

beastlyslumber · 20/08/2023 16:00

RedDedRedemption · 20/08/2023 15:44

Why should the man offer and not the woman? It's not a given that he's the higher earner.
Of course I'm saying this as someone who's dated both sexes. Even with friends sometimes I just pay for them and they do the same.
It's a person, not a sex-based thing though.

I suppose people say 'well the woman ends up doing more housework' etc etc but I am the opposite. I cannot see mess, am massively disorganised and the only thing I'm halfway decent at is cooking. And making money...

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I didn't say the woman shouldn't offer. I said the man should. I always offer, but that doesn't mean I don't want the man to offer. Not offering is tightfisted.

Women can pay a bit of a dating tax when it comes to hair, make up, nails etc. So when it comes to straight dates that's something to consider?

Either way, I am still convinced that a man I'm dating should offer to pay for my coffee and if he doesn't offer it tells me he's not generous and I don't want to see him again. I don't really see how anyone can argue with that but loads of people apparently think I should lower my standards and go out with someone I find to be miserly 🤷

https://youtube.com/shorts/7olthyCHa8Y?feature=share

Before you continue to YouTube

https://youtube.com/shorts/7olthyCHa8Y?feature=share

RedDedRedemption · 20/08/2023 16:30

beastlyslumber · 20/08/2023 16:00

I didn't say the woman shouldn't offer. I said the man should. I always offer, but that doesn't mean I don't want the man to offer. Not offering is tightfisted.

Women can pay a bit of a dating tax when it comes to hair, make up, nails etc. So when it comes to straight dates that's something to consider?

Either way, I am still convinced that a man I'm dating should offer to pay for my coffee and if he doesn't offer it tells me he's not generous and I don't want to see him again. I don't really see how anyone can argue with that but loads of people apparently think I should lower my standards and go out with someone I find to be miserly 🤷

https://youtube.com/shorts/7olthyCHa8Y?feature=share

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I don't think you should lower your standards if that's what you want. Or need to explain yourself to others. I just find what people use to gauge intentions rather interesting and I see what you are saying.
I don't want to date stingy people either and, even worse (!) I want a partner with good earning potential. I'm pleased to say that H covers both bases.
The reason I would not use a coffee is as we both agree it's a wasted investment in the first few dates. But also if you use online dating apps you might be seeing multiple people, coffees and treats here and there can add up. I don't think it's fair to expect to go on all these dates for free as a woman. I think the dating tax is silly because nobody is forcing women to do all these things, if you're the sort who cares about your appearance that much you'd be doing all of those anyway regardless of whether you had dates lined up or not.
I do the opposite if he likes me make-up free when we go somewhere really nice I pull out all the stops. Quite surprising how well I scrub up.
Once we are exclusive absolutely I would expect him to not begrudge me a couple of quid. Usually if we're at a fair or watching a movie he'll order and not asl me to transfer him the couple of quid. Which I think is fair enough. Most decent men do treat their woman, H also bought me quite a few surprises like one of those everlasting roses. So cute!

It baffles me when women are on here saying 'ohh my H forgot my birthday and has done nothing I'm so sad'. It turns out they have never bothered and they've given him a free pass, then moan about it . Why?