I’ll confess here, I’m so f****ng envies of women who have male admires…

[UglyNameChange]

I know we're supposed to be independent-need-no-man, who needs male validations, but god damn do I want even one man to like me.

I was reading another thread about op who kissed her boyfriends friend (yeah, not the best situation) and she went to say how he told her he has had feelings for her for long time bla bla bla. I can’t imagine how that must feel like to hear.

I want someone to like me, want to be with me.
I’ve never been in a relationship, never been on a date (don’t judge,please).

No matter how I read the advices people give to single women, I can’t even help myself to be okey with being single and it just makes me feel like a double loser.

How I wish I was a woman men liked/wanted to be with/could love.

Just to be clear, I don’t wish anything bad to lucky women (well, all the rest of the women in the world it feels) I just wish I was as lucky as them too.

Thanks for anyone who read my rant.

I sympathise OP. I'd always had lots of attention, then a couple of years ago, got ill, had chemo, lost my hair, looked terrible, and all the attention stopped. Strangers were openly contemptuous of me, it was horrible. I was genuinely shocked at how some people behave. Since then I've recovered and things are going back to normal, but I haven't forgotten.

Can you set a budget for your makeover project? You can do quite a lot by yourself but a budget will help and will give you confidence. And 'outside help' means new ideas. Then I would do three things if you haven't already tried.

Go to M&S bra shop or similar and have a fitting.

Find a decent hair dresser by personal recommendation. Look around the people you know and ask those who always have lovely tidy chic hair. Then go and ask their advice about a new style, based on your face shape and type of hair. Can you set a budget per 6-8 weeks (£100 ?) which should allow for a regular cut and colour. It may take several visits to get it right.

Find an image consultant locally, with a good web site. Ring a few and have a chat. Say you want cheering up, help with a new confident look for autumn/winter. Or you could try a session with a personal shopper. Or you could simply ask a friend or relative whose clothes/look you admire. Dedicate time browsing the web sites when the autumn collections come out next month. Don't hurry. Looking good takes time. The style pages on MN have plenty of links, so find some sites that make clothes to your body shape. Think carefully about a whole wardrobe incorporating clothes you already have and like, that will suit your lifestyle. Make sure you identify at least one dressy outfit you would love to wear on an evening out.

Once you've done all of that, and look good/feel confident, go out to hobbies & places you enjoy. You won't meet anyone staying at home. Build up some regular haunts - favourite coffee shop, sports venues, a new class etc, because you need to meet the same people multiple times for someone who likes you to get chatting, and then pluck up the courage to ask you out.

Enjoy your autumn project. Remember this is meant to be fun. Even if you don't meet anyone, you will look great, probably make some new friends, and enjoy yourself. Being happy is always attractive. Good luck.

This is interesting, I never had any trouble approaching men, I think quite a lot of women don't, I certainly never waited around if I liked someone I let them know.

I am now wracking my brain to remember if I was ever knocked back. If you fancy them- tell them , honestly what is the worst that can happen ?

Hi OP. First of all I did not think about having a sexual relationship until.i was 45. Convinced myself I wasn't bothered. I was but knew being do overweight I I couldn't be bothered with rejection. I am a likeable person got friends, full life etc.

I went OLD, this was 8 years ago. I had 2 relationships as a result. The se ond one was with simeine who had been unhappily married for over years. He was getting divorced- not because of me. They had split before I came along. He thought I was the best thing since sliced bread. . It was wonderful. I was size 18 ish. He loved my lumps and bumps- suddenly I became more confident. We had a great time together.
I would make sure I'm doing things I enjoy. I certainly would not be trying to.maje myself more charismatic, unless u are an absolute cow, which I'm.sure you are not.
There are people, usually those who have someibe, who say 'you will meet someone when you least expect it's or 'will happen. Whilat that might be true I think you have to.make opportunities OP. Good luck.

I have read many of your threads now, and also the ones I believe you wrote under a different username.

The one thing that shines through every single one of your posts is the tone of resignation. You're coming across as incredibly sad, desperate to be loved and also, if you don't mind me being blunt, obsessed with not having been in a relationship.

If this is how you come across in writing, know that it will likely be magnified in real life. And that will put people off.

Unlike my username suggests, I have been in relationships, and even married, but none of them were loving ones; all were abusive. I know why and have done extensive therapy and soul searching and I have come to the conclusion that I'm not meant to be romantically involved, or loved, by anyone apart from my children.

Here's the difference, though: I enjoy my life. I like my job, have a few people in my wider friendship circle who I meet up with occasionally, I throw myself into my hobbies. And, as a much happier person than I was I get male attention despite being fat now and having hair you only ever see in stereotypical mad cat lady portraits. Some men scoff at me, but they're usually the superficial loser type who'd have been all over me in my prettier days. I'd rather take the smiles from the random street lamp fixer I walked past yesterday.

People are drawn to personalities, and your level of happiness or unhappiness shines through. If you enjoy your life, you will attract people, it really is that simple. But you will need to figure out how to enjoy life in the first place.

This was a hypothetical post as I'm happily married! Just remembering the feelings of my youth

I know what it's like to get horrible, unwanted male attention so I'm not dismissing it at all...but I don't think it's helpful to someone in OP's position. It isn't a compliment, but it's a different sort of problem and it won't help anyone who is struggling with loneliness or self esteem.

There seem to be so many women who ’don’t need no man’ (and they’re always in relationships 😀😉) and it’s like let’s swap roles.

This made me chuckle a bit, but do you think the correlation might be significant? That women who are confident they can get by on their own are in happy, sustained relationships?

When I talked about sexual energy, I really can't stress enough how much I don't mean dressing and pouting like Marilyn Monroe all the time (unless that's your thing, in which case go you). There are lots of ways to be alluring, in your presentation and the way you act, and you aren't necessarily being overtly flirtatious or sexual...just showing yourself in an interesting and engaging light. Like I said, there's some instinct involved.

Many men do not have very high standards and I believe any woman can get attention off a man.

Oof. I think it would have to be a woman of very low self-esteem indeed to have this as their bar for their appeal to men.

It’s not even about self-esteem or what I have a problem with.
It’s just categorically untrue.
And also, imagine how hurtful it is to read that men have no standards when you have never been asked out and when you asked men out, only been rejected.

Like jesus, I’d rather you just puch me in the face with a hammer! That would hurt less!

It’s not about having a low bar, it’s facts.

You do not need to look like a super model to get a man to like you.

OP says she’s never had any attention off men which I struggle to believe.
Not because I think she’s lying but either she’s not been in situations where she’s been around many men or they just haven’t made their feelings known.

As I said I don’t do online dating because when I did I got numerous messages asking to meet before I even put a photo up because some men don’t care what you look like.

These are many men I wouldn’t encourage a relationship with but to think you can’t get a man based solely on looks is just not true.

This is interesting, I never had any trouble approaching men, I think quite a lot of women don't, I certainly never waited around if I liked someone I let them know.

I am now wracking my brain to remember if I was ever knocked back.

Oh wow, good for you I guess?

There is a very wide chasm between not being a supermodel and being any old thing that will get a man’s attention. Most women, and I’m sure OP included, will fall in between.

honestly, if I told someone I was struggling to find a man and I was met with ‘how can that be? Most don’t have very high standards!’

That would be much worse for my self-esteem than the lack of attention. I want a man who is attracted to me to have decent standards, like myself.

You do not need to look like a super model to get a man to like you.

Most people aren’t super models, I don’t think anyone is asking that.
Plenty of people are still good looking, okey looking, average.
Then there is ugly.

OP says she’s never had any attention off men which I struggle to believe.

Well, here I am. If I could show you my past, I would.
Never had any attention. None.
I have been around men, plenty.

they just haven’t made their feelings known.

I sincerely doubt this.
I’m not the kind of women men secretly have a crush on.

What do you want from this thread OP? People saying you aren't alone, it's been their experience too? Or a virtual hug? Or some concrete advice on how to change the situation? Happy to critique any OLD ads you may have, give other advice. I'm fat, but never lacked for male attention, and I do believe if you do want to find someone, you can.

Have you ever had crushes on people? What sort of man do you like?

Do you go anywhere other than work OP?

I’m not saying it’s great that some men have such low standards that they’ll
shag anything but many men do not actually go for women based on their looks and not just because they’re desperate.

Women tend to be more choosy about their partner based on their looks, whereas men are much more likely to look past looks.
Obviously this doesn’t apply to all men.

But saying you can’t find someone based on pure looks is not right because not everyone is that shallow.

Women tend to be more choosy about their partner based on their looks, whereas men are much more likely to look past looks.

I don't think this is true, but I do think some people overestimate the bar for "generally attractive to men".

I can only speak for myself obviously but appearance wise most women are attractive in their own way. Yes I have my preferences of what I would like overall but usually there is something about most women that I find attractive. Whether that be their face, body or personality.

If their personality is good it outweighs their appearance. If their appearance is good, even to the point of being perfect but their personality is not good, it's generally a no relationship wise. Something fleeting, perhaps but nothing serious.

In the same light I don't know whether I am attractive to women, I have no idea what women look for or whether they work in a similar way. Not all men are confident in their appearance or in approaching or initiating something.

What I do know for myself I wouldn't be attracted to someone personality wise who's giving off vibes that they are closed off and others I have crossed paths with have kind of been the same, regardless of their intentions. Very much a case of conversations around other men of she's alright but likely too much hard work or there's no point even trying so they bypass all together.

Except from the sleazes who are relentless and over step, which are usually the ones calling out women or doing things to make them feel uncomfortable.

I am 47 have been mostly happily married for 15 years. I have had a total of 5 LTRs including DH of those initiated 2 and 1 was initiated by him. The other 2 including DH I honestly can't remember. In addition I think I have had 4 or 5 ONS , one of those I definitely initiated the others I am less clear on. So I think I have approached a man I find attractive possibly 5 times over 12 years, it's hardly record breaking. About the same number of times I have been approached. I don't think this is in any way remarkable.

Anyway OP said she has approached men and been unsuccessful so "waiting to be asked" isn't the problem here.

I feel the same all the time. I used to have "admirers" when I was in my late teens, 20's and then by 26 I let myself go massively! I'm 32 now. I don't go out anymore, avoid everyone I used to know so they can't be like "oh god what happened to her" I just go to work, come home and go out with my 12 year old daughter on days out. I would love to go back to how I looked to get some attention. It's really depressing!

I haven't seen a photo of you but I highly doubt that the reason you're not getting any dates is because of your looks, it's more likely to do with your self pitying attitude to be honest. I'm just going to say it because that's all I see in your posts.

There are women who are constantly sexualised and can't get a genuine relationship with anyone but they get attention sure... do you think that's anymore fulfilling than nothing at all?

If you're reading books about loving yourself it sounds like you're not really doing much of the actual work around loving yourself because all I'm hearing you do is put yourself down in your messages so how's that working for you?

If you don't think much of yourself then i'm sorry but that's not attractive to anyone, if you're going to put yourself down constantly then why should anyone else come and tell you otherwise? It sounds to me like you want a relationship to bolster self esteem that you simply don't have and frankly that's only going to end in tears (one who knows).

I think you'd be better off with a therapist to help you understand why you feel this way about yourself before you start looking for a partner. How you feel about yourself matters and you've slammed yourself pretty religiously in every post so far. That's the problem, not how you look.

Oh @PonyPatter44 you did make me laugh with the East German Shot Putter! 🤣😊

It’s too bad @roses321 that you can’t understand a person just having an honest moment and a little vent anonymously online & then just real life existence.
Life ebbs and flows, I’m assuming that even people in relationships aren’t smiling and having sunshine all the time.

Now, I am giving you a benefit of the doubt and not just assume that you were trying to be hurtful on purpose.

It sounds like you're more "invisible" @UglyNameChange.

I mean this kindly, @UglyNameChange , but there is a difference between having an ugly moment and obsessing about not being in a relationship, which you do lament a lot on many threads here.

This is more than that, it goes deeper, but what @roses321 said was true. You need to love yourself before anyone else can, because you know yourself better than anyone, all your strengths and weaknesses, and if you cannot find something which makes you attractive and build on it, how can others possibly do that for you?

I'd assume from reading some of the posts on here about relationships that you're right... you can give me whatever benefit of the doubt you want sweetheart, but i'm telling you very plainly that I see nothing but self pity going on here. Self hatred even.

Do you think that is akin to loving yourself? Or is it hurtful because perhaps it sails slightly too close to the wind of truth?

You're welcome to vent anonymously, but in doing so it may be best not to get a bug up your ass when people respond anonymously to your public posting. Having said that, what answers would work for you exactly? People agreeing with your self pity? I'm not going to do that.

I'm telling you what I see from your posts. You say you read self love books and they take away the pain for a little while, so it sounds like you're not really absorbing the mindset that goes along with the books.

I'm not saying for one second it's easy, there are days I wake up and absolutely can't stand myself to be honest, and other days where I've felt utterly worthless to be quite honest. We've all felt like that. It may amuse you greatly to know that the times I felt the worst in my life were when I was with someone, so at least take comfort in the fact that someone else being in your life will not fix you, in fact it'll break you if you're not careful.

It seems you're very easily offended, I've seen a few offended responses from you in this thread as well so i'm guessing you don't like yourself very much.

My honest opinion is that if you don't accept yourself, it'll be hard for anyone else to except those that are predators for people with low self esteem.

Also we're not supposed to be "need no man", that's a very recent and ridiculous attitude in my opinion - a feminist one that has done nothing good for anyone. Just my view though. But no, we don't need toxic men. Absolutely not.