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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Wife doesn't want sex

275 replies

studyinscarlet · 30/07/2023 11:58

Was wondering if the mums of mumsnet could give me some advise.

Been married 25 years. We have a loving relationship and 2 kids grown yp. We are both 50. We have not had sex for 5 years. She has gone through menopause and it is not just painful for her, but before menopause she was no longer interested in it. She has tried HRT etvc - no different. All the advice out there talks about communication etc, but we have already discussed the issue for years and she has told me that she definitely doesn't want sex anymore (any form of sex including non penetrative etc.) and does not want to try testosterone gel (another thing that people usually advise). Our relatiknship is otherwise very good and neither of us are having affairs etc. I keep myself in shape and am a nice normal person (uou'll have to take my word on that!)

There is a dead-bedrooms forum on Reddit but all they seem to say is "get divorced" or "get an open relationship". I 100% do not want to get divorced as we both love each other! There is also absolutely no way on God's earth that my wife would agree to an open relationship - trust me. She would also definitely leave me if she ever caught me having an affair (not that I have had an affair - I'm not really into anyone else)

The only other option is to accept celibacy. I am only 50 and always really enjoyed sex - it feels like a bereavement. I know some of you will advise just solo-sexual activities, which is fair enough but it is really no substitute - it's not the climax i'm after but the physical affection/excitement that goes beyond hugging and hand-holding (we do already hug alot)

There might be nothing any of you guys can advise and probably I just need to accept our sex-life has given us 2 kids and now it's reached the end of the road. I just thought i'd put it out there, though, in case there was something I had not thought of.

OP posts:
HairyKitty · 30/07/2023 13:00

Op your flirting may be what’s put her off, she may not even know this, or it may not. If you don’t talk, preferably with professional help, you won’t find out

Milyt · 30/07/2023 13:01

Just get divorced. Relationships don’t have to last forever

KingsHeath53 · 30/07/2023 13:02

@GreyCarpet he cheated on her 25 years ago!

i’m not saying it’s ok but they’ve gone on to get married and have kids since then.

Life is long, people aren’t all perfect.

xxalhxx · 30/07/2023 13:03

Have you spoken to your wife about this? Her decline in sex drive can be to do with her is her moods low,sex for a woman is an emotional and mental state while for men it's more for the physical and pleasurable side if she's got stuff going on she probably not even thinking of sex which is probably why she's not wanting it she's got to be emotionally and mentally stimulated check in on her see is she's okay buy her flowers watch a movie with her go on a date be more intimate rather than just sex hug her kiss her tell her she looks good see how that goes I'm not telling you to shower her with love but sex is more than just sex for a woman good luck!

Justanything86 · 30/07/2023 13:03

That would put me off op and I'm not sure there would be any coming back from it. To cheat once I might be able to deal with over time but if it seemed you were attempting to do it again all romantic feeling for you would die off as there would be 0% trust left.

Alcemeg · 30/07/2023 13:04

Dombasle · 30/07/2023 12:24

Oh dear Lord! autocorrect!

I'm sure your wife doesn't have a red Asian on the side! It's meant to say 'reason'!

Sorry about that!

Maybe she does, though, and this explains a lot 😂Those red Asians are meant to be pretty hot in bed!

OP I'm really sorry you find yourself in this situation. The fact is that it's intimacy that's lacking, don't just brush it off as "sex" which is something most people can live without.

TomatoSandwiches · 30/07/2023 13:05

After your update I think you should leave and give your wife the opportunity to meet someone that treats her well, I'm sure her libido will fire right back up with a decent man that doesn't cheat.

xxalhxx · 30/07/2023 13:05

studyinscarlet · 30/07/2023 12:46

Dear Justanythings88

It all goes back to a message I sent about 10 years ago to an ex-GF from 30 years ago, who I had stayed in touch with via Facebook, a message saying she looked nice in some photos she posted. My wife got into my account and saw this and was very upset/angry. She also discovered some e-mails we had exchanged (just along the lines of how is the family? How are the kids?) She percieved it as an attempt at flirtation (which to be honest maybe it was), but I haven't seen this ex-GF for about 30 years (she is married with kids). I wasn't trying to have an affair with her, but my wife doesn't trust me because 25 years ago (when I was 25 and me and my wife were together but not married) I did cheat on her once (and onve only) when I was very drunk. I was an idiot and regretted it and told her about it and she married me 2 years later, but it seems to have irrevocably damaged her trust. But we did have great sex for our first 5 years of marriage, so maybe that isn't the reason?

Oh I've just read this didn't even read he cheated but that could be a factor aswell even though it might of been years ago it still leaves scars that might of not healed

drpet49 · 30/07/2023 13:07

wutheringkites · 30/07/2023 12:32

So just because you didn't experience low libido during menopause are you saying that doesn't exist for anyone? Just an excuse women make up?

As for saying she is cruel, there is absolutely no indication here about what she would do if op says he wants a divorce. Perhaps she would accept it, you have no idea.

OP states the wife didn’t want sex anymore before she hit the menopause.

SheIIy · 30/07/2023 13:08

BeaumontLivingston · 30/07/2023 12:54

I find this thread to be more proof of a small theory I have about relationships.

I think it's all very well to partner up and form a family and give children a loving, stable, two parent home.

But I think the idea that it's natural or even desirable to partner up for LIFE is incorrect.

I know so many people who had kids, broke up, coparent well as friends to small and adult children, and move on to find new partners.

I don't think romantic relationships are meant to last for life. I think boredom or growth apart if usually inevitable, and it's rare it doesn't set in at some point or you grow apart. People tend to grow and it can make you incompatible with your partner.

I think being with someone forever, fancying them, wanting to spend lots of time with them, enjoying sharing life with them, I think that’s rare and we should stop as a society telling people that it’s normal, because it isn't.

I think it would be much better to normalise having children with someone and moving on as the children grow up, because that’s what seems to happen anyway and it's viewed as a negative but it’s so normal why is it not viewed as positive? You don't have to lose the person from your life, you just no longer share it with them to the degree or in the same way you did when you were raising children together.

Splitting up later in life is already normalised. Those who stay together do so because they want to. It's 2023.

GreyCarpet · 30/07/2023 13:09

KingsHeath53

She forgave him once. I suspect it was a bitter pill to swallow to he expected to put up with him trying to cheat a second time (that she knows of).

studyinscarlet · 30/07/2023 13:22

I probably should have put the back history in the original post, but would have been a long read. As I said I am 50 now and I did cheat on her when I was 25 (just once). She then slept with someone else, to get her own back. We were both v young and daft and we did get married 2 yrs later. The facebboks and e-mails with the ex-GF were conversational - not trying to arrange meets etc. But you are right - this is the reason she doesn't trust me. But don't any of you guys who are happily in relationships ever speak or message an ex-boyfriend. Is that really a dealbreaker? Maybe I am glazing over it cos I don't see it as a big deal / sufficient explanation for our broken sex-life now. But maybe I'm deluded and this was actually a huge breech of trust?

OP posts:
Wheredoistart78 · 30/07/2023 13:23

I left a relationship because of this. First it's the no sex, after this your self esteem erodes and over time resentment builds. Why should she get what she wants and you get left out in the cold which is where you'll stay because you can't force anyone to have sex and rightly so.

I'm now in a new relationship for the past two years and sex is amazing. Not just the sex but the intimacy that comes with it.

Just yesterday we were lying naked in bed with a keg flung over each other just chatting. Bliss. Once the sex is removed it changes everything and you're just friends.

HairyKitty · 30/07/2023 13:26

Honestly op I don’t actually think it’s the old g/f messages at all

Poivresel · 30/07/2023 13:27

OP do you think the no sex is a form of control/punishment?
Personally no sex would be a dealbreaker for me unless there was a good medical reason.

Appleofmyeye2023 · 30/07/2023 13:27

Ok, you say she’s menopausal yet she was like that before?
so, women don’t just get to menopause overnight. Women go through perimenopause for years and years before final menopause - which is defined as when periods stop for over 12 months. But that doesn’t mean , for many women, that all the horrendous “menopausal” symptoms stop. I’m 60 and still have hot flashes, flushes and all sorts of issues with vulva , ache and pains, uti etc

To have completed menopause by 50 she’d have been at the very younger age of completing menopause and has probably been dealing with hormaonal issues for anything from 5-10 years earlier.

so what you’re saying, needs clarification - it is very possible that it DID start as part of perimenopause, and it is also possible she is now experiencing some menopausal symptoms still.

even something like UTIs and bladder control can put a lot of post menopausal off sex- the embarrassment of peeing all the time- and frankly there’s not a lot of help out there for some women. Constant UTIs and interstitial cystitis is common - I suffered from that and actively feared sex as it would set off symptoms. It took me 8 years to get a successful treatment for that despite numerous hospital interventions.

so, I think you need to perhaps clarify with your wife about when she went off sex, and to find out if she’s afraid her menopausal body will cause her embarrassment with sex. Don’t say she’s needs to go to GP- al lot of GPS see menopausal women as just that and effectively tell us to put up with a load of shit symptoms (like my UTIs) and put it down to “aging”. So, really gently question her, find out if fear/shame/ embarrassment about her body is a cause.

if it’s not physical, than it is probably hormonal. A lot of women do become asexual or even bisexual post menopause . We call it out as something to be fixed, but it doesn’t have to be. It’s just how some women react to the drops in hormones post menopause. Our whole feelings change towards sex and desire, in exactly they did when we reached puberty.

one thing to check on yourself about. When you want sex, how much do you build up to it? Have you got to a point that physical affection is limited by you to a precursor to needing sex. Could she be sensing this- that every kiss and cuddle is a nudge to announcing you want sex. This seriously isn’t uncommon and if left unchecked it becomes “sex pesting”. Maybe set some boundaries, that you start by just physical closeness , sitting together, hugging holding hands for a few months, then add in some cuddles, then some kisses. BUT all the time agreeing sex or any form of sexual contact is off the table . Make it” safe” for her to express her affection back to you, without feeling like you’ll take it as a green light for sex and push into next stage. Slow right down. Back off. Explain what you’re doing, and very slowly, even over a couple of years, between you agree to building back to a safer space of intimacy. She may never want intercourse, but there are other ways to have physical intimacy that both benefit you, and allow you to achieve climax.

Poivresel · 30/07/2023 13:28

Wheredoistart78 · 30/07/2023 13:23

I left a relationship because of this. First it's the no sex, after this your self esteem erodes and over time resentment builds. Why should she get what she wants and you get left out in the cold which is where you'll stay because you can't force anyone to have sex and rightly so.

I'm now in a new relationship for the past two years and sex is amazing. Not just the sex but the intimacy that comes with it.

Just yesterday we were lying naked in bed with a keg flung over each other just chatting. Bliss. Once the sex is removed it changes everything and you're just friends.

Presume you were having sex in a brewery.😂

ZeldaWillTellYourFortune · 30/07/2023 13:31

BeaumontLivingston · 30/07/2023 12:54

I find this thread to be more proof of a small theory I have about relationships.

I think it's all very well to partner up and form a family and give children a loving, stable, two parent home.

But I think the idea that it's natural or even desirable to partner up for LIFE is incorrect.

I know so many people who had kids, broke up, coparent well as friends to small and adult children, and move on to find new partners.

I don't think romantic relationships are meant to last for life. I think boredom or growth apart if usually inevitable, and it's rare it doesn't set in at some point or you grow apart. People tend to grow and it can make you incompatible with your partner.

I think being with someone forever, fancying them, wanting to spend lots of time with them, enjoying sharing life with them, I think that’s rare and we should stop as a society telling people that it’s normal, because it isn't.

I think it would be much better to normalise having children with someone and moving on as the children grow up, because that’s what seems to happen anyway and it's viewed as a negative but it’s so normal why is it not viewed as positive? You don't have to lose the person from your life, you just no longer share it with them to the degree or in the same way you did when you were raising children together.

Totally agree. It's unrealistic to expect everyone to find a lifelong partnership. Some have a natural expiration date.

OP, your kids are grown. They'll be fine. Your wife will be fine if you divorced. And wouldn't it be great to find someone who was into you, wanted lots of sex with you and didn't have baggage!

Dombasle · 30/07/2023 13:32

It sounds like she never forgave you for being an utter cad and either deliberately or subconsciously she has denied you sex as punishment.

You both need to part ways before the situation turns completely toxic.

Crikeyalmighty · 30/07/2023 13:41

@studyinscarlet I am your wife in this situation- I too found out my H had been a shit to me 7 years ago (even though the event was 10 years previous to that ) and it was over a period --not a one off. It wasn't a full blown affair but was enough for me to see him in a different light and to be frank 'take a dim view'

I still care about him, I do like him a lot and we get on well but for me it killed stone dead how I felt about sex and romance . Imagine being with someone you would have took a bullet for to find out they were the one holding the gun.

We stayed together but I was honest and said I no longer wanted sex. (I'm 61 now) I wasn't that interested before I found out and was post menopause but it killed what little sex drive I had. So yes, I think it may well have affected how your wife perceives you. Whilst I do care about my H, I now care about myself too and if my H said to me that we had to have sex at least once a week, I would opt for divorce and staying friends. It may not be logical but women's minds are funny things and different to many men's and once you break that specialness and trust many of us simply turn off physically - even if we still value the relationship/friendship - that's just how it is for some.

If you genuinely think you can't do without it then I think you have to discuss, treat her fair and make plans to move on. It's better than you suddenly signing up to hook up sites and more honest.

GreyCarpet · 30/07/2023 13:43

OK. Well it's going to be hard for you to get reliable advice if you keep drip feeding little extra bits that change the narrative...

But to answer your question.

I have only maintained a loose friendship with one ex. He sent flirty messages to me while I've been with my boyfriend. I didn't respond and I told my boyfriend because until then we occasionally met up for a beer. Again, my boyfriend knew. Point is, I wouldn't be flirty with an ex and I wouldn't tolerate someone flirting with me whilst I was in a relationship.

I'm also open about it, so my boyfriend could never 'find' anything because he'd already know.

If I found out he was exchanging flirty messages with an ex and telling her she looked really good, I'd consider that to be a betrayal and end the relationship.

I appreciate a boyfriend isn't the same as a long term marriage, which is probably why your wife hasn't ended it. But it sounds like she doesn't trust you anymore and doesn't want to give access to her body to, or be intimate and vulnerable with, someone she doesn't trust. I wouldn't either.

Milyt · 30/07/2023 13:52

Which is fine @GreyCarpet as that’s her choice. She can’t be surprised if he leaves her though. There are only two choices here.

Stay and accept

leave

TomatoSandwiches · 30/07/2023 13:56

Even more dripped information, so you both have stepped outside of the marriage, I think with your history of cheating first it was really foolish to message your ex, you can't expect your wife to be OK with that tbh.

It sound like her refusal of sex could be a mix of resentment, distrust and not wanting to make the effort for you because she doesn't think you are worth her discomfort.
I doubt she would change her mind, so it will be up to you to stay and put up or leave.

GreyCarpet · 30/07/2023 13:59

Milyt · 30/07/2023 13:52

Which is fine @GreyCarpet as that’s her choice. She can’t be surprised if he leaves her though. There are only two choices here.

Stay and accept

leave

Oh I totally agree with that.

The OP seems a bit perplexed at how the situation might have arisen though...

It's a shit situation. Who knows if, without past infidentileis and more recent attempted one, the situation would have been different. They now have to deal with the situation in hand. Ignoring it isn't going to improve it.

I'd suggest a realy open and frank conversation tbh.

BeaumontLivingston · 30/07/2023 14:00

@SheIIy Not really, it's seen as a shame, a broken home, not what was planned.

I'm talking about normalising going into these things planning to likely part ways later.

Not promote that as the only option, but make sure we all see it as a valid option.

the person who is a great father may not be the person you want to grow old with, you may have different wants for retirement.

When you think about it's so unlikely you'll find someone with similar enough goals in life. One may want to retire on the costa del sol and drink wine on a balcony, one may wish to live in Grimsby and sit on a patio with a fag, but they make a great parenting team.

Also, normalise being single as a lifelong option. This idea that we should pair up and stay paired up I think it causes a lot of problems.