Left out of a holiday with friends, help to move past it

[CallHerJohn]

This is pretty lame but I'm feeling a bit vulnerable so looking for advice.

I have two local friends, who have kids the same age as mine. We tend to meet up all together, have a group chat with the three of us, and the only reason we'd be without one of us is if the 3rd one is working or not around for some reason - generally we invite each other and/or our families when meeting up.

Last week the two other families went on holiday together. I only found out a few weeks ago after asking what one of their plans were over the Easter break. She sheepishly said her family were going away with the other family. I didn't really react, even though I was a bit hurt not to be asked. It's so silly isn't it? I'm a grown woman, but it feels like all those school days feelings of not being included have come right back.

We have a little baby (the other families have two dcs each), so maybe they thought we wouldn't be able to come or want to, but it would have been nice to be asked i guess? Or maybe they just didn't want us to come. Which hurts to think about.

I was ditched by my group of friends at the end of primary school (I never found out why), and ever since it's given me a bit of insecurity around relationships, so this plays right into my anxieties.

I will be seeing these friends regularly at the school gate, activities and socially (i hope?) and I guess I need to have some help to get over this and just move on so it doesn't affect the friendship. Like a mantra to tell myself? Or something?

If your friend was a bit sheepish then she feels bad - which is a good sign of your friendship!!

Do you know how it all came about?

I have a group of mum friends from school. I am going on holiday with one of the families, but not the other. It happened because we were talking about holiday destinations, they had already booked somewhere and I said that sounded great. She said 'why don't you guys come along', so we did!

Didn't think much more of it after that. I suppose we could have then said 'why don't we also see if xxx wants to come'. But we didn't, and it wasn't malicious at all, just didn't occur to us.

This. I’m part of a large group of friends. Two of us couples are going for a weekend away as we have a similar hobby. Some of us ladies do fitness classes together but not others. Some invite others for dinner but not others. I can see how this holiday has hurt you but I wouldn’t say anything to them and I certainly my wouldn’t cut them off. Make plans with your wider circle too xx

Yes we would have absolutely gone. It was a low key family oriented sort of thing, not far away, and only day time options as there's no night life there.

Our eldest dcs are at school, although they've known each other a lot longer than that. So we have a wide overlapping social circle as our dcs have different friendship groups at school but they all play really nicely when they're together outside of school. Thanks for the kind words though, really appreciate it

I’d be hurt too but I’d also know I didn’t need to be if that makes sense - because my friends would never mean to hurt me, if they do stuff without me it’s just that’s how it worked out that one time.

You know them, if they’re good people you know they won’t have intended to hurt you at all. Don’t ‘give them space’ or do anything martyr-ish like that, and don’t turn one minor thing into ‘why does this always happen to me’. Next time youre chatting, ask them nicely and sincerely how it was. You can say ‘let us know next time you go we’d love to try it’.

Al friendships have a small thing like this happen that can become a big thing if you create a narrative around it and then you never get to enjoy a friendship that’s had time to nature and have some ups and downs because you pull the plug instead of moving through it (with people who are worth it).

I have two friends both with dc , one has a small child, a lot younger than ours. He is a pain in the arse sometimes, but I'd not ever leave her out, at least without talking it through with her first. As you said op, it's understandable they may not want a baby, but you could have potentially left the baby at home with dad and take your older child. Not very thoughtful of them. They should have spoken to you about it.

I immediately thought husbands too.

It sounds horrible and I understand why you are upset.

I agree with others about baby thought. Going out for dinner than be ruined by a baby that keeps crying in a restaurant, for example, then one of you would have to take it outside or fuss around to calm baby. I imagine that having been through that stage your friends just want to be with older kids, the same with travelling there.

Still unpleasant though and I don’t think I’d want to continue the friendship, they didn’t care about hurting your feelings.

I agree either baby or husband. I wouldn't go away with a baby either, it changes everything. Totally respect friends" choice to have an age gap child, but I don't want to spend my down time when I can be a more hands off parent back in the trenches with my friends. I moved past it and it does not interest me Fine for a cuppa and a cuddle, but not a weekend. Different life stages, different priorities.

Perhaps all of the children don’t get on as well as you think?

Regardless the secrecy makes it more hurtful.

Oh and I definitely would not have mentioned it beforehand to you, because: being mean about a baby/ you'd say it would be fine, go and it would not be fine/ say you wouldn't go and be hurt.

in a 3-way friendship dynamics can be tricky. When I was in a four way friendship group, it didn’t feel excluding is a couple of us met up just two of us. When one of the four emigrated, it did change things as meeting as a two left one out. We still make plans as a 2 but then invite the 3rd but usually make plans all together. I was the only one who went on to have one more child than others in the four of us and they were very careful to include me but they did do things just them without me because it wouldn’t work for me with a baby/toddler.

Op. It likely means they are closer to each other than you if you’ve never been on holiday with them. But it doesn’t necessarily mean they are if they do go on hols with you at other times. Do you ever met up with just one of them now? It sounds like you do if you were with just one of them when they sounded squirrelling about their Easter plans.

That has been a shock especially as you introduced them to each other. But it can be fine too. I have a couple of great friends where we all met at the same time (school gates) but they’re closed to each other. It came as a shock when I realised that and hurt a little (mostly because it triggered childhood angst) but my friendship with each of them is still balanced (I feel they like me similarly to the amount I feel connected to them) So it’s fine, we have a 3 way friendship and within that 2way friendships where theirs with each other is closer.

So I guess this could go either way. If you wanted to let them know it’s ok that they went without you, then breezily say that you hope they had a great holiday in the hols and immediately go to say some lovely things you and your family did in the hols. That way you can not feel lied to as they can be open about meeting up just them sometimes and maybe you can also be freed to met up 1-2-1 sometimes too. Personally, I would let them know it as totally fine for them to go without me (even if I didn’t feel that way) as bringing these things into the open maximises the chances of maintaining friendships. If you feel you don’t like being in a 3-way friendship where you feel the other 2 are slightly closer then you’ll naturally pull away a bit. But I

I'd be very upset by this op, I think how you feel is valid
I'd be phasing them out and finding new friends

OP I would 100% be unhappy about this and you are very valid in your feelings. If you can find the courage to ask why you weren’t invited I’d really recommend doing so but if not (and I understand why) I echo what others have said and give them a wide berth. To be honest that’s what I’d do as I’m not a very confrontational person, despite being quite an extrovert in other ways. When people do this I always think it shows their true colours a bit.

So hurtful of them to do this and keep it from you. If you did ask them why like in a text, they might just say they didn’t think you could go with the baby etc, which wouldn’t really be the reason, imo, and so you’d still not know why.

It’s frustrating. I’m curious and would want to know the WHY. And how they could hurt you like that. You know, maybe this could be an opportunity to find out some things and you could then choose new nicer friends and hopefully you will become even closer with them than the two who have done this to you.

so to that end, I’d ask each one separately and in person to get the most honest responses. If you can work it out that way. Obviously you’d have to ask the other one pretty soon after the first one because I guess it’s likely they’ll call or text each other about it. Just put it like, ‘hey I’m sure it’s nothing but I felt a little weird when I found out you two are going on holiday and didn’t say anything to me?’ ‘I think of you both as very good friends’ something along those lines.

I think I’d just be too curious to not ask.

Imagine how that would go down on mumsnet. This is the problem, sometimes you can't win. I also think if it was posted from the friends perspective, the comments would be different again.

Our friends did this recently. We usually go away as a six, they have went off as a four. I was told by one of them, a bit awkwardly and then the other fronted up saying oh you know we are going on hols. So clearly texting about it.

I can’t decide how I feel about it. On one side I am not entitled to always go with them, and it isn’t something I’d have wished to do. But on the flip side I feel they should have asked. However unreasonable this is. I’m not overly hurt or anything, I just feel a little awkward about it.

Great advice 🙂

You sound lovely OP, measured and thoughtful and mature in your approach to this. A little space is good, you are hurt and don't have to hide it or show it.

I would be absolutely breezy.
Ask to see the photos, tell them as warmly as you can muster you are glad they had a great time. It looks like something you would love to do in the future.
I absolutely get you but view this in the terms of a friendship with many years left to run. Been there, done that got the T shirt.
As Michelle Obama said "when they go low, we go high".

I normally have no time for MN friendship dramas, but this is rubbish, OP.
In your position, I'd carry on being friendly towards them (at some point, it might become clear why you were excluded - and it might be a reason that has absolutely nothing to do with there being anything wrong with you or your DH), but I'd revive/develop other friendships too. Though that doesn't stop you feeling hurt! I definitely wouldn't directly ask them. The fact is, they chose not to include you for whatever reason, and the only really dignified thing to do is to act as if it's not something that bothers you.

I think the suggestion in this about opening chat about the holidays in a positive way is a really good idea.
I have friends in my group who over the years have teamed up on holiday with different families, so just because these two have been together does not mean that is the only option, although if it went well they may well do it again fairly soon.
I do feel you’re hurt OP and know what it is like to feel left out.
However I’m convinced that practicality and convenience play a big part in joining two families together for a holiday. Day of travel, bedrooms in accommodation, dates availability, cost, etc etc will have been a bigger influence than whether these people like you enough. Maybe they felt your young baby would hinder their activities or wake them at night. And I don’t think this means they don’t care about you and your family!
So try and get over it and keep open to your usual connections and socialising.

I’d be really upset too to have been “wendied”.

Be civil and friendly but just take a step back and observe. You might see things you’d not noticed before. Plenty of time to make a decision going forward as to step back a lot more or whether the holiday wasn’t important in the grand scheme of things.

I can understand why you’re hurt but there might be a good reason.

I’m friendly with two neighbours and we go out for girls nights/lunches and also out with DHs.

However we also go away with just one couple every year and don’t include the others. This is due to the DH having a totally different idea of the type of holiday we should do.

We like to spend the day walking for miles, stopping off for lunch. He’d hate that.