Left out of a holiday with friends, help to move past it

[CallHerJohn]

This is pretty lame but I'm feeling a bit vulnerable so looking for advice.

I have two local friends, who have kids the same age as mine. We tend to meet up all together, have a group chat with the three of us, and the only reason we'd be without one of us is if the 3rd one is working or not around for some reason - generally we invite each other and/or our families when meeting up.

Last week the two other families went on holiday together. I only found out a few weeks ago after asking what one of their plans were over the Easter break. She sheepishly said her family were going away with the other family. I didn't really react, even though I was a bit hurt not to be asked. It's so silly isn't it? I'm a grown woman, but it feels like all those school days feelings of not being included have come right back.

We have a little baby (the other families have two dcs each), so maybe they thought we wouldn't be able to come or want to, but it would have been nice to be asked i guess? Or maybe they just didn't want us to come. Which hurts to think about.

I was ditched by my group of friends at the end of primary school (I never found out why), and ever since it's given me a bit of insecurity around relationships, so this plays right into my anxieties.

I will be seeing these friends regularly at the school gate, activities and socially (i hope?) and I guess I need to have some help to get over this and just move on so it doesn't affect the friendship. Like a mantra to tell myself? Or something?

I think you having a baby is a bit of a bs excuse. It doesn't change any dynamic. If anything, babies are way easier than kids. I just went to Paris on a city break with a girlfriend and strapped the baby to me, we did all the normal things we could have done, bar late night drinking. If I'd have had my toddler there however, that would have been a different story and would have definitely hindered.

I'd have been upset if I were you. Maybe keep them as friends, but find a different tribe?

I had exactly the same happen to me. Without sounding dramatic it was completely traumatising. It involved deceit and exclusion so of course it hurt my feelings! Definitely expand your social circle. I think your feelings will fester if you don't say anything.

Things like this, regardless of intent, are really painful. They may not have meant to be spiteful but they were inconsiderate and I think basic consideration is essential in relationships. Had they communicated with you and informed you the what's and whys it may have hurt but you would be able to move past it. Imagine how you'd feel if you found out 6 months later, which could quite have possibly happened as they weren't planning on saying anything it seems.

Really hurtful. Are the others' kids closer to one another maybe? Clutching at straws a bit but I have a friend where I'm close to her and would happily spend time with her and her youngest DC, but the oldest is unpleasant to my eldest so I give a hard swerve to any family outings and just offer alternatives which don't involve the older kids.

I'm sorry. It hurts, this sort of thing.

I really feel for you OP. It is really horrible when something like this happens. I became 'the third wheel' when I introduced a good friend of mine to my other friend - they hit it off and I was slowly ignored as they became closer. It was a wake-up call for me, and I made other friends who genuinely wanted to spend time with me, no matter what my family situation was, and I'm much better for it. I don't think having a baby should matter when it comes to going on holiday and spending time with friends - it's lovely for children to spend time with younger/older children - it teaches them a lot I think. Don't beat yourself up about it. In these situations, I find that it's best just to concentrate on your own family and what makes you happy, rather than depending on others, especially in terms of holidays. It's nice to go away with others, but it can also be quite stressful. And instagram pictures don't always tell the whole story! I wouldn't say anything to them about it - be strong and believe in yourself and your worth. Take care x

Totally shit and totally normal to feel really hurt. Women's friendships are very important and alongside that means the emtions can be strong. Don't let anyone trivialise that for you.
In terms of handling it i would be upfront with them that you know they went away - ask how it was - and don't be passive aggressive, mean it when you say you hope they had fun. As someone else pointed out they can do what they want of course, but it is ok to feel left out - so admit that and see how they react. you may not get the response you want and that's ok too. you will probably have to heal this one away from them.

i've had something similar happen and it still stings and i admit i did move away from that group. Whilst there is no cruelty intended it can and does hurt a lot. x

When you see them again just breeze past it and ask how the holiday went. They’ll probably offer up an explanation as to why you weren’t asked, and I agree, it’ll probably be the fact that you have a baby. Whatever the reason, I’d be letting them know that missing a holiday wasn’t the problem, it was that they felt they had to keep it secret that hurt.

Yup. In the vast majority of cases when 'nice' people exclude their friends, it's something to do with the children. Either conflicting parenting styles, or DC disliking each other or clashing. Typically the excluded parent has no idea, because no one likes saying anything that might sound like a criticism of someone's child or parenting so they grit their teeth, but minimise family contact where they can.

I get why you’re upset but yeah, it’s likely because of the new baby. I wouldn’t want to go on holiday with a young baby in that scenario either, and would also assume that the friend with the baby wouldn’t want to go. It totally changes the dynamic.

Is there a chance one of their kids and your kids don't get on/ aren't friends?

Just thinking back to when I was a kid my mum wouldn't have made me go on holiday with another family if i didn't get on with the other child.

Not that we ever went on a group holiday mind!

Did you invite THEM to all go on holiday together? No you didn't.

Maybe they were so hurt because they didn't get a holiday suggestion/ invitation from you, they just decided to cut their losses and go without you.

I understand why you are upset about this, I really do. I find it very hard to brush off not being included in activities with friends where we often do things together. On the other hand, if you generally really like these people and value what you get from the friendship it absolutely isn't a reason to pull away.

I think it might be helpful to try to let go of the idea that you need to do everything as a three. I have two friends that I often form a trio with, but we also regularly do stuff in pairs as well. Mostly just walks/lunch/theatre etc but sometimes a weekend away. Sometimes it is logistically easier not to try to find dates etc that work for everyone. Finding accommodation for three families is harder. Finding a holiday that works well with a range of different ages including a baby is harder. Maybe next time one of the families will ask you instead? Or you could suggest something to them?

I see that a family holiday is a bit of a big thing, so it is more hurtful. They should probably have been more open about it. But it doesn't mean any real harm was meant, or that your friendship is necessarily less valued.

If it is niggling away at you, then I think it would be a good idea to address it. I usually find it helps, and certainly rarely does any harm. Just be honest. Do it face to face to reduce chance of misunderstandings. Tell them that you feel a bit silly raising it, but you were a bit hurt that they didn't include you in the holiday or even mention it, and were wondering if there was any particular reason why.

The kids all played together two weeks ago, and not a cross word was said for the hours we were all there. Eldest dc are three primary aged girls, very mature and inclusive. Younger kids also have a ball together. I get this could be an issue with others but our kids love each other and the time they spend together.

I think even if three folk are friends two of them should be able to arrange things without always including the other person. Keeping secrets is just too childish. Make some new friends. And don't rely on those two all the time.

Agree with @ladycarlotta . I really do understand why you are feeling fed up . The one thing that I gained from being left out at secondary school was to never stew over anything like this .
For your own self worth I would ask them in a polite way why your family were not invited. Nothing worse and more destructive to MH than stewing over this sort of thing .X

I’ll offer my views. We are a group of friends and we usually do holidays together, a weekend away here and there. Since we are all high earners, we usually treat each other. It could be one of us rent a cottage and invite everyone there, we’d provide food and drinks. Anyhow, one friend is really flaky due to her husband working away often, he’d say yes to activities then claim fatigue to not show up (ie “ I just got off the plane from Mexico last night, you guys have fun I’ll miss it this time”). After a few times like this, we just stopped asking this particular couple. Mind, we had booked a big cottage to include them as a family (our expense) and it felt petty to ask them to reimburse. We could have booked a smaller cottage etc. So we decided to not ask this couple anymore, however the wife is still a friend and we do things together (without the husbands), but every time we have gone away (the girlfriends and I), she gets upset “Well I wasn’t asked”. Followed by an immediate, “we’re off skiing in two weeks would you like to come”, she will say “ I’ll have to check with S if he’ll be here”.. it just makes it so uncomfortable and inconvenient. Then she says “ yeah ok, go ahead and book we will come”, only to tell us they will not go for the fifth time a few days before the trip. Yet every time we go away she gets upset she wasn’t asked.
Are you like my friend? Perhaps you are high maint as well? Perhaps they want to enjoy their holiday without a screaming baby, all of that is allowed.

I would have to mention it.

That's really shit of them.

I think l might ask if l had done anything to upset them and see how they react to that.

The kids all played together two weeks ago, and not a cross word was said for the hours we were all there. Eldest dc are three primary aged girls, very mature and inclusive. Younger kids also have a ball together. I get this could be an issue with others but our kids love each other and the time they spend together.

That's what you think. It might not be how the other two families feel.

The way I read this situation is that the other two mums / families / children are either not that much into you and yours or they are but feel that you wouldn't take kindly to not being included.

It's completely normal to not be joined by the hips and do activities in various constellations, not always all families in a friendship group. But if things were good between you all, they wouldn't have felt the need to keep this secret from you. It is perfectly acceptable and also nice to be free to arrange activities and trips individually without everyone having to join each time. But if all were well between you, they'd be open about it. Either they didn't feel like they could tell you because they knew you weren't going to be happy about them doing something without you. Or they don't regard your friendship as you do.

To expect to be included is a bit suffocating.

Relax, think about what you get out of these relationships, it doesn't alway perfectly match between kids and parents in these scenarios.

For example, do you like one family more than the other?

If I were you, I'd ask casually how the trip was but not mention your disappointment. See where these friendships go and focus more on others in the meantime.

These child matching friendships often have a short shelf life.

What ?????

Umm.. what? This is so left field I'm not sure how to respond.

If I want to go on holiday with friends; I'll suggest it, invite them, organise it. OP didn't care enough to do that. So it makes no sense to complain that someone else thought "I'd like a weekend away with X" and arranged it.

The problem for me here wouldn't be that they didn't invite me, it would be that they tried to keep it quiet. There was a reason for them not including you and if it was something flippant they wouldn't have tried to hide it.

That would be a backing off from the friendship for me.

OP you should definitley ask - it will play on your mind otherwise and it won’t stop you being less hurt. This is just pure mean girl behaviour and I think you can ask why in a non confrontational way.

I wouldn’t dream of doing this to my friends with babies, everyone is invited everywhere and last year we did a group holiday with a few kids of different ages and couples without kids. It’s up to someone to decide if they don’t go, not have the decision made for you.

Hope you feel better soon xxx

This is so hurtful.

can you ask them? It will play on your mind years later if you don’t

They might be working off US etiquette. There if someone isn't invited to something it is very bad manners to mention it in front of them. It is like rubbing it into their face, 'We're going on holiday and you're not invited, Nyer Nyer'.

I suspect it is that they thought a baby would change the dynamic. Please don't overthink the friendship if you enjoy spending time with these people. I was dumped by my best friend of 11 years when I was 18 (too boring) and dumped by another best friend when I was 41 (turned out she had a habit of ghosting people for no reason whatsoever). After that even the hint that someone was finding me boring would lead me to dump them before they dropped me first. All that happened was that I had no friends at all. Having realized that I have joined a bunch of interest groups and am making friends and have decided I really don't care what they get up to when I am not around as long as they are happy to spend some time with me.