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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

How do I do this? This is the worst pain.

290 replies

Tootiredtosleep · 26/03/2023 07:44

DH walked left the house 2 weeks ago on my birthday to go to work. He text me the next day to say he wanted a break, that we were drifting apart. I’ve not seen him since. Albeit a few texts, that either me or his children have initiated.

He’s obviously met someone else, but still denying it. His lies are transparent.

22 years, and left by text message. 2 children (18 and 16 - still at home).

Things were hard at home. He had a breakdown in the summer (last year). I was putting every effort I could into saving our marriage. Our planned future.

It was pointless, wasn’t it? He’d already checked out. Rewritten history.

All the times I supported him. And there many. Forgotten.

I had been coping well. But the other woman and his lies are catching up with him. I’ve had a total and complete breakdown. I can’t move. I can’t think. I shake all night. I cry all night. It feels like the walls are closing in on me. I was physically sick last night, when I woke up covered in sweat, shrouded in sheer terror at the awfulness of this.

How can I find a way through? Please tell me it gets easier. I can’t function at all.

Thank you.

OP posts:
80s · 17/05/2023 16:05

Sorry it's come out like that, but it does show your instinct was 100% right.

DH is only giving brief details. He’s confirmed that it did start 10 years ago, but hasn’t been permanent that whole time. That it’s over, and it’s likely her messaging me to get at him.
You can't believe anything either of them say, and it makes little difference to you whether it was constant for 10 years or off and on, or whether he's still with her.

How do I deal with this? He’s stolen 10 years of my life.
Don't know about you, but for me it was important not to simply accept my ex's take that our entire marriage had been a sham. He's welcome to think of all those years as wasted with me. But those were real years of my life, that I was living genuinely. His years might be worthless and fake, but my years are not. He doesn't get to change that.

I will likely lose our home as well.
You'll still have a home of some kind, and it will be your home and thus a proper, genuine, warm and loving home. You'll have to adjust to your new future, and it isn't easy, but it is doable. Take things step by step, make sure you have good legal support and other help.

LaffTaff · 17/05/2023 16:06

On the money front, you fight him all the way. Use every dirty tactic in the book if necessary, and label it karma. Channel your anger. I listen to DMX or Eminem to get me in a fighting mood (😂 and it works tbf!).
It might help to reframe this revelation. Your husband is a far weaker man than you thought. And he he's only stolen 10 years if you allow yourself to think of it that way, because you've been loved by countless other people during that 10 years who are worthy of you (he isn't).

I'm so glad you enjoyed your holiday. It's testament to how strong a soul you are that you went on the holiday (genuinely; that took guts!).

Beyond that, take any and every opportunity you get to remind the dozy prick of what he's thrown away.

Keep your chin up girl, you'll get through this! Come and chat to us here any time you need 💛

Tootiredtosleep · 17/05/2023 16:08

@katmarie Thank you. It is totally shocking. I’m actually feeling ill with it all.

No remorse at all. Just how bad he feels, and how it’s all affected him over the years. He did say he’s sorry for ever being in our lives, but that’s it. True narcissist. And I just didn’t see it. I’m an educated, informed, strong woman. I don’t know how I didn’t see this. I’m broken.

OP posts:
Tootiredtosleep · 17/05/2023 16:11

Thank you @80s amd @LaffTaff. I will try my best to take your advice on board. I know it will take time. It’s going to take a long time. I’m going to have to fight with every ounce of strength I have.

OP posts:
LaffTaff · 17/05/2023 16:18

Tootiredtosleep · 17/05/2023 16:11

Thank you @80s amd @LaffTaff. I will try my best to take your advice on board. I know it will take time. It’s going to take a long time. I’m going to have to fight with every ounce of strength I have.

I really feel for you, his behaviour is awful.
Just take it a day at a time, and be kind to yourself - you have so much going for you, don't allow him to rob you of that.

katmarie · 17/05/2023 16:33

If you're going to have to move out of your home, maybe consider giving it a new patio before you go? I'm sure there are plenty of mn'ers who would help.

I sort of felt that my ten year relationship had been a waste when I split with my ex. He'd led me on for all that time telling me we were going to get married and have kids etc, but it transpired he had no Intention of doing either.

With a bit of distance and perspective though I can see that there were a lot of really good parts to that period of my life, it wasn't a waste at all. And I grew from it, and from it ending. It does take a good bit of time to get that perspective though. And I'd probably still call him a twat if I ever had the misfortune of being in the same room as him again.

Thewookiemustgo · 17/05/2023 17:15

@Tootiredtosleep will reply to more points later, am about to go out but didn’t want to read and run, but I’m so, so sorry. Don’t beat yourself up for not knowing, seriously, the length of time doesn’t mean you should have seen it, he was clearly very good at it. Intelligence had nothing to do with it. A clever manipulator who knows you well, knows what might make you suspicious, plus your blind trust has everything to do with it. That’s what I had for my husband, complete trust, trusted him absolutely, he was one of those guys who would never, ever cheat on me, never, ever do something like that to me, to the family. So I wasn’t suspicious, he was good at hiding it, it all happened an hour’s commute from where we lived, two totally separate lives. He gave me no reason to be suspicious until it had been going on for a year. I kicked myself black and blue for not realising, but how could I have known? It’s not your fault for not seeing it, it’s his fault for being so bloody good at concealing and deceiving. People this hasn’t happened to often can’t believe this, think we must have been in denial or didn’t want to see it. Not in all cases at all. Husband totally normal at home, goes to work on train, comes home on train, is perfectly normal in the evenings and at weekends. Just how, exactly, would anybody know? It’s not your fault, neither the affair nor the not knowing. I can tell you with all sincerity it categorically isn’t. X

Tootiredtosleep · 18/05/2023 17:17

Thank you @Thewookiemustgo. I’m really, really struggling today, and your words have helped.

I just so desperately helpless. I need the details. I have a visceral pain, that I need to know. And he won’t tell me anything. I’m never going to know, and I have to accept that. It’s messing with my head big time.

I lost it with him last night, and it wasn’t pretty. I think it had been a long time coming. How can someone who I loved unconditionally treat me like this. It’s beyond all comprehension. I know I don’t deserve it. I just don’t understand it.

OP posts:
Thewookiemustgo · 18/05/2023 19:41

@Tootiredtosleep it absolutely is a visceral pain, it rips you in two. So again, take time, this will take a while to even absorb. You are back in shock again, yet another not long after the first one, and not that it helps, but I feel for you, I really do. One thing I learned was to stop trying to get my head round it from a ‘normal’ viewpoint. It is incomprehensible because you are looking at it from your moral standpoint, your belief systems about love and loyalty, and simultaneously coming to terms with the fact that you always thought his belief systems lined up with yours. If they had done, if he had had the integrity to stick to the vows he made, he wouldn’t have done this. He doesn’t think about morality in the same way that you do. You can’t imagine yourself ever doing anything as despicable as this, therefore it’s just not something you can understand. Don’t try to, it’s not worth it. He may well have had an intact moral compass at some point. But when it showed him the right way to go, it hurt his conscience and tried to stop him doing what he wanted, so he started lying to himself, justifying ignoring the compass. Slowly his moral compass lost the ability to show true north, and got skewed. It’s very common for those who have affairs to struggle with the ‘why’ they did it, because once you strip away the bullshit they told themselves to ease their consciences, there’s no justification left or real reason. They’ve lived with so much dubious thinking and mental gymnastics and history re-writes going on, that they find it hard to define the reality that led to it all. Because what led to it all was their choice, their brokenness leading the way, they avoid trying to look at the reality of it all because it’s bloody painful and shaming to see that actually they acted out of pure selfishness and that it was all about them. And that they brought it all on themselves. Your husband didn’t view this in the same way as you, and will probably refuse to see it that way until his last breath, since in abandoning you and his children, he has train wrecked his life and, as with any kind of post rationalisation, this absolutely has to work out for him. Because if it doesn’t, he’s been a complete idiot and will be forced to admit he just made another horrible mistake. So it’s pointless trying to get your head round what he was thinking, how could he do this, why did he do this etc, even though you are no doubt desperate to hear how the hell the man you loved and married could have done this, and asking yourself, having spent your life with him, who the hell is he? He did it because of historical issues of his own, because of unchecked personality flaws like selfishness and entitlement, and because he is an Olympic standard liar who specialises in lying to himself in order to justify the shitty things he’s done. He’s the king of making himself into a victim of other people, a victim of circumstances and therefore justified in doing xyz because ‘they made me do it’ ‘I had no choice, given the circumstances’ ‘ I was driven to it’ ‘they never cared about me so…’ ‘I had no other choice than to…’ So don’t bother trying to understand it all, the whole thing is the product of a skewed internal narrative, an invented alternative back story and even an alternative reality to the one the rest of us inhabit. Just take care of yourself, because what he did, with whom, how often, when, how long, will eat you alive trying to figure out, so stop trying. He’s gone, there’s no reconciliation, so this information isn’t needed to move forward. The trash took itself out, and that information went with him and although you want to know and deserve to know, you don’t need to know his seedy story, it will only serve to hurt you further. He had an affair, he’s left, and thank goodness for that, you don’t need this selfish uncaring man, you deserve better. Find a counsellor to help you through this, it’s an enormous, shattering event which now has an added element to it which is another body blow. Get support and somewhere you can talk this out as soon as you can, but waste no more head space on what he did, you have proof from that message, sent at such a damaging moment what a horrible, spiteful woman he had an affair with. Don’t ever think she must have been better than you or that she must have had something you don’t, dear God Tootired, I don’t know you but can tell from your writing, your good manners and grace written here, you are worth a million compared to a vindictive woman like that. Take care now, rest, try to eat and have plenty of fluids if you can’t eat much. But please get help to work through this, it will help you to see it with perspective and see him for who he is. You must remove yourself from any blame and shame and put both where they lie: with him. He is to blame, he should carry the shame for this, then you can start to heal and find a new, happier life, even if that seems impossible now. The clouds just got darker and thicker, but I promise you that the sun is still there. Sending love X

Twiglett2 · 19/05/2023 16:12

@Thewookiemustgo
That is such a lovely post, and so very true. I've gone over and over how my ex H could have done what he has. How he could just leave me and his children and not seem to care how much he has devastated us. But you're right, I will never understand as I could never treat anyone how he has. I need to try to stop with all the endless questions that he will never answer and try to move on.

@Tootiredtosleep everything will seem so bleak and truly awful now but it does get better. I'm a year on and still have very down days, but I have far more happier days. I do far better when I have nothing to do with him and don't try to find out what he's doing, who with etc.

Thewookiemustgo · 19/05/2023 16:30

@Twiglett2 thank you. I’m so sorry this has happened to you, too. Don’t be hard on yourself, it’s perfectly normal to have endless questions about this kind of trauma, it hits every part of our lives, beliefs, reality and leaves us questioning our own judgment, before we can even try to get our heads round theirs. Of course you have every right to answers to your questions and you deserve answers, but since you have a new life now, new opportunities for happiness, when the burning desire to know and ask gets too much, ask yourself these questions: “why torture myself over something in the past which was not my responsibility? Why give more painful head space to something I did not cause, I cannot change, I had no control over it then and I don’t now? What good comes of the questions, how do they help me feel better? Will the answers give me peace and closure, or will they give me more things to be hurt by, which in turn will lead to more painful questions?” Incomprehensible behaviour is just that, incomprehensible. Be glad that you are too nice a person to even be able to come up with one legitimate circumstance where you could see why somebody would think this was ok, where you would think it an understandable response. Leave him to work out why he did it, because the answer to why has nothing, I repeat nothing, to do with you. It was all him. I’m so sorry you were left in this way, I scratch my head myself as to why some men behave like this, can’t be honest and open, can’t communicate effectively so avoid it completely and just bugger off when they’re ready. It’s an abominable way to treat anyone, let alone a wife and children. Think of all the courageous things you’ve done to get this far and feel pity for the idiot who left a woman like you behind. X

Tootiredtosleep · 20/05/2023 09:59

@Twiglett2 Thank you. So sorry you are going through something similar. It’s the pits. I’m starting to come out of the fog (for the second time).

@Thewookiemustgo once again, your kind words and wisdom have helped me see things in a different light. I am going to stop trying to get answers. I’m sure if I need to know anything, I will eventually find out. I’m going to concentrate on moving forward and building a life for me and my girls. They’re going to spread their wings in the next few years, and I want to be fully present to help do that, as best I can.

This man that I thought I knew. That I loved and supported for all these years is just not worth another minute of my time. I just need to get the financials sorted and get him fully out of my life for good. He’s the loser here, not me.

OP posts:
Buildingthefuture · 20/05/2023 20:22

As always @Thewookiemustgo has very sage advice. None of this is on you, you did nothing wrong, he is obviously a very well seasoned and practised liar. Whilst people love to tell themselves that “my DH wouldn’t” or “I would know” the sad fact is, you often don’t and there are literally a million threads on here that prove that. Go forward and thrive op, without a shitty lying twat holding you back. And, on your behalf, I wish him gangrene. Of the genitals Xxx

AloneAgain2023 · 20/05/2023 23:08

@Tootiredtosleep I am so so sorry to read your latest news, that is beyond devastating. You sent me some lovely words on my posts a while ago, and I wanted to wish you every bit of luck, thoughts, and best wishes 💐Everyone on here has such wonderful advice, but I can imagine how much you must be suffering after that discovery. And on your first night on holiday too 😞That feeling of questioning all the years you had together is brutal, wondering if those years were wasted on the wrong person, and however hard we try, we keep going over the same ground trying to make sense of it. But I guess there are some answers we may never get, and at some point we can hopefully accept that. Sadly though it does make you feel that you may never want to go there again in terms of trusting someone - the selfishness & entitlement & lack of conscience that so many men have is disappointing to put it mildly. The thought that I may never have that sense of togetherness again is pretty hard to digest at times. But I guess the reality is we don’t know what’s around the corner, and it could be something or someone great 🤞

Twiglett2 · 21/05/2023 06:30

@Tootiredtosleep
My husband had also been having an affair, he lied to me for months, swore on our children's lives he wasn't still seeing the ow, then left when I found out he had been. We'd been together over 18 years and have 2 daughters. Our now 16 year old hasn't seen him since he left (over a year ago) as she wants nothing to do with him if he stays with the ow. Our younger dd spent time with him initially but he constantly prioritised the ow over her so she stopped.

He has never admitted to any other affairs or cheating but I now feel like I never knew him and he has been so awful that I think he's capable of anything. I highly doubt this affair is the first time he's cheated.

He refuses to discuss how we split our assets and won't communicate with me at all so I haven't started a divorce yet. The situation stresses me out but I don't know how to move it forward.

I just try to hold onto the fact that I have my amazing children, a lovely home, and the support of everyone. He is living between his parents and the ow's grotty flat. Everyone thinks he's a dick, and his daughters are ashamed of him and have no respect for him.

In time we will be fine, I think the men that do things like this usually end up regretting it.

Theimpossiblegirl · 21/05/2023 15:07

He’s the loser here, not me.

Let this be your mantra.

ilikeeggs · 21/05/2023 17:16

I’m so sorry @Tootiredtosleep . Like a pp said at least you know you can trust your instincts as you thought he was probably cheating. My ex had an affair for 2 years which was hard enough so I can imagine what a huge shock and betrayal finding out about a 10 year affair is. It’s his loss though at the end of the day and you just need to concentrate on you and your girls.

Tootiredtosleep · 22/05/2023 07:59

Thank you @ilikeeggs and @Theimpossiblegirl.

It’s totally shocking. I feel like my life has been a total lie. He was always thought of as the happy family man. Worked hard, came home and just spent time with his family. He said he loved me every day. All lies. You can’t love someone and treat them this way.

And like your ex @ilikeeggs he is refusing to engage in any discussions about the way forward. Leaving us all in some sort of limbo.

A true narcissist, and I didn’t see it.

How can I be the bigger person, and still encourage our girls to still have a relationship with him. He doesn’t deserve it.

OP posts:
BanditsOnTheHorizon · 22/05/2023 08:15

In your shoes op I'd firstly find a good councillor and talk to them.

Secondly I'd carry on with the divorce, push it forward but only speak via solicitors, if he won't engage with you then hopefully he will a solicitor. If he won't via solicitors then you'll have to take it to court, but just keep in pushing.

As for the dc, tell them that you'll support any decision and if they want a relationship with their df then you'll do what you can to enable this and encourage it, but ultimately, at the age they are, they can make their own decision. I tried to be supportive without pushing my dc towards their df. It's easy to think you're doing the right thing encouraging a relationship with them, but don't forget this is a massive bolt out the blue for them too, they will wonder if their df ever loved them, and they need time to process this and understand how they feel about him too. Maybe they even need to see a counsellor to process their feelings.

Thewookiemustgo · 22/05/2023 09:18

@Tootiredtosleep I echo @BanditsOnTheHorizon . No, he doesn’t deserve it at all, he’s forfeited the right to their good opinion of him in the most appalling way. And you’re right in saying that their relationship with him needs careful consideration. I’d look at it from your role as mum, and decide to do whatever you think will most benefit their mental health going forward. Any relationship with him must be their choice but crucially on their terms, not his or yours. It’s your job to care for their well-being but it’s not your job to encourage any relationship with him, what you encourage is an opportunity for them to process the new reality, and, as you have been forced to, to absorb and re-evaluate who he now is compared to who they thought he was. With your support. What they want going forward is more important and that’s what you encourage, that feeling of no pressure of having to pick sides or worrying about disloyalty to you if they want contact with him. But encouraging them to see him or contact him is his job now, not yours. That’s their choice, and supporting their choices is you job, no more than that. Your job is to comfort and support and create an environment for honest, pressure-free communication. No more than that. Kids of any age really aren’t daft, the older they are the more they understand, and their opinions become more concrete and less easily influenced. Every time it sticks in your throat (and I don’t blame you, it would stick in mine) remember why you’re doing it: for them, their future mental wellness, not him or his. X

Tootiredtosleep · 26/05/2023 12:46

Sorry for later reply @Thewookiemustgo. I can't thank you enough for your kind words.

Thank you too @BanditsOnTheHorizon.

I'm having a very tough time. Still managing to go to work each day.

I have found out some more details of what's been going on, and I'm totally struggling to grasp the fact, that this man, this man I was married to for all this time, is the same one who has been doing these things. I just can't compute that I didn't know. He was always kind, considerate, loving and generally an all-round good egg. But it wasn't real. Our lives have been totally shattered, and with each new revelation, I am hit again, like I've been hit by a truck.

I am now having to stop telling the girls what's going on. It's too much for them to take on board. I may tell them at some point, I still just don't know what to do that's best.

I think I'm numb, to be honest. I'm still coming to work, and leading a relatively normal life. But underneath, I think it's all going to hit me one day, and I will totally break down. That may never happen, I just don't know.

I do know, that he's ruined me ever trusting anyone ever again. I would prefer to be single and happy.

OP posts:
80s · 26/05/2023 14:08

I didn't tell the kids any details about what my ex said or did, as some of it was very disloyal to them personally and could ruin their relationship. I'd rather they thought he did something stupid towards me but was still basically a loving dad.

I was surprised to find that I've regained my trust. Not that I think my dp would never cheat on me (I've never thought that way). Partly I feel like he couldn't hurt me as much as my ex because I am tougher now, and partly I think that if he did cheat, he'd be less disloyal about it than my ex. But at the same time, I'm more cautious - we don't live together and I like feeling as if I could back out without any major changes to my life. But it's a very enjoyable relationship; I don't feel anxious.

Tootiredtosleep · 26/05/2023 14:45

How old are (or were) your kids @80s ? Mine are almost 19 and 17. So, adults really.

I think what he has done is despicable and disrespectful to them. He has used them in the most awful way. He's lied and gaslighted them, for his own gain. I can't reconcile how having a great relationship with him is beneficial for them. I admire you for how you've handled it, but I don't know if it's the right way for me. I will think about it, before making any decisions.

Your new relationship sounds great 😀 I hope in time I can move on and find something similar!

OP posts:
80s · 26/05/2023 15:08

14 and 16 at the time. I was too pissed off not to say anything, and realised when it came out that the older dc must have guessed herself, so it would have been stupid to pretend it was a natural end to the relationship.
They obviously also realised he must have lied to them; they just don't know how exactly. They don't know about him booking a room in a brothel (they do it by the hour for affairs, it seems). They don't know about him asking work colleagues to our house as he enjoyed the thrill of them being with us, without us knowing who they were. They don't know that he claimed to OW that he never wanted to have our children, and I "made" him. (It was a load of nonsense anyway; of course he wanted them.) I don't want the kids to despise their own father. Mine was a bit of a rubbish father, but basically nice: I love him and can use him as a role model in some respects. If my mother had told me that sort of thing about him, I think I might have respected them both less and have been a bit lost for role models!

Tootiredtosleep · 26/05/2023 15:30

Thank you @80s. I can see why you wouldn't share that information. And you sound like a lovely Mum, who has put her children first. I admire you for that.

I will try and do the same. I love my girls with all my heart. I want to protect them. I just need to get past the fact that he's not the Dad I thought he was.

OP posts: