Page 18 | Getting the “ick” over money

OreganoOregano · 2023-01-19T15:58:06+00:00

Named changed as I’ve spoken to a couple of friends about this. DP and I have been together around 8 months - were friends for around a year prior to being in a relationship. We met through work and clicked immediately. I had left exH 6 months prior to meeting him. I have a DD who is 3.5. ExH was financially abusive and contributes a minimal amount to her life. I didn’t initially fancy DP - not my type on paper at all and genuinely saw us as friends but the more I got to know him, the more I found attractive. My main concern before getting together, which we discussed at length before anything happened, was money and finances. I am 10 years into my career, am senior management and a high earner. He retrained to move into his role and took a pay cut. He has the potential to be where I am in around 3-5 years. I told him that for us to realistically work long term, he needs to be earning more. He is currently earning c£25k. I earn around 4 times that. We both work in a commission based environment and he has the opportunity to earn good money fairly quickly but you do need to put in hours/graft to be successful. Initially he was spurred on by me and was working harder to earn money and be successful however, the further into our relationship we get, he isn’t, IMO, doing what is necessary to be successful in this industry. He has minimal disposal income and I’m naturally picking up the tab for 99% of things including paying for a holiday, paying for all meals out, he will always stay at mine. I’ve even paid for lunches out with his parents however noticing that his work ethic is dying off, I’m beginning to get the ick. He is genuinely the loveliest, kindest person, is fantastic with my daughter, all my friends and family love him and I genuinely cannot rate him highly enough however I’ve worked really hard to come back from financial ruin after my ex and I need things to be 50:50 or at least on track to be. We’ve had a conversation about this and he is in agreement with me/has vowed to do more and in his defence, is, but I cannot help feeling less attracted to him because of this. What would you do in this situation? Head is saying end things. Heart is begging me to give him a chance.

Stravaig · 20/01/2023 11:45

She's tried him on for size, and he doesn't fit, much like those slippers he gave her. No harm, no foul, end it kindly and move on.

@Ridemeginger Perfection 🤣

Ridemeginger · 20/01/2023 11:46

To be honest, I don't know what you are on about either, @BatildaB , so let's just leave it there.

billy1966 · 20/01/2023 11:49

Paq · 20/01/2023 10:10

Just friendzone him OP. He's not partner material but he's probably not the monster people like to make him out to be.

I don't think he is a monster, but he certainly hasn't the character traits that some people expect from a partner.

He's work shy and happy to sponge off a very hard working single parent.

It is 100% clear to me she should dump him asap.

Why the OP has accepted this for so long is the question she REALLY needs to be asking herself.

His type are often charming and thoughtful, how else do they worm their way into a position of being a complete sponger.

The Wagawama story tells you everything.

He views the OP as his sugar mummy🙄.

KatherineJaneway · 20/01/2023 12:09

He made it clear from the offset that he wanted success

Yes, yours!

mewkins · 20/01/2023 12:10

OreganoOregano · 20/01/2023 11:37

@mewkins I think it's a little unfair to suggest I'm living outside of my means. I save a good proportion of my income. I make all food at home from scratch, shop around for bargains. I'm not struggling. When you take out all outgoings of a single parent living a good lifestyle in a relatively expensive area, the disposable income isn't huge but more than enough for DD and I to do nice things with.

I could of course downgrade my car, reduce subscriptions, move to a cheaper gym etc but I'm absolutely not going to do that to fund the lifestyle of work shy boyfriend who doesn't seem to want to contribute.

I didn't mean it like that! I too am a single parent living in the south and know how easy it is to burn through money on one income. I can't afford regular meals out, rarely get a takeaway etc but that's similar to lots of people, especially at the moment.

I think if I earned 25k I would really struggle with any treats.

The upshot is that he's not going to be able to afford those things any time soon and if you don't want to give up doing nice things and he can't afford them then the only options are to either pay for them or to end the relationship.

simplefree · 20/01/2023 12:19

You looked at potential rather then reality.

Had you accepted reality as it was you wouldn’t be feeling resentful and turned off.

You either take as it is or leave - and any improvement from here is a bonus.

TicketBoo23 · 20/01/2023 12:56

OreganoOregano · 20/01/2023 11:37

@mewkins I think it's a little unfair to suggest I'm living outside of my means. I save a good proportion of my income. I make all food at home from scratch, shop around for bargains. I'm not struggling. When you take out all outgoings of a single parent living a good lifestyle in a relatively expensive area, the disposable income isn't huge but more than enough for DD and I to do nice things with.

I could of course downgrade my car, reduce subscriptions, move to a cheaper gym etc but I'm absolutely not going to do that to fund the lifestyle of work shy boyfriend who doesn't seem to want to contribute.

Strictly speaking, he's not work shy if he's working.ges just not very ambitious and driven maybe.

But it's not that which bothers me in your post - it's the fact that he's fallen into this comfortable habit of expecting you to pay for pretty much everything, including a lunch to meet his parents!

He's just too comfortable taking from you and making you the default provider.

If he couldn't afford to pay for a lunch anywhere half decent with his parents, he should've cooked for them at home. But it's too easy to fall back on sugar mama.

Algor1thm · 20/01/2023 13:05

KettrickenSmiled · 19/01/2023 21:42

If your research is based on "it's true whether people 'admit' it or not" either you are fudging, or your parameters are not based on solid data.

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There are lots of ways to test psychological phenomenon beyond just asking people what they think...

MNisMyGuiltyPleasure · 20/01/2023 13:13

OreganoOregano · 19/01/2023 16:14

@Aprilx I appreciate his earnings are not going to change drastically in 8 months but my ick is me working consistently hard and every hour I can to be successful and him working the minimal hours to bring home just his basic salary and allowing me to fund everything.

I am also a high earner (a little more than what I guess you are on) and when I started dating after my divorce, I quickly noticed that the (few) people I saw a few times, suddenly let me pay for everything once they realised I was on more money than they were. In my case, that trumped everything else and I broke things off immediately. I didn't even dither. It's too big a deal for me. Now with my partner we share things fairly equally and I am much happier.

Don't forget, OP. Talk is cheap. If he's not even making enough effort, he'll never match you later on.

billy1966 · 20/01/2023 13:22

MNisMyGuiltyPleasure · 20/01/2023 13:13

I am also a high earner (a little more than what I guess you are on) and when I started dating after my divorce, I quickly noticed that the (few) people I saw a few times, suddenly let me pay for everything once they realised I was on more money than they were. In my case, that trumped everything else and I broke things off immediately. I didn't even dither. It's too big a deal for me. Now with my partner we share things fairly equally and I am much happier.

Don't forget, OP. Talk is cheap. If he's not even making enough effort, he'll never match you later on.

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This is what I think a lot of people would do very quickly.

All it should take is this happening two, max three times for the penny to really drop that someone is tight and sees you as a mug.

The paying for the lunch with his parents is just shocking.

OP needs to look hard at her boundaries and self respect and find them.

What she has accepted here makes her seem very vulnerable to being taken advantage of.

Who cares how nice he is, he's a shameless sponger.

ToffeeNotCoffee · 20/01/2023 13:31

A few little trinkets to keep you/your daughter sweet....

Jeez, set the bar higher. Much higher.

He doesn't mind about you co-sleeping with your daughter. Once he's had the sex he wants you can sleep where you like.

I guess he's always smiling when he's around you ? Christ yes, of course he is.

He's taking you for a mug. Why are you making life so easy for him ?

He will keep freeloading off of you until you tell him to STOP. That happens when you end your relationship.

I also suspect he targeted you / your income somehow i.e. he guessed how much you earned and what an easy touch you were, frankly are.

GerbilsForever24 · 20/01/2023 13:37

I don't really understand all the nitpicking. Isn't this what's great about MN? You come on with an issue and then in the process of people giving opinions and asking questions, you realise that either you're wrong or that actually, there's more going on here than you originally realised.

So in OP's head she was framing it as lack of ambition etc, and perhaps not consciously thinking about the cocklodger element, which was also why she was confused because perhaps she thought she was being a bit of a bitch to complain about a man earning less. And then, as the thread moves on, she fine tunes her own thinking and is better able to define the problem. And, hopefully, make a decision.

billy1966 · 20/01/2023 13:56

GerbilsForever24 · 20/01/2023 13:37

I don't really understand all the nitpicking. Isn't this what's great about MN? You come on with an issue and then in the process of people giving opinions and asking questions, you realise that either you're wrong or that actually, there's more going on here than you originally realised.

So in OP's head she was framing it as lack of ambition etc, and perhaps not consciously thinking about the cocklodger element, which was also why she was confused because perhaps she thought she was being a bit of a bitch to complain about a man earning less. And then, as the thread moves on, she fine tunes her own thinking and is better able to define the problem. And, hopefully, make a decision.

You'd think!

A large portion of MN posters push back very hard when an OP has any standards, expectations of decency, boundaries or dares to ask a question about them.

They simply cannot cope with women not being 100% tolerant of every mans...

meanness,
bad behaviour,
expectations of a woman being their silent skivvy,
not wanting to silently raise THEIR children AND pay for them,
not make them 3 hot meals a day...even when they don't eat,
pay for them endlessly when they sponge off them🤷🏻‍♀️.

This cohort cannot bear women having any standards, any boundaries, any self respect.

They respond to queries from OP's that look for advice with insults, character assassination and nastiness.

Original poster

OreganoOregano · 20/01/2023 14:21

GerbilsForever24 · 20/01/2023 13:37

I don't really understand all the nitpicking. Isn't this what's great about MN? You come on with an issue and then in the process of people giving opinions and asking questions, you realise that either you're wrong or that actually, there's more going on here than you originally realised.

So in OP's head she was framing it as lack of ambition etc, and perhaps not consciously thinking about the cocklodger element, which was also why she was confused because perhaps she thought she was being a bit of a bitch to complain about a man earning less. And then, as the thread moves on, she fine tunes her own thinking and is better able to define the problem. And, hopefully, make a decision.

It's been a helpful process bar the snipy comments & has very much helped me realised, through an initial rant, that the relationship has very much likely run its course.

OP posts:

WhereYouLeftIt · 20/01/2023 14:26

OreganoOregano · 20/01/2023 09:54

It's sad as I do think a lot of him. He's genuinely fantastic in other ways - I still co-sleep with DD and he is incredibly respectful of that. If he stays, I sleep in her room with her. He will tidy round. He will pick up a bag of chocolate buttons for my DD if he knows he's going to see her. When she had chicken pox, he left some Aveeno and a colouring book on the doorstep and a note for me.
Things that I would perceive as incredibly thoughtful and kind...

My friend has suggested that maybe he just doesn't understand the concept of what I have to pay out monthly and genuinely sees me as well off. I appreciate I'm in a fantastic position but once you remove rent (in the longggg process of selling marital home), bills, full time nursery fees, fuel, car, food, gym membership, pets, money for dd's clubs plus a bit for savings, there isn't a huge amount of disposable income left. I understand her point and think it's really valid however it doesn't change the fact that for me, he is taking the piss and just the lack of drive alone is not attractive to me.

Your friend is being too kind to him here. This bit of one of your posts I found particularly striking -

"Just an example, a child free afternoon between Christmas and new year. Went for lunch. I suggested Wagamama. He said no, he wanted to try this new upmarket fish restaurant. Managed to get a table, really excited. He went to the loo when they came over with the bill..."

THAT is who he is.

asquideatingdough · 20/01/2023 14:59

I think you are right to let this one go @OreganoOregano. You are just incompatible on this level and will end up fighting and feeling taken advantage of. You are entitled to your own take on these matters and do not sound shallow or materialistic to me. My ex and I were a bit like you and your DP and it was no end of disagreement between us. In the end I felt that everything was on my shoulders and I couldn't rely on him for support. That's essential for a happy relationship. I think it's smart of you to have thought this through early on rather than let the honeymoon phase carry you into something more serious.

FormerlyPathologicallyHappy · 20/01/2023 16:13

I take something when I see my adult niece, usually chocolate. Doing it for kids is normal.

FetchezLaVache · 20/01/2023 18:17

@OreganoOregano What would have happened last night had you replied to his text message thus: "That sounds bliss, thank you so much! Could I have chicken in black bean sauce, please?"

ToffeeNotCoffee · 20/01/2023 19:32

@FetchezLaVache
What would have happened last night had you replied to his text message thus: "That sounds bliss, thank you so much! Could I have chicken in black bean sauce, please?"

Indeed. So, basically, he fancied a Chinese Takeaway but couched it like he was doing you a favour !

He's trained you up well, hasn't he ?

CurlyhairedAssassin · 20/01/2023 20:57

GoldilockMom · 20/01/2023 08:24

I’m a female and was the lesser earner.
I don’t spend my DH’s money. I contribute tot he bills, look after the kids and sort all they need. I paid clubs, brought shoes etc and went without a lot of the time so they had what they needed. Don’t get me wrong DH is generous and pays for the bulk of the bills. Bit quite often I was scraping by.
I never suggested posh restaurant’s, we had picnics, walks in the woods, beach day, cheap farm days etc £1 play dates -

So agree he enjoys spending your money, nice to offer a Chinese but won’t pay? He’s still raking in £2K a month! Same as me!!

Typically I pay for a few takeaways (there’s 5/6 of us depends on friends being round) I buy birthday presents, kids petrol and car insurance, tv license, clothes, lunch money, etc -

You are being taken for a ride here and you know it!

PS set up a pension saving scheme for your DD - much better than a savings account!

Are they not your husband's kids too? Even if they are not, you are married, why would he be happy, as the higher earner, to stand by seeing you just "scraping by" and going without? I wouldn't put this forward as an example of the perfect financial setup!

TwoBoysTooMany76 · 20/01/2023 21:15

@OreganoOregano I want to applaud you for how articulate and level headed you have sounded through this discussion. You have absolutely made the right decision. I ended a few months ago a two-year relationship with a man who though generous when he had the money but lived very much flying off the seat of his pants financially. He had huge debts and to me, he wasn’t making enough effort to stabilise his financial situation. He doesn’t have any dependants so he is free to live this way and was in fact quite proud of it.

I don’t begrudge some of the money I spent on him/us. I paid for a week’s holiday for his birthday that sort of thing… But I did end the relationship when he started to angle towards living with me and my teen DCs. I, like you, had worked hard (and still work damn hard) to have a good income and my own home. I’m not funding him and his financial ‘carelessness’. It was hard though as it was two years down the road and I did love him so I would say lucky escape for you!

By the way, don’t be surprised when you try to end things, the ‘promises’ he will make to make things better and he will also try to make you feel bad for dumping him for being a lesser earner… don’t fall for it! You are not responsible for his him. He is an adult.

CiderJolly · 21/01/2023 07:35

How is it going @OreganoOregano ?

Hope you found the strength to end the relationship.

coolcahuna · 21/01/2023 08:57

I've been in one like this. He would contribute but anything nicer like a holiday or a posher meal, I would need to pay for. Its fine for a bit and then it just wasn't. He kept complaining how he wasn't getting promoted at work, then dossed around all day at work!

One major moment for me before we split was when he said he couldn't afford to go to a local city for the day, mooch around and have lunch.. seriously needed more.

Paq · 21/01/2023 09:09

CiderJolly · 21/01/2023 07:35

How is it going @OreganoOregano ?

Hope you found the strength to end the relationship.

OP has already said she's away for the weekend and will deal with it next week. Her life takes precedence over our desire for updates!

CiderJolly · 21/01/2023 09:23

Paq · 21/01/2023 09:09

OP has already said she's away for the weekend and will deal with it next week. Her life takes precedence over our desire for updates!

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My question didn’t come with a stipulation that it must be answered immediately.

I’m sure the Op will appreciate your self-appointed position as Thread Monitor in her absence though.