Ignorance is no longer bliss

[WhereAreYouKeir]

I'm pretty confused about what is the best thing to do next and I'd like the sanity of strangers to help give my head a wobble.
DH started to withdraw from family life 17 months ago, it was very gradual and I guess I didn't see how bad it was until this Christmas.
Our boys are 7.5 and 5.5. DH is constantly irritated by the children and me.

To the extent the 7 year old says he's just mean or try to be extra quiet, (no bothering him in the morning).

There's no family time together, he actively avoids us. Hours at the gym, hours on his phone or doing some work project that is not needed (and doesn't warrant extra pay/time off/ recognition.) Basically avoiding us for hours.
He doesn't eat with us but will come in mid-meal and have toast leaving the boys to ask why isn't dad eating with us.

DH teaches in a primary school and has refused to look after the boys outside of term time. Just blank refused. He's doing things I'd expect someone to be doing who has no family commitments. London concerts, hours at the gym, hours on his phone. The bloody phone.

I'm the breadwinner and there's no bloody respite.
Work, children, housework, school admin.

Every time I bring something up, he says he wants to leave, says I'm a nightmare and don't make ANYONE happy. He shouts, raises his voice, slams doors, slams plates around, and of course, we all shut up.

He can go days without speaking to me at all.
I've tried to get him help for several months now. He has refused therapy and the GP. I've tried to get him to go to the GP for something else . His parents say they don't want to get involved. They tell me that I need therapy, I must have upset him.

His friends don't see the behaviour. He is super charming, affable, smooth with everyone else very nice. Helps the neighbours . And yet participates in absolutely nothing at home. No chores, no admin, nothing school related.
The boys and me see a very different side to everyone else.

He's ignored me now since Saturday because I pulled him up on shouting at the kids at bedtime. I'm still being cheerful with our boys but I'm ignoring his sulking for now.

Do I give him a deadline for seeing the GP or therapy? Every time I go out with the boys, I see parents working as a team to manage their kids and I get angry, with myself for not being able to change this shitshow that my kids are seeing.

Defo another firm

A solicitor is there for legal advice not mansplaining and counselling

This. I bet he has a higher earning wife who he feels neglects him!

Def see another solicitor OP - it was v unprofessional of him to give his personal opinion like that and try to dissuade you - that’s not what he’s there for. And as for suggesting a weekend away with your abusive husband - we’ll, he’s just an ignorant dick isn’t he?

That solicitor sounds like a bellend and a half!

He said it was very common for high-earning women to prioritise their work and de-prioritise family life. Perhaps DH was suffering from my excessive work commitments and he felt neglected whilst I only thought about the children.

Well which is it then smartypants, de-prioritising family life or only thinking about the children?

Bin him from your mind and find a kickass woman who won't spout this crap.

Sounds like the solicitor was airing his own private grievances - talk about projecting! Get another one. Your DH sounds awful and, far from adding to your well being, is seriously detracting from it.

If he has any idea about stepping up and changing, then filing for divorce might just trigger that, though from what you've said, it seems unlikely.

Stay strong. You'll get through it and life will one day be so much better. A colleague of mine divorced her abusive husband last year. Prior to filing, she was suffering from so much stress it was making her ill, both physically and mentally. She's now back to her lovely, competent self.

@WhereAreYouKeir please don’t take that shitty solicitor as the way it is.

I had a free half hour a couple of months ago with a lovely local woman and it was NOTHING like that and everything like you’d hoped.

Sadly I’m going to have to use my woman’s advice as we’re in the shit today. But I want you to find someone who treats you properly (same as a husband should). SOLIDARITY.

@WhereAreYouKeir

So now you've seen 'the enemy's camp' as it were, with that first solicitor. He obvs has a bias but he has given you good insight into what may be thrown up by your STBX's solicitor in divorce court. So, look at it as an experience in what may be to come. I'd sit down and write up the shit he said and put your own 'counters' to it. Then take it with you to the next solicitor you see. Now that you know what may be used, you're better briefed in finding a solicitor that you will be able to question as to how they'd counter that 1950s bullshit if need be. And they may have an insight into the judges in the area, which are fair and which are, well, biased.

Hopefully under the new 'no fault' in the UK, none of this will be relevant to the actual termination of the marriage itself OR in the financial negotiations. I was divorced 'no fault' US state and none of the crap that solicitor spouted would even come into it, hopefully it's the same there now, too. 'No fault' meant they didn't care who did what or why, all they cared about was verifying that there were 'irreconcilable differences' (that's the legal grounds) on the part of the petitioner (that was me). The judge didn't 'pry' into whys and wherefores, he just asked "Do you feel that your marriage has irretrievably broken down to the point where there is no saving it?", I answered "Yes, Your Honor" and that was it. I didn't need to justify it, there were no arguments against it. 'No fault' means there is no need to apportion blame or justify the reasons behind wanting a divorce. The respondent is not even allowed to contest the termination of the marriage or offer their 'opinion', the fact that one party says 'I'm done' is all it took. They don't try to keep you in an unhappy marriage because you don't have 'enough reasons' to end it. You want out, that's reason enough. I truly hope it's the same there now, too.

Finances can be difficult, but again, it's not a matter of "Judge, she's a nasty nasty woman therefore I deserve to get everything". It's a businesslike 'what does each of you have vs what does each of you need". A SHL will get you the best 'deal' within the parameters of the law.

I think, if the UK 'no fault' is similar to ours, that your only difficulty will be in settling child access. That's where you have to listen to the bullshit about 'career women' and ' wonderful helpful husbands' etc etc. That's when you'll really need a SHL!

So sorry for what you're having to deal with op. Your husband is emotionally abusive & gaslighting you. The solicitor sounds like he has had an unhappy personal experience of divorce , he's also a sexist & a misogynist who needs refresher training on client relationships. If you haven't already done so complain to the senior partners. 💐

@AcrossthePond55 that is true - good reframing

Sounds like the solicitor was airing his own private grievances - talk about projecting!

That is exactly what struck me! @Upsidedownagain

This sounds like a bitter, misogynistic man who has difficulties with women, possibly with a wife he resents because she is cleverer/ higher earner/ won't iron his underpants, and he's taking it out on OP.

Excellent post - good insight!

I really think you should type up minutes of this meeting with him and send it to the solicitor who passed you over to him.

You have every right to be furious at your time being wasted.

I would voice your absolute displeasure and fury at being pased to such a misogynistic twat who used a professional consultation to air his private views.

I would write that I expect my fee to be returned and that you have every intention of warning others to avoid such a deeply misogynistic practice.

I also think you could mention copying the Law Society and the Taxing master on being charged for such a deeply unprofessional consultation.

I agree with @billy1966 you definitely ought to have a refund.

The issue of whether there's another woman or not is a total red herring. I had an affair towards the end of my marriage and continued to be a loving and caring mum and even wife. (And yes, I know that is a contradiction in terms!). Your husband is just a prick, full stop. He treats you all horribly and this would need to end even if he was the most faithful man in the world.

Update February 2023

Thank you to all of you who replied. I'm humbled by the wise advice, general support for mums and understanding. I found myself crying reading every few posts and wondering how on earth there was so much sanity online and yet I felt like I was losing mine.

I had some good legal advice and started to withdraw from DH. Carrying on life wit the children as if he wasn't there, going to weekend rugby, swimming etc and just not engaging with his sulking and grumpiness.

Added to that, I had a health scare re hormonal cancers in mum's family, lots of checking, nothing ruled out but I won't know if I'm in the clear for another two weeks.

We had a party last week where DH felt poorly - normal run of the mill stuff with primary age kids. But DH's colleagues were also at the event with their party and he was furious with our boy 'showing him up'. My boy was sick and waited in the car while DH schmoozed with his colleagues.

We had a big disagreement about kids first, sod your colleagues. DH was so surprised and then angry. Stormed off into the cellar, and then packed his bag.
Drove off with the kids crying outside begging him not leave.
I cannot forgive him for telling the kids it was all their fault.
Something just snapped in me.

3 days later......no contact. I asked the police to do a welfare check because we didn't know where he was. And this morning, he's back. I should have got the locks changed but legally I cannot stop him from returning to the joint home.
Just rolled in with a face like thunder and stomped into the spare room.

I'm seeing a solicitor later this week re behaviour escalating and the impact on our boys. The neighbours saw the boys crying on the drive asking him not to leave so others outside the home are now seeing things he would rather they did not.

I am so torn about filing for divorce now and what contact would mean for the kids. Deep down I know I need to do it for them, and for me.
Just when I think he can't be any worse...bang and he does something like this.

Thanks for reading....it helps me structure my muddled thinking on here

You poor woman.

He is an abusive man terrorising his family.

Your poor children.

They are being so deeply traumatised by this.

All We can do is wish you the strength to do the right this by those children.

You sound like such a lovely woman but the damage that bastard is doing to those poor children is so dreadful.

I hope your health news is positive.

You need to publicly seek help and support.

I would self report to SS that he is terrorising you and your children and what can you do.

I'm delighted your neighbours have seen what they did.

Tell them the truth.

Tell family and friends, work.

Get help in getting him out.

Women's aid.
National domestic violence helpline.

Reach out for help.

Ring 101.

This doesn't have to be your childrens childhood.

Oh OP, that sounds awful. You have to keep going. I wold say I can't believe this behaviour and attitude but I can becuase I've seen it in BIL a million times.

You cannot change him and you will never get him to admit that he is at fault in any way so please don't try. Just know that any rational person would 100% be horrified to hear a man stormed out and left his family with no word for 3 days. That is NOT normal or acceptable.

You know you have to leave him.
You're already a single parent.
You're also the breadwinner.
Your solicitor was a tosser.
You need practical advice of how to get him out/stop him claiming he is Primary Carer.

I think you do need to file because I think it will be in the DC's best interests to have contact 'regularized' even if, after his nasty words, that means the only acceptable contact is supervised. He's shown what a shit he is so he's not going to make things easy for you. Or them. In these cases it's often better to 'have it down in writing'.

I agree with the legal advice you've gotten so far. As far as you are concerned he must 'cease to exist'. Do not speak to him unless absolutely necessary. Do nothing for him, do not say anything about him to the children unless they ask a question.

If he takes off in a huff again, LEAVE IT! No welfare checks. If 'something' happens the police will be in touch with you. But it won't. People like him are about causing pain to others, but they want to be there to enjoy it.

Yes, I found that heartbreaking. OP, please tell him to leave, for those sweet boys as well as for yourself.

One of my relatives married a man like that. He dumped her for another woman when the children were young. But the few years they had lived with him were enough to damage them.

Grown up now, one has never had any self-confidence and is almost a recluse. The other is desperate to rescue and protect those around him, throwing himself into every good but hopeless cause, endlessly trying to put the world right - always ignoring his own unhappiness.

Don’t let your DC pay the price for their lousy father.

You and your children deserve so much better.
Well done on all you have achieved so far.
Agree in being open with others about what is going on. You have done nothing wrong and let others see him for the bullying bastard that he is.
Sending you all my good wishes x

He jealous of you and resents his kids. He doesn’t care if he hurts them emotionally because to be kind to them would be to assist you in parenting and his priority os to dislike and belittle you. This man is a small, petty, vengeful person who cares about his image and selfish needs above all else. You presence as a successful, caring, strong mother is anathema to him. He is an enemy to you and I don’t say that lightly. His jealousy is so far gone all he sees is competition - one he is losing and the more you try to make things ok the worse he will get because he will resent you for trying to be a mature person vs sinking to his level. You cannot win with him, he hates you. He also sees the boys as extensions of you so he cares not one bit about them. They’d be better off without him and so would you.

This sort of cruelty from him will damage them beyond belief. My advice is to get as far away from him as possible as soon as possible. And tell as many people as you can what he is truly like.

I am in a pretty similar situation myself. Except DH doesn't go to the gym. Itold him i wanted to separate and he claims it will all change he has gone to the doctor and started counselling but is still the same sulky overgrown man he has been the last 8 years. I don't think there is another woman either, i just think he doesn't want to parent or take part in mundane life. I'm taking steps but its very hard. What will people say etc etc i read a meme one day it said ' a wise woman packed her bags one day and said this fucked up shit will not be my story and left' and thats what I'm working towards. Has to be more to life

Seriously this is one situation that’s unacceptable.

You. need to leave. Don’t wait for him to decide how u ought to live Yr life.

@billy1966 Thank you. I did call children's services yesterday morning. I had about a 30 minute chat with the duty social worker and then the MASH team that deals with safeguarding. We don't meet the threshold for their intervention.
No in receipt of certain benefits, no prison record for DH, he's a teacher etc......
I can sort of see why - not in a deprived area, no schooling issues, children are at a school that is sought-after locally.
Unless someone is in the home or sees us out together, no-one can believe the contempt DH shows me and the boys.

Look the set of behaviours you are describing are hardly ever isolated. It has lack of empathy. Huge selfishness. It’s borderline psychopathic. If this comes with other controlling behaviours you don’t need to put up with it. Coercion etc should not be tolerated and us punishable by law.