Husband and his messages

[morningskye76]

Hello

Long time lurker.

We are WFH atm. Husband left phone in kitchen to deal with the car yesterday.

(Bit of background
Large friend group, all in relationships/married. )

He received a WhatsApp for a family friend and I opened it expecting the usual, as she contacts us both.

Turns out there is dozens of messages daily going back months.
Mostly day to day messages all ending with "xxx". Good morning/night messages daily from both. Messages full of innuendo and flirting.
One even says he thinks they are more than friends.
He compliments her and tells her everything (even things I wasn't really aware of)
Nicknames for each other (never heard/used them)
Pictures (from him not her)

I'm barely mentioned. Although they both ask about each others children.

I've questioned him about it and he says I'm over reacting.
She is 15 years younger than both of us. But they are both very similar in hobbies and interests etc.

AITA for packing his bags

No I haven't. I don't trust myself

Start trusting yourself. You sound like a trustworthy person. You have every right to be angry, upset, hurt or whatever else you're feeling right now. You are not overreacting and you are not embarrassing. What he says about you isn't true, he's just trying to make you not trust yourself, so you don't do anything and eventually take him back, where he can have a wife at home that does stuff for him but also a little affair on the side to keep him entertained. You need to trust yourself to break his status quo x

He is insulting your marriage and your intelligence.
not owning this is appalling and he is trying to minimise and deflect. It’ll be your fault next.

OP he is such a slimeball. I'd be tempted to say to him that if it's just harmless banter, he won't mind you sharing screenshots of their messages with her husband, so he can join in the harmless fun. He doesn't need to know you didn't take any copies, and it might make them sweat a bit.

Yeah it's not a normal reaction for him to act they way he has. No remorse and trying to make you out to be the bad person.

Glad he's going or gone and you can sort out how to go forward.

If I were you I would tell the husband and also message the women that I knew but I wouldn't expect that to go well. For example you don't have any screenshots so everything will probably be deleted and people often shoot the messenger.
I would tell as I can't keep things to myself and would want the other guy to know but if I was talking to a friend I would probably tell them to just focus on themselves and get things in a row to leave.

It's mostly been what he would do to her and how

I mean he can say that it isn't an affair if he wants.

All that matters is if it's behaviour that you can't/won't tolerate.

I agree with others, if it's just harmless banter he won't mind sharing it with others to see their reactions. Maybe twist it to say let's see if I'm being irrational and send the messages out to everyone, let's see how everyone agrees it's just banter.
I would want to tell the husband of the OW, he deserves to know what has been going on.

You deserve so much more than this and your husband sounds like scum that he feels he can do this and then blame you for getting angry.

Wow he has really brainwashed you good if he’s got your second guessing yourself at the obvious “put me out of my misery” 🧎🏻comment. Don’t let him continue to gaslight you like that. You are perfectly in your right to send him packing.

The fact that he is being so dismissive and is trying to suggest you are embarrassing, foolish, overreacting etc is almost worse than his affair. Inform the 'D'H of the OW. A quick message to the friendship group and to your family to say you are separating due to X and Y's affair. Then crack on with unentangling your lives and building your own one. The emotional side of things is going to be a rollercoaster and will happen on its own anyway so get on with the practical stuff - and get in before he does! Good luck OP, you will get through it.

Please don’t let him gaslight you! It happened to me years ago. My boyfriend had an emotional affair with a work colleague and it was on the cusp of turning into more when I found out. The difference was that my partner was immediately apologetic and ‘ended’ it. We then went to counselling and found out what our issues were and worked through them. It was a hard process. Please don’t just gloss over it. He’s being a d!ck trying to make you feel like it’s nothing. Don’t get me started on her pretending to be your friend, for me I’d never talk to her again for that 🤮

He is the worst. He is such a cruel, nasty piece of shit.

Not even the affair, but the way he has responded and treats you.

Please tell me you are going to leave.

Tell her husband. Send him the messages if possible.

Then kick him out.

He is having an affair. He has cheated. He is a nasty piece of work to try and downplay all he has done.

I feel sick for you that he won't own his actions!

What a dreadful shock. I don't think I could recover feelings.

My sister learned that her husband was cheating on her with a mutual friend; it had been going on for two years and they even had a rented flat to meet in. And had been frequenting pubs and such that sis and he also frequently went to -- she looks back and thinks the servers and barmen were looking at her with pity. Everyone knew but her.

In fact, the last New Year's Eve of their marriage, I was visiting and we all had a great time (or so we thought) but in looking through his phone later, she found he had been texting the girlfriend throughout the evening. Same at my sister's 50th.

Anyway they divorced, my sister bought her own place and established a new life over the past five years. She told the girlfriend's husband and he divorced her posthaste; girlfriend was given very little in settlement. She's never worked a day in her life, at age 50.

Two years ago ex had a stroke and still can't speak well or walk. He and the girlfriend live in his fairly isolated house rurally -- so she is now stuck there alone with him helping him to toilet, etc. instead of "living the dream." So much for all the romantic holidays they'd planned on.

My sister was humiliated and devastated at the infidelity but is now very happy in her new life and says "better her than me" when referring to the girlfriend turned caregiver.

Sometimes things turn out for the best.

Good luck in whatever you decide.

Out of interest if she hadn't worked and was now 50 why did she get so little in settlement?

OP, unless you really want to, don't feel you should confront the OW or Inform the rest of the friendship group. In her case, it's not worth it. She's obviously got no loyalty to her own husband so you can't be surprised that he has none to you. Guaranteed, she will be nasty and you'd just be sullying yourself talking to the nasty piece of you know what.

As for the friendship group, they will draw their own conclusions. If you keep quiet about your reasons for the split, then your husband going around saying 'Oh, she's mad, she completely imagined I was having an affair with X' will just make him look guilty. Let him incriminate himself.

I would definitely tell OW's husband though, if you and he are friends, because I think anyone would want to be told in that situation. However I'd stick to the straightforward facts of exactly what you saw in the messages, without needing to say that you think it constitutes and affair, an emotional affair or whatever. The facts speak for themselves and he can draw his own conclusions.

*an affair, sorry

@morningskye76 I'm so sorry. Finding those must have been heartbreaking. They are both culpable, him for basically cheating and her for allowing it to happen, she's supposed to be your friend. I hope you can find some solace before you make any decisions, but you know that you need to do something as this is unfair and unjust. Sending love xx

You deserve so much better than him.

They are having an emotional affair. He's told her she's 'his' person. Shared rude pics. Told her what he'd like to do to her. Innuendos. Flirting. Secret nicknames. Apologised for your behaviour. He treats her better than he treats you. He thinks more of her than he thinks of you.

He knows he's in the wrong but he also knows he needs you to keep quiet about it so as not to rock the boat for him and make him look bad amongst his friends and family. So he tries to convince you that either a) it isn't that bad and you're being unreasonable or b) if he's doing anything wrong it's actually your fault.

Don't believe his ridiculous gaslighting. As pp have said, if it's all innocent then he'll he happy to include you and her husband in the chat won't he? You know what you saw. You know how he treats you. (It sounds like, this issue aside, you aren't happy with him anyway). You know you can't trust a word he says to you.

Insist he stays away while you collect your thoughts. Keep talking here but also start to confide in people IRL. See a solicitor to find out where you stand. Don't be ashamed in any way - the only person who needs to be ashamed is him (and his OW). Tell people you trust what's happened.

You will be so much better off without this sorry specimen of a man.

How awful. Not just the deceit but the way he talks to you. You come across here as someone who could do a lot better than stay with this rotten specimen.

Your sister should write a book about this as a cautionary tale to not be a cheating dirtbag.

Your husband's level of arseholery is absolutely staggering. He is 100% cheating on you, and whether he had sex with her or not is irrelevant. He is cheating and he must think you're very stupid to believe that he could gaslight his way out of this. Get rid.

MorningSkye, you’ve rumbled his emotional affair that has moved into the sexual arena. It certainly runs the gamut: affection, deep intimacy, confiding, attraction, sex-talk, playfulness, humor.

He’s terrified and is pulling out all the stops to protect their affair — trying to block and manipulate you with minimizing, denial, blame shifting, and any other tactic he can think of to make you feel small and back off.

His insisting on joining them for Christmas Eve was their desire to secretly share their frisson and ‘coupleness’ at that special time. It was despicable of him to use/trick you and the children for their own gratification.

Kudos for asserting your self-respect and telling this remorseless cheat to leave. How insulting that he thinks he can bamboozle you after making an utter mockery of you and the children.

Of course, it would be impossible to move forward with someone who refuses to admit his infidelity/dishonesty and accept total responsibility. He is a massively selfish and entitled man.

I would call or work email (other contact could be intercepted) OW’s H to inform him of everything they’ve said. Like you, he deserves to be brought out of the dark. Tell him that you’ve sent your H away.

MorningSkye, I’m so sorry that you’re facing this double betrayal. Please keep posting so we can provide support.

@pocketvenuss
about the settlement; I don't know the details but apparently there wasn't much to get. Her husband had been ill with cancer and has subsequently died. He had a business but apparently the monies were separate and not considered marital assets.

I do know that the judge told the girlfriend point blank "you need to get a job" and scoffed at her request for spousal maintenance. (My sister was a solicitor and a colleauge of hers was actually in the courtroom for that exchange, so she is sure it's true).

She went to some sort of works assistance program and was working a few days a week in a shop till ex had his stroke.

Even the girlfriend's own family dumped her in disgust when the affair came to light, they continued to have her (ex) husband to theirs on Christmas, etc until he died, and they are the ones who arranged for his funeral.

What I really do not get and what makes me mad is people that cannot own their shit. If you screw up, at least have decency to apologize and acknowledge the other persons feelings, show them you care. Instead, they deflect, gaslight and make you question your own sanity.

It does not matter what he says, or thinks about this situation, this exchange is not appropriate for two married adults, period! I am so sorry that you are going through this OP, but I see only one way out of this situation. You have to kick this sob out of your house, your life and tell everyone why. However, do not worry much about what everyone else will think about you or this whole situation, you are right and if they are real friends, they will support you.