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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

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Original poster

Is this a compliment? *[content warning: concerns sexual abuse]

528 replies

Shell563 · 05/10/2022 01:16

Would you see it as a compliment if a partner said he couldn't stop himself when you were having sex?

OP posts:
yousexybugger · 05/10/2022 14:11

I'm so sorry for your experiences OP.

Please be clear that his behaviour is not OK. A hug does not have to turn into sexual contact unless you both want it to. It is not normal to hug someone and progress to touching them sexually if they are frozen and not engaging/ enjoying it.

It is so widely publicised now that 'no means no' that there are no excuses for men not obtaining enthusiastic consent. If you don't want to be touched or have sex then that is fine. If a partner isn't happy with this level of sexual activity then it is up to him to walk away, not just do it anyway.

Things like pinning down, I.e. rough sex or experimenting with control require both partners to consent and be willingly involved. This is not for springing on someone with a traumatic past.

It's not about whether you'd class him as a good or bad man overall, it's about whether he can make you feel safe and be the partner you want. I'm afraid it doesn't sound like he is doing so at all.

Vapeyvapevape · 05/10/2022 14:11

However you gloss over this and make excuses, doesn't change the fact that he is abusing you.
You really aren't thinking straight, look at how many posters are saying this isn't ok .

Original poster
Shell563 · 05/10/2022 14:14

TooMuchToDoTooLittleInclination · 05/10/2022 13:59

(Gentle, non sexual, hug)

you need to stop seeing him.

A man who was interested in YOU, would not see you for the first time in years & would not do what he did.

He'd take the time to properly connect with you & see where you wanted to take things.

A man who cared about you, would NOT pin you down, unless you had told him it was something you enjoyed.

if he inadvertently did something you didn't like, he'd stop, he'd make sure you were ok & not start anything sexual unless you indicated you wanted you.

he or previous men have you thinking that you being so sexy/hot/whatever they just can't resist you & you shouldn't expect them to! It's crap! You could be/might be the sexiest woman in the world and a man can stop doing whatever he's doing if he respects you. He might still cum, but he can stop touching you in any way!!

you might be his partner, but he has NO right to touch you in any way you don't want him to.

he's abusing you, hard to hear I know, but he is. It's YOUR BODY, YOURS!

I'm sorry but I do not believe that most men don't pin down their partner. I don't. I'm not saying that every man has I've even consented to sleep with has beaten & abused me, or tied me to the bed or something, but they all have secured me in some way, there was no conversation in advance, squirming wouldn't stop it, & for one, maybe two they genuinely seems to enjoy it more when I did.

I'm certain that if an honest conversation was had with women in your life most would say men walk all over or right up the boundary line.

OP posts:
Watchkeys · 05/10/2022 14:16

so it's not like he hasn't done these acts to me before so why does it bother me

Because you have boundaries, whether you choose to listen to them or not.

How old were you when you were first touched without wanting to be, OP? Totally understand if you don't want to go down that path on a thread, but somewhere along the line, you've been taught that when you feel bad, you need to shut up about it. And that's why you're confused: your feelings are telling you one thing, and your brain is telling you to cover it up at all costs. Your brain/your conditioning, are trying to overwhelm your heart.

This won't have happened due to your adult relationships. You will have learned this young, and your adult relationships will have followed the pattern you were then familiar with: Feelings say 'no', but I have to say 'yes'.

You don't have to follow this pattern any more. Feelings say no? SAY NO. And remove anybody who doesn't respect that 'no' from your life, altogether. No ifs, no buts. There is no excuse for overriding your feelings. Not for you, not for anybody else. Currently, you over ride your own feelings by allowing this to happen. What will he do if you say no, and stop him? Are you afraid of him, physically? Would you be in danger?

bloodyunicorns · 05/10/2022 14:17

His behaviour is not ok. He is abusing you, and you have such a skewed idea of what's right and wrong that you don't see it.

Yes, he has pinned me down a few times, but men like that don't they?

It doesn't matter whether men like it. YOU don't like it, so your partner should not do it to you.

Even a hug leads to wondering hands. When we first met up again ... a hug led to a hand on my knee, which led to a hand running up my thigh, which led to him putting his fingers inside me. I just froze. If he was a bad man he would have taken things further. He didn't stop, but he didn't have sex with me, doesn't that prove something?

No. He's abusive. That's a horrible thing to do. He wants to have power over you.

Op, if you don't want to have sex ever sharing, that's up to you.

Do you think the Freedom Programme might help you?

bloodyunicorns · 05/10/2022 14:18

Op, pinning down is really not the norm. None of my sexual partners have done that without us discussing it first.

Watchkeys · 05/10/2022 14:19

I'm sorry but I do not believe that most men don't pin down their partner

It's a fact, OP. But just like if you live in a pub and never go out, you'll think that everybody drinks alcohol, you've been immersed in the company of disrespectful and abusive men, and therefore think that every man is abusive.

How do you think ordinary, happy relationships happen? Do you think that all women in straight relationships are silencing the same feeling of dread as you do?

SwanRot · 05/10/2022 14:20

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

MangshorJhol · 05/10/2022 14:23

My husband has literally never done anything to me that I didn’t consent to. That is the norm. It is not normal to tie up women when they are squirming to get away. It really is not.
And there is no such thing as ‘couldn’t stop myself.’
I can’t imagine a man putting his finger inside me without my explicit consent. Especially someone I hadn’t seen in a long time. When you say he didn’t have sex with you- he did. He penetrated you digitally.

Badger1970 · 05/10/2022 14:26

You sound really confused OP, and I would suggest that you need some time and space to think through what you're feeling.

And FWIW any man who can't respect his partner's boundaries isn't a nice man. You deserve to have your feelings respected because they're valid and they're no less worthy than anyone elses Flowers

Northbynorthbreast · 05/10/2022 14:28

OP, my DH has never pinned me down, ever. I would find it very frightening if he did.

JorisBonson · 05/10/2022 14:28

Shell563 · 05/10/2022 14:14

I'm sorry but I do not believe that most men don't pin down their partner. I don't. I'm not saying that every man has I've even consented to sleep with has beaten & abused me, or tied me to the bed or something, but they all have secured me in some way, there was no conversation in advance, squirming wouldn't stop it, & for one, maybe two they genuinely seems to enjoy it more when I did.

I'm certain that if an honest conversation was had with women in your life most would say men walk all over or right up the boundary line.

Show quote history

OP, I've had my fair share of sex and have never, ever been pinned down non consensually.

Please listen to what is being said here. This is in no way normal.

Solasum · 05/10/2022 14:28

You get to control what happens to your body. If someone tells you not to do something to their body, you don’t do it, even if you really want to. This is how I explain consent to DC. It really isn’t more complicated than that.

I am so sorry this has happened to you OP 💐

Original poster
Shell563 · 05/10/2022 14:29

C1N1C · 05/10/2022 08:11

I'm seeing a few mixed signals so my response will err on the optimistic side rather than the rapey one... I don't think PERHAPS here it's a question of consent or 'rapey', but about patience. I think there's a big difference between forcing yourself on someone that has said they don't want it, and occasionally (accidentally) overstepping a comfort line for someone that has had a rough past and needs to be gradually warmed up to it???

The questions you need to ask are:
Do you actually love him?
Do you WANT to eventually have real sex with him, or do you simply feel you SHOULD have sex with him because that's 'normal'?

If you want a sexual relationship and he occasionally gets carried away, then that is something to BOTH work on... he needs to be clear what no means, and you need to accept that allowing him to be that close and being told no just at the "good part" can be incredibly frustrating and attempts will be made to push boundaries...
IF however, you are just doing it because you think you should and he is being pushy, guilt-tripping you and not respecting boundaries, yes that is rape, because you shouldn't be made to do ANYTHING you don't want.

I don't want anyone to touch me, it's the price I have to pay , I try to take as little involvement as I can & spend the time during trying to breathe & not panic. Reading it back it doesn't sound good, but it's not as bad once he gets going. I just have to fight the urge to run away.

I'd like to not come away from every sexual encounter so stressed & upset, I don't always cry, I really try not to as he finds it hard to finish, so I just drag it out for myself. I'm so stupid.

He thinks I should be flattered he wants me so much he just rips my clothes off once we are alone, that he cannot stop himself or slips into another sex act he knows I hate more than just whatever was happening to me.

OP posts:
JorisBonson · 05/10/2022 14:30

He thinks I should be flattered he wants me so much he just rips my clothes off once we are alone, that he cannot stop himself or slips into another sex act he knows I hate more than just whatever was happening to me.

HE IS WRONG.

Please see this.

Watchkeys · 05/10/2022 14:30

it's the price I have to pay

For what? What are you paying for?

BBBBMushroom · 05/10/2022 14:31

A description of DV in this post.

I was sexually abused and almost killed as a child and then fell in to a really horrible sexually abusive very violent relationship when young and have a diagnosed MH condition. I completely understand not tolerating being touched. I have had a lot of therapy and it gave me new eyes as such. I have been in a really decent relationship for almost 25 years now.

You need to leave this abuser, rape was so normalised for me when young unless they were beating me senseless it was ok. I remember telling my therapist how my ex kicked me in the face as I was laying curled up on the floor trying to protect myself but minimised it by saying well he was not wearing shoes. I remember worrying about him when he broke a bone in his hand because he punched and beat me so bad one time.

You must leave this man and you must have therapy because abusers look for women like us, they smell out the vulnerability. I was single for a good couple of years while I worked on myself.

gwenneh · 05/10/2022 14:35

He thinks I should be flattered he wants me so much he just rips my clothes off once we are alone, that he cannot stop himself or slips into another sex act he knows I hate more than just whatever was happening to me.

He thinks you should be flattered that you're being raped and you still want to say he's not a bad man?

Dervel · 05/10/2022 14:35

I’m a man, and I can’t stop myself wanting someone, but I can sure as shit stop myself raping anybody…

Furthermore it’s of absolutely no relevance how desirable a woman is it is a reflection on how weak the man is.

Its a pretty common practice for the
psychologically disordered, to blame everything under the sun for their own actions.

The compliment isn’t really a compliment at all, it’s designed to make you feel special whilst simultaneously eroding your boundaries. Also its
an assertion that they aren’t going to take responsibility for their actions.

CrystalCoco · 05/10/2022 14:36

Shell563 · 05/10/2022 02:12

If your sexual partner knew that you didn't want to take part in a particular sex act, or even have sex at all & continued anyway would you be complimented?

I have many issues in this area due to previous abuse, I don't feel good about it but he says I'm confusing things.

Check out the video on youtube called 'Tea Consent'

Franklyfrost · 05/10/2022 14:38

Anyone doing things to your body that you don't want them to do is wrong.

If you don’t want to be touched that is okay. It doesn’t matter why you don’t want to be touched, your body is yours and no one else’s.

You might feel broken but that means that you handle yourself with care.

Men aren’t unable to stop during sex, they choose not to when they’re abusive shits. I struggled with identifying what was unkind behaviour after trauma, so I understand how rape can be construed as a compliment but it’s not. Look after yourself.

TwoWeeksislong · 05/10/2022 14:38

@SwanRot I’m sorry you were raped. You should perhaps step away from this thread if it’s making you feel belittled. It’s no one’s here’s intention to do that when they describe what OP has experienced as sexual assault or rape. We just want OP to understand that what’s happened to her is not ok either.

OP, sex is optional. Always. It’s supposed to be fun and enjoyable for both partners. Every time. If someone is having sex and notices that their partner doesn’t seem to be into it, then they should stop. Enthusiastic consent isn’t just about your partner not saying NO. It’s about being sure your partner wants to have sex too. The fact your partner knows you don’t like certain sex acts but ´gets carried away’ and does them anyway makes it rape/sexual assault. Whether or not it would stand up in court is not the point. Whether or not you shouted ´no’ at him during/just prior to the assault does not make his actions ok and it does not invalidate the feelings you are having.
You do not have to keep doing this. Please don’t keep doing this. There’s nothing wrong with never having sex again if that’s what you want. Can you breakup with him/tell him you don’t want to have sex with him anymore? Women’s Aid or the Police can give you advice about how to leave the relationship safely if you’re worried about his reaction.
I wish I could give you a cup of tea and a hug (only if you wanted one though).

Original poster
Shell563 · 05/10/2022 14:39

Watchkeys · 05/10/2022 14:16

so it's not like he hasn't done these acts to me before so why does it bother me

Because you have boundaries, whether you choose to listen to them or not.

How old were you when you were first touched without wanting to be, OP? Totally understand if you don't want to go down that path on a thread, but somewhere along the line, you've been taught that when you feel bad, you need to shut up about it. And that's why you're confused: your feelings are telling you one thing, and your brain is telling you to cover it up at all costs. Your brain/your conditioning, are trying to overwhelm your heart.

This won't have happened due to your adult relationships. You will have learned this young, and your adult relationships will have followed the pattern you were then familiar with: Feelings say 'no', but I have to say 'yes'.

You don't have to follow this pattern any more. Feelings say no? SAY NO. And remove anybody who doesn't respect that 'no' from your life, altogether. No ifs, no buts. There is no excuse for overriding your feelings. Not for you, not for anybody else. Currently, you over ride your own feelings by allowing this to happen. What will he do if you say no, and stop him? Are you afraid of him, physically? Would you be in danger?

I was 14/15. It was complicated. I tried to stop it, but I couldn't. My husband use to be a good man, he rescued me. Then he developed mental health problems & starting behaving really horrible to me. My social worker found out, I got swept up in the safeguarding process & removed. It was horrible, the abuse got put all over my records, it was humiliating & I'm so ashamed.

I don't live with this current partner, please don't worry about me.

Do you know what happens when a woman says no in this situation? I've gotten myself in so much trouble, it's not worth it.

OP posts:
JorisBonson · 05/10/2022 14:40

@Shell563 if a woman says no, the man should stop. It is that black and white.

happygertie · 05/10/2022 14:41

Shell563 · 05/10/2022 02:12

If your sexual partner knew that you didn't want to take part in a particular sex act, or even have sex at all & continued anyway would you be complimented?

I have many issues in this area due to previous abuse, I don't feel good about it but he says I'm confusing things.

If he knew you didn't want to have sex and he went ahead anyway then that is Rape.

He could help himself, he just didn't want to.