We just scared our 4 year old & I'm so ashamed

[TreesAreFriends]

DH went out at the weekend. He has had very little sleep. Tension brewing all weekend. Last night we had a row over something silly and we slept in separate beds.

I got up with my 2 DS (4 and 2). Making them breakfast. DH came down. I tried to make up with him. He was sulking. Started rowing again. And then basically he started losing it. Really shouting. Stormed off. I needed to get ready and leave for work (he's on holiday) so I followed him and shouted "you need to look after your own children you arsehole"

And the 4 year old started shouting up the stairs "I'm scared mummy I'm scared"

I then had to comfort him. I forced DH to come downstairs and cuddle DS too. And DS started saying "family family I love my family. Kisses and cuddles please mummy and daddy"

I then left for work. I'm in tears on the train. I'm so ashamed this is their existence. Its not frequent but because I'm putting on a brave face and biting my tongue I guess when it happens it really goes off.

I feel deep shame. I wish I didn't have to leave them with him. I don't know how I work full time and pay for it all and be there for them.

I do try to talk calmly to DH to sort things out but he can't listen. And I hate the arguments because of the kids.

Sometimes I daydream about him just disappearing. I just wish he would walk away and never come back.

He sounds like a complete waste of space. Divorce him. He might just step up and be a better parent when there is no one else to do it for him, but if not then he will give up on the reality of 50/50 pretty soon.

I think you need another longer appointment with another solicitor, and see what they say about the fact a nanny does most of the childcare when you are at work even when your DH is at home. It might be in your interests to put off the job move and more money until after the divorce, you need to play the long game to get shot of the burden of this man, after that you will be free to do whatever you want.

laughing at the thought of a man -who’s so disinvested in looking after his own children when at home that his wife needs to pay for a nanny instead - getting shared care to the extent of 50/50
he sounds like a self absorbed freeloader. Don’t keep beating yourself up about this morning. You know the shouting was out of line but frankly he’s abusing you and you sound at breaking point.

I just feel for you and your DS. This thing isn't ideal but uncommon either.

I'm not sure that keeping a record of this argument will go in the OP's favour.

Frankly, you do not know that he is abusing her so don't say that.

you need to start documenting everything regarding how much you remain the main care giver and do it over a period of months so that when you are ready to separate that you can prove what’s in the best interests of the children.

Much has been said, so I've only got a few things to add, really (and I'm another one with parents who stayed married when they shouldn't have).

1. when he says he loves your children but the reality is that you have to employ a nanny to care for them despite the fact that he is in the house and not working, then you have to ask yourself whether what he is saying is true, because his actions don't support it.
2. shutting himself in his room and refusing to come out, despite knowing that you have to go to work and your children are too young to be left unsupervised isn't about his feelings in that moment, it's about controlling you (TBH I think there's a lot of evidence of controlling behaviour in your posts)
3. reducing his income and pushing you into the position of paying for everything is about financial control and you have to ask yourself if on some level he is doing this in order to keep you in the relationship by making you financially unable to leave unless you leave the children behind (my father did this to my mother when I was in my early teens. I didn't understand it at the time, although I do now. He used the same excuses, too - job was ruining his life, blah blah, we'd all be happy if he was able to work less, blah blah, he'd have time to paint (he wanted to be an artist). Reality was that he did none of the above, it didn't fix anything, but it did put my mother in a financial hole that kept her married to him for another 5 years).
4. he went out of his way to get you to lose your temper in front of the children so that you were left feeling like you were the one in the wrong.

Please remember that it doesn't have to be this way. x.

He is abusing her. He is using her up, allowing to her to work flog herself to death doing all the work paying for everything and he can’t even step up and parent when he’s off work and at home. She has to pay for a nanny. She says he is angry and resentful though apparently she has supported him in changing jobs and reducing hours to support him.

abuse is about lots of things: one of them being control. One of them being financial abuse. At least two boxes ticked. Plus she feels unable to manage and confront issues in their relationship.

You appear to have little understanding and awareness of abuse so perhaps find a subject where your ignorance causes less damage to people dealing with it and post there.

Good posts from @movingcastle and @Whiskeypowers

@TreesAreFriends

From what you describe he will definitely not want 50/50 custody;it'll be EOW at best and definitely no more than Fri evening through to sun most likely Sunday morning;he'll be a total Disney dad.

On the contrary, I have lived through years of abuse.

God I remember that feeling so well even though it was 40+ years ago.

Listening to my parents arguing, the tension, the atmosphere followed by the forced jollity when my mum would think I was over it, even at 4/5/6 I was pretending to be fine because I knew that's what she needed from me. I was never fine BTW, I grew up walking on egg shells, wary, anxious, stressed out waiting for the next row. Don't kid yourself that they don't pick up on it or that they're too young. I shielded my younger brother as much as I could but when we have discussed our childhood us adults he knew exactly what was going on. I wouldn't even say my parents argued a lot it was more the hiding it, thinking we didn't realise, the rows through gritted teeth or at night when they thought we were asleep, living in that constant state of tension took such a massive emotional toll on me.
So what if it's 50/50?! At least they'd have the opportunity for a happy homelife for half the time. I can't stress to you just how damaging this is for your children, please don't think a game of hide and seek will wipe this from your sons memory.

He is a miserable, angry, bitter, cruel, grasping cunt, and he’s ruining your life.

I hope you can tell him to fuck off once and for all. And I hope he doesn’t fight for 50:50, though he may well do just to hurt you.

I wish my parents had split long before they did.

My mother was a narcissist with the emotional maturity of a teaspoon. She was spiteful, jealous, nasty, violent, and drank too much.

If my dad had left years before he did, I would have had a chance at being happy and seeing what normal relationships should be like.

It has messed me up like you wouldn’t believe. And I’ve had to work damned hard to fix that.

My brother is bitter and twisted and full of resentment too, and he was the golden child!

Leave for your kids sake!

As have I.
To dismiss this man’s behaviour as non abusive when you’ve apparently lived through being mistreated makes it even more horrific that you wrote what you did to me.
is also concerning your comment about recording this argument being unfavourable on the OP also ignorant since her behaviour is clearly borne out of desperation of being on the receiving end of abuse and not being the perpetrator of it.

Just to say you sound like an amazing mum who truly cares about their children. They are very lucky to have you!

do you think he would want 50:50?

@Dalint I'm so sorry to hear your mum was so abusive to you and your dad. And I totally understand what you mean about not automatically siding with the woman and that men are victims of this of kind of behaviour.

And I know I shouldn't have shouted at my husband when he stormed off.

But I promise that over the years he has done less and less and he's spent weekends sulking, shouting, sleeping. He can also be loving and funny but things have gone horribly wrong.

He is angry because he is abusive, not because he is angry. He has a problem with anger; YOUR anger when you rightly call him out on his unreasonable behaviour.

Abusers can be "nice" sometimes hence the loving and funny you describe of your H but the nice/nasty cycle of abuse is a continuous one. And in the meantime whilst you are all under the same roof, the abuse of you and in turn them continues.

Who knows, you might be making each other miserable. Maybe he'd be a better (or at least more patient) father after you divorce.

Or maybe he'll go in all guns blazing for 50;50 custody. Then realise that as a teacher, finding last minute childcare is a nightmare or looking after children and the home is hard and change his mind.

I'm booking myself some therapy. I did suggest marriage counselling some months ago but he just got upset "I thought we were happy. Why would you suggest that?". He did have some online therapy but he didn't want to talk "about my childhood and shit" he just wanted to feel less anxious and out of control. They said he sounded like he has OCD. Lots of invasive negative thoughts etc. He's not happy. Sometimes at work I talk to people who are like "oh we are taking the kids away this weekend" etc and I just don't understand how that's not my life too. I want to see family and friends but also seem to avoid it.

I'm going home now and feel sick with nerves. I'm just going to try and be really upbeat and not engage with anything negative. God I wish I'd done better.

And I'll keep planning.

Go to counselling on your own and see if you can find a BACP registered therapist to work with. Interview such people carefully and at length before going with any particular one.

Joint counselling is never recommended where there is abuse of any type within the relationship. He did you a favour here by refusing.

Keep up the planning of your exit from this miserable marriage.

This. Hands up here who is the perfect parent. I know its not me. There are MANY times I ve been ashamed of myself because of my parenting. MANY. Many times where I ve been too exhausted to play lego. Many times where I shoved on the TV and had an extra 30 mins sleep. MANY times where my dinners have been beige coloured. Too much screen time. Too little crafts and books and general perfection.

And yes - I ve shouted in front of my kids. Once recently where my husband was bickering about my driving (just passed my test) and I shouted at him. I was stressed. My kid shouted at me not to shout. It was awful.

You know what OP.... I taught primary. I have seen hundreds of primary age kids. It takes a lot to involve social services. And I ve seen some pretty horrific parenting. The fact that your kid had the emotional depth and felt safe enough to have that outburst? That shows that this is not a regular occurrence in an abusive household. Cut yourself some slack. You are clearly doing a very good job in very difficult circumstances. The fact that you are 'ashamed' (don t be - its not great... but it is not a situation where shame is needed) shows that you know to be sorry and can communicate that lovingly to your kid.

4 year old refusing to go to bed. 2 year old in cot but not sleeping as he's so overtired (didn't have a nap today for some reaon). 4 year old hit another kid at the park. Chaos. Can't get either of them to bed. Once I've got one calm and in bed the other goes off. DH on tiktok. But I'm not much better as on MN in my sons bedroom. I thought I'd bring up a happy home. The only reason I'm doing well at work is because I know how to make that successful. You work hard you do well. Doesn't seem true at home.

Thank you @BeardyButton that's nice of you to say. It feels much much harder than it should though.

If this is happening on a daily basis, please leave for the kids defo do not stay for the kids. I come from a background of selfish arguing parents, never understood why they stayed together. They eventually split up when I was 36?! Mum had an affair and left. Not sure who started the arguments probably my mother.