In laws doing my head in, midlife crisis and what to do next?

[Onceuponawhileago]

Hello good people of Mumsnet. Long term user - namechanged.

I'm M 49 and my wife is 50. Together 23 years, two kids 15 and 12.
I come from a different background than my wife, mine is working class, history of sexual abuse and subsequent addiction and alcohol issues. I went through many years of counselling and addiction suport and got better.

My wife comes from a wealthy background- in our relationship we are pretty good together. We share children stuff, I do most of the cleaning, house organising and any ongoing repairs etc as its an old house. My wife is not really into cleaning and more messy than me, I figure that cleanliness matters to me so I do it for me rather than have arguments about it. Cannot get a cleaner - too remote.

Years ago we started living close to her parents- their house is on a farm, ours on the farm too and so we see them most days. I would say her parents are essentially kind but not very empthatic, tone deaf sometimes and oblivious to poorer people and especially my kind of background. Often they just 'dont understand' why we dont have a cleaner or repair the house etc. Its because we are on average salaries living in a house that requires more upkeep than we can afford. My wife will inherit a lot of money so in a way she feels she should stay close to her parents and also its her family home and will inherit farm etc.

Her parents farm the land but badly so lots of stuff falling down etc. They want full contol of their farm and are gettting more difficult as they age so wont accept suggestions of getting in help on the farm even though they have millions in the bank and could easily pay for a nicer life.

I'm not money motivated, happy in my job, grew up with very little.

I am really worn down by constantly having in laws in my life- every day, thinking about how we will manage as they get older, how we will get them to accept help etc.

My wife just trudges on, is happy to just be as is.
I have a fantasy of a smaller house, no in laws, less cleaning and an easier, smaller and peaceful life.

I dont think I want to seperate- thats a big price to pay for a simple life plus impact on kids. Because I grew up with very little I have no attachment to this place or to wealth.

Happy for advice.

Thank you. Im actually unsure if its OK to feel like I do about the situation I described. Maybe Im a controlling, damaged, nutjob. Maybe I should just walk away when the chaos hits home.

Great. Thank you. All good perpectives.

Well done for the positive changes that you ate making.

No advice but I would be absolutely furious for the unnecessary stress her lie caused.

Because she lied to you when she said your daughter was sorted.

So selfish of her.
Your daughter was no doubt a little nervous and did not need the unprepared drama your wifes inaction brought.

So selfish an so unnecessary.

No way could, or would I keep quiet about it.

I think i was furious for my daughter because I never had anyone look out for me when I started school.

Gosh OP

Hand up, admit I have only skipped through the thread so might have missed something crucial. I'll read it all properly tomorrow.

But impressions are that you are a kind and resourceful person, and you have somehow got yourself stuck with a bunch of people who are stupid and selfish. This is not going to change, sadly, however much you try and overthink it.

It is 100% ok to be upset about this. It’s also very triggering for anyone that grew up with their needs not being met.

I’m sorry that you are feeling down, OP.
i have a similar issue with my DH, he doesn’t like to clean and he could live in a dirty house. Tried some arrangements to no avail.

As you say, the absolute worst is to expect things to be done because it was agreed and that they aren’t. At the end as from the house chores what he liked best was cooking he does all cooking and shopping(I add what I like to the shared list). He also does this and that when I ask him, but the point is that I have to ask when I see he isn’t physically doing anything else and will be doing it immediately, or else he’ll say “yes” and forget.

At the moment I am working on him to get used to empty the dishwasher while stuff is cooking, so that he gets into the habit and doesn’t forget. If someone reads this I don’t mean it like dog-training or so, but it’s my last resort.

About the inheritance / future arrangements planning, let me just say that is hell and I know from experience. Especially when one of the parents dies first and the wishes of the surviving one need to be respected but at the same time they become absolutely impossible. Please do not fall into that trap and put a plan in place before that. A lonely widower PIL has destroyed many marriages, the inheritance being one of many factors (cause then you are co-owner but aren’t at the same time… but under the law you are responsible).

So it’s probably my experience in this issues making me irrationally scared for you but I would be really concerned of these “not plans” of your wife. Even if she had ADHD or some planning issues, surely she can tell you at least whether she’d liked downsizing or not? If you can start remodeling the cottage or not? Else I would even think she is just leading you on believing there’ll be and end to the current situation just to keep you from going crazy.

Also, her way of crying to not talk about things is Ok for a while but it seems to me you are putting 90% of the effort in finding a solution. Does she care? Does she not see that you hurt? Does she value her own time more than yours? Does she think she’s entitled to private /hobby time while you are off cleaning a bathroom? If a partner did that to me and on top of that does not want to improve that would be a big red line

Im not sure how to make it work better. Sometimes it feels like I admin
everything and when I let it go this kind of situation happens. Maybe I
should just be OK with chaos and let it happen? I like to be organised.
My wife less so. Big difference

I'm trying to imagine what kind of person you are op, intellegent with an intense need to control your envioroment.
Now that's not a critism, but you are clearly poles apart from your wife and how you deal with stress.

Some people can live with such chaos, it doesn't mean they are lazy or innactive just that they tend to spring into action without as much planning or worry. You do seem highly strung and I should imagine your wife lies to stop or prevent you from becoming angry when things do not run smoothly.

Maybe you have OCD tendancies.

Now I think if I were you, I would move from the role of organiser, you keep the diary of life together and your wife seems to be doing the physical aspects.
You do not need to be the one to ask or inform, take the lead, you knew the school thing was today, you could have got her stuff together and told your wife you had already prepared the stuff.
You knew she was away for the weekend with a tight schedule for getting back, the school stuff should have been done without her asking you.

You were organising when you asked her and she felt the need to lie, that is a concern because that means she is fearful of you in some way.

Your screaming at the situation did not help matters at all, it solved no problem, it left your wife and children upset and the pattern will happen again, she (they) will lie to prevent you from erupting again.

Now I know others will disagree but I can't help feel you are in a managerial role at home and your wife is run ragged, trying to keep everyone happy.

I know you like your gardening, but presently at your stage in life who does that help, help with the children and child rearing and what they are involved in, this would cut down chaos.
And don't shout at your family, it's scary to be on the receiving end of that.

Thanks for posts.
In the little therapy I did recently it was surprising to discover that I internalise so much of my anger. I remember how scared I was as a kid of anger so it takes a lot for me to explode though I do explode. Holding it in is not healthy tho- I have chronic pain and I believe it is very much driven by personal stress. I feel resentful and that I am in a relationship with a child not an adult. Of course I can step up and do more but Im told things are done and they are not. I tried to introduce a roster and shopping list for groceries so we have food etc every week- otherwise Saturday afternoon supermarket hell.... It went by the wayside. Now theres no cereal, lunch for kids for school etc. Its not her job to do it all but please just say that the supermarket nerds to be done and I will do it. From now on I think Im just gonna have to do more because she is incapable of asking, I think, because she thinks in her head that she really will get to do it but everything, like the school trip tonight is a last minute, skid to a halt, adrenalin fuelled panic. It does not have to be like that.

I do think you have to work on your reactions; find ways to accept and express your emotions properly.

That might mean walking away sometimes.

I also would just take over these things for the kids’ sake. It’s not forever.

All these things that you are stressing over are just life, what every married couple experiences with children, negotiation and teamwork to get through the childrearing years.

These things are not life ending, it sounds as though you catastrophize over the minutaie, you are a whittler.

Easier said than done to relax and allow these feelings to wash over you, but dwelling on things does not help, keep active, keep busy and constructive, working out rota's, lists and calender reminders doesn't actually get the job done. I know how frustating it must be to feel you are the one who is keeping an eye on things whilst your family go about their hobbies but for your own health you need to let go.

It will be easier as your children get older but there will be different problems as you age, it's good you are seeking help, your anger needs addressing, but no matter what your problems are you must not explode, that is line that must not be crossed, it negates any point you may have.

For what it's worth, most women I've ever known have been the responsible ones, the organisers, the doers for home and family and to relax for any given time would have led to a breakdown of all law and order in the home, but they tended to do everything. I think you may have an expectation that your wife should be like this but not all women are.
Help her, the effort you put in is for both of you.

It’s sounds like your wife has ADHD (like me) so struggles with ordering the life around her. Is it worth looking up strategies on ADHD websites. She needs to work out what strategies work best for her, which will probably be very different to the strategies you use day to day.

advertise for a room exchange type scheme utilising your present house, with you living close by in a small modern property. , Each person could offer 14 hours a week in Labour in exchange for a free room and no bills.

any time your in-laws bend your ear about tasks, redirect the conversation and ask who they could pay to do the job. Be honest, say farm renovation is not your thing but you’re happy to do any gardening required. Keep repeating so that you draw a clear line in the sand which is unmovable.

Also try to create some balance.for yourself. Build a yurt with a burner or plonk a shed some distance away somewhere on the land and use it as a quiet retreat. Your own space for growing vegetables, a poly tunnel. Have a fire pit and hammock and meditate or read.

join a local walking group and get out weekly with them. Make some local friends and explore the local area so that you feel more connected

plan a couple of walking holidays each year, invite the kids and your wife. If they decline go anyway.

organise a weekly or fortnightly cleaner for your own home. Lead by example and
demonstrate how well employing people to help works.

Another idea is to allocate them one hour a day to undertake any tasks. Be very clear and say that’s your limit.

@BloodyCamping thats interesting about ADHD. Why do you think that my wife has ADHD?

You do not need her permission to shopping so just do it.

If she comes back with a problem, remind her that just saying you will do something is not enough.

Do a basic delivery order that will ensure lunches, cereals, basics for dinners are covered and use your freezer.

Your poor daughter not being looked after properly going back to school.

I can only imagine her anxiety at it all.

You cannot do everything so focus on the basics that ensure the children are looked after as they return to school.

I never had anyone look out for me when I started school.

How about now, OP? Who looks out for you now?

PPs say your wife probably pulls her weight in her own way. Does she, and how?

I dont know. Our relationship is sometimes fundamentally good but there is some dysfunction in how she plans and uses time and how that affects the family and in how I react to that.
I dont really have anyone that looks out for me. My family are AWOL - NC with some, my mother is elderly and still living in the past and thats about it. So I'm pretty self sufficient.
We had a long discussion about yesterdays stuff at lunchtime. We are poles apart when it comes to planning and time management.

Just planning and time management, or being considerate in general? Does she make you feel cherished generally?

In relation to the planning and time management, can I recommend getting a whiteboard installed in the busiest room of your house. On it, you put the days of the week and each of your names.
If the kids have a horsey event to go to, onto the whiteboard it goes. Same with school stuff.
If your wife has something she needs to do, onto the whiteboard it goes on the day that it has to be done.
Same goes for your stuff - anything that is planned goes on the whiteboard.

Now, if it's not on the whiteboard, it is up for discussion. For example, if the kids get an invite to attend another horsey event at short notice, then it obviously impacts on the whole family not just them so it's not an automatic yes to that one (it probably will be in the end but it's up for discussion).

Same for holidays - it could become your 'thing' that you go away for Christmas. But the key thing here is that holidays are up for discussion.

All that said, there is something that I think you're holding on to as the silver bullet that will sort all of this out and that is the other property that you can see from your house that has it's own entrance and is away from the inlaws. I think that the grass is always going to be greener and I believe that a complete break from the inlaws is what is required here - just like the woman in a previous post on the thread, the one who only wanted a small patch of land in the corner of a field that her brother refused and her parents supported that.

It's got to be an all or nothing approach here, I think. I also think that your children shouldn't be exposed to the swings and roundabouts moods that their parents exhibit as they will see this as how their role models behave and expect that in their friends/future relationships and so the cycle goes on.

Just my 2c on the matter. I do hope that you manage to find some happiness in the situation at some point.

She is considerate but this whole issue has really escalated in the past few years as I am getting browned off at fixing stuff I guess. So I feel resentful and I'm really aware of how that can lead to relationships going off the tracks. Its all a merry go round of ponies, admin, kids, playing catch up, dealing with in law shite etc. Like most people I guess. Cherished?? Hmmm, not for a while. We do have sex still though and talk a bit. No idea how normal this is.

Sorry to be like a dog with a bone, OP. I guess this is something I'm still working out in my own life. I wonder if sometimes when we've been forced to be "adults" from a very young age, we easily accept others being "children" and needing our care. At some point resentment creeps in because there's that aching need to be cared for ourselves, in every sense. Then it's a toss-up between feeling bitterly resentful and thinking "I made my bed and must lie in it." But I think the resentment is valid and might even be what we need to nudge us along to make some changes. No idea if any of this hastily cobbled-together cod psychology is of any relevance or usefulness to your situation. Good luck.

@Alcemeg

No I think it's a good point, quite illuminating.

@LookItsMeAgain Thank you very much.
OK, so I will answer and I apologise for length but you raise good points.

Other house - yeah - it is grass greener - I'm still living with same person. In laws not as close but I have really limited contact there so thats nicely resolved to some extent.

Kids seeing this arguments - yep - awful. I hate it, its why I dont explode so much - I go to the garden. There are never shouting matches but of course kids recognise tension.

Christmas - this year I insisted we do her parents christmas stuff and then go away somewhere. It will be something to look forward to. Idealy we would do xmas on our own but her parents live right behind us and her aunt comes so its the same every year. Something to tackle again - I hope when kids are a little older we can go away completely and switch off.

Today we agreed that having two rescue ponies in addition to three others was just plain nuts so we agreed they go back to recue centre - she fosters them but they add extra work etc. We really have enough with three ponies.

OK, calendar.
My whole working and social life happens via google calendar. Everything goes into it. I did go through several periods of printing out calendars, whiteboards etc.....not really taken on board, left by the wayside unfilled in. This year though I created a family google calendar for all events such as school, holidays, pony events. It has worked well as in I can see what happens when. If its not on the calendar it does not happen. It has worked well.

Here is an example of how an event translates into real life.

So, I knew about last weekends pony event x 3 days. I knew it finished on Sunday before lunch and I knew school event was at 6 - 7 pm. All in the calendar.
Despite that it was the usual mad scramble and tears etc to get to the school event. So we discussed that calmly today.
Once event was over my wife went for lunch instead of coming home. Once home she knew she had not got all the school stuff together and could not ask me as it was too late.
So I asked how she 'saw' her afternon after the event. Instead of looking at the times she just ambled along so kind of knew she would be late/ under pressure - kind of accepted it. In my case I would have immediately finished event, got on the road, grabbed sandwich in garage on route, got home and got the school thing out of the way. I would have worked out drive time etc. We did that together today and she would have been home at 5pm - an hour to get ready for school thing. I pointed out that taking her time cost everyone their evening, upset me, my daughter etc. So we have very different ways of planning and travelling etc so I am not sure she thinks about the impact of being late etc on other people. I could have collected my daughter, she could have got a lift or my wife could have left with time to spare and get home. Thats kind of the crux of it. Its like cleaning - its not really a priority so it falls by the wayside. I am curious (and often mad) as to why there is no urgency despite the outcomes. I think its something we really will have to get to the bottom of. Its not particularly adult behaviour in my mind - its a bit in the lap of the gods on her part. Maybe she hates schedules, maybe she likes free will, maybe she daydreams?? No idea. Hence my frustration.

Sorry for the essay.

Thanks. Thats brought tears. Yes I think so. I never remember being hugged, being told it was OK, minded. I always just did what I needed to do just to survive. Theres a certain validation in being 'needed' yeah? Being needed means you are important, someone knows you are there. I think in my case thats how I started in my relationship and after a lot of therapy I started to be who I should have been, got healthy and honest and I guess that change is really hard to see in someone who previously was dependent on you. Now they are striking out and being adult. So its difficult for both of us. Really when I think back to my childhood tears come easy despite the work I've done.

I am not sure she thinks about the impact of being late etc on other people.

It sounds as though there's a lot wrapped up in that "etc" and perhaps another word for poor time management is selfishness?

Sorry!