Husband wanting to take kids on family holiday alone

[Thatgirlcat]

Hi guys,

myself and my husband are currently going through a separation. Previous to this we had booked a family holiday to the Philippines for 1 month in July this year. My husband hasn’t been home in 5 years and his family have never met our 2 children. We have split up since booking the holiday, but currently still live together, as we are waiting to sell our house. We both agreed that we would still take the kids on holiday together before the house sells and we divorce.

Recently my husband told me that I’m not coming with them, and that he will be “taking his children on holiday without me, as he doesn’t want me there around his family”. I’m devastated, as I really want to go and see me kids enjoy the holiday. I will never be able to take them away like this with all 4 of us again, so it’s really important for me. I don’t want to stop them from seeing their family, but at the same time I can’t sit back while they leave. I just don’t know what to do. Has anyone got any advice?

If his family want to see them so bad then they can fly over to you .

@Sailingovertheedge Yes I have the children's passports safe. I know that in the Philippines divorce is illegal, however this does not apply for me as I am a British citizen and I therefore can divorce him. Also I am aware that it is extremely corrupt there. I am still waiting to hear back from the solicitor, might just ring another one just in case

www.ibblaw.co.uk/insights/steps-to-prevent-your-child-being-taken-out-of-the-country-port-alert-orders

Fighting a legal battle in a foreign country would most likely be lengthy, very very stressful and very very expensive, even if in the end the "weight of the UK and Philippines legal systems" came down in her favour in the end. The legal system and courts in the UK have backlogs of years in some cases, especially after the pandemic. I cannot imagine the Filipino ones are faring better. The youngest child is two. By the time any battle was won they would not even recognise their mother in all likelihood.

I call bullshit here. Are you really a lawyer?

It doesn't sound as if he likes you, or that he's willing to stick to agreements.

Your kids are tiny.

I wouldn't let him take them to a foreign country, no. Mainly because if he tries to keep them, by the time you've argued it out in the courts, the UK might not be the best place for your kids to live anymore. Don't take the risk.

It would be different if they were older and more capable of standing up for themselves/expressing an opinion. Don't let them travel.

They are far too young to be away from you for a whole month.

Hmm, rude much?

Collaborate is right. I'm another family lawyer who would advise a client in this situation that he'd be likely to get an order to travel with the kids.

But the OP shouldn't worry - the court may also agree with her going, and staying in separate accommodation. Neither parent will know the outcome of any court case until one of them applies.

As it stands, OP need only apply for a PSO if the father threatens to take the kids without her consent - this doesn't seem likely as he has asked her to sign her consent and has also said he's applied for a court order. He is, therefore, perfectly aware that he cannot take the kids without her consent.

You call wrong. Collaborate is an experienced family lawyer who posts regularly on Mumsnet. I agree that the OP's husband is likely to get the order he wants.

I've just read your thread OP with my heart in my mouth. Thank goodness you seem now to be taking all the good advice you've had on this thread on board and a friend is coming to take the passports. You may have had hope that your divorce would proceed amicably but it appears now that he will not be making things easy for you. Stay strong for your kids. Sorry you are going through this

From Rights of Women (aimed at women so swap the sexes for the OP's situation)m

If your child’s father refuses to agree to you going on holiday abroad with your child, then you will need to apply to the Family Court for a specific issue order. This is an order the court makes when it is asked to decide a particular issue that the parents are not able to agree on.

You can make this application on an emergency basis if you have travel plans, but you should be aware that the Family Court may not be able to deal with your case very quickly. A court is unlikely to make an order allowing you to go on holiday with your children unless they have heard why your children’s father does not agree.

So while our resident lawyers might advise him to apply for an order, it seems unlikely the Court will grant it without asking the OP why she doesn't want her ex to take her two tiny children away from their mother for a month.

I just spoke to a family solicitor, she told me I need starting funds of between £500-1000 plus the hourly fee is 275-£295. There's no way I can afford that. I really don'y know what to do now.

OP would solely be concerned with getting the children back, not him. There seem to be plenty of posters here objecting to the father ever taking the child to see his own parents. The court does not, as a rule, instinctively rule against such visits, especially in the case of a country already a signatory to the HC.

I don't think anyone is objecting to him taking the children to visit his parents @Collaborate. The OP isn't. What she is uncomfortable with is him taking them for a month without her. And the fact he's become so aggressive.

A month is a long time in a small child's life.

And doesn't the screenshot below mean they only recognise child abduction with a limited number of countries?

100% this

Indeed. Lawyers are very variable I have always found.

I find it very hard to believe that the DH would be allowed to take such small DC so far away for so long against their mother’s will. Also given the animosity he has shown, his refusal to entertain the compromise put forward by the mother, and the fact that there are alternatives (the family could come to see the DC if they really wanted to).

No one is saying the DC can never see the DH family. How dramatic. They can see them when they’re older or the family can fly over. For the moment, they are very small and this country is their home.

In addition, according to the legal advice given on reunite.org the DH does fulfil the criteria for a flight risk.

Did you book the airline tickets? Can you cancel them?

I would be wondering if he would have time to get a court order in the next couple weeks, given the covid backlogs.

Hi Op, if you can't afford legal advice I would try citizens advice bureau see if any free advice available. But it may be worth you paying out for solicitor advice (use the money you would've spent on the trip?).

Try Rights of Women. They're a brilliant organisation providing free legal advice to women.

Here's info on their family law helpline. They're open funny hours (mostly evenings) so check this page before calling.

rightsofwomen.org.uk/get-advice/family-law/

Rip the passports up, burn them, just destroy them, he won't get new ones anytime soon, and you can honestly say you did it as he was threatening you.

I'm guessing he's thought better of it having you there. Unless there is a drip feed coming you are unhappy in your marriage, want to divorce him and wanted him to move out, fair enough but you can't expect him to want to go play happy families with you on a holiday which is primarily to see his family. 2 and 4 are very young to be without you for a month. Suggests you go but stay somewhere separately where you can see the kids without him.

can you get a refund on the tickets ?

I'm sure you know @Thatgirlcat that there are many children in the Philippines raised by family members . It is all too common for women to work abroad and send money home to have their children raised. I would fear that this is his plan.

It might be worth alerting the passport office if he’s threatening to take the DC without your consent as he may try to apply for new ones by claiming they are lost or damaged.