AIBU Would you be worried about this friendship?

[Lucyofthemichealcar]

Background:
Married for 11 years and together for 17.
H very outgoing, fun loving and flirty but never had concerns. Similar personality to me, so a bit of flirty banter is fine so long as we both respect the line.
Since married neither or us go out as much and since kids deffo not.
Both of us have male and female friends. Being friendly with a woman doesn't bother me but the dynamic between these two has always seemed different but cannot put finger on it.

H and his work friend.
I would say she definitely fits into my H's 'type'. They teach together. They are in different departments so it does not sound as if they speak every day or every week but they do seem to catch up face to face at lunch or over messenger if it has been a few weeks. She goes back to the US every summer and as far as I know they go weeks then with no communication so they are not always in each others pockets but it seems in the school they are very much viewed as a pair, so get paired up to chaperone school events and over the years they have organised several trips together as they both say if they are stuck with colleagues for a week it needs to be someone they get on with and like and apparently because they trust each other to organise and not mess things up when carting around 50 odd teenagers. Looked at messages from her when I was in the throes of pregnant paranoia and the chat is friendly but mundane. Not even flirtatious. She asks after me and H about her partner. The tone is how he talks to all his other friends. We have had her round for dinner and she has also done the same and we have went for drinks together. All very nice and above board. Done the odd favour like making us a whole load of meals when our kitchen was getting renovated and doing a food shop when we had covid or helping with looking after cat when we were away but I just can't shake a feeling she does it all to look good to H. She is very American and brings round baking, goes all out at christmas and since I have known her has always given me and the kids gifts (all our birthdays are in Late Nov/Dec so they are birthday/xmas gifts). Her and H also always exchange birthday gifts but they are stupid cheap items as part of a running joke from work. She seems keen to be friends with me too and suggested going for a wine or doing a gym class but as I said something always seems off and never felt entirely comfortable around her in the 9 years her and H have been friendly.
She has a BF of 12 years but they have never married and don't cohabit which seems strange.

Why am I concerned?
Aside from being pregnant and crying at the drop of a hat, what has made me question it all is that three weeks ago my H stayed at her house overnight. She got a phonecall at work to say her mum had passed back in the states. Her partner was away on business and she had a meltdown at work. H brought her back to ours but she said she wanted to be at home, pack and get the first flight home. H took her back to her place. He came back after dropping her off and asked me if I minded him staying to keep an eye but i think he had pretty much made up his mind while I said yes or not. He stayed the night in her spare room and then drove her to the airport at 3am. At the time I did feel like she could have reChed out to other friends but i suppose if that was me I would be all over the place too. She and her BF came by a few days ago with a restaurant voucher for the two of us to say thank you for being there for us. We have two kids and I am seven months pregnant with our third. Is it hormones or should I be worried?

H sensed I wasn't okay when he came back after dropping her off and I said how I felt and he said there was and never had been anything between them that I could check through messages etc if it put my mind at ease but I don't know. Have asked friends in the past and they have said it is a bit of an unusal one but probably because as a society we generally are uspicious of male female friendships unless they have been sustained through childhood and adolescence.

AIBU?

Because she clearly is a massive bitch

Who has not said anything for nine years, nine years.

Bitches are a little quicker off the mark in my opinion.

It's unreasonable in your opinion though, not in other peoples opinion. I think the husband is being very selfish and just thinking about what he wants.

Everyone is different. You would put friendships above your marriage, that's fine. Others put their partners first at all costs. That's fine too.

Oh please! He goes running to the actual woman that the OP is feeling insecure about with the marriage problems, he could SURELY have found someone else to confide in if her really needed to. So disrespectful and disloyal to the OP

@TedMullins

Whatever you think of OP, a grown adult calling a complete stranger a "massive bitch" on an anonymous forum doesn't exactly make you look like a nice, reasonable person either. It's a bit weird and sad tbh.

That letter is an absolute disgrace. The DH has shown an utter lack of respect to his wife by revealing private family matters to the OW, who by the way, sounds like a very sneaky fucker. The DH has shown no compassion to his wife and has tried to slope off on backsheesh holidays where he knows the OW will be. I would be divorcing his manipulative arse asap.

I meant to add earlier that this not control! I have been in a controlling marriage and this is nothing like it in the slightest. Far too many people are hiding behind the "it's controlling" narrative to make sure their partners don't express their upset about situations.

I was responding to a comment saying I was calling the OP a massive bitch which I actually hadn’t done up until that point. But if the shoe fits.

Literally the first 9 or so pages are people who can read the vitriol in OP’s posts for what it is and aren’t in support of her, it’s not like I’m a lone voice here.

Can someone explain though why you’re convinced this woman has an ulterior motive? All I can see from what OP described is repeated attempts to befriend her and extend an olive branch, perhaps she is a little gushy and OTT but I’m not seeing anything that suggests she has nefarious intentions. I reckon if she HADN’T attempted several times to reach out and include the OP, that would also have been wrong, and she’d be accused of wanting to sneak around in secret with the husband. Genuinely though, why all the suspicion towards someone going out of their way to be nice, often in the face of hostility? What is it about that that’s getting your backs up because I don’t get it at all.

@TedMullins It's nothing to do with the woman's motive, that is irrelevant. It is the inappropriate relationship and actions by the OPs husband and the complete disregard for how his wife feels about the situation.

What’s inappropriate about it though? The OP herself says they don’t really speak or hang out outside of work. He stayed at her house ONCE to give her a lift to the airport in an emergency. His friends and family like her - he doesn’t have control over how they feel or behave. OP asked him to stop seeing this woman, he told her he wouldn’t be going to her social events, she asked why, he confided in her which is a pretty normal thing to do with a friend. So where is the inappropriateness? Or do you just think any level of emotional investment in anyone other than your spouse is inappropriate? Of course he’s disregarding her feelings because he think’s she’s wrong as do over 9 pages of people here!

@TedMullins it's inappropriate because it is causing his wife distress. His wife whom he has known a lot longer than this woman and has children with. He stayed over at the woman's home once too many which is completely inappropriate in a marriage. Confiding in a woman that your wife is already unhappy about is completely disrespecting the marriage. He should have put the effort into talking to his wife instead and finding a solution. He needs to think in terms of "us" rather than "me".

So no matter how baseless her distress is he should just acquiesce to it? Nah, I dont subscribe to that at all. Why on earth is staying at a friend’s house in an emergency inappropriate? Just because she’s female? It is possible for men and women to be in the same building without being compelled to shag, you know? How very sad that he isn’t “allowed” to do a good deed for a friend because of some bizarre social code that says all other women must be viewed as harlots and men are incapable of self control.

Who can people confide in about relationship problems then if not their friends? No wonder so many people end up trapped in abusive relationships if they subscribe to this unhealthy belief that telling anyone about marital issues is a betrayal.

as for finding a solution… pretty difficult when the OP can’t even talk about it like an adult, instead resorting to calling this woman names, calling her a drama queen when her mother died and generally referring to her with utter vitriol. Have you actually read her posts and the way she talks about this woman? You think that level of bitterness and hatred is reasonable and rational? No wonder the husband is disregarding her feelings if that’s how she’s bringing them up.

@TedMullins There is very little point us going back and forth on this as we will never agree. We have very different values when it comes to a relationship. If the OP is unhappy with the situation, then she has every right to be. Telling her that her feelings are ridiculous and baseless is unfair and it completely dismisses her as a person, a person who has every right to feel happy and secure in her marriage.

Yes, clearly we’re never going to find common ground but I’m absolutely staggered that anyone can read the OP’s posts and the level of nastiness in them and think it was in any way justified.

Yes, she deserves to have a secure and happy marriage and the best path towards that for her would be therapy to address her issues, often the root of unpleasantness is feelings of inadequacy and low self esteem. Of course she’s entitled to her feelings - no one can help how they feel - but that doesn’t mean feelings are always justified, rational or deserving of respect. It isn’t right or fair to impose your own issues onto your relationship and expect them to be pandered to.

I don't know what you expected him to tell her OP if he suddenly stopped going to her events etc? Or did you think because you don't like her its ok for him to treat her in a shitty way and ignore her with no explanation?

Just out of curiosity and trying to understand your POV - are you or have you ever been married or currently share/ever shared finances/house/kids with a partner?

When you don't want to work with someone because you think they're a bitch - would you tell them exactly that and detail why or would you have a more considerate/diplomatic response? Or if your partner doesn't want to meet a friend or family member because he finds her irritating and childish - would you tell your friend that or come up with a more diplomatic response?

It's never ever 62 year old Margaret who's a size 20 is it. Never.

But thats not whats happened, OP has told her husband he can't meet his friend because she has issues she wont address. So he is in a position where he needs to change his behaviour towards someone who he likes and respects. It was an awful position for him to be in and OP needs to own her part in it.

Yes I have shared a house and finances with a partner. I left hi because, among other reasons, he tried to police my friendships, particularly male colleagues, because of a similar mindset to the OP.

@TedMullins and would you share a house, finances, kids etc with a friend? And if you did, would you attach any more conditions to the friendship? Or would you treat it as every other friendship - no expectations , no contract, they can up and leave whenever they get a partner or a new job and not consult you?

Also - if friendships and relationships ate exactly the same in priority - is there a reason you aren't sharing a bank account, or including your friend in life decisions like where you should live or what work life balance looks like?

Eh? I’m not sure what sharing a house or finances has to do with anything or what point you’re trying to make.

Sharing finances and a house is one big practical element of a relationship, yes, but it doesn’t entitle one party to police or veto the other’s friendships. Being entwined to that degree certainly makes it harder to split up, but it’s not a reason to put up with unacceptable controlling behaviour.

And if OP decides she wants to move across the country for a new job or to be closer to family and he doesn't want to - can she call him controlling for putting her in an awkward/difficult position for upsetting work and family? Can she then shut him down and suggest she get therapy to deal with his insecurities around change? Tell work or family that the reason she isn't accepting promotion or moving is because DH said no - and would you consider it reasonable for work and family to write to him a long letter telling him why he should accept the decision?

Trying to understand why you are likely to find the situation I've outlined unreasonable but the OP not wanting a woman she doesn't like in her life is so unreasonable.

In actual fact, I have discussed things like where to live and work-life balance with friends, when I have had big life decisions or upheaval, I’ve found friends an invaluable support. Some of these friends are also in relationships and the opposite sex, but still find time to have discussions about big important topics, not just about me, but about their own lives too, if they need advice. But I’m still not sure what you’re getting at.

So does a partner expressing a dislike about a certain behaviour always equal being controlling? Are people meant to just accept anything in their relationship?

Well they do share house and kids and finances which I assume you understand to mean that the conditions of their relationship require a lot more conditions and compromises than a friendship. Which means he does sadly need to find ways to compromise with his wife because that is the person he chose to commit too. Just like he would compromise with any person he makes significant commitments to.

That's why no one does these things with a friend.

And if he feels that strongly about it - he can leave. But I don't think many people put their kids through a divorce without making any efforts to compromise and communicate.