Dating thread 228: ribbons round a maypole

[ButterflyOfShay]

The Rules:

The first rule about the dating thread is don't talk about it with people you're dating.

Develop a thick skin.

Do not invest emotionally too soon.

It's all BS until it actually happens.

Trust your gut instinct.

People vanishing, lying & being generally weird is not your fault.

Know your worth.

If it's not fun, stop.

Loo update is mandatory.

No dating the thread.

Treat others as you'd like to be treated

Any relationship you have that could get ruined by having a conversation about your feelings, standards and/or expectations wasn't really stable enough to begin with

The things you choose to ignore/ tolerate now are the reasons you will break up in the future

OLD can get very time consuming. Keep doing other activities you enjoy.

Optional: Please give your irons (potential dates you are talking to) nicknames like Mr Scottish. Initials are allowed (Mr S) when you are an item

I'm now going through a mini panic about Mr S. He's been nothing but kind and respectful, and even seems like a bit of a pushover. However, I find myself analysing every little fact to see if he could be similar to my ex. I know that abusive men can put on an act to reel you in!

He has said a few things that remind me of my ex's cheapness and entitled attitude:

I told him that flights back home in the summer are massively expensive, and he asked whether I could get my new employer to pay for it (it's been suggested I should fly to the other side of the same very large country for some meet and greets). I also mentioned volunteering to do some work way below my paygrade to make some improvements. (There isn't any support staff and my suggestion is regarded as being very helpful). He said that later, I could then make a point about how the work should have been done by secretarial staff and it was unfair on me.

He also has mentioned aspects of his family relationships which make me worry that he can be a saviour/controlling type.

I'm not sure whether there is any way to find out whether these things are indicative of a problematic person without living this thing out, but I am suddenly very frightened of getting enmeshed in another abusive and damaging situation.

@Mila14 indeed, dating is a minefield full stop! I wasn't looking for a committed relationship at the time, but I liked him more than I meant to. He did say more than a few things that led me on to thinking he saw me the same. With hindsight I think he got cold feet (commitment phobe) and I didn't handle it well. It did free me up to meet my lovely Mr D a few months later though, who I've just realised I'm coming up to a year with!

@ibelieveinmirrorballs @Thisisworsethananticpated no experience or useful words but just wanted to send virtual support and 💐 for what you must be going through with the challenges of your kids, you both sound like fricking amazing parents, I couldn’t begin to think about how hard it must be trying to support them through those kind of issues 😔

@ICrunchCrispsNotNumbers you got to remember that when people are cruel its actually nothing to do with you - you can just feel a bit of pity for them that they’re that insecure to be that way and advise them to seek help - then block em! Be secure in yourself and know you’re on the right path and just cut any negativity out your life ad you dont need it. It seems to me like you’ve come a long way in a short time 💗 you should be proud of yourself! x

@hotnakedgelato I think what you are feeling is not unusual. You’re checking in with yourself as you proceed with Mr S that this is a healthy dynamic and the kind of relationship that you know you want (based on others that have not been so good for you) There is of course that point where after you have got past the initial rush of adrenaline and navigated first intimacy you do start to see things with a little more clarity. Is it Mr S who hasn’t had many relationships or been in one for quite a while? I think you will have to see if any of your slight niggles start to increase.

@hotnakedgelato I can understand you feel nervous if getting into another toxic or frightening situation but I’m not getting any bad vibes from what he said. It feels like he’s just trying to listen and provide some helpful or supportive suggestions to the things you say… there is always going to be a risk a man’s abusive but we don’t ever know, can only look at the signs… is he on good terms with his exs do you know? Just take things slow give it a bit of breathing space.. try not to panic 🙂 x

ibelieveinmirrorballs

the group is parenting mental health
it’s become quite well known
wjat I like is that there is always someone who has been through what you have
it’s a very safe space and non judgemental
people there GET it and people in real life don’t

the problem with kids and mental health is

it’s hard to fix

it comes with a healthy dose of guilt and blame

the system is a mess , if not broken

it can also take a while to fix , as you are maybe seeing

and kids and teens don’t always engage with their own self care !

at the very least I hope you can get your build done , one major stress down

microdosing ? Please elaborate ! 😁

@Stepcount @ButterflyOfShay

Thanks. It's such an odd panic I am suddenly feeling.

He has had maybe 2 relationships, of 6 months and a year, respectively. He told me the breakups were amicable 🤷‍♀️

It's unclear why he hasn't had more relationships. He certainly wasn't sleeping around based on what I know.

hotnakedgelato

analysing their past leads to no good ! I understand the overthinking and anxiety
god knows !

but their past will always be a minefield especially if you are an anxious overthinker

there is no way to win on that one

hes just a flawed human , like we all are

ButterflyOfShay

isn’t it your birthday this week and another threadies !?

thanks for the kind words
it is , what it is 🙏

I possibly have date 2 tomorrow, date 1 was three weeks ago so this feels like a slow burner 😬, still not sure if he likes me in the way I want him to like me so we shall see what happens.

Im not sure if there’s something in the air or it’s the fact summer has arrived but several old irons have come out of the woodwork asking to go on a date, one has pretty much asked for some kind of relationship (long distance) which isn’t really what I’m looking for, we dated for a while a couple years ago and it was pretty casual due to distance. Another messaged me yesterday, he’s someone I met up with once for a coffee but turned out he’s living with someone, he’s basically decided he’s staying living with her until he finds someone’s else 😬, he doesn’t see anything wrong with this (obviously I do). And then my friend (who I met online 2 years ago) decided to step over the friendship boundary at the weekend asking me why I won’t have a relationship with him, I have told him many times that I don’t feel that way towards him but I enjoy our friendship, he was quite pushy which has now made the friendship a bit odd.

A couple weeks ago I felt no one was interested and now I feel like men are trying it in left right and centre but none of them really tick my boxes. I would like the guy I’m dating tomorrow to progress more but I think he’s a bit shy/awkward and I don’t want to be too full on and scare him off but I also don’t want him to think I’m not that interested either. I will just see how it goes but keep my options open. I still have one other iron on Tinder that I might meet up with.

How old is he..? That seems really not very much relationship experience.

I'd agree with the others in that you are doing the right thing to be cautious and yes, this is the point at which the adrenaline high of having met someone decent starts to wane a little bit and the reality of the situation emerges... not altogether a bad thing but things to consider start popping up.

To me those suggestions he's made are socially a bit awkward, as in - not very savvy as they're unlikely to be successful or to work. My exH was a bit like that, he had odd ideas of what was the right thing to do in work situations and I used to find it a bit alarming, as though he didn't have the same grip on the world as I did. It's not so much that his suggestion your work pay for the flight is entitled (though it is a bit), for me it would be more like 'oh god no, that would be an embarrassing and stupid thing to ask for!'. Ditto with the work you've offered to do - a socially clever person knows that to make gestures like that wins you currency at work, and this is a good thing, and ultimately will serve you well. It's a far more basic view of give and take that assumes that to do work 'below your pay grade' requires work to somehow compensate you.

@hotnakedgelato I think it's a positive that you are wary of Mr S and things he says and as someone else said you can't tell abusive men by looking at them so all you can do is file these things away and just be mindful of them.

I've been with Mr K over 2.5yrs and I'm always looking for flags, part is self sabotage and part is protection. I had a terrible marriage so I'm on high alert for similar behaviour.

My counsellor reminded me that not everything needs to be a red or amber flag so I try to bear that in mind.

Try to go with the flow and just keep one ear open for more comments.

thisisworse it's shay's birthday on Thursday and mine on Friday. I wonder if I've had an early birthday present in Mr Arty. We just both did Wordle and asked the other one if they do it. I have to be very careful as we have not actually met yet and we all know what can happen when you build a virtual relationship, and then don't click irl.

gelato it's understandable that you're on your guard but that carries a risk of overanalysing and self sabotaging. Give him a chance, see how it goes, you've been through too much together to write it off just yet.

@ibelieveinmirrorballs

He's 40! No, it's not much relationship experience at all.

Based on what I know, he was wrapped up in a very bad family dynamic with his mentally ill brother, did loads of drugs, got kicked out of uni, and has been on a delayed path with everything ever since. He has a maths PhD and a seemingly good job now.

I have thought a fair amount about his lack of relationship experience and I suspect it's down to being focused on other things, insecurity, and not being interested in the people he met.

I completely agree with your assessment of the social intracacies here. I have a lot of experience in very political work environments, while he has relatively little.

@SortingItOut @WeWantTheFinestWines

Yes, it's a constant vetting process, isn't it! Red flags could pop up anytime. It's so difficult to balance reasonable vigilance with neuroticism.

hotnakedgelato

whikst I hate diagnosis he sounds like he has a few asd traits
and don’t we all ! But the delays , social skills , inability to navigate politics etc
and whilst I hate to stereotype , the maths PHD

I like him as he reminds of why I have going down with my son
he’s 100% going to be late developing

and I hope he can meet a lovely
woman sometime

WeWantTheFinestWines

have you got a face to face lined up ?
in the meantime enjoy it for what it is 😊

Oh, I think that it can practically be assumed that anyone I am involved with will have ASD traits. I believe that I have many such traits, though I have learned to be less socially awkward in some ways.

Mr S has specifically mentioned some of my characteristics that he likes which I think link back to this: I think and speak about relationships etc in a very logical way which reflects thoughtful decision-making rather than being driven by emotions. When we had a chat about some relationship stuff at the weekend, I actually laughed when I noticed how detached and businesslike it all was and I said "i wonder how this conversation would sound to someone else." (He said he thought it would sound very rational).

I actually put a lot of my ex's misbehaviour down to probably being ASD (not diagnosed), to my own detriment - for example, he was incapable of taking my emotions into account and seeing them as valid. Maybe this is part of why I am feeling alarmed.

I do not know if this is comforting to you in any way. I am not at all put off by these traits as long as the social awkwardness doesn't veer into totally inappropriate weirdness. I'm sure that there are many other women like me who would appreciate your son!

Question… if a date goes well, how do you leave it with them? Equally, if it doesn’t go well, how do you leave it?

I’ve always found this part really quite awkward and painful so I’m wondering what other people do.

@IodineQueen if a date goes well, I would normally say that I had a great time and it would be nice to meet up again.

In my experience, both people can usually tell if a date hasn't gone well, and both parties have gone silent. But if not, I would write a nice message that says that things aren't going farther, probably with an excuse (i told one guy earlier this year that I realised i am not ready to date post divorce)

IodineQueen
it goes well you will know ! no action needed

if it doesn’t I’d do nothing to be honest
and if they message send a really nicely
worded no thanks but lovely to meet you

hotnakedgelato

i did the freedom programme
its actually one of the best courses I ever did

and one bit I loved was when they said you can’t blame abusive behaviour on mental health

they used BPD as an example which is hilarious and back then I diagnosed my ex with it !
how I laughed 🙄

then I was like nah , he just abusive . And maybe he has other issues but so do I and I don’t abuse

@Thisisworsethananticpated I also did this, and it gave me the same insight! So valuable.

hotnakedgelato

wow did you ? I got sent on it (long sad story )
did you do face to face or online
I was lucky enough to do it pre covid

ifs ducking amazing actually

@Thisisworsethananticpated yes, but only online. I am not sure whether I finished it, come to think of it