Husband and I having different views on him not working

[coffy11]

I've been going over this in my head for so long and would really love to get some perspective from others in this situation.

So some background, dh was a SAHD for a number of years when the kids were little and never had a career as such. I've always been the breadwinner and love working. Dh has had various casual jobs here and there but quits when it gets hard. He has anxiety and issues with his knees, back etc so the type of jobs he's done in the past have been cleaning type jobs which he can't really do anymore because of his health issues.

We haven't really talked about it but he has pretty much decided that he is "semi retiring" and won't really look for work because as he says he's not qualified to do anything and nobody would want him.

The problem is that while I understand his health/anxiety concerns it's not fair that he gets to decide that without me agreeing. I have so much resentment that's built up over the years and i feel like something has to give. It's like I've lost respect for him, I'm always annoyed with him and then he's annoyed that I'm annoyed. I just want him to want to contribute financially, even if he went out looking for work one day a week it would make all the difference. I just feel like I'm stuck and have no idea what to do. I just want to stop being angry with him all the time.

Any advice?

I disagree with any SAHP for a long time.
I think it’s lovely if you can financially do it but it really impacts your confidence and makes finding a job much more difficult.

Now your kids are older he needs to have something for himself instead of just being a ‘parent’ and that usually comes from working.

I would encourage him to work for his own good.
This is going to be very hard for him though and I definitely wouldn’t push for FT. He could do just a few hours a week or even volunteer so he can gain some experience and confidence.
It needs to be something not physically or mentally demanding.
Does he have any hobbies?

When he is working you will have to step up and do more cooking and cleaning etc.

Plenty of women do this - refuse to start working after their ‘job’ of raising the kids is done. MN is usually pretty supportive of that in my experience.

There was a thread not that long ago about women who don’t work even though their children have left home.

Some of them justified it by saying their job was to cook and clean etc but most had cleaners and MNers were still very supportive.

If he has health issues can get pip? That might help ?

I feel a bit bad for him if he’s tried work and had to quit for health reasons and is doing all the jobs round the house ? He doesn’t sound lazy

@Sidisawetlettuce We see all too often on this site that to the partner then gets bored with them, leaves them, and they are they’re posting I have not worked in 30 years

This thread is sort of mind-boggling in its hypocrisy.
OP, in the gender-switched versions of this thread, the woman is generally advised to remind the man involved that marriage means a splitting of assets and potential spousal maintenance.
You should probably consider the financial impact on yourself before you start making threats.

@WonderfulYou

Plenty of women do this - refuse to start working after their ‘job’ of raising the kids is done. MN is usually pretty supportive of that in my experience.

There was a thread not that long ago about women who don’t work even though their children have left home.

Some of them justified it by saying their job was to cook and clean etc but most had cleaners and MNers were still very supportive.

MN is a bubble though. Thinking back to my teenage and young adult years, I don't think I knew a single person whose mum didn't work. Now I'm in my 30s and know a few people with babies and young children, I can't think of any SAHMs. I know a few people where both parents have cut or condensed their hours to share parenting equally. I've literally only ever met one person whose mum stayed at home until adulthood and he was an archetypal posho. He said his mum was "thinking about working again now he was in his 20s and ready to leave home" and I burst out laughing because I thought he was joking.

I think the key thing here is that you aren't happy supporting him to do nothing for the next 15 years. It's fine if both parties agree, but if one doesn't then a compromise has to be reached - it would be unfair to ask him to go back full time, but asking him to get a part time job to help out isn't unreasonable.

I think there is a lot of resentment there that's accumulated over the years because of his anxiety and the way he overreacts to things that the kids say and the arguments he causes with them so maybe this retirement issue alone isn't a big thing on it's own but rather it's the thing that's broken me?

I think this is the key point. Because if he's been a SAHD for many years, and has some physical and mental health issues, I really can't blame him for not wanting to take on a minimum wage, low skill job when you don't need the money and he IS still contributing to the household by taking on all the household tasks (although I agree there should be an ongoing discussion between you about it).

However, reading between the lines, it sounds like his mental health and anxiety issues are not being dealt with by him, and as a result, the rest of you are having to accommodate them in ways that are not ideal. And you are, naturally, resentful of that. I would address THAT issue first myself. Tell hi he doesn't have to work if he a) continues to do 99% of all household stuff and b) gets help for his mental health.

If you are in UK he will need 35 years of National Insurance contributions to claim a full state pension in his own name. Suggest you both login individually via www.gov.uk & check the Government gateway for your National Insurance & state pension forecast.

Most people don't retire at 50, because they can't afford it & the average life expectancy before covid was mid 80s

@TedMullins do you have kids?

This situation - one partner works, the other is sahp, then as the kids age the working partner has high income and the sahp has much less to do but has become unemployable except for crap jobs or looooong and expensive retraining - is quite common.

Recognise that if he is doing more housework and family admin than you, your DP is already making a financial contribution. If he was just lying around while you paid for a chef, cleaner, laundrette, and driver, that’d be different, but it doesn’t sound like he is.

Recognise also that your career was in part built on his contribution at home. If you’d been doing your 50% of the childcare, cooking, and housework, throughout all the toddler night wakings and school holidays, you would never have achieved the income you have now: your contributions and performance st work would have been much lower. It is family income, achieved by both of you. It is not just yours. You are taking all the credit for your current income but that isn’t fair.

His self-esteem will be very low, he may even be depressed, and this does not lend itself to enthusiastic job-hunting.

Remember also that you should have both discussed this more clearly when he became a sahp.

I suggest the first step is marriage counselling to help you recognise the contribution he is making now, and to focus his mind on what he wants from the future.

I do think it’s sad that your income is now so high that it can afford to support all of you, but you want him to take menial jobs like cleaning. I don’t believe that if he got a job you would suddenly start doing 50% of all the housework, and I don’t think him being a cleaner or whatever would cause you to respect him more.

The real problem here - and again its very common - is that you’ve grown apart. You travel around meeting people and feeling important and mixing with high-earning men while you DH stays at home doing the same old drudgery, and you simply don’t have much in common. Work on that. Do some of the drudgery and let your DP find a passion of his own, which may or may not be paid, and you’ll have more in common.

But to expect a sahp in his mid fifties to take on menial jobs when the family doesn’t need the money, in order to earn your respect, is not cool. Mid fifties is not an unusual retirement age and was standard for my parents generation, some pensions still start at 55.

No, I don’t have or want kids. But a non working partner with older teenage/adult children is in pretty much the same situation as a childfree couple if one didn’t work. There’s no need for them to be a housewife/husband, or for the working partner to opt out of all household tasks and life admin. It’s a power imbalance and is bound to lead to resentment. I disagree that mid 50s is a common retirement age! Maybe 20 years ago, but not these days. The 50+ year olds I know (and I do know several through hobbies etc) are absolutely still working. I don’t think it’s unreasonable to expect someone of that age to get back into work at all. It’s not just about money, it’s about identity and purpose. And the world would stop turning if nobody did “menial” jobs - the snobby attitude towards them is horrible.

If the partner is still running the house and the money is not needed then I am not sure what benefit there would be to his getting a poorly paid job, especially if he has physical limitations and it means he could do less around the house.

The benefit would be to his marriage and his wife’s mental health because she could stop feeling like she was being taken advantage of. It could help improve his own mental health because it would mean he’s contributing something to his home and providing something for himself and meeting other people which will contribute to self esteem. It would give him pension contributions. There are lots of benefits, compared to there being no benefit to him being at home except to his own laziness.

There is very little that needs to be done to run a house when all the occupants are out working and the children are old enough to fend for themselves. Houses do not need someone in them at all times ‘running’ them.

@sweetkitty

I spent 11 years as a SAHM then went back to uni and retrained and am now doing a job I love. DH has a very good job and could support us financially but my salary has meant we are very comfortable, we are paying off the mortgage early, we can afford luxuries, we don’t have to worry about money.

I find all this talk about low paid jobs demeaning, someone has to do them, many people are working in minimum wage jobs and it doesn’t make them any less worthy.

Personally I think it would be good for the OPs DH to find a PT job out the house even 2-3 days a week for himself.

Nothing wrong with low paid jobs. Many women however are happy to give one up in favour of staying home, but act like it’s a big sacrifice enabling their husband to ‘further his career’. When nothing stops them from walking back into said low paid job, a few years later. Unlike a professional career which could be set back a few years by staying home.

Of course this isn’t always true. There are women forced to stay home because their job, while competitive doesn’t cover childcare, their ‘D’H is absolutely useless, disability etc etc but a fair few who choose it because it suits them. We won’t know which is the norm because MN is biased anyway. You’d hardly see happy women creating threads about it

Ah wait.. was the snobbishness related to dismissing him getting a low paid job? M’ignore me…

Also to add I don’t think people should be giving up ang jobs, even if low paid. Working has a lot of benefits. And CC should be split between both

@TedMullins

No, I don’t have or want kids. But a non working partner with older teenage/adult children is in pretty much the same situation as a childfree couple if one didn’t work. There’s no need for them to be a housewife/husband, or for the working partner to opt out of all household tasks and life admin. It’s a power imbalance and is bound to lead to resentment. I disagree that mid 50s is a common retirement age! Maybe 20 years ago, but not these days. The 50+ year olds I know (and I do know several through hobbies etc) are absolutely still working. I don’t think it’s unreasonable to expect someone of that age to get back into work at all. It’s not just about money, it’s about identity and purpose. And the world would stop turning if nobody did “menial” jobs - the snobby attitude towards them is horrible.

I found what you said about not respecting women who don’t work once their kids start school very unpleasant.

I left something semi “high flying” (media) when I had kids and am currently looking into going back when my youngest is 3, but it’s not a walk in the park. I’m hoping to retrain as an early years teacher, with the hope of finding a term time job so I can be home in the summer holidays etc. I don’t judge anyone who has different priorities, but I don’t think wanting to do more of the childcare myself makes me unworthy of respect.

I agree on older teens and adult kids, but the idea that once little kids start school being at home is the same as if you didn’t have kids is nonsense. Of course, by the time kids get to that age many stay at home parents have been out of work so long the prospect of finding work is quite daunting.

I’m not surprised you don’t have kids, because I think you lack empathy and understanding of the reality of the situation, and the trade offs all parents make.

You need a plan that works for both of you. I’d start by seeing a financial planner to look at what your retirement will look like. A professional opinion on your options could make a difference to his attitude. I would expect a professional to look at a lot of different options. This would include you becoming I’ll yourself and unable to work.

It also feels like he is being a bit disingenuous. You say he wants to semi retire but he is not actually working at all and has no plans to. Is this an image thing?? What would he say if you asked him to describe what semi retired actually means.

I think 2-3 days in a job with low stress would be a good thing for his confidence and self esteem. Yes these kinds of jobs are often not that well paid but that can be the trade off for low stress which sounds like it would suit him. He could try a temp agency which would give him sone variety and the chance to work out what direction he would like to go in.

How are all of these people who don't work, male or female, funding their retirements?

He can’t just decide, he needs to discuss it with you. What about the costs of your children going go university? What about his pension? What about you cutting down your hours and / or retiring earlier?

I’m not being sexist, if roles were reversed then l would say exactly the same thing. I get his confidence might be dented but he can’t just duck out of the last 15 years or so of his working life because he doesn’t feel like it. Meanwhile you pick up the tab for everything. He’s being unreasonable and selfish

@BingBangB0ng that's not quite what I said though – I said having older teenage or adult children who don't need parenting is akin to being childfree in that there are no longer any barriers to working full time. You might find it unpleasant but that doesn't change the fact that I don't respect anyone whose children are over 16 and isn't working in the absence of health issues or extenuating circumstances. But I don't respect men (or women, but it's usually men) who opt out of every bit of parenting, life admin, chores and housework on account of having an SAHP at home either.

How will he/you fund actual retirement?

@OctopusSay

I usually don't like it when people respond "if it were a woman..."

But can you imagine a woman who'd been SAHM and as a result has no workplace skills, who additionally has some health problems that cause pain, being persuaded to go out and do menial work to make her DH feel better, when they don't need the money?

Exactly. I think op is a bit of a knob to be honest. It's suited her this whole time for him to do this, now she's jealous of it basically, but won't admit that. Her husband has health issues, but still wants him to work. If she was a man, she'd be getting called all sorts of names. This is probably just a test to prove that the women on here are actually sexist.

Loads of women have done this in the past and still do this. I know of a few that have done this.

Is he a passive type?

Has he tried to work on his 'knee', 'back' and anxiety issues?

Has he just shrugged and accepted that this is his life?

Has he made any kind of effort to improve how he deals with your children?

Is this 'who he is'?

If that's the case, I understand your frustration.

However, he clearly isn't going to change in any way as you're his shield against the real world.

This must be so frustrating OP.

I'm angry on your behalf.