How can I take it back?

[user12879982]

I've done a pretty awful thing.

DP and I have been together for four years, both mid 30s, we don't live together but I spend 95% of my time at his place since covid. A year ago he lost his dad in a short battle with cancer, they had a difficult relationship and he has been having therapy about it since as never really felt very loved by his parents who have both passed in recent years.

Generally we have a great relationship, lots of fun, love and laughter. We spent a Sunday a few weeks ago out with friends and took the Monday off work as we knew there would be lots of alcohol involved.

On our way home we had a disagreement and neither of us can remember what it was over, it was very petty but when we got in he was laughing at me during the argument, it's how he try's to get to me when we argue.

I stormed off and said 'at least my dad loves me'. I'm horrified by these words, disgusted I ever said them and immediately regretted it and hugged him while he cried saying I didn't mean it at all. We woke up the next day, discussed it and I again apologised profusely. We've spent the last few weeks carrying on as normal and it hasn't come up since.

Tonight he went for dinner with a friend and told his friend what I'd said, no surprise his friend was disgusted. He's come home and said he needs space from me and the words have cut him deeply and he doesn't know how he feels. I've gone to my house and he has said he will see me on Thursday.

I'm normally a loving, kind, caring and compassionate person and feel this was completely out of character of me. In fact he comments on how nice everyone says I am including himself.

Anything anyone can suggest for me to rectify this? I really didn't mean what I said and stupidly picked the one thing I knew would get to him.

It's an easy thing to do @gannett. I'm not sure why you're making out it's odd.

'Oh yes, I've know Helen for years. We had a bit of a fling before she met Dave but it was no big deal.'

Does he only laugh at you when he's drunk @user12879982?

@oliviastwisted

I think you know this OP but this is a Will Smith/Chris Rock situation. Nobody has clean hands in it but you were the Will Smith - the response was disproportionate and deeply wounding I think if there is enough love and trust built up between you, the relationship might survive but there are problems there that need sorting. His provoking you, your deeply wounding reaction to that provocation. But people do make mistakes all the time, relationships do recover from breaches of trust. Both of you need time and need to work on your own issues.

I like this analogy, only problem being I thought Will Smith was a total idiot, which is me!

Thanks for your words and taking the time to give me another perspective x

@Clymene yes only ever when he's drunk, but it does feel he likes an argument more when he's drunk so these conversations are more frequently where he's drunk as opposed to sober

I actually totally get the ex thing & not knowing about it, although it does sound a bit like someone might feel at the start of a relationship, before trust has built. I know I felt a bit like that with this person who my dh had slept with some while before we were together.
The relationship was young though & I didn't know if I could completely trust him.
I would think though after 4 years you'd development some trust with him & know that it wouldn't have been an issue as it would've been a long time ago?

I don't have anything to add about the comment you made except maybe you learned something new about yourself?
And I think you may have trust issues - sorry I don't want to presume that but don't mean to sound unkind

How much work have either of you done in coming to terms with your damaged childhoods? I wonder whether he's replaying behaviours he learned as a child just as much as you are.

Some people get a kick out of drunken rows and/or they are deliberately sabotaging their relationship.

Whatever is behind it, I think you both need to have some very honest conversations, and individual and couples therapy otherwise I suspect you're going to find yourselves back here again. If he won't take any responsibility for accepting the way that he behaves in picking drunken rows and laughing at your reaction is not acceptable, I'm not sure how you'll move forward.

Reading some of OP's updates I'm a bit sceptical that their relationship was such a bed of roses before and this was so anomalous.

OP is describing repeated patterns of arguments they have, and repeated poor behaviour while disagreeing. In a healthy relationship after only four years, arguments shouldn't be frequent enough for these patterns to show.

@Dundonian

I think his habit of laughing at you to upset you, or provoke a reaction, is pretty despicable. Maybe he needs to accept some responsibility for the argument.

This. It’s utterly unbearable for me to have my emotions invalidated and belittled like that. I would have said something I regretted too.

There’s a lot of flagellation of you here, and while what you said was very hurtful and mean, you’ve acknowledged that and apologised profusely. But you were upset and embarrassed and he laughed at you and called you crazy? And that’s just…..ok?! That’s very classic bullying - to belittle and invalidate a person’s feelings, deliberately and persistently goad them into a disproportionate response (to the original issue) and then claim to be a victim of that response. It’s also very male to belittle a woman’s emotions like that, while expecting his own to be positively revered. I’d suggest some help. Set up some couple’s counselling to figure out better ways to disagree and find compromises and to acknowledge there is responsibility on both sides here. You’ve accepted yours, but this will keep happening to a greater or lesser degree if he doesn’t acknowledge his.

I don’t think socialising with an ex is that big a deal, but yes it should have been mentioned and I can appreciate it would come as a shock. I expect as you process it the shock it will subside, and I think perhaps you do have it a bit out of proportion, but not to ‘crazy’ levels. The bigger issue is him laughing at your emotions, while demanding an enhanced level of respect for his. I imagine you felt humiliated, powerless and invisible. Of course you lashed out. It’s not ok, but it’s understandable. Bet he didn’t tell his mate all of it. Women are always expected to take responsibility for men’s feelings AND to fix them in a relationship, and that’s not actually ok. While lashing out is not ok, neither is laughing at big feelings.

What I don't understand is why he appeared to have come to terms with or forgave what you said in an argument, until his friend gave his opinion.

@dworky

What I don't understand is why he appeared to have come to terms with or forgave what you said in an argument, until his friend gave his opinion.

I think thr word “appeared” is key here. Clearly he had not, which is why he felt the need to discuss it with his friend. If he had forgiven and accepted he’d not have done so.

I don't find it difficult to understand why you were upset in the first place.

What you said, as you have admitted, was totally out of line.

DH's family can be like this - they say things and act in ways that are totally disproportionate. DH had to seek extensive therapy prior to us getting married to help him manage his responses. And overall, it's a lot better.

I get on well with his mum but truthfully I have never completely forgiven her for some of the things she said to DH in an argument 10 years ago and I will never fully trust her because of what she said. What's interesting however is that DH doesn't even REMEMBER the argument.

I think people like you or DH"s family can say and do unacceptable things, and fully accept (in retrospect) that they're awful, but you say them because you have the ability to get over them. Other people (like me) not so much. DH has never said anything as cruel to me as what you said to him but I can think of 2 major incidents that almost destroyed our relationship and that took a lot of time for me to get over. In both cases, DH was respectful of my need to take some time.

If you're lucky, your DP will be like me. But that level of cruelty can never be repeated. How you ensure it doesn't I don't know, but you need to be 100% confident that when you tell him you won't do it, that you won't.

@dworky

What I don't understand is why he appeared to have come to terms with or forgave what you said in an argument, until his friend gave his opinion.

Sometimes we can be so influenced by close relationship that we can't view things objectively. It was such a dreadful thing to hear from someone who supposedly loves you and should have your back that the friend (quite rightly) would have an opinion on this - they want to protect their friend.

To reiterate, I have no jealousy towards the other woman, she is my friend and will continue to be. At the time, I was bothered by my partners deceit and secrecy and yes whilst I never explicitly asked if he'd slept with his friend I don't plan to do that with every female I meet in his company and I would have expected some common decency for him to tell me in the early stages of our relationship and my friendship with this woman. I hold no ill feeling to her, it was never her place to tell me.

A PP mentioned that trust is probably very important to me due to my past, and that's absolutely correct. Concealing the truth is the same as lying in my eyes, trust is of paramount importance to me and I have very quickly exited previous relationships where there has been no trust. I trust DP, or at least I definitely did, but this deceit felt like it knocked me for six, not least when I was then laughed at for expressing my upset. I felt like my partner didn't have my back, loyalty being of importance to me too.

I know I have some trauma to deal with, at 16 I began medicating in my bedroom daily and it changed my whole mindset, I became a calmer, nicer person and I can feel myself slowly slipping back to that old me. I've booked some therapy in for this evening, a virtual call and will see how I get on. I know this is a marathon not a sprint.

DP has messaged this morning to say good mornings and love yous and I've not readdressed the issues but have said we can chat face to face later this week.

Thank you everyone for your words, even the posts that were harder to read, your opinions and perspectives have given me so much to think about

It's just not something that comes up naturally! If you really want to know you ask your partner "so, did you and her have something going on in the past" and they shouldn't lie. But it's not info you volunteer when it isn't requested.

Well I think it would be a bit odd to ask, "Have you slept with her?" everytime you're introduced to someone... I certainly wopulent want to be asked.

But if I was introducing my boyfriend to a friend and their partner and was expecting us to socialise regularly. I'd drop it in.

"You'll really like them. I've not known her for long but she's really nice. He and I have known each other since school. We had a bit of a thing once but that's all in the past."

Seems reasonable to me.

*wouldn't.

But wopulent - what a great word!

We're going to meet some of my friends, by the way I fucked one of them 10 years ago"?
"Meet my friend X, by the way we fucked 10 years ago"?
"Oh by the way, that friend you met today, we fucked 10 years ago

Don't be dense, you call it a fling

ooouch that one hurt but I deserve it all right now

It wasn't meant to hurt - unlike the words you said to win your argument. But some people are unpleasant when drunk, whereas some are just a soppier, more affectionate kind of person. For whatever reason, and having an alcoholic, abusive mother is a pretty big one at that, the aspect of your personality that comes out when you drink is not one you want.

The solution to that is simple. Don't drink again. And if you are thinking 'but I want to drink, it's his fault for laughing at me, I'd never have said it when drunk if he hadn't made me, I want to be able to have a drink' etc, you do also need to consider who else in your life didn't want to stop drinking despite the negative consequences it had on her and her child. She had to start somewhere - and that might have been with using alcohol to either free the beast or to try and sedate it.

I think you've had a ridiculously hard time here, it's almost sadly self sabotaging how you're cowering and practically inviting the roasting - good grief, you haven't murdered anyone.

Yes but at the moment on mn it's like men can do no wrong and as soon as a woman retaliated SHE is the one in the wrong, or the abuser. It's laughable.

at 16 I began medicating in my bedroom daily and it changed my whole mindset

Whatever you were on, OP, sounds fun 🤣

Good luck!

@Dundonian

I think his habit of laughing at you to upset you, or provoke a reaction, is pretty despicable. Maybe he needs to accept some responsibility for the argument.

I agree with this. No one deserves to be laughed at and your dp should not use it as a ploy to shut down an argument. What you said was awful, but it sounds as though you were triggered by his mocking and you went for his most sensitive point. You both need to talk this through with each other.

@Thatsplentyjack

I think you've had a ridiculously hard time here, it's almost sadly self sabotaging how you're cowering and practically inviting the roasting - good grief, you haven't murdered anyone.

Yes but at the moment on mn it's like men can do no wrong and as soon as a woman retaliated SHE is the one in the wrong, or the abuser. It's laughable.

I don’t quite agree, I think if the genders were reversed and a woman posting saying this is what he said and did because I didn’t tell him I slept with someone years ago and because I laughed in his face during the argument, she’d be told to ltb. No doubt about it.

But some posters are doing everything they can to justify it, and make it his fault. Purely due to the genders invovled.

This man is grieving for his father, who only died a year ago, and in therapy due to the relationship. He cried for gods sake. And this all started because the op got upset because she felt she had a right to know he slept with this woman eight years ago. Four years before they even met. She didn’t have a right to know . It was private between them and nothing to do with her at all. And if the genders were reversed and this was a woman saying her boyfriend had demanded to know who she slept with all those years ago then there would be nothing short of outrage.

If we all dig deeply, we have all said and done things we regret in the heat of the moment and under the influence

Its not who you are are. Alcohol can sometimes have an awful effect if you're not feeling right

If your relationship os strong, then you will overcome this set back

Dont beat yourself up. You clearly feel wretched and i hope you can get back on track

I don’t quite agree, I think if the genders were reversed and a woman posting saying this is what he said and did because I didn’t tell him I slept with someone years ago and because I laughed in his face during the argument, she’d be told to ltb. No doubt about it.

What? Even if the woman was up in the man's face roaring (actual words from the OP) with laughter at his upset? ....I don't think so.

He cried for gods sake

Abusive people can cry. Infact it's an excellent way to make themselves look and feel like the victim.

@Ricksteinsfishwife I haven't demanded a list of all the women he has slept with. I expected to know about this one woman because he's put me in social situations with her over 100 times in the past four years, including holidays. You're making this out to be a jealous rage which is you read my previous post it was not at all about jealousy or needing to know who he slept with.

It's about the lack of loyalty, honesty and trust of my partner and him being deceitful, concealing the truth.

Taking the words I said about his dad out of the equation, I don't for one moment regret being upset and hurt by this betrayal. I do however regret my choice of words.

I’ve been thinking about your post since last night OP. My dad died a few yrs back and I have (different) complicated emotions relating to him. I’ve been thinking what I would do if my DP said similar to me.

I’d be distraught and deeply wounded. I’d talk to my close friend about it. She would sympathise and we’d plot to bury him under the patio. Having vented my spleen to her, providing he was deeply remorseful and it was a one-off I think I could get past it.

I would also think about my own behaviour and whether I was without blame. And if I had been deliberately trying to wind DP up by scornfully laughing at him, knowing I was intentionally hurting his feelings I think I’d have to acccept that I wasn’t blameless.

I’m quite analytical though and I do tend to think about my own behaviour as well as the other person’s ( by way of explanation, I’m autistic and if I don’t consciously think about things from both sides, I can miss something obvious).

I would make it clear to DP that if he said anything like that again I wouldn’t be so forgiving. I’d also want to talk to him about where the comment came from and why he was so hurtful (which you’ve already addressed in your comments).

I would need a few days to process it and work through the emotions. The reaction of my DP would determine a lot. Genuine heartfelt apologies and an effort to be understanding about why I’m so upset would go a very long way.

Ultimately your DP can’t help how he feels. But he does need to look in the mirror too - he was pretty unpleasant (and yes of COURSE he should have mentioned the history!!!!) Maybe he buried some of his hurt at the time and talking to his friend just reignited that resentment. He genuinely might just need some time to work through things.

I know you feel like the bad guy and can’t say anything for fear of sounding like you’re making excuses - but I feel as if he’s getting away Scot-free. His behaviour was poor and now he’s also effectively kicked you out of your “home”.

Doesn’t sound though as if he’d be willing to acknowledge the part he’s played in all this, just wants to keep beating you for being cruel.

I hope you’re ok OP.