Partner not understanding why I can't tell my family about her

[Sasani]

Hi, first time poster. I really would like to have outside point of views.

My family is very religious and lives in A very small village in Pakistan. I have been with the woman of my life for 9 years but... I am also a woman! My family already is not happy that "my friend" is black but if they knew she is my partner they would never ever talk to me again. Lucky I am not in Pakistan because they would have killed me.

My partner's family is super cool and understanding. At first she was super she was super understanding too. I told my family we were roommates, but now we bought a house together, whenever my mom comes over she goes to her parents and I pretend I live alone..

I know it must be horrible for her. But I have no choice. She wants to move forward with our future. I will never tell my parents and siblings. My partner says she waited more than enough. She is OK with me not telling them but wants me to go home instead of my parents coming. She told me she will no longer leave the house. I find that very unfair. It's just a month now and then.

We want to get married, however last night we argued like crazy. Dilemma: Either I visit them or she leaves me.

What do you think. Sorry for any mistakes.

www.gov.uk/uk-family-visa/partner-spouse

Can I ask, when did you buy your house together?
Maybe previously it was a case of you were just renting together so she just kept the peace and moved out while your mother was there. Now though, you own a house TOGETHER!! A huge commitment and what she would’ve thought was a move in the right direction. She probably feels (and rightfully so) that she shouldn’t have to and won’t do it anymore.
If you bought your house years before Covid hit and you believe this issue has only come up since Covid then maybe it was the reality check she needed. She got you all to herself for 2 years. No upheaval of her life several times a year for a month at a time.

You must also look at it as she loves you and wants you as you are, the person your family loves and are proud of is a fictional person. You have to hide you really are from them each time you speak with or see them. You can’t expect her to hide any longer.

You are a lesbian and you cannot change that.
It's also at serious odds with the cultural beliefs of your background. That also, you cannot change.

Any hiding of your western life was always going to be a temporary fix, wasn't it? You didn't think you could live your entire life and not at some point be tricked into returning home and forced into an arranged marriage if you either stay "single" or come out as a lesbian, at best, or your life at risk at worst. Either way your relationship with your mother was always on a timer given she would either disown you or cause you harm.

I really feel for you. You want to keep the status quo because it means you don't have to face that stark future where you are hurting. But your girlfriend is hurting too - she cannot keep pretending forever, nor should she. Even if she gives in now, that's only until the next visit and the next - and she will finally walk away, and you'll be leaving yourself still at risk of honour reprisals, still at risk of an arranged marriage, still hiding, but also doing all that on your own.

You are angry that she has a supportive, inclusive family but your anger is misdirected at her when it should be anger at your family /your culture that expel you just for being who you are. She didn't cause this. Neither did you but it stems from your culture, so the onus is on you to choose between her or your mother.

You need to face the fact that you have chosen a life your parents and family will not accept. You cannot treat your partner like this, if it was me I’d have left you cowering in your closet and moved on with my life.

What do you see as the end game here? Will you get married to please your parents and have DP as your hidden side piece? Grow up.

OP, you are choosing your family over your partner. In this situation, however unfair or difficult it may be, you have to choose her or them. And what they want for you and how they will punish you for not doing what they want, shows that you should be choosing your partner.

I agree with her suggestion. You should move away with her and cut all contact with your family. Marry your partner, take her name (which I presume your family doesn't know) and live your life completely separately from them.

I would also give your partner's family your passport(s) to look after permanently, so that if any (male) relatives came to visit, they couldn't try to force you back to Pakistan to have you marry a man.

I understand the difficulties, but you understand racism and homophobia and you must see that your family's stance means that you can never live the life you want. Your partner could quitely hide away for years but there will still come a time when you say your family will try to force you to marry a man, and that your life will be in danger if you refuse, so what do you have to lose in cutting contact with them, really?

I would not return to Pakistan under any circumstances and as I said, I would give your passports to your partner's family for your own safety, too.

As harsh as it may sound, your family cares more about appearances and the opinions of others than your own happiness and wellbeing. Their love for you isn't strong enough to accept you as you are. Your partner's is. You should keep telling yourself that and feel no guilt about cutting off your family.

This is an awful situation for you OP. And shows just how far the world has yet to progress.

Sadly it seems like you are being forced into a position of either going no contact with your family to pursue your happiness, or you're going to need to go to them to visit.

This is no doubt causing huge strain on your parter. I think she sounds amazing and understanding up to now. And after 9 years I can't blame her for saying you should go visit them instead of turfing her out every time they visit.

What matters the most is your happiness. You should be able to be the person you are. And your love with your partner should be celebrated, not hidden.

Would you consider cutting contact with your family over this?

[quote oviraptor21]www.gov.uk/uk-family-visa/partner-spouse[/quote]
Exactly.

You have one life in this world. You either live the life your parents want for you and be unhappy or take charge of your own destiny and take the fallout.

I get the family culture. But your parents live abroad and won't be around forever sadly. It's scary to tell them something like this and it's hard but you have to brave.
Nothing good is ever easy.

From her side of things she's had enough. This is not the life she wants to continue. So either you let her go as it's not fair to her also. It's not all about you and your circumstances. This is her one life too. And love alone is not enough.

Thanks everyone. So I made a decision, after talking to my partner for hours. Yes, I agree she is very understanding. Because the lesbian "thing" was for me too much to tell my mother, I told her I lived with a black man. SHE GOT SO UPSET AND ANGRY. Told me things like: Come back home to marry a Pakistani man; You became a whore; Wait until your dad/brothers/uncle find out.

Then suddenly after her despicable lecture, she changed her attitude. Asking me what "his" job is, if "he" is nice to me. I said yes I want to marry "him". She asked if I can bring "him" to visit them. I have never heard my mother talk like that. I am really shocked, if she talks like this about a man, me telling her about loving a woman would be so much worst.

I hope this event confirms to you that you have to choose between your fiancee and your family. It's sad, but they are the worst kind of bigots. In your position I would cut them off forever.

i think that was a risk thing to do.
it may not conform, in fact it definitely does not conform with your family's idea of respectable behaviour.
the males may come looking for you to avenge you insulting their honour.
i think you need to move away.
have you told your partner what you told your mother.
your partner is also in potential danger.
i'm sorry, i do sympathise, but i'm beginning to agree with the people who say your partner would be better off without you.
you sound rather immature in your outlook. like when you resent that she could still be in touch with her family, have their support. how would it benefit you if she did not have that support. you sound childish, dog in a manger attitude. how can that be loving. instead of celebrating their support, and being grateful for it, to both of you, you'd rather she was deprived of it, just so that she does not have some benefit that you do not have.
as they say on MN, you really need to give your head a wobble.
now your mother knows where you both live, so your brothers etc will know. the house you both own. you have put your partner in real danger. you must warn her. maybe seek police advice too.

What are you going to do now though that she wants to meet "him"?

That was a pretty risky strategy OP. Now, if you ever do decide to tell them about your GF, they’ll know you lied.

@sasani I can't see you getting much support with your update - and I think its pretty brave of you to come back and update so kudos.

The only person you need to answer to is your partner and if this is what you've agreed between you then that's all that matters.

I really wish you both the best

OP, I am not sure that you have really done yourself any favours with this lie. And I reckon you are naive to think and have potentially placed your partner at risk, now your family suspect that you live with a guy and might arrange for an 'intervention'. On the other hand, in such a racist patriarchal society, the idea of a black man with an Asian woman could be seen a lot worse, than a black woman. I am not sure that your mother really came around, rather than fishing for information. You have only ripped the plaster half off. Since you started the process, you really should see it through and at least, tell her the full truth. You aren't really in a better place in the moment.

If you are going to be vilified for a black man, then you might as well tell the truth. It can’t be much worse than it is already.

It’s a very sad situation but it’s only going to get worse for you as time progresses. Even if your partner were to agree to move out every time your mother visits this isn’t sustainable in the long term. It’s not sustainable now. But with age you would have more pressure put on you to marry within your culture and to marry a man.

You’ve made one step in stating you are seeing a black man. I agree that you might just as well rip that plaster off and now admit the truth.
What other choice do you actually have if you want to marry your partner? You either loose your partner or your family as the two aren’t compatible.

You have obviously decided to live a western life which isn’t on the same level as your family, you can’t change your sexuality so something has to “give”. Your partner is right in refusIng to keep the facade up of moving out constantly so you have the choice of meeting your mother in another country but it’s not going to stop the constant pressure of being married off to a suitable husband which is only going to increase as you get older.

In many ways it’s a blessing that you live where you do removed from your immediate family. But it’s at crunch time whereby for your own sanity you may have to remove yourself from their lives. At the end of the day you have your life ahead of you in a western culture and may have to make extremely difficult decisions about how you protect yourself happiness going forward.

Your mum asked to "bring him to visit", after saying "wait till your dad/brothers etc find out" Only you can know if it's a true olive branch or that they're planning to get rid and marry you up as soon as you land!
If you feel it's an olive branch then have a heart to heart and just tell her. Then it's out there. You'll feel relief and just deal with whatever consequences there are.
If it means they disown you then so be it. They are a different generation, have grained in views that won't change, and what "other people might think" can sadly be more important.
Be true to your self and live the life that makes you happy.

@NannyKrampus

OP, I am not sure that you have really done yourself any favours with this lie. And I reckon you are naive to think and have potentially placed your partner at risk, now your family suspect that you live with a guy and might arrange for an 'intervention'. On the other hand, in such a racist patriarchal society, the idea of a black man with an Asian woman could be seen a lot worse, than a black woman. I am not sure that your mother really came around, rather than fishing for information. You have only ripped the plaster half off. Since you started the process, you really should see it through and at least, tell her the full truth. You aren't really in a better place in the moment.

This

You previously said you were concerned for safety?

So OP that was risky. Do you now feel safe?

I know some families who would send make cousins and brothers to "visit". If you think this might happen then perhaps it would be worth you and your GF going to the police to tell them the situation. They may be able to flag your home/number so that if you ever called they'd know there's a serious risk. I'm not sure how it works in France but I'd be surprised with the recent attention to domestic violence if there wasn't some kind of similar system.

I'm sorry you're in this situation.

@Sasani

Thanks everyone. So I made a decision, after talking to my partner for hours. Yes, I agree she is very understanding. Because the lesbian "thing" was for me too much to tell my mother, I told her I lived with a black man. SHE GOT SO UPSET AND ANGRY. Told me things like: Come back home to marry a Pakistani man; You became a whore; Wait until your dad/brothers/uncle find out.

Then suddenly after her despicable lecture, she changed her attitude. Asking me what "his" job is, if "he" is nice to me. I said yes I want to marry "him". She asked if I can bring "him" to visit them. I have never heard my mother talk like that. I am really shocked, if she talks like this about a man, me telling her about loving a woman would be so much worst.

This scared the hell out of me. I’ve read too many stories where a woman’s family pretended to be ok with the situation in order to lure her back and kill her.

Come back home to marry a Pakistani man; You became a whore; Wait until your dad/brothers/uncle find out

With this, and remembering what you said about the risk to your life if the male family members found out, I'm still not sure why this is a woman you want to remain close to?

Have you also considered that the later "change in attitude" could be because she realised she wouldn't get you back over there using the original one?

You aren't even just putting yourself at risk.

You're putting your partner at risk if your family feel that way.

How you think you're the wronged party within your relationship with your partner is utterly baffling.

You're a victim of your family. Your partner is a victim of both you and your family.

Her family are waiting with open arms to accept and love and support you.

You are therefore giving up the chance to have a loving, caring, accepting family in order to maintain a relationship with people who would literally justify you having a forged marriage, being raped or being killed.

She is patient and kind. She's done this for so, so long. Stop punishing her for having a nice family. Cherish her. Cherish them.

Your family would rather you were raped or killed than have you live openly as a gay woman.

They deserve no place in your orbit.

Do not set foot in that country OP, I mean it. No way has she changed her tune overnight. Its a trap to get you over there where they have the power.

Don't open the door to them or anyone you don't know.

Do you have siblings/cousins who know?

I understand your dilemma - I have known gay men return to Saudi and get married to a suitable woman and made her life a living hell. He said that his family would kill him if they knew that he had been married to a man when he lived in the U.K. and he wasn’t exaggerating.

I’m not surprised she went nuts when she thought it was a black man. A relative (Pakistani) married a N African black man and her family were not happy at all (not as unhappy as when she had dated and then married the ‘wrong type’ of Muslim).

Yes they came round eventually - but I’ve heard that they know some very very unpleasant ‘traditional’ men who make their family’s lives miserable if they don’t act how they want them to. It can be violent and threatening - and these are in the U.K. uncles can also stick their oar in in the girls aren’t ‘behaving’.

So what to do - your mum may well try to accept all this, speak to friends who may convince her that ‘it’s ok, she will be married and then have kids, it’s not too bad…’ and then what? Hit her with the fact it’s a woman?

Personally - I’d tell her by phone, and say I love you mum, but this is my life. I know you will need to think about this…’ and just leave it. If possible tee up some relatives or friends of the family who can try to keep the peace and report back.

This is what I’d do. You have chosen the person you want to spend your life with and you don’t choose your family. Make peace with the life you have and maybe try to find a councillor who can listen to you and your very specific issues of culture and sexuality and help you make peace with the emotions you have (there will be guilt, oh there will be guilt!).

Tell your wife to - thank her for not freaking out at the prospect of the in-laws.

You are entitled to be happy. You deserve to choose your life.