DH's ENTJ behaviour - I'm losing my mind!

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Really struggling with my ENTJ husband (Myers Briggs personality type). He's always been very lawyer-like, contractual and efficiency-driven. I feel that this works well for him at work (he's not a lawyer btw) but it doesn't necessarily translate well for a marriage relationship.

I feel like I'm going mad because we talk around in circles and we don't seem to make much headway with our issues. Increasingly he has taken to looking up words in the dictionary to prove to me that I'm using them incorrectly when speaking to him (I'm not).

I also feel like I'm being gas-lit when I'm trying to explain how I feel about something and he then focuses in on one word that I've said. It then becomes all about that word to the extent that my original heart-felt sharing/request becomes completely invalid. I recently said that I found an incidence of his behaviour "very rude". He then went to great pains to explain why it was just "rude" and not "very rude", and that I was over inflating the issue by using the word "very". I just felt he needed to get the spirit of what I was saying. This "very" word focus completely derailed the original conversation and I was left totally unheard and confused. This happens regularly. He also rarely apologies for anything and if he does, everything needs to be dissected first.

He recently gave me a hand written note that looked frighteningly like a contract to explain that he was withdrawing his previous offer to help me with something work related unless I stop "weaponising" the fact that I think he may have some Aspergers traits. He doesn't think he does. I don't think I weaponised it, I was just expressing some concerns about how his behaviour is affecting our marriage. The note even had dots for me to sign my name at the bottom! I'm afraid to say that I tore it up in front of him in utter frustration.

We've been together for over 20 years and have teenage kids. This unempathetic behaviour is not new. Not sure if he has mild Aspergers, is a narc or is just being an ENTJ. For years I thought he was just being awkward but now I just think it's how his brain is wired. I want things to work, but I'm running out of energy and sanity.

Other than suggesting turning to drink, any tips/thoughts?

Totally agree on the masking, but being a gaslighting knob isn't a symptom of any mental condition. It's a symptom of being a knob. I just get so annoyed at all the attempts to figure out what's wrong with a partner as if knowing will make a miraculous difference, when all an OP generally needs to know is that their partner is being totally unreasonable and treating them badly. Why isn't important.

Idiot men annoy me. I'm off to find somewhere else to hang out. for you OP, perhaps you could scratch his eyes out with the thorns?!

Strangely the GP did chat to him for 7 minutes and told him he is unlikely to have Aspergers. I was surprised they came to that conclusion after such a short amount of time and without speaking to the person who has lived with him for over 20 years!

Yes, in some ways it doesn't matter what it is, Aspergers, narc or whatever. There's something going on definitely. I guess my rationale re: a diagnosis is that it might help me make sense of it all in my head and would help me process what's gone on for the last 20+ years.

I’m afraid I agree with @WildPoinsettia, OP, it’s arsehole behaviour and I personally couldn’t be arsed with it!
In your shoes, I’d ignore his nitpicking and do whatever you think is necessary chore-wise…if he doesn’t like it, he can do more himself.

Honestly, life’s too short for this.

Well if it helps at all, I spent 8 years living with a fully fledged narcissist (obviously diagnosed 3rd hand, no narc ever goes to a psychologist!), and now 15 years with DH.

There is a palpable difference, which I'm happy to discuss further if helpful. Just pm. Otherwise, I wish you well, however you choose to approach it.

Btw, lovely lovely paediatrician wasn't at all sure about sending child for assessment. Thought possibly one out of three areas may register as ASD1... assessment came back as ASD1/2/2! Child is fantastic as masking.

...and might help him moving forward. A few years ago he said he will have an official Asperger's assessment to get me off his back, but he said that I have to do all the leg work to sort it all out.

In the end he made the process all so difficult for me that I gave up searching for the right person/org to assess him. And GP wouldn't refer him as mentioned in my previous post.

^^ Yes!

Not sure if he has mild Aspergers, is a narc or is just being an ENTJ

Unless you're his psychologist, none of this matters. What matters is he won't change and he's insufferable. Sound the type who would argue in an empty room.

My one suggestion is using I statements more. Not 'it was very rude' but 'I felt really sad'. Unless he's a complete arse, and he might be, it's quite difficult to argue that you didn't feel something.

Back away from the Myers Briggs thing and read Lundy Bancroft's 'Why Does He Do That? Inside the Minds of Angry and Controlling Men'.

You are dealing with an utter twat.

Yes, you are being emotionally abused and along with that you are being psychologically abused - that's what gaslighting is.

Forget about figuring him out. The Bancroft book is all you need, along with therapy for yourself. Get a therapist specialising in treating the victims of emotional abuse.

His behaviour toward you is horrible and you're very unhappy. Even if he had some sort of diagnosis nothing's going to change unless he then willingly undertook appropriate treatment because he actively wants to change the dynamic and recognises your pain.
It seems clear that's never going to happen. He's so firmly inside his own head (and I was going to use a far less gentle term) that I don't think your distress even registers. It certainly doesn't give him the slightest pause.
You have every right to end this marriage and I hope your Church congregation would hopefully put any feelings of disappointment around a divorce aside and be there for you as supportive friends.

Ach, get off the Myers Briggs, in this instance it’s like using astrological sun signs.

How are things between you? Not good.
You two are locked into a poor spiral of commutation & in your own ways lashing out at each other. He’s pedantic, quibblesome, corrects you, diminishes you & does not accept what you say. You are hiding behind proto-Jungian archetypes or rather stereotypes, pondering his navel & looking for labels or reasons to explain away who he is & how you have both ended up this way.

Do you both want to stay married?
If so book in with Relate for you both to start work on your relationship.
Get on with that work, rather than deliberating.

If you have come to the point where you really don’t like him enough to try or, more importantly, your sense of self is being eroded, then go see a solicitor specialising in family law, to find out what your rights are if you decide to end the marriage.

Please do not allow the teachings & tenets of your faith about marriage to obscure the fact that you may be very unhappy in this relationship & your life is not as it could be.

I would absolutely seek a marriage counsellor. He sounds like an insufferable arse but I'm wondering whether he's got anxiety and/or depression? Happy people don't usually go at others like that...

Hope your situation improves soon OP.

@Lemonata - you're completely right, I just wasn't sure if this was the moment to stand on my soapbox. Thanks for doing it

I am ENTJ and am not an asshole.

Your first problem is that you’re trying to diagnose him with a disorder when there’s no real reason for it. You know his behaviours and he’s clearly managing to function appropriately at work. Secondly, MBTI is well documented as a load of shit, and no psychologist worth their salt has touched it for the last 30 years. It’s just business bollox and the fact that you’re actually trying to use it as a diagnosis of some sort - a purpose for which it was never even intended - highlights everything that is wrong with it. The simple fact of the matter is that he’s a bit of an arse and you don’t like it. He’s not going to change. You know that. No amount of armchair diagnoses, arguments, gaslighting etc. will change the fact that you just don’t get along. So, you live with it, or you leave him and try to find a happier life.

I don’t think approaching this by ref to Myers Briggs is very helpful. Fwiw, there’s no MB type that behaves in the way you describe (the “lawyerly” type is usually considered INTJ but they don’t act like that either and neither do actual lawyers). Trying to control how you act by making you sign a piece of paper is controlling and abusive, not lawyerly.

It’s possible that he may be autistic but again, the behaviour you’ve described isn’t typical of someone with autism and neither would it be justified by a diagnosis. If he did have a diagnosis, how would it change things?

I’d suggest thinking about what you want. Have you had any counselling, either together or apart? Does it feel as if there’s anything to save or is your focus on how to finish things?

Why don't you just leave the pillock?

Your situation sounds very similar to mine OP. Married 22 years, both Christians, children aged 19 and 17, autistic husband and quite controlling (but never intentionally so, he just always knows better about everything!!). We've had marriage counselling on and off for two years which has really helped (excellent counsellor). Not sure what the long term solution is though as still a very difficult situation to live in. Do feel free to DM me if you want to chat further.

He’s abusive - please think of your child’s future. What messages are you giving him/her.

Agree with the others - putting a name to it is not the answer:

1. His behavior is making you miserable.
2. Your children are old enough to understand.
3. Your church will accept the separation/divorce.
4. If your housekeeping is slovenly and your words are weapons against him, then he might be happier alone - so he can have everything just the way he likes it.

This isn't ENTJ -- it's someone being rude, proud and unkind.

It does sound like emotional abuse. Whether he has asd or a personality type or something else makes no difference though. I have an ex with Asperger’s diagnosis (no longer a diagnosis just asd it’s all under now) tons of lee way and let him hurt me when actually it was just him. What’s at the root doesn’t matter, can you put up with it for the rest of your life?

One thing I would say is that you say you are staying for the kids, but his cold unempathic managerial style of communication will not go down well with teenager whatsoever. In fact, it was around the teen years that I started thinking why doesn't my mum leave him, why does she put us all through this, as much as I blamed him for his ways? In the end, he left her and we all had a much happier time. Something to think about, your relationships with your kids (your own ones) may end up strained by these choices, having a happy more relaxed home most of the time with some contact with dad may suit them better. Don't assume all together is better for the kids. I am happy my parents got divorced and the negative atmosphere and vague fear was removed.