When the OW gets her man

[SaintVal]

This is following on from a thread where someone is having an affair with a married man who claims his marriage is on the rocks. The majority of the replies are telling the OP to wake up/grow up and to get a grip on reality and that ultimately, he will come up with an excuse as to why he can't leave his wife etc. However, what about the OW who does eventually get her man?

My exH left me 5 years ago. Unbeknown to me, he'd been having an affair with a woman at work and he dropped the bombshell the day after Boxing Day. I didn't even see it coming! Our DS had just turned 2. Anyway, he eventually moved in with OW and they've been together ever since. I assume they're happy as he seems to be and they're planning their holidays for next year. Anyway, it made me think about other affairs and their 'success rates' for want of a better phrase!

I think if I had originally been the OW, I would forever have a nagging doubt that I may also get cast aside just as the wife before me. Anyway, not sure what point I'm trying to make other than surely not all outcomes of infidelity meet the same cliched end?

What

TossaCointoYerWitcha

said, in spades.

aurynne

I agree with TossaCointoYerWitcha.

Being with someone who cheats on you but ultimately you have no unavoidable ties with that person (ongoing and long standing complex business relationships, young children where you in some way share parenting etc)

Not being tied to that person in those ways when you find out they have cheated on you
That MASSIVELY changes your options and how you can respond when you find out.

Leaving aside the idea that you yourself decide to leave them or not (which will be a decision in itself) assuming you do decide to leave them (and they do not leave you first) - the colour of your landscape is unrecognizable if you have no debt; no joint finances; no joint dependent children; no close knit family ties - compared with if you do not have.

Of course forgiveness is the "holy grail".

But your post leaves me cold.

I’ll be honest — I was cheated on. So was my mother. I haven’t rtft but I can say that my stepmother was a blessing in my life. That stings l for my mother, but she’s an adult — we’ve had open conversations about it and she’s moved on. Some things work out, however they start.

My own husband left me for someone else, and you know what? I would so much rather that my pain was in service to something real. It was horrible at the time, but I’m glad that it happened, however long it took me to get to this place. I don’t know whether he feels it was worth it, because I cut him off when I left him, but I will say that I’m better for the split. I often feel that there’s a lot of feeling here in mumsnet that doesn’t reflect the nuance of real life — and I say that as someone who has had the worst of it.

LondonCrone

Do you have any children (biological) - I hope you don't mind me asking.

Of all the ones I know who started as an affair, only one are still together (30 plus years) but I have heard he has cheated behind her back.

My ex was dumped within months after he left for OW. The heart bleeds for him

The majority seem to last about 8 to 12 years before the person gets itchy feet again.

I do know people who have gone on to have long relationships with people they have had affairs with.
I'm obviously not privy to the finer details. Perhaps they cheat on that person, perhaps they don't. I know I wouldn't really trust my partner if he had been sleeping with me while married to someone else. He'd have already proven to have low morals. (although so would I, so...)

@aurynne

People are complex, relationships and feelings are complex. The person who was left will always hope for "karma" and fantasise about how much happy he/she is and how much unhappier the cheater will be in their new relationship. The upheaval of being cheated on, especially when there are children involved, is massive and becomes a central part of the "cheated on" partner's life which will always hurt.

But the reality is, some couples are not well suited to one another, and sometimes a new person appears who is suited, and meets at the right/wrong time when one of the partners is in a low emotional time, or very relaxed because they never thought they would fall in love with someone else... and falling in love completely changes perspectives, changes plans and what the person thought he/she would ever do.

I only cheated once when I was a teenager with a boyfriend of 5 months, never as an adult ion long relationships. But I have seen enough cases to know that is it never as simple as "the OM/OW will never be happy, there will be a vacancy, they will never feel good"... I am sure many people want to believe that, but it's bullshit. Partners who never cheat can also go on to have shit relationships. OWs and OMs can go on to have an amazing relationship. Karma, no matter how much we like to believe in it, does not exist. Plenty of Nazi criminals died calmly in their bed in their Caribbean house surrounded by family and loved ones after committing the worst atrocities imaginable. Sometimes bad things happen to bad people, sometimes bad things happen to good people, and the same with good things.

What I do know is, keeping grudges and being bitter about anything, cheating included, and keeping thinking about revenge and karma years later, hoping that the other person lives a miserable life, only hurts the person who feels like that. The cheater may well be living the best years of their life, or the worst. This should not make a difference in yourself striving to live the best life you can and putting hurtful feelings behind. Turning the cheater into a "monster" may provide short-term relief and feelings of fairness... but long term it is just not useful. A person who cheated on you may still be a fantastic partner for someone else, a great son, a fantastic friend... Just not a good partner for YOU in particular circumstances, in a particular point of time. Accept this, move on, forgive, be happy.

I think what you are trying to say is life is not fair.

People who are betrayed are fully aware of that. Now the complexities that you speak of are multiple, the idea that you can move on and have a long second partnership is not a luxury available to everyone.

So my 35 year marriage was with someone who was not compatible with me? Well it was a long time to come to that conclusion.

Sometimes affairs are stupidity, my husband made the unfortunate mistake that I would forgive anything because of our longevity I presume, and my devotion in previous years. Why would I forgive, why do people think that because you do not forgive a husband for a betrayal that your anger overflows to others.

It doesn't, if anything it has opened my eyes to others in pain and made me more understanding and more able to help others in real life.

I am no longer tied to keeping one person happy, my family are now much closer to me, friends are sympathetic to what I have been through, I feel open and well free from influence, I have time for others.

My hatred of his actions has nothing to do with how I feel for others, but I do find your last paragraph incredibly niave and patronising.

Who are you to tell someone to forgive and forget, many people on this planet do not and rightly so, there are terrible atrocities that go on and to lump everyones experience in marriage to a set, move on be happy start again don't hold a grudge, don't look back is frankly rediculous.

@Onthedunes I have told no one to forgive and forget. I do recommend to forgive, not in the sense of "I forgive you for what you have done", but in the sense of "I will release you to be dealt with by life, and I will stop feeling bitter for the rest of my life and giving you space in my brain". Forgiveness as a way of becoming free, not a way of implying what the other person did was acceptable in any way. And no, never forget. Learn from it.

I see my post has triggered a number of people who have suffered. I am sorry for what you are going/have gone through. But yes, you got it right, the gist of my post is, life is not fair. You have no control of what another person does to you,or if someone chooses to betray you. But you do have the choice about how to react to it. So in answer to the OP, "when the OW gets her man"... you can be bitter and resentful, and want revenge. Or you can rage, suffer and eventually decide to move on and let the other person deal with the consequences of their choices, regardless whether the consequences are considered "karma" or not. Waiting for the OW/OM to be punished by life may end up being a very long, eventually worthless exercise, because the OW/OM may very well live happily ever after, no matter how unfair that is perceived to be.

This is just my opinion. If anyone disagrees that's fine. Don't take it as gospel or get angry, or try to figure out if my opinion is due of anything happening/not happening to me in my life. That's irrelevant. If my opinion affects you negatively, scroll on. No need to read.

It’s the children I feel sorry for (if any are involved obs) poor buggers have their world torn apart

@aurynne

For pp's it would be interesting how your views were formed. To be so forgiving.
For instance your general age or have you been betrayed by a partner.

You have every right to your view, what interests me is if these circumstances have affected you? Or have you no experience?

@KylieKoKo

I think that's it's nice to think that relationships that start as affairs as all doomed and mistrustful because it seems that it would be fair. Unfortunately life isn't fair. Some people go onto have much happier relationships with their affair partners while the devastated spouse is left to rebuild their life.

Yes, I'd agree with that. My father for one. He left my mother for a younger woman and went onto have three kids. He moved back to New York so I haven't seen them since covid but they're both very happy.

@aurynne actually I do agree with what you've said but you must acknowledge that most of us would have to work through a lot of dark emotions to get to that point of acceptance.

I do not wish my ex-husband well particularly (as his behaviour was disgusting) and I think the OW (also behaved horrendously) deserves everything she gets. However, on a day to day basis, I do not think about them - I'm now indifferent.

My responsibility is finding my own happiness. If they are happy or unhappy together, that has no bearing on me. What's done is done.

I’m another one who would love to know your age and experience of cheating @aurynne.

I can honestly say that until being married with two small children I brushed cheating off as just a rubbish partner who didn’t deserve me. Maybe shared some of your views. And that happened several times.

Then I got married, to a man I was entirely compatible with, who had CHOSEN me over all others. A man who made vows and commitments. A man who bought a house with me then went on to father my children. We were in a happy relationship, never argued, never even bickered, I may have been a little busy taking care of small children but they were HIS small children. He had an affair with a woman who pursued him relentlessly (apparently these women don’t exist on mumsnet just ‘victim other women).

I found out. No one should offer ‘advice’ to a betrayed wife and mother unless they know what it is like to hold sobbing children, your whole world in your arms and try to explain why daddy isn’t there to read them their bedtime stories.

This is why I always suggest moving to an infidelity related site like mumsnet to betrayed seeking advice because PTSD is real after infidelity and you need support from those who’ve walked in your shoes.

I reconciled. We’re very happy but my husband talks of pure selfishness and entitlement as his reason for cheating, because he wanted too, it makes him sick now to think about it. He works to be a better person daily.

Forgiveness is overrated, I accept it happened, I do not forgive.

Personal stories of friends or relatives who made it into happy relationships on the back of affairs are commonplace. But statistically HIGHLY UNLIKELY, as I have previously posted. We need to change the narrative around why most people cheat to be able to help amd support betrayed amd cheaters alike.

• site like surviving infidelity.

My exdh and ow are still together although they did split initially when she found out he had been living a double life with me/her.

He lied to us both for for 5 years.
When I confronted her she said he was very upset he'd lied to her too but wanted to work through it. I think she's bonkers, knowing what he's capable off.
I wonder how their relationship is, knowing he probably emotionally manipulate her like he did me. However I'm so much happier and with the type of man I should have been with years ago

@ILoveHuskies did your DB never try to maintain contact with his son when he left?

I can only speak from my own experience but I discovered my exh's affair 4 years ago and we separated. He stayed with her for 2 years - I think mostly to try and prove a point as he had caused so much damage then he ended it with her and very quickly was in a relationship with someone else he already knew so I would be very surprised if there wasn't an overlap there too.

It's just what some people do I guess...get bored/restless and move onto the next one but they can't bear to end a relationship without another one to go to first.

I think some affairs end 'happily' for the person who had the affair but at what cost?

I think this is divided into 2 camps:

1. Serial cheater, happily married but craves the excitement and chase of an affair. Or drunk. Will not leave spouse unless kicked out.

1. Someone married but unhappy or discontent but soldiers on due to kids, finances, shared assets, fear of new life. Meets someone else and gets kick up arse to leave marriage.

I think forgiving in the sense that you can totally freely move on with your own life and not care about what happens to your cheating ex is the ideal. I'm reminded of that saying about drinking poison and waiting for the other person to die. But it's really hard to do when living with the aftermath and injustice of the cheating partner's choices. I'm not sure that real forgiveness is ever fully possible, even when a couple reconcile - it's impossible to trust someone 100% again.

The post where PTSD was mentioned really resonates with me. It's been five years since my exH left and in the day to day, I don't think about him or what happened and I'm certainly not still crying over HIM but, I am still affected by what happened, I find this time of year especially hard because Christmas 2016 was shit as I vividly recall and then on 27th December, he dropped his bombshell, whilst DS was in front of us playing on the carpet, completely unaware as to what was unfolding.

I clearly have not forgotten. It was traumatic and I will never forget it although the pain has subsided. As for forgiveness, I'm not sure I can do that either. Don't get me wrong, exH and I get on ok now and parent well together but I am wary of him because of what he did. I so wish I never had to see him again as that would have aided my recovery but we have DS7, so not easy right now.

Having said all that, I hope that exH and the OW (or gf I suppose I should call her now) stick together and make it work for DS's sake. He has only ever known his life to be like this: having two homes etc and I do not want him to ever be upset or subjected to his father's selfish actions. All is calm .... for now.

But you do have the choice about how to react to it. So in answer to the OP, "when the OW gets her man"... you can be bitter and resentful, and want revenge. Or you can rage, suffer and eventually decide to move on and let the other person deal with the consequences of their choices, regardless whether the consequences are considered "karma" or not. Waiting for the OW/OM to be punished by life may end up being a very long, eventually worthless exercise, because the OW/OM may very well live happily ever after, no matter how unfair that is perceived to be.

Incredibly naieve and straight out of a "self help" book.
Being "bitter" is one thing. Having to have day by day by day contact with someone who betrayed you in the most fundamental way because you continue to have to (young children) whilst they sit, far off from the day to day demands of raising their children with the affair partner is not "being bitter". It is dealing with the fall out of selfishness. It is incredibly glib to say "eventually decide to move on" like everyone else (especially you aurynne ) sits on the sidelines shaking your head saying "why don't you just forgive" ignoring the fact that this person is getting up and dealing with very real and serious consequences of the affair for many many years after the event, consequences which impact not only the adults / parties to the marriage but many many other very innocent people too.

@bubblesbubbles11 I agree with you. I don't believe you do have a choice as to how you react, not in the beginning anyway. The pain is very much physical as well as emotional. I think you can train yourself to refocus your thoughts but short of having a brain transplant, it's very difficult to forgive and forget completely. Like most horrid things that happen to you in life, it's all about time. And it takes some people longer than others to 'get over it'.

SaintVal thank you.

Of course "forgiveness" is the holy grail.
But on a personal level, having had a long term committed relationship (not marriage no kids no other material joint commitments) end; and then having had a subsequent long term marriage with kids and substantial joint assets (house etc) end due to an affair - I can tell you categorically that it is 100% easier and quicker to reach "forgiveness" in the case of the former than it is in the case of the latter.

Spouses who leave for affair partners seem to highlight and emphasise to the exclusion of all else the "love" narrative (but I met my soulmate) because the day to day demands of family life and innocent others no longer "apply" to them. Society buys into this.

Hence by standers like aurynne (I assume by stander status although aurynne has not disclosed any of their personal experiences) feel qualified to talk about how a betrayed spouse should not be bitter, should forgive and should move on (all the while picking up the pieces on a day to day basis).

Oh the luxury of doing a break up in the first above scenario. without those ties/commitments you can very literally move to a new city/country, get a new job/make a new social life etc etc and LITERALLY never have contact with that person again. Forgiveness came so much more easily in that situation, why would it not?

As hard as it is, being bitter and resentful and not forgiving ultimately only brings suffering to the bitter person. It’s like drinking poison and hoping he will die. It may be out of a self help book, or resonate with themes from self help books but that doesn’t mean @aurynne isn’t right.
You can nurse an eternal wound or you can get on with it - I’ve lived through this as a child witnessing my parents divorce(s) (yes there were multiple!) and as an adult. There is literally no benefit to harbouring nasty, corrosive feelings.

[quote Ginger1982]@ILoveHuskies did your DB never try to maintain contact with his son when he left?[/quote]
Yes he did try, however his son just simply didn't want to see him

I don't blame him tbh and if a child doesn't want to see someone then their wishes should be respected

I would never say this to DB though