Husband kissed friend

[Berghia]

Sorry this is long.
I have name changed for obvious reasons but this isn't my first post.

Went out for drinks with husband and small group of friends. It's quite late, some have gone home and us remaining few are a bit drunk but not hammered.

Husband goes to bar with friend and they're gone ages. No longer at bar. I find them on dance floor talking so return to other friend and tell him. Something feels off so I go back and catch them as they're about to kiss. Feel like I'm in a soap opera.

I go home alone. Lots of angry phone call conversations with husband who wouldn't stop phoning me. Admitted they were about to kiss but kept saying that they'd not actually done anything. I said that was irrelevant as they would have if I'd not interrupted them. I tell him he needs to tell me now if anything has happened before or if anything did happen. He says no.

We talk a bit when I get home. I'm furious and tell him I'll never forgive him for the double betrayal and putting me in a position of risk in a city centre and having the nightmare of getting home alone when there were no taxis. I tell him I can't ever trust him.

In the morning I'm still angry in shock etc. He then tearfully admits they did in fact kiss.

Later we talk some more, I've calmed a bit and no longer want to move out. I tell him I need space so he stays out of my way, I go for a walk, visit my mum, message friends etc.

He's trying and is contrite and assures me he doesn't want her or for us to break up. We've talked about why he did it etc. I still feel like I'm missing some details but...

So now what do I do. I don't want to leave him but how does one go about moving on and getting past the lies. It's the lying I can't stand and the fact she was my friend. And that I was there. I'm meeting up with some friends this week to chat but I don't know what happens from here. If someone had suggested this would happen to us I'd have laughed. He's never given me reason to mistrust him. He's not perfect and neither am I. Our relationship was good, not perfect but pretty strong. I never imagined this could possibly happen. It's just blown my mind in the worst possible way.

If you made it to the end thanks so much.

The answer of what to do will come to you in time, Berghia. Sounds to me like everyone involved regrets their part.

@Berghia you seem to have an otherwise great marriage. I wouldn't be about to throw it away for a small transgression. Yes he was stupid and careless and the public nature is insulting but I wouldn't jump to conclusions. Lots of people get a bit flirty & silly when drunk - I reckon this incident will shock him into not doing anything further. Years ago a friend of my ex-husbands kissed me whilst drunk. I wasn't expecting it and pulled away suprised. He apologised. We had flirted earlier but I do think he was just being silly. No one saw and I told no one as saw no point upsetting my husband and his wife. I tell this story as random drunken kisses certainly do not indicate an affair!

Scum, the pair of them. Don’t waste your time on either of them. Trusts gone now

It’s your call OP but you deserve so much better

I wouldn’t consider this a small transgression.

The humiliation of it, blatantly done in front of friends, in public. The betrayal. And letting the OP walk home alone.

That to me is a considerable display of disloyalty.

The relationship has changed now.

If you stay together, it will be exhausting living with that little niggle of doubt every time he's out.

This will not have been his first time. He's done this so many times he's got quite brazen about cheating whilst you were there.

These things don't just come out of the blue.

You realise that an affair is never about the sex - it's about that person wanting to be seen in a different light, to become a new version of themselves.

Sometimes affairs are most definitely about the sex, with someone new/different. Especially for men by the looks of it.

@Allsortsofroses

You realise that an affair is never about the sex - it's about that person wanting to be seen in a different light, to become a new version of themselves.

Sometimes affairs are most definitely about the sex, with someone new/different. Especially for men by the looks of it.

I think they can be a mixture of both. If a Victoria’s Secret model walked up to a guy and said ‘take me to bed’, if he was that way inclined, his trousers would off in the blink of an eye. Pure lust and absolutely nothing to do with connections, emotion etc…

On the other hand there are the emotional affairs where ‘she understands me’ bollocks.

Either way, both scenarios are as bad as each other

Late to the thread. But for what it's worth....

Until I saw your age I assumed you were all very young couples and maybe most were in short term relationships, if any. The scenario reminded me of when I was young - I had a long term BF from about 18 but we lived apart, only met up two or three times a week, and I have to admit that many of our group might have a cheeky snog with someone else after a few beers. I think with hindsight he was quite often properly unfaithful - but none of us were perfect. We were young and not terribly committed, and having fun.

But when I saw you'd been married 12 years and were in your 40s, I was surprised! It's a different kettle of fish, certainly. But - I think you need to ask yourself whether you believe he would have gone further?

In my head a one-off kiss in isolation is reasonably forgive-and -forgettable if there's no wider plan (and obviously drink was involved). But the fact that he said he had felt attracted to her for a while is more of a red flag? That's a weird thing to say - as opposed to 'yes of course she's nice looking but thats not the point, I just got carried away....'

But I'm sure many marriages have coped with worse than this situation. (Leaving you to make your own way home is worse to me - but if he wasn't thinking straight then that applies to the whole evening). If you love each other and think you can move past it, then don't let one stupid incident ruin everything. Listen to yourself, not the collective wisdom of MN. Only you know how you feel and whether you can move past this, and you know your DH better than anyone so are in the best place to judge him.

Sorry you're going through this - and good luck!

The fact you said you all weren't THAT drunk stands out to me.. like another pp said theres a difference between so drunk that you have no memory and dont know what your doing... or being a bit merry...he knew what he was doing... he knew he'd done it the next morning he wasnt THAT drunk...if you hadnt had caught him hed have probably never admitted it... how will you ever know if hes done it before or will do it again.. that's not even the point, he's meant to be your partner who you trust and rely on... he has ruined it all

@expat101

The answer of what to do will come to you in time, Berghia. Sounds to me like everyone involved regrets their part.

Who's everyone?

Only two people are/were involved.

How regretful ops h would would if he hadnt been caught is debatable. He only told her the truth (if it is the truth) under pressure, he lied first off.

As for the "ow", how regretful is she that she's avoiding op like the plague, not apologised not discussed it, and let's not forget She's kissed someone else before recently according to op.

She is either using new other than her partner for, at the very very least, ego massage, validation etc or ar the other end of the spectrum she is looking for someone to leave her partner for.

Op describes her as selfish and spinless.

I v much doubt she regemrets anything other, again, than getting caught.

She sounds like she's on the look out for an affair or someone to monkey branch from her partner to ... and what's significant in that instead of recognising that , not getting involved, steering clear, acting either integrity & loyalty eyc; ops h has gotten straight in there. Apparently flirtation one night, followed by separating off, snogging etc (with his wife in the vicinity).

Sure looking for a man who's not committed to his partner, who's up it; and she found one in op's h.

Fu NY how one person (ops h) treating another like shit, with disrespect, disloyalty.etc somehow becomes "us" getting through something, fighting for our relationship, working through it etc etc. Its all delusional.

Simple facts, op can't imagine kissing getting romantic and sexual with another man; meanwhile her h can do so with another woman and actually has. He's a even had the integrity & loyalty (or even good sense) to steer clear of the groups "selfish, spineless", unhappy, on the pull, wannabe femme fatale.

*She is either using men ...

That type of person (the "friend") is, in this scenario, a bit like a predator; they are looking for "weakness", for an "in" ... and your h is a weak link, and gave her one.

On the flip side, I also find that when it's a woman who's acting like this; that men (single and married) will likewise display predatory behaviour, in the pursuit of validation, sex etc.

They can see she's unhappy, "up for it", vulnerable in a way etc and a certain type of man takes advantage. They often let her think they'll be an alternative to her partner for a relationship (or don't make it clear they're not) for as long as it takes til they get what they want_get bored, and then still be hit with the reality that he's not offering her anything, he just used her desire to monkey branch away from her current partner to get sex etc.

It generally duesbt say anything good about their character.

They're either "weak" (weak boundaries, disloyal , lacking integrity) or they're predatory/exploitative themselves, or both).

As for Esther Perel and her rambling psychobabble; fiesbt it boil down to "people (mostly men) cheat; take it. And here's how to rationalise ot to yourself".

There is a huge market for "counselling" the cheated on who don't want to end their marriages or ltr's; Esther Petel fulfills that market opportunity.

Drug dealers do likewise; doesn’t mean they're "good" or gaf about your welfare.

No doubt some posters will slate me for this, but I’ve always said if my husband ever ‘strayed’, I would go out and do the same and show him some evidence. I love him and wouldn’t want to end my relationship. Men don’t deal well with ‘their’ woman being with another man. Go and snog someone and have your phone selfie ready. Text him the photo and tell him that whatever you do, you’ll do and having done it, you’re prepared to put it behind you. You then won’t feel like a door mat and he will know the risk if he messes with another woman in the future (hides behind sofa from the brickbats and insults).

*Admitted they were about to kiss but kept saying that they'd not actually done anything. I said that was irrelevant as they would have if I'd not interrupted them. I tell him he needs to tell me now if anything has happened before or if anything did happen. He says no.

...... In the morning I'm still angry in shock etc. He then tearfully admits they did in fact kiss.*

He realised sober that "ow" could say they did or that other people might have seen them. He was prepared to lie before that.

*Something feels off so I go back and catch them as they're about to kiss. Feel like I'm in a soap opera.

I go home alone. Lots of angry phone call conversations with husband who wouldn't stop phoning me.

.....putting me in a position of risk in a city centre and having the nightmare of getting home alone when there were no taxis.*

Why exactly was he not right on the heels of his wife, having just been caught in a clinch with another woman .... and if you could walk home, why couldn't he walk home straight after you (or was he phoning constantly while walking home?) ... why wouldn't a man with longer legs, and flat shoes have caught up with a woman, if walking home on her heels.

It suggests that running out after you, was not his immediate reaction, or even short term reaction.
Which suggests something decidedly off about his priorities.

(In line with the infidelity, to call a spade a spade).

Leave him and leave her. You will never get over this. You will never trust them again. You need to escape it now. Life is too short to live it with unfaithful people

Because we love each other

Snogging the friendship group's "unhappy, selfish, spineless" loose cannon on a night out with his wife in the vicinity (having previously flirted with her), lying about it when almost caught, and apparently not running straight after his wife when found .... is a weird kind of way of showing it.

Also, they're both as bad as each other ... but while she's apparently in an unhappy relationship of (how long?); he's fkg married and in an over decade long relationship that neither you (nor him according to himself) considered unhappy or dissatisfactory .... it actually makes him look worse.

She's apparently not throwing away or at the very least risking something of value in acting like this and potentially being caught by her partner ..... whereas he risks something apparently valuable to him (or is it?). If I was in your friendship group, thdys why I'd think he was even more of a wanker than her.

Probably a combination of being friends, alcohol,music and dancing. I would just forget about it.!

I think you should also consider that her number could be stored under someone else’s name. (Cheaters usually hide their lover’s number by using a man’s name. If you ever catch up with her again, ask to borrow her phone while in his presence. Ring his number and see what happens.)

"He's trying and is contrite and assures me he doesn't want her or for us to break up. We've talked about why he did it etc. I still feel like I'm missing some details but..."

If he doesn't want her, why kiss her? And where he could be caught by you ( as you did) or by friends, he's took a big risk, unfortunately for him, he got caught.

Also, this person is not a friend, is this their first time kissing? Or has there been previous kisses or meet ups behind your back?

I'd think about what I wanted to say and confront ' friend', find out her side of the story, but don't tell her you want to talk, I'd turn up unannounced and catch her off guard, so she doesn't have time to think about what she's going to say or talk to your husband first to get their stories straight.

Can you trust your husband again? If you're always going to be wondering what he's up to when he walks out the door everyday, is the relationship worth the hassle, because it's no way to live the rest of your life?

What is wrong in your relationship for him to want to do this, because he must've fancied her to have done this and you don't go for a dance with your wife's friend and go in for a kiss without other flirting or things going on before this.

If someone truly loves you, they wouldn't be doing this in the first place, I'd walk away with my head held high and have some self respect ✊

He's a cunt for what he's done and probably won't change, but you are the only one who knows if this is something you can truly put behind you and leave in the past or start afresh by yourself.

Have you spoken to 'friends' husband, I'd be talking to him as he could be oblivious as to what went on, do it without telling your husband, as 'friends' hubby might piece together other things you may not know about!

OP, you speak of issues that now need addressing, but these did not cause your H to take the unethical route. He chose to trash your marriage and publicly humiliate you. He decided to tell you lies, and he allowed you to suffer until he finally came clean (to some degree) the next day. It’s unlikely that he actually sprinted after you to accompany you home. He may have stayed behind to set a narrative with OW.

He has fancied and crushed on your friend for quite a while. When he got the chance, he left your side to flirt, embrace and lock lips with her. He was going for Round 2 when you interrupted them. But for that, they would have continued their sordid shenanigans, with you being none the wiser.

He is home alone working most of the day, but you believe he has no opportunity to interact with OW either in person or by phone/computer. Does he not take lunch or other breaks? Does he never have outside appointments? He could easily be messaging on weekdays/weekends and then deleting, or using a second phone. There has clearly been more to this than OW being flirty (that you never saw) on one evening out.

Be cautious, OP. He is not a safe partner. In my opinion, you really do need to send him away for a while. He needs to feel the loss of you. If you don’t set an effective consequence after his utter betrayal, he will likely lose more respect for you.

I wish you the best.

Bloody hell, the dramatics on here. 'he' s not a safe partner' etc. OP it's v v easy to look from the outside and think 'I'd never put up with that, woman up and LTB, you'll never feel the same, the trust has gone'. Life is not an episode of Eastenders. Its a shock, its horrible and he's an idiot but there's a real marriage here, two people, a home, two whole lives. I get the sunk costs fallacy thing but for this one incident, absolutely not would I be ending things or running to counsellors to tell me how I should be feeling as though I'm somehow betraying all women if I don't Gloria Gaynor this.