Constructive help understanding this please

[Franklyfrost]

I’d really like some advice, perspective and practical suggestions. It’s me, my dp, my 4 dc, 11, 9, 5 and 3. Dc 11 and dc 9 are exdh’s, dc 5 and 3 are dp’s.

Back story:
Dc 11 is lovely and can be very endearing and interesting. He is also pubescent, plus has SEN, so there’s no denying he often is hard work to be around. Dp and Ds 11 don’t have a good relationship- a vicious circle of them being rude to each other, I wish my dp would stop and treat ds 11 more like a child who needs love rather than an irritation. If dp made the effort to not engage in conflict and tried to develop a connection I’m sure ds 11’s behaviour toward him would improve. Dp knows this but just wants to be obeyed by ds 11.

Every 4 months or so my partner has grabbed or shoved ds. I’ve told him it’s unacceptable. He says he won’t do it again. As ds 11 is getting older- he’s very tall for an 11 year old, wears age 14 clothes- it’s become more shocking and the last time dp grabbed him, which was this summer, I really explained at length how it was not okay for my dp to grab or shove or drag ds 11 or dc 9 (he’s done it a few times but less with dc 9).

Yesterday morning dp grabbed ds 11, lifted him and in doing so banged his head against a piece of furniture. Ds 11 had accidentally hurt ds 5 while playing with him- enough to make ds 5 cry for a few seconds but nothing serious. Ds 11 freaked out- he wasn’t badly hurt at all but had hit his head and teeth. I came into the room because of all the shouting- asked what had happened, checked with the dc and then went to tell dp that he couldn’t behave like that. Dp then started screaming at me, yelled at the top of his voice and then left the room. He came back from work that evening and refused to talk to me.

When I came to bed I said we had to discuss what had happened. He repeated much the same stuff he yelled in the morning: that ds 11 had kicked dc 5, which he had but dp didn’t mention the fact that he only kicked him lightly by accident while playing. Dp said lots about how I should support him and be in his side, that it was my fault for not telling him how what to do with dc 11 (I have explained many techniques, provided literature and we even did 12 weeks of cbt as part of the NHS well-being treatment for ds 11). He listed all my parenting fails and I pointed out none of them involved violence and they were all followed with an apology and an explanation. When I said he couldn’t touch my children dp replied well we live together so that’s not very practical- when it was obvious I meant not touch my children in anger or with violence. I told him I wanted an apology, that he needed to say sorry to ds 11 and I went to sleep on the sofa. Dp did apologise to ds 11, although it was ‘I’m sorry you got hurt’ rather than ‘I’m sorry I hurt you’. I didn’t hear any of the rest of the apology but I expect it was along the lines of ‘you hurt dc 5 and didn’t move when I asked so I had to move you’.

He messaged me during the day today and said ‘I’m sorry’ to which I replied ‘why are you sorry? I would like to know that you understand why your behaviour was so upsetting. You overstepped a clear boundary which you had previously agreed to. The subsequent aggression and minimising doesn’t assure me that you understand that boundary and won’t do the same thing again. I love you and want us to be okay. You made a mistake and you can make it better. Try this:
I apologise for ……..
I did it because …….
I wish I hadn’t done it because …..
In future I will…..
X
I’m not trying to be bossy but to explain clearly what would help me feel better.’
He didn’t reply or even open the message, came home from work and gave me the silent treatment again. What is going on? He lost his temper and acted badly why won’t he apologise? Am I being unreasonable? I’ve been working really hard to make our relationship better but I can’t let this slide. Advice please. I won’t be ltb for a few years as I am doing a vocational degree which will allow me to support myself and the children independently down the line. For me having dp as a stepfather for a few years is better than living in poverty for your whole childhood. Dp acts like he can’t see what he did or why it’s wrong. He doesn’t even seem to know he lost his temper. What do I do? Am in being a bitch or over reacting? How do I protect my kids and get dp see that he cannot shove or grab my kids. I don’t understand how he thinks it could be okay. Is it okay? He’s not perfect but I don’t think he’s an idiot or a monster despite evidence to the contrary. And, I love him.

A lot of this post has been about dp because my question is about dp’s behaviour but my son’s well being is the priority here. Any help in understanding or navigating this situation much appreciated. And sorry this is so long…

Good grief OP. He's abusive and violent with it. To you and DC. Emotional abuse too. That's what the silent treatment is and turning it round on you by pointing out your flaws. He's not a good parent or partner.

You need to contact the police about the assault on DS11 and mention past stuff too like you have here. That's so he doesn't get unsupervised access to your joint DC.

And you need to LTB. You're neglecting your DC if you don't.

@Franklyfrost

Can anyone use words that aren’t insults to explain why my partner is behaving this way?

Because you're letting him by not removing your children from harm.

Because he's an abuser.

Maybe he was abused himself and knows no other way to parent. Maybe he really dislikes your DS and has no self control. Maybe he dislikes you and this is his way of punishing you for some imagined transgression. Maybe he enjoys being violent.

Does it really matter WHY he does it? All that matters is that he does, and he will continue to do so until you step in and protect your son.

Find your mothering instinct to protect your child. You can do this

@Franklyfrost

Can anyone use words that aren’t insults to explain why my partner is behaving this way?

• Because he doesn't want the work of dealing with your son in better ways?
• because he feels entitled to take out his frustrations on your son?
• because he believes hurting/manhandling children is OK?
• because your son is not his blood?

Does it really matter though? He is treating your son in abusive ways and hurting him, and teaching him that violent behaviour is normal in family life - and he is refusing to acknowledge this is wrong or to change.

So there aren't many options here, because he doesn't want to change.

You can stay in the relationship and expose your child to violence and abuse and let your son down. Or you can do better for your son.

@Franklyfrost

Can anyone use words that aren’t insults to explain why my partner is behaving this way?

Because he wants to and you let him.

Because he wants to and there are no consequences for him.

Because he wants to and knows you would rather stay with him than protect your son.

Your son is being bullied in his own home where he should feel safe and protected.

I don't know how you can even look at this man.

I am sorry OP I realize that the replies are not what you expected but I am really not sure what you did expect. What kind of advice are you looking for? You said you were not prepared to leave any time soon, but if your DP does not want to change his behavior you cannot really make him. My DC are grown up now and I did spank them occasionally when they were little and would move them if they would not move etc, I think what makes it worse for me at least is that this man is not a father of this child. Perhaps it is not fair to say that the man has to take care of my kids like they are his own (which is what I would expect from him), but not to discipline them in the way I may. Idk.

There is a sort of family counseling, I believe, where you could all go together and try and resolve some of the issues, so perhaps you can try that. Good luck.

I was abused as a child. I went into care at 14 due to the abuse. I have seen many children that have been abused as part of my job. I take yearly courses on safeguarding as part of my job which clearly defines abuse. Your partner is abusive to your child. You are failing to protect your child from abuse. If your son came into my care as a nurse and disclosed this incident I would be making a referral to social services.

Let’s accept as a premise that I’m a bad mother allowing my child to suffer terrible abuse. But why wouldn’t my partner, even just for an easy life, apologise and not touch the children?

@ tapastastic

*Because You're ALLOWING him

Perhaps he knows on some level being a poverty stricken parent is a fear of yours, you've several children this WILL affect,
It would be hard going it alone but it could not hurt your kids more mentally than this,*

Yes, maybe he knows that I don’t want to live on uc.

I’m not convinced that moving house, having no money for food, clothes, transport, heating etc plus looking after their pensionless mother in old age etc is better than having an adult move you every few months in a manner that doesn’t hurt but is briefly unpleasant. I have a feeling that a lot of the replies are from those who haven’t ever been broke and alone with four dependents.

@Franklyfrost

But also, why can’t my dp see it’s wrong? That’s what I don’t understand. If he said sorry and we worked out a way not to let it happen again then it would be alright.

I'm starting to think you're on a wind up!

You're certainly taking delight in winding posters up. To a trained eye, your behaviour is as see through as cling film.

You ought to be ashamed of yourself. But people like you know no shame. You're every bit as bad as your partner ( if you actually have one) you are complicit that's for sure.

I don’t mean to be defensive, I’m just talking it through. I have taken on board the fact that no one agrees with me.

"He didn’t mean to hit his head. No lasting injury at all." You say this now. BUT he could have seriously hurt your son and might in the future. Moreover, there might be no lasting physical injury, but there will be lifelong psychological damage to your boy. Did you grow up with a stepfather who would push you around? Put your children first.

OP, you seem to be in denial.

What do you think your job is as a mother? Doesn’t it include protecting your children from a man that they can’t protect themselves from? Because that’s how literally every person on this thread has responded. Why do you think you are at odds with all these people?

The truth hurts, and it seems you are shying away from that pain because it’s easier for you.

It’s not your fault that your partner abuses your child but it is ABSOLUTELY your responsibility to make sure it doesn’t happen again.

You being slapped and hit as a child is awful. It should not have happened and it has clearly skewed your judgement in this current situation. But you can overcome it and in fact you have a moral and legal duty to do so.

[quote Franklyfrost]@JurgensCakeBaby
He didn’t mean to hit his head. No lasting injury at all. I doubt someone leading ‘a multi agency team including police and social workers’ would post identifiable details on mumsnet.[/quote]
Lasting injury isn't important. Gosh if that's you bar that is so low it's through the floor. He shoved him, picked him up and as a result DC bashed his head. The bashed head may have been accidental (says who, him?) but the actions that lead to it most definitely were not. It is abuse.

You asked for help understand what is going on, you've been told accurately what is going on but you don't want to hear it. If you don't believe us, you can speak to Women's Aid, they'll tell you if it is/isn't abuse. You can report your family to children's SS. If it's not abuse, a quick chat with your DC will acertain this and you'll never hear from them again.

I’m not convinced that moving house, having no money for food, clothes, transport, heating etc plus looking after their pensionless mother in old age etc is better than having an adult move you every few months in a manner that doesn’t hurt but is briefly unpleasant. I have a feeling that a lot of the replies are from those who haven’t ever been broke and alone with four dependents

Took my DC and left my abusive ex with nothing but the clothes on our backs and a few of the kids belongings.

You're shameful for putting a comfortable life before the safety of your DS. And I'm reporting your thread because I think it's a wind up.

Let’s accept as a premise that I’m a bad mother allowing my child to suffer terrible abuse. But why wouldn’t my partner, even just for an easy life, apologise and not touch the children?

Ask him.

It's evident it's an easy enough life for him to continue behaving this way. He does it because he doesn't give a shit what you think.

Also pushing and shoving is physical abuse. That's fact.

For someone who who claims that they are looking for advice and guidance, you sure do have a very patronising manner. Firstly, all of the posters who have told you that your partner is abusive are wrong, they don't understand abuse, they're lying about their professions. Then anyone who uses any language you deem to be 'insulting' is also disregarded. Next, every other answer that you don't like just because nobody here could possibly have ever been poor and also have children. Just go and write your own response to your question in private, perhaps?

Open your eyes O.P. Your partner has pushed and grabbed your children on several occasions, despite you repeatedly asking him not to do so. This is clearly abuse and you are not protecting them from a grown man much bigger and stronger than they are. Now when the unanimous advice is to leave him you are defending him by saying he is not abusive as his actions don't qualify as such.

Wake up and sort out your loyalties here, your poor children deserve better!

Thank you @Xiaoxiong @category12 @freeatlast2021 for trying to give some answers.

It’s easy to tell those you’ve never met on the internet to ltb. But the bastard is mostly not a bastard who does lots of positive things too.

@Franklyfrost

Let’s accept as a premise that I’m a bad mother allowing my child to suffer terrible abuse. But why wouldn’t my partner, even just for an easy life, apologise and not touch the children?

@ tapastastic

*Because You're ALLOWING him

Perhaps he knows on some level being a poverty stricken parent is a fear of yours, you've several children this WILL affect,
It would be hard going it alone but it could not hurt your kids more mentally than this,*

Yes, maybe he knows that I don’t want to live on uc.

I’m not convinced that moving house, having no money for food, clothes, transport, heating etc plus looking after their pensionless mother in old age etc is better than having an adult move you every few months in a manner that doesn’t hurt but is briefly unpleasant. I have a feeling that a lot of the replies are from those who haven’t ever been broke and alone with four dependents.

Wrong, I've been there, You're looking at it completely skewed. I HAVE been there and managed properly with your finances and support it's feasible. I rested FAR easier knowing my children were safe and hopeful that I'd gotten out in time than I ever would knowing I'd allowed this to go on.

You’re failing your kids. Your partner is violent towards your son and you don’t leave? Absolute disgrace. If I knew you’d I’d be reporting you to SS, you’re failing to protect your kid.

"Let’s accept as a premise that I’m a bad mother allowing my child to suffer terrible abuse. But why wouldn’t my partner, even just for an easy life, apologise and not touch the children?"

OMG because abusing people and being a bully IS his (easy) life. He has no respect for you and demonstrates contempt for your poor DS.

I really explained at length how it was not okay for my dp to grab or shove or drag ds 11 or dc 9 (he’s done it a few times but less with dc 9).

Shoving AND dragging. Both his step kids. Repeatedly.

Shouting at you. Shouting at them.

Physical abuse. Emotional abuse.

Your children are growing up in an abusive home.

Legally they've been assaulted. If he picked you up in anger and you hit your head would you think it was assault? Of course. If he dragged you physically would you think it was assault? Of course. If he shoved you in anger would you think it was assault? Of course. Because it is.

So why don't you consider it assault when he does those things to a child who is more vulnerable than you due to their age and inability to remove themselves from the situation? And in your older sons case, SEN too.

I hope your son mentions this to his school so the safeguarding lead is alerted to the fact his step father is emotionally and physically abusing him and his mother is not protecting him because she is prioritising her degree.

Living with someone you are frightened of and someone who allows them to behave in a frightening way is terrifying for a kid. It means they are in a constant state of high alert and anxiety. This is exacerbated with his SEN.

Your partner is also an idiot because he thinks that the right 'punishment' for a child not controlling themselves is to lose control and shove / drag / push them in anger thereby showing them that losing control and physically lashing out is acceptable and normal when it's not.

What on earth are you doing?!

He regularly 'grabs or shoves' your child. And with enough force that your teenager sized child managed to smack his face on some furniture. He's also done it to the other child who isn't his biological son, albeit apparently less regularly.

And you are here claiming it's not abuse?

I'm going to be charitable here and say his emotional abuse of you - because the screaming and shouting and withholding contact and blaming your child for the physical harm done to him is emotional abuse - has made you lose your sense of perspective... because otherwise you are minimising this man's horrific behaviour because it's more convenient for your degree plans for the time being.

Wake up, OP. He physically abuses your child, and that child is going to grow up remembering every time you didn't defend him, trust me.

@Franklyfrost

It’s certainly wrong to hurt a child or be aggressive toward them but I don’t think it’s classified as abuse by the law. My children all know it’s not okay for any adult to be violent toward them and I’ve discussed what happened with the older two kids. It does feel awful. Why can’t dp just not touch them? Or at least acknowledge he was wrong?

Your children DONT know this at all because you are letting an adult be violent towards your eldest.

You need to leave. This will only get worse. Protect your child.