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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Original poster

Constructive help understanding this please

348 replies

Franklyfrost · 23/11/2021 22:57

I’d really like some advice, perspective and practical suggestions. It’s me, my dp, my 4 dc, 11, 9, 5 and 3. Dc 11 and dc 9 are exdh’s, dc 5 and 3 are dp’s.

Back story:
Dc 11 is lovely and can be very endearing and interesting. He is also pubescent, plus has SEN, so there’s no denying he often is hard work to be around. Dp and Ds 11 don’t have a good relationship- a vicious circle of them being rude to each other, I wish my dp would stop and treat ds 11 more like a child who needs love rather than an irritation. If dp made the effort to not engage in conflict and tried to develop a connection I’m sure ds 11’s behaviour toward him would improve. Dp knows this but just wants to be obeyed by ds 11.

Every 4 months or so my partner has grabbed or shoved ds. I’ve told him it’s unacceptable. He says he won’t do it again. As ds 11 is getting older- he’s very tall for an 11 year old, wears age 14 clothes- it’s become more shocking and the last time dp grabbed him, which was this summer, I really explained at length how it was not okay for my dp to grab or shove or drag ds 11 or dc 9 (he’s done it a few times but less with dc 9).

Yesterday morning dp grabbed ds 11, lifted him and in doing so banged his head against a piece of furniture. Ds 11 had accidentally hurt ds 5 while playing with him- enough to make ds 5 cry for a few seconds but nothing serious. Ds 11 freaked out- he wasn’t badly hurt at all but had hit his head and teeth. I came into the room because of all the shouting- asked what had happened, checked with the dc and then went to tell dp that he couldn’t behave like that. Dp then started screaming at me, yelled at the top of his voice and then left the room. He came back from work that evening and refused to talk to me.

When I came to bed I said we had to discuss what had happened. He repeated much the same stuff he yelled in the morning: that ds 11 had kicked dc 5, which he had but dp didn’t mention the fact that he only kicked him lightly by accident while playing. Dp said lots about how I should support him and be in his side, that it was my fault for not telling him how what to do with dc 11 (I have explained many techniques, provided literature and we even did 12 weeks of cbt as part of the NHS well-being treatment for ds 11). He listed all my parenting fails and I pointed out none of them involved violence and they were all followed with an apology and an explanation. When I said he couldn’t touch my children dp replied well we live together so that’s not very practical- when it was obvious I meant not touch my children in anger or with violence. I told him I wanted an apology, that he needed to say sorry to ds 11 and I went to sleep on the sofa. Dp did apologise to ds 11, although it was ‘I’m sorry you got hurt’ rather than ‘I’m sorry I hurt you’. I didn’t hear any of the rest of the apology but I expect it was along the lines of ‘you hurt dc 5 and didn’t move when I asked so I had to move you’.

He messaged me during the day today and said ‘I’m sorry’ to which I replied ‘why are you sorry? I would like to know that you understand why your behaviour was so upsetting. You overstepped a clear boundary which you had previously agreed to. The subsequent aggression and minimising doesn’t assure me that you understand that boundary and won’t do the same thing again. I love you and want us to be okay. You made a mistake and you can make it better. Try this:
I apologise for ……..
I did it because …….
I wish I hadn’t done it because …..
In future I will…..
X
I’m not trying to be bossy but to explain clearly what would help me feel better.’
He didn’t reply or even open the message, came home from work and gave me the silent treatment again. What is going on? He lost his temper and acted badly why won’t he apologise? Am I being unreasonable? I’ve been working really hard to make our relationship better but I can’t let this slide. Advice please. I won’t be ltb for a few years as I am doing a vocational degree which will allow me to support myself and the children independently down the line. For me having dp as a stepfather for a few years is better than living in poverty for your whole childhood. Dp acts like he can’t see what he did or why it’s wrong. He doesn’t even seem to know he lost his temper. What do I do? Am in being a bitch or over reacting? How do I protect my kids and get dp see that he cannot shove or grab my kids. I don’t understand how he thinks it could be okay. Is it okay? He’s not perfect but I don’t think he’s an idiot or a monster despite evidence to the contrary. And, I love him.

A lot of this post has been about dp because my question is about dp’s behaviour but my son’s well being is the priority here. Any help in understanding or navigating this situation much appreciated. And sorry this is so long…

OP posts:
Thread gallery
5
whistleryukon · 23/11/2021 23:39

I don't think that you are in any position to be lecturing to other posters about what is and isn't abuse. You very obviously have zero insight into this, and the impact of abuse upon children. And this is compounded by the fact that you don't appear to care about your children's welfare. As long as you can carry on with your course, and your partner stops his silent treatment of you and completes your partly pre-filled apology eh?

Jesskir89 · 23/11/2021 23:39

Wow op please leave for your poor dc. This is horrendous and you seem either blinkered and in denial. This is not ok.

Original poster
Franklyfrost · 23/11/2021 23:39

@JurgensCakeBaby
He didn’t mean to hit his head. No lasting injury at all. I doubt someone leading ‘a multi agency team including police and social workers’ would post identifiable details on mumsnet.

OP posts:
JurgensCakeBaby · 23/11/2021 23:39

Picking them up as pre schoolers and redirecting their attention isn't grabbing an eleven year old who you say is as big as a fourteen year old, roughly enough to lift him off his feet and bash his head against furniture. I'm starting to suspect hairy hands.

category12 · 23/11/2021 23:40

He's grabbing and shoving your son - he banged your son's head against furniture. He's out of control.

He may not be hitting your son, but he's manhandling him and you're trying to minimise it by saying it doesn't fall under the word abuse. Actually pushing and shoving are considered acts of domestic violence and are abusive when inflicted on children.

If he did this to a stranger in the street, he could be charged with assault. It is not acceptable that this is happening in your home, and you need to protect your son.

FlowerArranger · 23/11/2021 23:40

@Franklyfrost - I can tell you from my own experience that you have reached a fork in the road. You know what you need to do, deep down you know. I so, so wish there'd been a Mumsnet in my day to advise me. I cannot stress too much that your children will never truly forgive you if you continue to expose to your partner's physical and emotional abuse.

ladymary86 · 23/11/2021 23:41

[quote Franklyfrost]@JurgensCakeBaby

I’m in the uk so if you’re inclined to, you’re free to hit your kids so long as it doesn’t leave a mark/ lasting physical damage. Not something I’d advocate obviously.[/quote]
Erm.... not in Scotland it's not and come 2022 it will also be illegal in Wales.

There's a reason for that... he's abusing your child.

JurgensCakeBaby · 23/11/2021 23:41

@Franklyfrost there are hundreds of not thousands of people nationally who do the same job as me, so it's hardly identifiable. It's like saying, I'm a teacher or in a social worker. Critique all you like you either have far too much time on your hands, or you're happy to let someone repeatedly assault your children. Either way not a discussion I care to continue.

Original poster
Franklyfrost · 23/11/2021 23:43

Didn’t anyone on this thread get hit as a child? I grew up in the uk but with parents from different cultures and was regularly hit, mainly slapped on the head and face. It wasn’t ideal and I’d never do it to my kids but what my dp does isn’t comparable to my childhood and my childhood is still entirely legal today. Maybe my perspective is off. I don’t know.

OP posts:
DeadoftheMoon · 23/11/2021 23:44

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk guidelines.

Original poster
Franklyfrost · 23/11/2021 23:45

But also, why can’t my dp see it’s wrong? That’s what I don’t understand. If he said sorry and we worked out a way not to let it happen again then it would be alright.

OP posts:
category12 · 23/11/2021 23:45

Also, your own excerpt from the Met says:

pushing or kicking
using physical force to discipline

So the Met would in fact agree it's abusive.

And don't you want better for your children than you got?

TheVanguardSix · 23/11/2021 23:45

What do you want out of this thread, OP?
Why exactly have you posted? The 'constructive help' you've asked for doesn't seem to be landing.

bloodywhitecat · 23/11/2021 23:46

@Franklyfrost

But also, why can’t my dp see it’s wrong? That’s what I don’t understand. If he said sorry and we worked out a way not to let it happen again then it would be alright.
He can't see it for the same reason you can't see it is abuse. You both choose not to see it.
Interrobanger · 23/11/2021 23:47

You can split hairs over what constitutes abuse in your eyes if you want (and it is abuse by the way - emotional, psychological and physical). But I got as far as half way through the first paragraph and I was already thinking this man’s a bastard and you should leave him.

You acknowledge that he finds your son an irritation but you seem okay with this? Makes me wonder what else is going on that you’re not acknowledging.

You’re married to a cruel bastard. You won’t get him to stop being a cruel bastard. The only way you can stop this is by not being married to him any more.

tapastastic · 23/11/2021 23:48

@Franklyfrost

Didn’t anyone on this thread get hit as a child? I grew up in the uk but with parents from different cultures and was regularly hit, mainly slapped on the head and face. It wasn’t ideal and I’d never do it to my kids but what my dp does isn’t comparable to my childhood and my childhood is still entirely legal today. Maybe my perspective is off. I don’t know.
A lot of us were sparked, slapped, went to bed hungry, saw chalk board erasers fly past out heads, NO self respecting or child respecting parent would want that for their own child!

You'll find not one soul on here who will sympathise or respect how you're "handling this!"

Violence perpetuates violence,
People and agencies are trying desperately to try and break that cycle, but "there's no lasting damage" and you need your degree,

Deplorable
Your poor children

Culture is irrespective

Franklyfrost · 23/11/2021 23:49

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted as it quotes a deleted post.

HaudYerWheestFella · 23/11/2021 23:50

Poor fucking kid is all I can say. A step dad who abuses him (and it is abuse FYI) and a mother who lets it happen and minimises it completely. Protect your son for fucks sake.

Original poster
Franklyfrost · 23/11/2021 23:50

Can anyone use words that aren’t insults to explain why my partner is behaving this way?

OP posts:
TheVanguardSix · 23/11/2021 23:51

You want your partner to admit he's wrong, see that he is wrong, and say sorry.
But you can't even admit he's abusive.
So what is it that is 'wrong' here? Is it that you just want to win an argument? What do you want him to apologise for? Abusing your son? Because that's what he's doing and that's what needs to stop.
This is beyond 'I'm sorry.

Iflyaway · 23/11/2021 23:51

Why are you even with this man who is abusing your children?

I couldn't even read more than a few sentences of your OP.

You owe it to your kids to get out of this - I had to do it.

You can too.

tapastastic · 23/11/2021 23:52

@Franklyfrost

Can anyone use words that aren’t insults to explain why my partner is behaving this way?
Because You're ALLOWING him

Perhaps he knows on some level being a poverty stricken parent is a fear of yours, you've several children this WILL affect,
It would be hard going it alone but it could not hurt your kids more mentally than this,

Jesskir89 · 23/11/2021 23:52

Op how do you expect your 'd'p to understand its wrong when you yourself are minimising this so much?

bloodywhitecat · 23/11/2021 23:53

@Franklyfrost

Can anyone use words that aren’t insults to explain why my partner is behaving this way?
Because he can and because he continues to get away with it and you continue to allow him to.
TheVanguardSix · 23/11/2021 23:53

Can anyone use words that aren’t insults to explain why my partner is behaving this way?

Abuse is not an insult here. It's a fact.
And what's going on is that your partner doesn't like your son... at all. He doesn't respect you. That much is clear. And he's pretty much abusive and miserable. And you need to see this for what it is.