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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Dating thread 216 ... spooky fun in cuffing season

988 replies

BelladiMamma · 26/10/2021 22:22

Hi everyone

Can someone else please copy and paste the rules as my screenshot is crap 💩

OP posts:
VanGoghsDog · 05/11/2021 00:38

Did he initiate ? Does he ever comment that he’s frustrated with his busy schedule? Or does he show any awareness of your feelings or needs ? Not everything needs a label but what does he consider you to be to him?

Thank you for your post. I do feel a bit at sea here, on my own, in my house, with no-one to talk to!

So, he's "submissive" so he doesn't initiate. Also, we started meeting up for walks back last Nov and we had various lockdown rules etc to navigate, both have cev parents etc.

So, Val Day I happened (arranged!) to be nearby and asked if he was around, he asked me to his for coffee and presented chocolates and flowers. (I just assumed he did that for everyone).

April he came over one morning, fixed my router, brought all the makings and made pancakes with bacon, fruit, yoghurt, maple syrup, orange juice and croissants for brunch, and we had a walk. As he left he kissed me on the mouth, but scurried off. I was a bit in shock.

At some point he said if I'd like a submissive friend to come round and do chores, cook dinner and, if he's lucky give me oral sex, to just say. I did not respond (he later said he "bottled it" on making a further move because of my lack of response) because it was a bit of a complicated suggestion to me!

Obviously I just carried on texting a few days later.

Then the Covid rules lifted a bit and people could meet up, so I sent him a silly meme about it, he said "is that a demand?" I said yes and he found an evening to come over. He cooked, we went to bed, etc.

Then he was bringing flowers every time, and doing things for me, we went out to dinner,had take aways, watched comedy shows...... He sent texts saying to just say if I want to see him etc. But I don't feel there's any point "just saying" because I get these huge long copy pasta texts telling me all the things he's doing where he can't see me.

He says he "prefers the friends option because of his hectic life" says he "not good boyfriend material". I actually never gave a "friends option".

Then recently he's been away a lot (this is all genuine) and then the op which he has been sort of building up to.

He does seem a bit remorseful that he's so busy. Without going into too much dom/sub detail he does a few things that mean it is in his interests to see me!

He has zero awareness of my feelings or needs. To be fair, I've never told him I have any and I'm not great at knowing what they are myself. I suspect he only thinks in terms of sexual needs.

Re previous gf - I just heard from a mutual friend that he was seeing someone pre Covid and she wasn't keen on meeting during lockdown, and when they could meet the relationship petered out. I know he was on Tinder last summer so I'm guessing it ended after the first lockdown.

He himself told me he was "seeing a bit of someone in 2019 but lockdown ended that" (I was teasing him about his edible cock ring being out of date 😂)

I do want to talk it through with him, and I'd be able to if I felt I had his attention, but on the phone he's often clattering around doing other things, or he's listing off a million things he's supposed to be doing.

I don't want to be another chore on his to do list. I don't want it to just fizzle and be an "option". I'm scared he'll say it's too much if I do talk to him or he'll just back right off, but on the other hand I'm getting nothing out of it except irritation and a filled head right now!

VanGoghsDog · 05/11/2021 00:41

[quote StartingAgain6369]**@pinkfondu* @VanGoghsDog* I really can't believe these men, I'm a bit lost for words, but I would think very carefully about taking things further

@BelladiMamma re Ms YM1 I promise a full recital if the meet comes together, but yes a lot has gone on and it's complex[/quote]
I don't have an issue with a submissive man, I quite like it. I loathe being told what to do, I actually have pathological demand avoidance, so when men try to dominate me (which they so often do because they think they are the natural boss of everything) it all goes very wrong, very quickly!

Unless you're confusing dominance with bondage or sado-masochism, which is a different thing. You can dominate someone without hitting them or tying them up!

Onesmallstep67 · 05/11/2021 01:11

I’ve just seen the time @VanGoghsDog so I will keep this brief for now. One question, one thought.
What do you like about him that you’re not feeling or seeing in other irons ?
In terms of facing the ‘difficult conversation’ we have seen so many times on here people building up to and avoiding speaking to someone but often when it happens it brings some resolution.
This might be difficult to answer but do you think if you had met someone else off the apps that you clicked with Mr WG would by now be a thing of the past ?

VanGoghsDog · 05/11/2021 01:21

The conversation will bring resolution, just not one I like. :)

What do you like about him that you’re not feeling or seeing in other irons ?

Intelligent, interesting, active, one of the least sexist men I've met, other than not actually having piv sex he's great in bed, when he kisses me I just dissolve into him. He cooks, he'll literally do anything (hard limit - wallpapering!).

The reasons he is so busy are all very virtuous. His whole life is dedicated to service in some form or another.

He just wants to make me smile.

Obviously then - pheromones or something! Fancied him the day I met him over three years ago, spent many nights fantasizing about him. Though my fantasies weren't quite like this :)

No idea re meeting other people. I still do that. Obviously hoping to meet someone I click with, but also knowing I probably need a good six month break from him and the apps as I'm not really being fair on people.

(He expects me to see other guys btw, I'm not cheating on him. He also knows if I meet someone I want to get with I won't see him any more. He would prefer me to have a FB on the side, but I'm not sure I can deal with that).

StartingAgain6369 · 05/11/2021 06:47

@VanGoghsDog

Unless you're confusing dominance with bondage or sado-masochism, which is a different thing. You can dominate someone without hitting them or tying them up!

I know the difference

SortingItOut · 05/11/2021 07:00

I mentioned on the last thread that the less I see Mr K the less I want to see him, well today is 1 week since I've seen him and not likely to see him until middle of next week and currently I don't care whether I see him again.
I touched on this with my counsellor and
I likened it to a fuel tank in a car, I need to see Mr K regularly to keep the tank topped up but the longer I go without seeing him the lower the tank gets and before I know it, its empty and I don't care about seeing him again.

I know others said they were like this although the majority missed their dates/partners etc

The reason for not seeing him for so long is that he is away on a fishing trip on the other side of the country 🙄
I don't begrudge this as he's done it twice a year for quite a few years but it adds to the lack of time for me.
The trip means missing out on one evening with his son so he saw him the night before he went instead (which would be a night we normally see each other but I had a work meeting).

I'm not sure if my work schedule and his life schedule are compatible any more - I changed jobs in January (which he encouraged me to do) but it means evening meetings on some of the nights we would usually meet and he has no flexibility to see me on other nights.

My counsellor is worried I'm running away/self sabotaging by always looking for problems and red flags and my first instinct is to just end things rather than think about them logically or discuss them with Mr K.

What a mess, I'm hoping the counsellor will work miracles and sort my head out and maybe one day I can throw my all in to a relationship and actually be vulnerable😱

StartingAgain6369 · 05/11/2021 07:25

@SortingItOut

In my eye's that is the post of the day, I'm sat at my WFH office pc and you've just hit the nail on the head with so many things with Ms YM1

Wow, fantastic post

Onesmallstep67 · 05/11/2021 07:29

@VanGoghsDog, having re read our messages from last night I feel for you because knowing there is chemistry and potential there with someone but being thwarted from developing it is a rubbish place to be. No wonder your mind is running on overtime thinking about him. The issue here is whether there is potential for things to be more regular and satisfying for you.Can he even offer you that ? He’s already said he’s not great boyfriend material because of all his commitments. For whatever reason he’s kept his distance and recently with his op etc hasn’t accepted your help or company even when you offered it. There’s clearly a gap between what you would like with him and so far what he’s given you. Do you think the gap will suddenly close or are his actions actually a true reflection of what life with him would be like ?

Onesmallstep67 · 05/11/2021 07:51

@SortingItOut, you’ve always been very honest about your emotional unavailability and that the most likely explanation was self preservation for lots of valid reasons from your previous relationship(s). When you can’t see Mr K what are the feelings that it stirs? Do you miss him, as in the whole person, or do you still feel somewhat detached from him? A few weeks ago you said that you wanted to be loved but didn’t at the same time. You want to be a priority for Mr K but you are still fighting what that means in terms of making you feel or appear vulnerable.

Dazedandconfused10 · 05/11/2021 08:19

Well back on that horse. Date tonight. An iron I had mostly forgotten about got in touch yesterday. I have no expectations anymore. But it beats sitting at home alone. And I need someone to appreciate my fab new hair. I have resigned myself to not being anyone's cup of tea but eh, might as well have fun right?

BelladiMamma · 05/11/2021 08:42

Him: so what are you into

Her: I'm just a girl, sitting in front of her smartphone, asking an app to find her a guy who texts her filth, adoration and is free every Friday night

My Friday feeling

OP posts:
Moopyhereagain · 05/11/2021 08:54

@BelladiMamma so much this. Seems to be a lot to ask though for,reasons unknown. I’m supposed to have a date 0 with Mr Cagey on Sunday - he’s named a time but not a place , seems a pattern of intense texting for a couple of days then goes very quiet. I’m going to wait for him to confirm, might crumble tomorrow and send a brief ‘so is this happening coz I need to fill my dance card’ text. He’s in my head so much though in an unhealthy way, it’s stopping me bothering to respond to other messages.

Stayingstrongish · 05/11/2021 08:59

@Dazedandconfused10 enjoy your date tonight, I think that’s a good attitude to have, even if he’s not the love of your life it’s a night out and an experience!

SortingItOut · 05/11/2021 09:04

@Onesmallstep67 If I know in advance I'm not going to see him I'm slightly disappointed but that's about it, if I don't know in advance and I'm expecting to see him the next day and he says he has plans I'm more annoyed than disappointed.
I wouldn't stay annoyed for long, maybe an hour or so.

I'm not sure I do miss him, I don't feel a yearning for him, the longer I don't see him the less I want to see him.

On the one hand I want to know he likes me and wants to be with me but on the other hand that scares me because then I have to be open and make myself vulnerable and I'm not sure I can do that.
I'd love to be loved but in reality I'm scared of getting hurt again so I'd rather not be loved.

I asked my counsellor how people can throw themselves 100% in to a new relationship after a bad one without worrying it will go wrong/they'll be taken advantage of, that concept feels alien to me. We're discussing it next week as part of discussing my crap marriage.

The funny thing is I don't want to get married again or live with anyone or share finances so surely what me and Mr K have is perfect - 2 independent people who spend a night or 2 a week together.

I have been thinking lately that we don't really do much, we occasionally do meals out but we don't do cinema, or theatre, or go out for the day as I only see him some evenings - and some of those evenings are after work so I won't get to his until 8/8.30 and we're usually in bed by 10 as we wake at 6 as I have to get home for my dogs and animals.
Part of me wants more than what we do and part of me likes staying in - we cook, eat, watch netflix, walk the dogs, chat and generally have a great evening.

I always get like this when I've not seen him, if I'd seen him this week I wouldn't be pondering all this.

theworldsastage · 05/11/2021 09:07

UGH.

So, I met the long lost iron, and he's still seeing the woman he was before we lost touch. There's still something intense between us, but I refuse to be the OW and told him I wasn't going to see him ever again.

He might be in a bad relationship, but he has to choose between staying in it and not staying in it. I am not Meredith Fricking Grey and I am not doing the Pick Me Dance.

I'm really quite frustrated, because even with an accidental hand touch there was electricity, but I'm not just going there.

In good news, he still found me attractive, so maybe other men will too. It's nice to know you're not a complete troll.

But, UGH. UGH, UGH, UGH.

If he was single, and I was single... but he's not.

Why is it only ever married or as-good-as-married men who are into me? No wonder single women get just a bad rep.

I was a fool to think he'd got in touch because he'd finally ended things with her.

Sad
BelladiMamma · 05/11/2021 09:15

@VanGoghsDog
Oh I’m sorry to hear that. I had been wondering about how you were getting on but I’d assumed that no news was good news and you were back to your Wednesday routine. I totally get that feeling when you’re alone / the only adult at home and you’re going over and over things in your mind and wondering why you’re where you’re at. I suppose my thing with MrA is slightly different in that ‘I knew what I was getting into’ schedule wise and that’s why we were both on Feeld as we’d found it impossible to make things work with people who wanted a more straightforward relationship. We both have scheduling issues. But it doesn’t make it any easier at the time; my main thing is questioning if I’m just happy with little time because I don’t believe I’m worth more than that. At the moment I’d rather spend my limited free time with MrA than anyone else off the apps. And we dedicate significant portions of our day to staying in touch but we are only 5 weeks in!! So like many note at the 3 month mark we could be over.

@sorting As for how you feel about someone when you don’t see them - I think that this is maybe more about how your mind works …? That maybe you don’t like to project yourself too much into the future / feel that vulnerability of trusting the future. I am continually pushing myself to be genuine and not play it cool, keep being vulnerable but also be a version of myself that I’m much happier with, eg one that can talk about all my crazy creative thoughts or my ‘bombs going off in my head’ ideas. MrA is enjoying that for now and when he doesn’t well that’ll be the end of it. Or when I can’t deal with not seeing him I’ll withdraw. I hate being moved around or cancelled on as I take it super personally but I also have to remember what my life is like and I wouldn’t hesitate to cancel an arrangement if my family needed me.

OP posts:
BelladiMamma · 05/11/2021 09:32

@Dazedandconfused10

Well back on that horse. Date tonight. An iron I had mostly forgotten about got in touch yesterday. I have no expectations anymore. But it beats sitting at home alone. And I need someone to appreciate my fab new hair. I have resigned myself to not being anyone's cup of tea but eh, might as well have fun right?
Good for you. Keep going whilst it's enjoyable - and when it isn't, go to the hairdressers / gym / whatever sparks joy
OP posts:
BelladiMamma · 05/11/2021 09:34

@theworldsastage that's a really unhelpful thing for him to have done - but you've totally kicked him into touch so good for you. What is it about peeps who need to line up their next person before they've dealt with the relationship they're in?

@Moopyhereagain yup it's so hard to get the balance right. Although nothing wrong by the way with you asking for confirmation, and if you don't want to make it too confrontational then just leave him a cheery voicemail 'hey just wondering where we're at with our plans?' If he doesn't answer, his loss!

OP posts:
FabulousMrFifty · 05/11/2021 09:40

@VanGoghsDog
I know how you are feeling about the of availability / commitment.
Ms Business is like this, last Sunday she proposed a dinner date for tomorrow and there has been zero communication since then.

I’m a planner, so would have a restaurant booked, sent her directions and an iCal and probably followed up with her today.

But from her side it’s like tumbleweed, nothing, don’t know if we are going out or staying in, or it’s on or off, nothing since last Sunday, that’s what really pissed me of previously, as I ended up doing all the work, it was so one sided.
Every fibre of me is screaming to message her, but I think I will just on my hands (not literally ), and see what happens, but currently I’m thinking this is going to be her 3rd Strike, I know I’m worth more than this.

theworldsastage · 05/11/2021 09:42

@BelladiMamma I'm both proud of myself and hate myself in equal measures. I know I did the right thing, but part of me really, really achingly misses him. Should probably block him on everything before one of us caves.

This morning is hard. Sad I hope he's having a miserable morning too. Idiot.

Moopyhereagain · 05/11/2021 09:51

@theworldsastage So sorry you are having a rough morning with this. But Meredith fricking Grey made me laugh 😂
Mc Dreamy would be boring anyway.

BelladiMamma · 05/11/2021 09:52

[quote FabulousMrFifty]@VanGoghsDog
I know how you are feeling about the of availability / commitment.
Ms Business is like this, last Sunday she proposed a dinner date for tomorrow and there has been zero communication since then.

I’m a planner, so would have a restaurant booked, sent her directions and an iCal and probably followed up with her today.

But from her side it’s like tumbleweed, nothing, don’t know if we are going out or staying in, or it’s on or off, nothing since last Sunday, that’s what really pissed me of previously, as I ended up doing all the work, it was so one sided.
Every fibre of me is screaming to message her, but I think I will just on my hands (not literally ), and see what happens, but currently I’m thinking this is going to be her 3rd Strike, I know I’m worth more than this.[/quote]
Ok so I have to admit to being 'that person' sometimes. I'll get all enthusiastic about a plan and a person and make some sort of arrangement and then just carry on with my week and all the stuff that gets thrown at me. Having said that, if it's someone I fancy the pants off I don't leave them waiting, I make sure they know I'm still free and looking forward to seeing them. It all depends whether or not you think it's worth having that final date (on the day arranged), or just binning it now. Maybe you could have a straight up conversation with her, if you did see her?

OP posts:
Moopyhereagain · 05/11/2021 09:55

@FabulousMrFifty tbh an ical and directions sent would send me running for the hills- but different strokes. Hope she confirms.

BelladiMamma · 05/11/2021 10:00

[quote Moopyhereagain]@FabulousMrFifty tbh an ical and directions sent would send me running for the hills- but different strokes. Hope she confirms.[/quote]
Agreed, but I'd kinda assumed you were being ironic
@FabulousMrFifty
🤗

OP posts:
theworldsastage · 05/11/2021 10:01

@Moopyhereagain McDreamy bloody well dies anyway, leaving her to parent, what three kids, including one with special needs? What kind of love story is that? EXACTLY.

Sigh. I'm better off just forgetting about him.

But maybe I'm getting ready to get back on the dating horse hopefully with men who are at very least actually available if not emotionally available too.

Silver lining, maybe?