Do affairs work?

[JodyD1973]

Hi I’m having an affair with a married man. I’m 48 separated 3 years ago and we’ve been seeing each other for 10 months. I have fallen in love with this man, he tells me he loves me, adores me and can see our future together. He tells me his marriage has been unhappy for years and has left twice before but always went back which he says he regrets.
We both have an overwhelming guilt at what we are doing, we’ve had arguments, cried about it and I’ve walked away 4 times but we hate not speaking to each other. We get on so well, we chat about everything, our kids, our work is similar so we understand the pressures and we have fun. He has a work incident right now and states once it’s resolved he will leave her.
But do affairs work out ever? I lay awake at night wondering what’s to come, will we ever work, will we be happy? My friends worry as I don’t go out in case there is a chance of seeing him. It’s all a bit of a mess and wonder if I should walk away for good but fear it will take me a long time to get over him.

@Journeyofthedragons

Having cheated does not always mean that you will cheat again.

Of course, but like shoplifting once you have crossed that line it becomes something you are capable of and easier the next time.

We are all capable. We can decide to do it or not. But it's not that you become capable of cheating

Men do not have this expectation of other men. Nobody has this expectation of men.

Interestingly, my husband seemed to think this. A bit like 'I was his property, how could any other man approach me?'

I found out on our 4th date that he was married.

So you’ve known from very early on that he will lie to you to get what he wants…

You walked away 4 previous times but always returned. Be determined that you will not repeat the pattern this time. This illicit relationship has diminished you. Steel yourself and move through the grieving process, knowing that this decision will empower your life.

@IamAporcupine

Men do not have this expectation of other men. Nobody has this expectation of men.

Interestingly, my husband seemed to think this. A bit like 'I was his property, how could any other man approach me?'

But he wasn't expecting men to have no desire for you whatsoever just because you were married. In fact, he expected them to think of you as property, which equates to desire in his frame of reference.

And if you had indicated any interest, he would not have expected men to be repelled by the immorality of your character.

See I don't get this 4th date stuff.

I'd say the majority of affairs begin with aquaintance/ work situation progressing to being overly friendly, crossing the boundary into an EA and then finally PA.

You speak as someone who found someone on tinder, our 1,2, 3 4 th date.
It doesn't make sense really.

If I were to find by the 4th date someone had lied on the previous 3 or witheld vital information about himself, I would say nada, you're a pile of crap I'm off, say hello to the wife and kids.

What was it that stopped you from allowing him to progress?
Suppose we are back to the old self moral questions.

There are holes in your story, obviously you don't give the game away on mumsnet, but you backtrack.

Do you not see your life would be full of excuses, lies and justification if you 'got' this man.
The lies do not end when the affair ends and you become the primary partner, it can last a lifetime, you can end up seriously dissapointing yourself.

@fourminutestosavetheworld

I agree I am puzzled by @DrSbaitso's view.

So you are saying that a person who has a high moral standard has actually a lower moral standard because they do not have the same internal struggle as someone who does find people attractive and finds it harder stop automatically when they see a wedding ring.?

Ok that sounds self appluading.

Your thinking is skewed. There are many other factors when one thinks about the morality of a situation and of course married people find each other attractive but for many it is simple to stop as they think about the hurt and pain that may occur should they ignor their morals.

Morals can be hard to quantify, even harder if you start bending the rules to suit your own situation or narrative.

There is right and wrong no matter how much people do not wish to accept that.

@Onthedunes

See I don't get this 4th date stuff.

I'd say the majority of affairs begin with aquaintance/ work situation progressing to being overly friendly, crossing the boundary into an EA and then finally PA.

You speak as someone who found someone on tinder, our 1,2, 3 4 th date.
It doesn't make sense really.

If I were to find by the 4th date someone had lied on the previous 3 or witheld vital information about himself, I would say nada, you're a pile of crap I'm off, say hello to the wife and kids.

What was it that stopped you from allowing him to progress?
Suppose we are back to the old self moral questions.

There are holes in your story, obviously you don't give the game away on mumsnet, but you backtrack.

Do you not see your life would be full of excuses, lies and justification if you 'got' this man.
The lies do not end when the affair ends and you become the primary partner, it can last a lifetime, you can end up seriously dissapointing yourself.

You don’t need to get the 4th date thing, our paths have crossed over the years through work with me not knowing his story him not knowing mine… I enjoyed his company, he made me feel good all the while me knowing it was Wrong….. and of course I’m not going to spill all on here. I am not going to get this man as I’ve ended this today for good. I made a bad choice, thinking it would be ok I was wrong… does not make a bad person for making shitty decisions and I’m sure every one of you can think of times you done the same albeit not get into something with someone else’s husband! But other area where you’ve made the wrong choice. Does it give me the right to name call and judge no it does not!

So you are saying that a person who has a high moral standard has actually a lower moral standard because they do not have the same internal struggle as someone who does find people attractive and finds it harder stop automatically when they see a wedding ring.?

I'm saying that I don't think it's a higher moral standard to have your desire, any feelings whatsoever, killed stone dead by the fact of a marriage. You're not better than someone who still wants the married man but says no. And that it's foolish to expect a wedding ring to kill female desire stone dead. There wouldn't be any affairs if that were true!

But if you do like getting very moralistic about it, then I think resisting a temptation in order to do the right thing requires more strength of character than doing the right thing because it's what you want to do and doesn't require any sacrifice.

Either way, you're doing the right thing. If you want to argue that of these two women who did the right thing, the better one is the one whose desire was killed stone dead, well, God knows the discourse of humanity has gone that way since year dot...

Like I keep saying...the idea that women might have desires that aren't dictated by morality is still shocking and incomprehensible to many people. It's happening now with these posts. Women shouldn't just not shag married men, they shouldn't even want to. The mere thought of the immorality of it should kill all feeling.

But nobody says this about men. They may say he's a shit for doing it, but there's nothing they don't understand about it.

@JodyD1973

I can see you are trying to defend youself, look at what HE has done to you, you are angry for being judged but this forum is annonymous, people can and will speak the truth.

What do you think people will say if you end up with this man, people will speak the truth behind you back if not infront of you. It will happen, why allow him to take your integrity, forever batting off comments of the woman who stole someone elses man.

Ged rid of him, then there will be no need to defend your honour.
Men like this expect an awful lot, more than you think.

Just remember an old saying….

When a woman marries her lover, it creates a vacancy for a mistress.

@DrSbaitso

Dr do you think that people who make a definitve choice not to sleep with another woman's husband live in some empty vacuum?

That they too do not have the ability to attract and be attracted to the opposite sex or that they are so boring that they cannot see the euphoria of continually falling in love and the joy that can bring, albiet fleetingly.

No there are many forces at play other than self gratification of ego by harming another human.

Here you go, OP. This might help. It's only one woman's experience, it's not going to be the same as everyone else's, but yours is following a script and I'm pretty sure that if you did end up with him, this is what you could expect.

www.independent.co.uk/life-style/till-marriage-do-us-part-1252782.html

[quote Onthedunes]@DrSbaitso

Dr do you think that people who make a definitve choice not to sleep with another woman's husband live in some empty vacuum?

That they too do not have the ability to attract and be attracted to the opposite sex or that they are so boring that they cannot see the euphoria of continually falling in love and the joy that can bring, albiet fleetingly.

No there are many forces at play other than self gratification of ego by harming another human.[/quote]
Of course not, and I've said nothing to suggest anything so risible.

Good God, the bollocks people will concoct rather than confront the fact that female sexuality isn't always turned off like a tap with a wedding ring valve.

My point is that it's a more definitive choice if you DO want to sleep with the person. It's not a sacrifice if you haven't got any desire to do it.

Errant female sexuality is apparently even more confusing than I thought.

@DrSbaitso I agree with you

@DrSbaitso

Yes men do like to believe a woman's sexuality cannot be controlled.

[quote Onthedunes]@DrSbaitso

Yes men do like to believe a woman's sexuality cannot be controlled.[/quote]
They do? Then why all the misogynistic, sexualised insults suggesting that she failed to manage it?

Why is nobody suggesting that a married man should, by reason of his marriage, never again feel any stirring for any woman not his wife?

The problem with the kind of thoughts being espoused here is that it isn't enough for a woman to control herself and do the right thing. She also has to have NO TEMPTATION to do the wrong thing.

And boy, the offence caused when I suggest that having the desires even while you resist them doesn't make her a worse person!

A good woman, or at least the best woman, is apparently one with no desires. Hmm, sound familiar?

Incidentally, Onthedunes, if you have found a way to control sexuality - and by that I mean, as you do, controlling the very existence or not of desire, not whether or not one acts upon it - then I can't believe you haven't sold it yet and become a jillionaire. You could end all affairs and you could even make gay people straight, if that were what they wanted.

I know someone who has been the other woman for 30 years. She's nearly 70 now. Has never married or had kids. He never spends xmas or holidays with her. Apparently she loves him. What a c**t.

I’ve had a couple of affairs and they worked for me!

Obviously very poor behaviour but I was in a sexless marriage for 13 years and they helped fulfil a need on both sides. One lasted 5 years but we didn’t have any expectations of the other.

It sounds like you have fallen for this guy and want more which is usually when it all goes tits up.

@Marrple What OP is meanig by 'worked' is she hopes that her MM wiill leave his wife.

"Does it give me the right to name call and judge no it does not!"

I know 'judging' is a dirty word now but honestly I don't see anything wrong with judging people who make decisions that they know for certain fact will ultimately end up hurting other people. Haven't you spent ten months hoping he'd bin his wife and come to you? I'm sorry, there are loads of things you shouldn't judge a person for, but ten months of crossing your fingers and hoping someone else gets hurt instead of you really does warrant some judging imo.

"Why is nobody suggesting that a married man should, by reason of his marriage, never again feel any stirring for any woman not his wife?"

Start a thread asking mn what they think of men who cheat. This one was started by ow so opinions naturally focus on her role.

No matter how attractive I found a married man, the minute he revealed himself to be a disloyal, cowardly liar I would go off him. I can't speak for anyone else but that's how I feel and I never really understand how others can continue to find such a man attractive. Low standards I suppose.

@PeriChristmas

I know someone who has been the other woman for 30 years. She's nearly 70 now. Has never married or had kids. He never spends xmas or holidays with her. Apparently she loves him. What a c**t.

Who is the c**t? Her or him?

Or did you mean - what a pair of c**ts?