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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Have i just been an idiot and destroyed things?

803 replies

abersterol · 05/10/2021 16:00

A year ago today I met the man I am currently with. He’s 39, I was 35 last week. When we met I was very clear I wanted to settle down and have a family. He said the same. He has a job that means he works 7am to usually half 8 (this is relevant I think).

In short, we’ve had brief sex twice, both times for about two minutes and then he stops. We’ve had other intimacy, he goes down on me and I on him, he’s hard when we kiss and he’s into cuddling and is quite affectionate that way. I’ve asked him why he’s reluctant to have proper full sex (we’ve done it twice and the last time was in may). I’ve asked him literally everything I could think of, gone through all the possible anxieties, worries or concerns he may have from sti to performance and everything in between. I’ve sat and held his hand and said whatever the issue is I’m here to work through it with him. I’ve also asked outright if he just doesn’t like sex. His answer is always the same: he wants sex, he wants that with me, he doesn’t have a reason why we haven’t developed that side to the relationship and he can’t promise me when we will do it but he knows he wants to at some point. So what happens is I leave it, a week or two, then obviously we do other things and he ejaculates with a blow job and things carry on, but I start feeling upset about the fact there’s no progress with sex and no answer as to why we are no doing it. He recently told me the last time he did have sex was 7 years ago. He’s not had a relationship for a long time and the longest has been much shorter than ours at a few weeks/months. I wondered if he was worried about performance but I’ve asked sensitively about that too and he says not.

That’s issue one.

Issue two is that since June I’ve been trying to book a short break from Saturday to Monday, to go away for a long weekend together. He’s not keen on taking time off/started a new job recently so said he doesn’t know if he can etc. I’ve said it’s just one day of annual leave. He’s said he can’t go abroad or go far as he just doesn’t want to do that right now with work. I’m not exactly sure why as his colleagues go away and they’re in the same role but he seems to find it all stressful. Eventually he agreed to ask to take a Monday off in October and so I booked somewhere an hour away, just for a change of scenery. It turns out he didn’t ask work/couldn’t take it off in the end. He’s not suggested another weekend or even said let’s just have a night away on a Saturday instead which I would have thought was a compromise. I know this is a bit of a first world problem and if the relationship is good then maybe I should stop complaining about something like this, but I guess it had upset me he didn’t want to find any extra time to share together. Again with this I was very patient, he said he did want to go away but didn’t know when etc etc. So I emailed him some dates and hotels and asked which he liked. He said he liked one of them and so I said I would provisionally book. Then he makes zero steps to organise it with his work or suggest an alternative. It makes me feel a bit messed around.

All this came to a head a few nights ago. We’d had a nice meal and come home and were watching a film, kissing etc. I suggested sex and he just stopped and shook his head. I asked why and he shook his head and didn’t answer. I got really upset. Said we’d had a nice night, if you want sex like you’ve said then why aren’t you doing that… it escalated.

I said it wasn’t normal to say you want sex and then not do it. I said he was weird for not wanting to go away together and do something nice and that most normal people in an adult relationship would appreciate me taking time to fit in with them and find somewhere nice to go for a two night break once in a year. I said he was selfish for not listening to me or compromising, said he was making me miserable and why couldn’t he at least understand that as a couple he should be honest and if he wants us to be together he needs to understand that you have to compromise. I said it was obvious why he had never had a relationship before. I said he was a bastard for playing games (no idea if he is but it felt that way). I asked him if he just wanted to break up because I couldn’t understand why he would treat me this way. I also raised the fact that in summer he would only see me briefly on a Sunday night for a few weeks and wouldn’t go for a meal or do anything as he had an interview coming up. It was a huge interview to be fair to him but I found it all a bit odd and extreme and said it was hurtful at the time.

He got upset and then defensive, said he does compromise to be with me because he spends all his free time with me outside work …that is mostly true he does but I said that’s not compromising, that’s just having the relationship. He said he would usually work later than he does it it wasn’t for me, so therefore it was a compromise Hmm

It ended with him saying I clearly thought he was inadequate and therefore he couldn’t meet my needs and I had been horrible to him and that changed how he felt now.

We had some breathing space and reconvened when calmed down but even then he was reluctant to actually talk about things rationally. He didn’t say much and I still have no idea when he wants sex other than he told me that the last two weeks he was too tired after work. He didn’t explain the last 11 months though.

Aside from these things we have had a lovely relationship. I do love him. He’s said the same to me. We’ve had some lovely times and I honestly thought he was the person I would be with.

Have I ruined it this by flying off the handle and saying horrible things in anger? I feel terrible and he is saying he questions the whole relationship after how I snapped. I am conflicted because I know I have been so patient and loving and kind in the past about these things. I’ve told him i support him and there’s no pressure and I’ve generally tried to be lighthearted about trips away and sex but obviously have mentioned it intermittently as time has gone on. He’s a nice person but his reaction to my outburst seems to be to ignore why it happened and to have a reason to withdraw further rather than sitting down together and having a chat about how we can work on things. Have i messed this all up? I also feel desperately sad at the thought of starting again at this age. It scares me. I probably sound pathetic here but IRL I have a good job and I’m usually quite together and positive :(

OP posts:
momtoboys · 20/10/2021 20:13

@abersterol

Thanks *@momtoboys* had you agreed not to have them with him as he didn’t want them? How did you move on?

I’m having a low moment today. For the first time since we stopped speaking I really really want to contact him. I keep thinking of the moments we had and times we spent to together - the few days out we actually did have - and how great they were and how much I loved them. Even when they were happening I was so aware of how lucky I was and how happy I was. I didn’t take it for granted. These feelings are overwhelming today and I just want to text him and ask is this really over for you?

I am so sad. I don’t know why it is suddenly harder today. I hoped it would get easier.

I was so besotted with him that I convinced myself that the things that I wanted didn't really matter. I just did my best to not think about it.

It will get better, I promise.

momtoboys · 20/10/2021 20:24

"It was the manner in which he conducted the relationship, not who he was, that made me feel so shit"

You will feel better when you realize that he was not two different people. He showed you the kind of person he was by stringing you along when I'm sure he had an exit plan ready when you pushed him too hard.

ChristmasPlanning · 20/10/2021 21:25

OP I mean this kindly hit you did not expect too much- you actually did not expect enough from him. He made you unhappy and didn't offer you the companionship, commitment, time or sex you wanted.

12 months is a long time to date someone to have them not commit to a night away/full day with you. It's absolutely not normal. You deserve more

abersterol · 20/10/2021 21:33

@ChristmasPlanning

OP I mean this kindly hit you did not expect too much- you actually did not expect enough from him. He made you unhappy and didn't offer you the companionship, commitment, time or sex you wanted.

12 months is a long time to date someone to have them not commit to a night away/full day with you. It's absolutely not normal. You deserve more

@ChristmasPlanning it’s true we didn’t get round to going away for the night. But after a few months I was staying with him nearly every night and going back to mine now and then. We did have some full days together at weekends. It wasn’t like he didn’t engage at all but he wouldn’t plan anything with me. Even the suggestion of going to the theatre in 3 weeks time would be met with uncertainty. He basically wanted a blank canvas of time to himself and then any spare time he would spend with me but we couldn’t arrange a night away or anything in particular as he wouldn’t like the idea that something was fixed. We did go to restaurants etc but that was often last minute and usually, not always, after I had suggested it.

One thing that stuck out to me was he would talk about things he wanted in the future like ‘I hope I have a log burner one day,’ for example. And another time he said to me, ‘if you ever get chance to go to Venice then you should do x, y and z.’ Both comments seemed odd to me, almost like he saw me as this friend he was just talking about HIS life to, not our life or our potential future. It was all just quite strange but he definitely wasn’t seeing anyone else, I know that as sure as can be. I know it sounds like a possibility but it really wasn’t that.

OP posts:
ChristmasPlanning · 20/10/2021 21:42

That behaviour is so strange though! After 12 months I was living with my now DH, we had great relationships with each other's friends and family and been on several holidays and weekends away together.

Your ex is selfish. You can't change him. What you can change is your expectations. Delete all his contact info. That way no matter how much you feel like contacting him you can't do it

SafeMove · 20/10/2021 22:39

After 12 months we lived together, had had holidays together, met each others friends and family, been to parties, hospitals, B&Q, cinema, gigs, storage units, furniture shops eyc together. Because we are a couple. We told each other what we wanted and we aligned/compromised on it. But most of all we had sex 5/6/7 times a day, we came together, we looked at each other, we made sure that the one thing that sets couples apart from friendship/companionship was right. We only have sex with each other, it bonds us. If he can't or won't penetrate and plan with you then I am not surprised at all that it failed. You were fighting a losing battle. You have both assumed the losing position, position yourself as the winner and improve your life. Only you can do that.

Buggritbuggrit · 20/10/2021 22:49

I’ve RTFT and I’m honestly a bit speechless. OP, whether or not you realise it, you are wallowing. To a degree that I’ve never previously encountered. You appear to be stuck in some sort of obsessive cycle about this, and nothing appears to be getting through.

Thus far, you’ve had multiple pages of people saying the same thing to you. It’s not really going anywhere, so I have to ask, what are you hoping to achieve from rehashing the exact same points ad infinitum? What is it that anyone here can say that will make you stop? This is a genuine question, I’m not trying to be unkind.

FluffyFlower · 20/10/2021 23:04

OP, please wake up. What you describe as happy moments - dinners, going to bed together - it is all very nice, but if fundamentals of the relationship don't align after a year you are not compatible. This man is not a relationship/marriage material. I spent years in such non-relationships until I seriously worked at myself and only then was I able to form a functional relationship. Men like that - and above all our acceptance of them - leave a bad aftertaste, and erode our self esteem the longer this goes on. End this right now, wish him well and let him go. Stop analysing him and going over details of your moments with him in your head, it's only pushing you further into dependency. Yes, this is dependency, this is not love. Treat it as you would any other dependency, reduce the time you think about him with each passing day until he is no longer on your pedestal.

CecilieRose · 20/10/2021 23:55

@Buggritbuggrit

I’ve RTFT and I’m honestly a bit speechless. OP, whether or not you realise it, you are wallowing. To a degree that I’ve never previously encountered. You appear to be stuck in some sort of obsessive cycle about this, and nothing appears to be getting through.

Thus far, you’ve had multiple pages of people saying the same thing to you. It’s not really going anywhere, so I have to ask, what are you hoping to achieve from rehashing the exact same points ad infinitum? What is it that anyone here can say that will make you stop? This is a genuine question, I’m not trying to be unkind.

It's an autistic trait. I have a tendency to do it. Rehash, obsess and repeat. I think it must be my way of processing things or something, but it drives other people mad. I think it's also a way of getting validation from others that I'm doing the right thing...if I beat myself up enough and blame myself for everything and people still think I'm in the right then I must be. Or something.
Shuffleuplove · 21/10/2021 07:35

@CecilieRose I agree. Totally.

anthurium · 21/10/2021 07:56

@Buggritbuggrit

I’ve RTFT and I’m honestly a bit speechless. OP, whether or not you realise it, you are wallowing. To a degree that I’ve never previously encountered. You appear to be stuck in some sort of obsessive cycle about this, and nothing appears to be getting through.

Thus far, you’ve had multiple pages of people saying the same thing to you. It’s not really going anywhere, so I have to ask, what are you hoping to achieve from rehashing the exact same points ad infinitum? What is it that anyone here can say that will make you stop? This is a genuine question, I’m not trying to be unkind.

I also said that wallowing to this degree is becoming too much ...but Op replied she is in that stage right now ad needs time to process...

The second she finds another man she'll stop talking about this one - - I think much of this ruminating/wallowing is about being terrified of running out of time (she's 35, wants to marry/have a family). I've met a few women who behaved like this until they either got what they wanted or made peace with the relationship being over. I had huge moments of panic and dread when I thought I'd lose out on motherhood due to not being in a relationship...

DFOD · 21/10/2021 08:11

“ I had huge moments of panic and dread when I thought I'd lose out on motherhood due to not being in a relationship...”

The irony is though that she is losing out on motherhood by either being in this relationship or obsessing about it in a delusional way,

It’s also a bit engulfing and controlling - I suspect that there were many many red flags but the OP refused to accept who he was and was like a dog with a bone - fixated on getting what she wants and insistent on forcing a square peg into a round hole (no pun intended) - maybe he was quite clear and fulfilled in his rigid lifestyle but she insisted on trying to change him to meet her needs?

Not saying her needs are OTT (in reality UTT) but she didn’t stop the see that get were incompatible and she seems unable to accept this which comes across as very rigid and somewhat entitled as well.

anthurium · 21/10/2021 08:20

@DFOD

“ I had huge moments of panic and dread when I thought I'd lose out on motherhood due to not being in a relationship...”

The irony is though that she is losing out on motherhood by either being in this relationship or obsessing about it in a delusional way,

It’s also a bit engulfing and controlling - I suspect that there were many many red flags but the OP refused to accept who he was and was like a dog with a bone - fixated on getting what she wants and insistent on forcing a square peg into a round hole (no pun intended) - maybe he was quite clear and fulfilled in his rigid lifestyle but she insisted on trying to change him to meet her needs?

Not saying her needs are OTT (in reality UTT) but she didn’t stop the see that get were incompatible and she seems unable to accept this which comes across as very rigid and somewhat entitled as well.

@DFOD

Yes I was panicked at 36/37/38//but at 39 I decided to pursue solo parenthood (via a sperm donor). She does not need to stay in this relationship or any other for that matter if she wants a family - she does need to re-frame how to go about this though - relationship and child don't need to be mutually exclusive
..She can explore solo parenting but doesn't want to.

anthurium · 21/10/2021 08:22

I agree along with 30 pages of other posters' responses that this relationship if one can call it that was a waste of time

CecilieRose · 21/10/2021 09:06

@anthurium it's sort of coming across like you're bullying OP into solo parenting when she's said she doesn't want to do it. It's a bit weird. She isn't 'wrong' for not wanting to consider it and she doesn't need to justify it to you.

Solo parenting isn't for everyone. It's incredibly difficult and I don't know how you can promote it when your child isn't even born yet. You don't know how you'll cope and you definitely don't know how OP would cope.

Why can't you respect her statement that she wants to have a partner to have a family? I feel the same as her, because I really don't think I'd cope as a solo parent. I'm neurodiverse (and STRONGLY suspect OP is too) and would be overwhelmed by things like having to make all the decisions about the child on my own and be responsible for everything on my own. Not everyone is cut out for going it alone.

abersterol · 21/10/2021 09:15

@anthurium I know you are doing what is right for you and I really am grateful that you’ve been willing to share your experience. It’s just something I’ve not wanted to do myself. I’m not hoping for a Prince Charming sort of moment. Just don’t want to do it alone, I don’t think. I do consider it often but come back to that feeling. It would take a load of pressure off in other ways but then again I suspect I would still be hopeful for that companionship, so that would still be (for me) a gap in my life.

I’m trying very hard to re read thoughts on this thread and not go backwards. It’s just shit when something ends with someone you really believed was different, in a good way.

OP posts:
abersterol · 21/10/2021 09:18

@CecilieRose I didn’t see you post.

Not sure about autism, in a lot of ways I don’t have those traits. I am rigid in my thinking over this because I did and do love him. It hurts and I have form for blaming myself for pretty much everything in life. My mum told my (a few times) that a man will never want me (different reasons each time). When I was in a physically abusive relationship (I got out fast, after a few months), my mum said oh he must have just lost his temper with you. I have very low self esteem.

OP posts:
CecilieRose · 21/10/2021 09:37

[quote abersterol]@CecilieRose I didn’t see you post.

Not sure about autism, in a lot of ways I don’t have those traits. I am rigid in my thinking over this because I did and do love him. It hurts and I have form for blaming myself for pretty much everything in life. My mum told my (a few times) that a man will never want me (different reasons each time). When I was in a physically abusive relationship (I got out fast, after a few months), my mum said oh he must have just lost his temper with you. I have very low self esteem.[/quote]
@abersterol maybe not, but the obsessing and rehashing the same things over and over is definitely an indicator. I thought it was just anxiety for years until I was diagnosed at 32. Do you tend to think in patterns like "if only I had done X, everything would have been fine" in every aspect of life and obsessively imagine every detail of how things could have been? Having an abusive parent can do that to you as well but you show a lot of signs of not being able to read someone's intentions and see the actual reality of your situation.

Definitely not saying you have to be autistic but I think there's a strong possibility, and autistic women tend to be very vulnerable when dating because it's much harder to see the red flags others see immediately. My mother is also very unhelpful and blames me for everything, like yours. When I break up with someone it's always 'what did you do?' as if everything has to be my fault.

I really feel for you because I'm in such a similar situation myself and totally understand how awful it is. I do also agree with another poster that it doesn't seem like you're madly in love with him, you're just afraid of being alone. Which is understandable, but it's clouding your judgement. There are other men in the world. There are other men who can give you much more than you're getting from this one. If you met another man tomorrow, you'd forget all about this one, I suspect.

Cavagirl · 21/10/2021 09:42

My mum told my (a few times) that a man will never want me (different reasons each time). When I was in a physically abusive relationship (I got out fast, after a few months), my mum said oh he must have just lost his temper with you. I have very low self esteem.

I presume you realise your last sentence here is inextricably linked to the two sentences before it?

Your mother's attitude is at the root of all this. I hope you are talking about this in your therapy?

anthurium · 21/10/2021 09:45

[quote CecilieRose]@anthurium it's sort of coming across like you're bullying OP into solo parenting when she's said she doesn't want to do it. It's a bit weird. She isn't 'wrong' for not wanting to consider it and she doesn't need to justify it to you.

Solo parenting isn't for everyone. It's incredibly difficult and I don't know how you can promote it when your child isn't even born yet. You don't know how you'll cope and you definitely don't know how OP would cope.

Why can't you respect her statement that she wants to have a partner to have a family? I feel the same as her, because I really don't think I'd cope as a solo parent. I'm neurodiverse (and STRONGLY suspect OP is too) and would be overwhelmed by things like having to make all the decisions about the child on my own and be responsible for everything on my own. Not everyone is cut out for going it alone.[/quote]
I'm promoting different options in life, taking control and making informed choices.

I'm a strong, independent individual and I will cope. So are many women when given the chance to think things through. Op has family/friends good support network, a job owns her own home. The only missing piece is a 'man'.

I'm sorry to hear that you're doubting me. You needn't. Thousands of single parents
manage well not just 'cope' whose relationships broke down. Why have such a negative, outdated and stigmatizing view of single parent households?? And you think having a man by your side will prevent you from not 'coping' or ending up a single parent? Relationships are fickle.

Solo parenting has many benefits which I can discuss but won't. And I'd advise you not to be 'suspect diagnosing' individuals either just because you are.

anthurium · 21/10/2021 09:47

@CecilieRose

And good luck in finding a partner, I mean that sincerely

FluffyFlower · 21/10/2021 09:58

@Cavagirl

My mum told my (a few times) that a man will never want me (different reasons each time). When I was in a physically abusive relationship (I got out fast, after a few months), my mum said oh he must have just lost his temper with you. I have very low self esteem.

I presume you realise your last sentence here is inextricably linked to the two sentences before it?

Your mother's attitude is at the root of all this. I hope you are talking about this in your therapy?

This is exactly what OP needs to look very closely into as the first step. Unless this is addressed it is unfortunately very likely she will keep attracting unavailable ,ambivalent, hot-cold men. As was recommended earlier in this thread there are plenty of books on the subject which may help. mr unavailable and fallback girl, and books about love vs addiction. Is not too late now to boost your self esteem, to learn to be fulfilled and happy on your own first, before seeking a new relationship . You can do it! Smile
abersterol · 21/10/2021 10:14

@FluffyFlower my therapist wants to go into this sort of stuff next time and I don’t want to. I know I need to but it is overwhelmingly distressing to talk about things that were said to me as a child, because they will littered in an background of huge privilege. My parents were also from horribly abusive, yet very wealthy, backgrounds. They are not like their parents and took lots of steps to break that chain of abuse, but sadly some of it is still apparent. They know no different, I am sure of that. But I feel scared to even think to my childhood. I try to forget a lot of it, though there were happy times too. Does everyone try and forget parts of childhood? I don’t know if that’s natural. Obviously not all of childhood is happy in any instance is it, regardless of abuse.

I feel like I’m far too old to address all this now, and worse, if I do, what if I open up a lot of pain that then sets me back for a while?

OP posts:
abersterol · 21/10/2021 10:18

@CecilieRose yes my mum is the same. It’s always been about what I may have done wrong, because it has to be me. It’s never anyone else. Even when a man threatened to break my fingers she didn’t seem to think that was a good enough reason to leave him Hmm she sort of ignored what I was saying. It was weird. I don’t tell her about relationships anymore.

OP posts:
Glitterybug · 21/10/2021 10:24

*my therapist wants to go into this sort of stuff next time and I don’t want to. I know I need to but it is overwhelmingly distressing to talk about things that were said to me as a child, because they will littered in an background of huge privilege. My parents were also from horribly abusive, yet very wealthy, backgrounds. They are not like their parents and took lots of steps to break that chain of abuse, but sadly some of it is still apparent. They know no different, I am sure of that. But I feel scared to even think to my childhood. I try to forget a lot of it, though there were happy times too. Does everyone try and forget parts of childhood? I don’t know if that’s natural. Obviously not all of childhood is happy in any instance is it, regardless of abuse.

I feel like I’m far too old to address all this now, and worse, if I do, what if I open up a lot of pain that then sets me back for a while?*

The therapist should be working to create a safe and supportive environment for you to start very slowly unpacking all this stuff and helping you to deal with it. That's what they're for. They should go at a pace that's comfortable for you and if you aren't ready to talk about something that's fine - they can slow down. If you've only had a couple of sessions its natural you don't trust them yet. I had SUCH a fear of my therapist judging me when i started it. i had never really had my feelings and emotions validated before. Unfortunately it's an incredibly difficult thing you're going to have to do eventually otherwise you'll continue in these same damaging patterns forever - but the right therapist and therapy can change your life if you let it.

Not to psychoanalyse but maybe you're so keen to hang onto this man because you really really don't believe in any level that you're worth having a kind, fulfilling and mutually enjoyable relationship with but that's simply not true. Of course you deserve better than this.