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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Have i just been an idiot and destroyed things?

803 replies

abersterol · 05/10/2021 16:00

A year ago today I met the man I am currently with. He’s 39, I was 35 last week. When we met I was very clear I wanted to settle down and have a family. He said the same. He has a job that means he works 7am to usually half 8 (this is relevant I think).

In short, we’ve had brief sex twice, both times for about two minutes and then he stops. We’ve had other intimacy, he goes down on me and I on him, he’s hard when we kiss and he’s into cuddling and is quite affectionate that way. I’ve asked him why he’s reluctant to have proper full sex (we’ve done it twice and the last time was in may). I’ve asked him literally everything I could think of, gone through all the possible anxieties, worries or concerns he may have from sti to performance and everything in between. I’ve sat and held his hand and said whatever the issue is I’m here to work through it with him. I’ve also asked outright if he just doesn’t like sex. His answer is always the same: he wants sex, he wants that with me, he doesn’t have a reason why we haven’t developed that side to the relationship and he can’t promise me when we will do it but he knows he wants to at some point. So what happens is I leave it, a week or two, then obviously we do other things and he ejaculates with a blow job and things carry on, but I start feeling upset about the fact there’s no progress with sex and no answer as to why we are no doing it. He recently told me the last time he did have sex was 7 years ago. He’s not had a relationship for a long time and the longest has been much shorter than ours at a few weeks/months. I wondered if he was worried about performance but I’ve asked sensitively about that too and he says not.

That’s issue one.

Issue two is that since June I’ve been trying to book a short break from Saturday to Monday, to go away for a long weekend together. He’s not keen on taking time off/started a new job recently so said he doesn’t know if he can etc. I’ve said it’s just one day of annual leave. He’s said he can’t go abroad or go far as he just doesn’t want to do that right now with work. I’m not exactly sure why as his colleagues go away and they’re in the same role but he seems to find it all stressful. Eventually he agreed to ask to take a Monday off in October and so I booked somewhere an hour away, just for a change of scenery. It turns out he didn’t ask work/couldn’t take it off in the end. He’s not suggested another weekend or even said let’s just have a night away on a Saturday instead which I would have thought was a compromise. I know this is a bit of a first world problem and if the relationship is good then maybe I should stop complaining about something like this, but I guess it had upset me he didn’t want to find any extra time to share together. Again with this I was very patient, he said he did want to go away but didn’t know when etc etc. So I emailed him some dates and hotels and asked which he liked. He said he liked one of them and so I said I would provisionally book. Then he makes zero steps to organise it with his work or suggest an alternative. It makes me feel a bit messed around.

All this came to a head a few nights ago. We’d had a nice meal and come home and were watching a film, kissing etc. I suggested sex and he just stopped and shook his head. I asked why and he shook his head and didn’t answer. I got really upset. Said we’d had a nice night, if you want sex like you’ve said then why aren’t you doing that… it escalated.

I said it wasn’t normal to say you want sex and then not do it. I said he was weird for not wanting to go away together and do something nice and that most normal people in an adult relationship would appreciate me taking time to fit in with them and find somewhere nice to go for a two night break once in a year. I said he was selfish for not listening to me or compromising, said he was making me miserable and why couldn’t he at least understand that as a couple he should be honest and if he wants us to be together he needs to understand that you have to compromise. I said it was obvious why he had never had a relationship before. I said he was a bastard for playing games (no idea if he is but it felt that way). I asked him if he just wanted to break up because I couldn’t understand why he would treat me this way. I also raised the fact that in summer he would only see me briefly on a Sunday night for a few weeks and wouldn’t go for a meal or do anything as he had an interview coming up. It was a huge interview to be fair to him but I found it all a bit odd and extreme and said it was hurtful at the time.

He got upset and then defensive, said he does compromise to be with me because he spends all his free time with me outside work …that is mostly true he does but I said that’s not compromising, that’s just having the relationship. He said he would usually work later than he does it it wasn’t for me, so therefore it was a compromise Hmm

It ended with him saying I clearly thought he was inadequate and therefore he couldn’t meet my needs and I had been horrible to him and that changed how he felt now.

We had some breathing space and reconvened when calmed down but even then he was reluctant to actually talk about things rationally. He didn’t say much and I still have no idea when he wants sex other than he told me that the last two weeks he was too tired after work. He didn’t explain the last 11 months though.

Aside from these things we have had a lovely relationship. I do love him. He’s said the same to me. We’ve had some lovely times and I honestly thought he was the person I would be with.

Have I ruined it this by flying off the handle and saying horrible things in anger? I feel terrible and he is saying he questions the whole relationship after how I snapped. I am conflicted because I know I have been so patient and loving and kind in the past about these things. I’ve told him i support him and there’s no pressure and I’ve generally tried to be lighthearted about trips away and sex but obviously have mentioned it intermittently as time has gone on. He’s a nice person but his reaction to my outburst seems to be to ignore why it happened and to have a reason to withdraw further rather than sitting down together and having a chat about how we can work on things. Have i messed this all up? I also feel desperately sad at the thought of starting again at this age. It scares me. I probably sound pathetic here but IRL I have a good job and I’m usually quite together and positive :(

OP posts:
MolkosTeenageAngst · 17/10/2021 19:35

Unless you’re a fly on the wall to his life I don’t know why you are so sure he’s not upset the relationship has ended. It seems more likely that deep down he is aware he couldn’t give you what you wanted (sex, time, commitment etc) and that it is for the best that he lets you leave the relationship. It doesn’t mean the whole thing is a lie though.

I am asexual although not aromantic, I want a relationship and all of the things that come with it, apart from sex. I have only ever had one long term relationship and one of the major issues was the lack of sex. The problem was my boyfriend would ask if I wanted sex etc and I would always promise yes, and it wasn’t a lie as such. I wanted to want sex, I wanted to feel ‘normal’ attraction and sexual desire (and at the time I didn’t know what being asexual was or that it applied to me) and I would promise my boyfriend I did want sex, just not tonight because a part of me did want to want it. I wasn’t lying, I just didn’t recognise that wanting to be a person who wanted sex (but actually didn’t like it) was very different to having genuine sexual desire and wanting sex in the moment. In hindsight I strung my ex along a lot, and added to the confusion by forcing myself to have sex (and pretending to enjoy it) from time to time. You say you tried to have sex on two occasions and he stopped it quickly, to keep that sounds like he wants to want sex but that actually in the moment regardless of what his head wants deep down the desire isn’t there. When we eventually split I was upset but I knew it was the right decision and I didn’t fight to keep the relationship because I knew I couldn’t give my ex what he needed in a relationship.

Maybe after the argument in which you were honest he has realised the truth and that he can’t give you what you need and is doing the kind thing by letting you go without a fight, because honestly if he can’t give you the relationship you want it wouldn’t be fair for him to try and convince you to stay. It doesn’t mean he doesn’t care or it all meant nothing, it doesn’t mean he’s not upset, to me it just says he knows this is the right decision and doesn’t want to upset you further by trying to fight your decision. The fact he’s going quietly might just show how much he did love you because he’s doing what is best for you long term, which is to let you find a nee relationship with a man who wants the same things you want.

CecilieRose · 17/10/2021 20:24

OP, I've seen a lot of posters saying your (ex?) partner might be autistic, but I'm actually wondering if YOU might be?

I'm autistic myself and I'm seeing a lot of my own behaviours here in you - the extreme rumination, repetitive statements, obsession over what you could have done differently. It's really quite extreme, especially considering the relationship is only a year old. Very similar to how I act when a relationship ends. You also seem very cut off from any support network or anything - you mention feeling completely alone, having no-one, and seemingly little sense of self...this are often signs of autism in women which are masked by high intelligence and capability in other aspects of life.

I hope you don't think I'm overstepping, OP...I'm just concerned as we autistic women tend to be quite vulnerable and naive when it comes to reading people's intentions. I'm in a relationship which is uncannily like yours (maybe not as bad) and which I'm considering extricating myself from. Weirdly enough I was with a different man before this who wouldn't have sex with me, finally ended things after six months and got with this guy within a couple of weeks, and it's just bad in another way. Please feel free to disregard if you don't believe this applies to you but something about your tone and your actions are ringing a lot of bells!

thislittlebird · 18/10/2021 11:36

@abersterol

Thanks *@minmooch* I know I need to stop going over it all. I just can’t understand how someone could be saying all the right things and then when it comes down to it, he’s happy to let me go. Probably hasn’t thought twice about it since.

Can’t imagine feeling open to a relationship again. This has really confused me and made me second guess myself a lot. He’s literally just snapped me from his life. Can’t exactly have been the love of his life as claimed.

You’ve had great advice here but I wanted to add that some people lie and some people are twats who muck you around. It’s as simple as that, what their motivations are might forever remain a mystery, it’s not really about you, it’s about them. You’ve done nothing wrong.

Before I met my husband I had two odd (bad) year-long relationships. The first one was with a guy at work, he told me he broke up with his gf and we started going out. He told me I was like no woman he’d been with before, I was this, I was that, he turned up at my house unexpectedly to say how he wanted to be with me, he came to my birthday party and met friends blah blah blah. He was with the girlfriend all along. He then did exactly the same thing with another colleague at the same office and repeated the scenario all over again. She thought he loved her, I broke the news to her and it wasn’t well received. He’s probably married to the much cheated on girlfriend now.

The relationship after that was with another guy at another work. We got on well but he wasn’t my type, he chased me and chased me, he wore me down and then we went out for a year. But as soon as I was into him he switched, suddenly he was aloof and too cool for school, not interested in settling down and stuff. This dragged on for a year and I should have had the guts to end it, instead it got dragged out until we barely saw each other and were probably messing around with other people. When he eventually sent me The Text saying we need to talk I replied saying no, we don’t really need to. And that was that.

Not that long after I met my husband. He wasn’t pushy about sex and I thought there was something wrong but after a few weeks it was fine. Then he was just so honest and upfront that it made me paranoid. I simply was not used to someone being straight down the line. Someone who would just say yes to going out and doing fun things with you, someone who would stay over at mine all the time, talk about getting a house with me and so on. Men being open, honest, genuinely into me and caring for me was alien and I had to get my head round the fact that this guy wasn’t playing games, he wanted what I wanted.

What I’m getting at is this man simply isn’t into you, I’ve been there too, it sucks and makes no sense but it is what it is and you can do better. Secondly, I have been you, I have blamed myself for being too demanding or clingy and I’ve hung in there way too long for no reason because I’m too scared to move on. I met my husband at 29, we started trying for a baby when I was 36 and now here I am at 38.5 without a baby and heading to ivf. I can safely say that infertility has been longer and harder than any of those weird relationships I had, despite how much I cried or blamed myself at the time. That’s not me trying to diminish what you’re going through, I’ve been there and I’ve cried way too many tears over bad men. But you will get through this and you will absolutely move on.

I would strongly encourage you take control of your own life here, end it, get some fertility tests done to determine how much time you potentially have, and if you really want a baby just get on with freezing your eggs or, in time, solo motherhood. You’ll meet someone else, someone much better and this man will be memory you shrug over and shake your head at yourself over sooner the you think.

anthurium · 18/10/2021 11:46

@thislittlebird

I'm sorry for your infertility issues, it's tough. I've had IVF so I know and understand (solo parent to be). I've already advised Op regarding doing fertility checks etc. She isn't interested in pursuing solo parenting.

One thing I don't agree with you is the idea that 'she will meet someone one day' there is absolutely no way of knowing of guaranteeing that. Other people's success is really meaningless to the individual. I've had a string of bad relationships inc a marriage and I haven't (and many other women) haven't met anyone. It's a bit like IVF - it may of may not work as I'm sure you're familiar with the unpredictable nature of the process. As with dating/meeting someone, there's luck and timing involved rather than 'the universe will deliver, I've worked hard dating therefore I deserve a partner!'

anthurium · 18/10/2021 11:48

Op does need to engage with other things in life to make her life feel more meaningful (rather than revering relationships as the panacea to her loneliness).

DFOD · 18/10/2021 11:49

I think that you being stuck in the loop of being unable to understand how someone could say something so convincingly but do the opposite is a form of denial because you are unable to accept that he is / was a time waster and liar, that the relationship was much more deficient and you chose to acknowledge.

I understand that you thought you could love him through it or wishful or hopeful thinking would magically deliver the relationship you want.

Being stuck in your thinking is keeping you protected from the pain of looking at the reality which you didn’t do during the relationship and are not doing now. Maybe allow yourself to be brave enough to feel the huge disappointment that it wasn’t what you hoped for - rather than imagining what it could/should have been - because that vision didn’t exist then or now and is not even possible in the future with his type.

What have you learned about yourself in through this experience?

thislittlebird · 18/10/2021 12:00

[quote anthurium]@thislittlebird

I'm sorry for your infertility issues, it's tough. I've had IVF so I know and understand (solo parent to be). I've already advised Op regarding doing fertility checks etc. She isn't interested in pursuing solo parenting.

One thing I don't agree with you is the idea that 'she will meet someone one day' there is absolutely no way of knowing of guaranteeing that. Other people's success is really meaningless to the individual. I've had a string of bad relationships inc a marriage and I haven't (and many other women) haven't met anyone. It's a bit like IVF - it may of may not work as I'm sure you're familiar with the unpredictable nature of the process. As with dating/meeting someone, there's luck and timing involved rather than 'the universe will deliver, I've worked hard dating therefore I deserve a partner!'[/quote]
I totally agree, no one deserves anything. But I do think, all things considered, she’ll meet someone in time. It may be at 40, 50, 60, it may be at 35, it also may not last, but there’s still lots of options out there. It’s never off the table as such.

I found a decent man, I may not get the baby. You can’t guarantee you’ll meet a father of your child, but you can take some elements of fertility into your own hands and I think I would definitely consider egg freezing in OP’s position. I’ve skimmed the thread so I’ve missed where the OP doesn’t want solo motherhood, I don’t know how I would feel about it either.

thislittlebird · 18/10/2021 12:01

@anthurium i mean to say, can I ask what as the deciding factor for you going solo?

StartingAgain33 · 18/10/2021 12:03

I once went out with a man who didnt like physical touch and who valued routine / hated changing things up / overworked a lot etc. He has recently been diagnosed with Aspergers. I hate it when people throw those things around but this did ring bells for me and may be worth thinking about because if it is something like this then there's no changing it. Regardless, doesn't sound like he'll comprimise anyway and you're just hurting eachother. I'm sure he doesnt mean to mess you about but he's quite clearly not right for you. I'm sorry to say but you need to move on.

StartingAgain33 · 18/10/2021 12:05

I also froze eggs at 35 and 36 - three rounds, got 28 which apparently gives over 90% chance of having my own child when the time is right. There are no guarantees but if you have the cash might be a good option to consider because I think my panic made me hold onto very inappropriate people, sometimes for as long as 11 months!

thislittlebird · 18/10/2021 12:10

@StartingAgain33 yeah, I agree and wish I had done it in a way . In no way do I want to panic OP because most people are totally fine but I think it’s good that this is an option women can consider now. If I’d known the position I’d be in now, in a relationship or single, I would have definitely considered it years ago so that I felt less panicked and had options, and to stop myself staying with bad choices of boyfriend.

anthurium · 18/10/2021 12:20

[quote thislittlebird]@anthurium i mean to say, can I ask what as the deciding factor for you going solo?[/quote]
@thislittlebird

Thanks for your response Smile.

I was 39 and I'd recently ended a lovely but volatile 'situanship' with someone who didn't want to have children in the timeframe required by me (he was younger).

I sat down and thought about things logically and rationally.

The chances at 39 of meeting someone that I fancy/love who fancies me back/we get along/cohabit (and it works)/we have the conversation about TTC/We TTC/it works ...or it doesn't/we agree or don't agree on further interventions.. All of this in my eyes wasn't worth the gamble. I loved the man I was in a situanship with, I wasn't interest in meeting anyone else. It was the right partner wrong timing. It took 2 good years to feel comfortable around him and I didn't have the time and I didn't want to rush anything with someone new.

In the meantime I'd become comfortable with the idea of separating relationship from having a child - they weren't mutually exclusive. I had to let go of the script 'life script' meet a man, fall in love and have a family. I went to a fertility clinic, got the checks done and was told my clinical picture was very good despite my age (genetics and luck probably)!. I realised then that I'd rather gamble 7/8k on having a child now (and I was advised still not to wait - I also have a blocked fallopian tube unbeknownst to me before the fertility checks were done). I had no time left and didn't want to waste a minute longer on dating. I didn't want to regret anything in 5/10/15 years' time because of my 'thinking and believing' there's only one way to do this - the conventional way...and I guess I prioritised trying for a child than looking for another relationship.

I hope once I've settled and got into a routine of being a solo parent, that I'll be in a good place to date again (and now without the pressure of needing a man to do it with!). Everyone deserves love, affection and care and I hope I find it again! Biology doesn't care/wait and relationships can be found at any age.

StartingAgain33 · 18/10/2021 12:20

@thislittlebird sorry you're having fertility issues - I really hope it comes off for you. So many people do get what they want but the struggle in the meantime is so hard. I know there's the donor egg option but that's not the same, and being 38.5 you've hopefully got a few years of viable eggs left - you just need to find the right one. I've got my fingers and toes crossed for you. So glad you met the right man in the end!

anthurium · 18/10/2021 12:25

@StartingAgain33

I also froze eggs at 35 and 36 - three rounds, got 28 which apparently gives over 90% chance of having my own child when the time is right. There are no guarantees but if you have the cash might be a good option to consider because I think my panic made me hold onto very inappropriate people, sometimes for as long as 11 months!
Well done on doing this Smile! I'm sure you've been advised about the benefits /drawbacks and outcomes of egg freezing.. it is still much better to do something concrete rather than nothing

I agree. My previous panic also made me hold on to in suitable relationships (which I'd never do in my 20s Hmm...

anthurium · 18/10/2021 12:43

Dating is emotionally exhausting in general...a cumulative tiredness of rinse and repeat, tiredness of of disappointment time and time again... and even more distressing when you're panicking about fertility on top of it. I really admire the women who've had the tenacity to treat it like a 'job hunt' and it paid off in the end! I definitely think dating can be fun: meeting new people/connecting etc ..I just can't remember the time when it was fun as I was goal-driven and very consumed by a definitive outcome which was having a child
...

KeflavikAirport · 18/10/2021 12:49

I would add that when you meet someone right in your late 30s, you know your own mind so much better you don't hang around, so things can move much faster than in your 20s :-)

StartingAgain33 · 18/10/2021 12:55

@KeflavikAirport i'm hoping this will happen for me - and him! still hopeful to find someone to have children with naturally at 37. never found it hard finding boyfriends but i've become so obsessed with panic / a scarcity mindset over the past few years I've spent far too long in things with the wrong people, or people not into me. Add to that the fact there are a lot more avoidants in the dating pool statistically and it's pretty dispiriting, but I don't want to give up :)

thislittlebird · 18/10/2021 13:18

@anthurium your story and decisions are indeed very logical, practical and rational. I like how decisive you were and didn’t just persist with waiting for the man, which I worry is what I would have done. I know people will say don’t worry about the checks but they really can be informative and I’m glad your focus on the child over the relationship paid off. As you say, taking the pressure off is probably a great thing. Separating those two things suddenly frees you up from worrying about finding the right man. You won’t regret the things you did do, and all that. I think you likely will find that love, affection and care, but whatever happens it’s great that you’ve got part of the script as such and you’ve taken control of events.

I could very easily have been in the position of OP, I see so much of myself in what she’s writing tbh and I know I’ve stayed in those relationships (in my 20s mind, not my 30s, I was regularly hanging on in bad situations for no good reason from a young age). That’s why the taking control part is so important from my POV, because I never did it, I just let myself coast along in these shit situations.

I echo your thoughts on dating...it’s been a long time since I did it but I can’t imagine it with the added pressure of thinking about children. I have a lot of respect for those women who are cut throat about it all, they’re more decisive and focussed than me, that’s for sure.

@StartingAgain33 thanks! I’m glad I met someone and we’ve both gone minor but not insignificant fertility issues, sadly, but I had all the fertility checks done and I’m still in a good position for my age (in theory, anyway...!) so my fingers are crossed it’ll work out. I hope your egg freezing works out well too, it honestly must be a relief to know you’ve got those banked.

momtoboys · 19/10/2021 20:54

Just jumping in one more time. This talk of babies got me thinking. I held onto the unsatisfying relationship (very similar to yours) for 11 years before he ended it. I was devastated and was sure I would NEVER meet anyone and convinced that if he didn't want me why would anyone else? I had given up on my hope for children because he had older children and didn't want any more. I was 34. I met someone wonderful and had 5 babies in 4 years. It can happen.

abersterol · 20/10/2021 11:40

Thanks @momtoboys had you agreed not to have them with him as he didn’t want them? How did you move on?

I’m having a low moment today. For the first time since we stopped speaking I really really want to contact him. I keep thinking of the moments we had and times we spent to together - the few days out we actually did have - and how great they were and how much I loved them. Even when they were happening I was so aware of how lucky I was and how happy I was. I didn’t take it for granted. These feelings are overwhelming today and I just want to text him and ask is this really over for you?

I am so sad. I don’t know why it is suddenly harder today. I hoped it would get easier.

OP posts:
DFOD · 20/10/2021 11:50

Ride out that yearning.

Trust that it will pass - do something physical to distract - and do this each time one of these waves hit. They will get smaller in time.

Be strong because you know that those few days of bliss are not ever going to be enough to achieve your goal of a calm and peaceful family life. He can’t deliver that and if that’s what you want every minute focusing on him is another minute of your finite and precious fertility going down the drain.

abersterol · 20/10/2021 12:00

@DFOD thanks. I am worried because I felt like I was managing them but actually it’s got worse. Is that a sign I should contact him. I don’t know.

I feel so sad and I’m hurting so much. I really felt he was the right one for so long. I was so so so happy spending time with him. The relationship wasn’t easy though and it didn’t develop in a way I have been used to in the past. This all feels really hard.

OP posts:
anthurium · 20/10/2021 12:20

[quote abersterol]**@DFOD thanks. I am worried because I felt like I was managing them but actually it’s got worse. Is that a sign I should contact him. I don’t know.

I feel so sad and I’m hurting so much. I really felt he was the right one for so long. I was so so so happy spending time with him. The relationship wasn’t easy though and it didn’t develop in a way I have been used to in the past. This all feels really hard.[/quote]
When you meet another 'right' one, the previous 'right one' becomes the 'wrong one'.

You won't achieve anything by contacting him, and you know that.

@DFOD as per this posters comment, you really are wasting your precious fertility time on this finished relationship. Why aren't you wanting to go and have fertility checks done (and get a reality check), but instead wish to wallow in denial?

DFOD · 20/10/2021 12:21

Think about the long stretched out decades of pain you will feel in 5 years time if you squander your fertility on this character.

It’s an indulgence and fantasy to be impulsive and contact him now. Nothing will have changed.

Keep practicing riding out the urge to contact and employ “delayed gratification” instead by imagining your babies and the feeling of being a mother in a few years time - because that’s your goal - not only is he not capable of giving you that - worse he (ie you/this “situationship”) is also able to prevent that from ever happening by frittering away your precious and fertile days.

You’ve wasted enough of your fertile years on this futile relationship.

abersterol · 20/10/2021 12:22

I’m not wallowing @anthurium I’m wondering if we could have worked on this and wondering whether to contact him. I’ve been trying to get on with things.

OP posts: