DP thinks if it doesn’t bother him it doesn’t bother me

[wetsummersundays]

I work term time. DP has been wfh since the start of the pandemic, so March 2020. His office has been open for a while but he’s elicited to keep wfh. That’s fine.

But it is restricting my life quite a bit especially with regard to social visits. Tried to raise this with him and he just says it doesn’t bother him, it’s not a problem, to carry on as if he wasn’t around.

But to be honest it’s really bothering me now and I am at the absolute limit of him being here constantly. I’m not suggesting he goes back five days a week but I would like a few days respite before work starts.

How can I raise this in a way that doesn’t have him just saying it’s no problem, he doesn’t mind my friends being here?

I work from home and wouldn’t go into the office just so DH can have his pals round. I work in the dining room and he’d be in the living room and I wouldn’t be listening to anything they were saying, because I’d be working. DH and DS were both in the house last week as DS had covid and we were isolating I didn’t even notice.

He certainly wouldn’t ‘lose any friends’ because his wife was in the house. I mean I’m in the house when they come round on an evening. It all sounds a bit odd tbh.

DP is good and kind and well meaning but personal space … doesn’t get it. Try to shave your legs over the bath arse in the air? Does he think I might need privacy? Nope smile And it frustrates me.

Here's something specific you could definitely try sorting out. It's reasonable to want privacy and personal space and there's no reason he shouldn't give them to you. You can be hardline on this because it should be easily fixed.

That makes your problem clearer to me, too. What I wasn't getting is why you felt you needed your DP out of the house in order to do any of the things you want to do. Because in our house, DP and I give each other all the space and "me time" we need, which is probably more than most, even if the other person is still in the flat.

It's not normal to feel monitored or unable to relax if your partner is in the house.

Do you think that if you manage to set firm boundaries about personal space, feeling checked up on etc, you'd be able to coexist more happily with your DP in the house as well?

Op I really don't understand why this is such a drama! Why you have to let your friends go???
I've got a husband who works from home always. I just have my friends in if I want or more commonly I'll go for a walk with them, meet them in a cafe or go to their house. It's not that hard surely!

I think if you are honest or isn't about your friends it's that there are issues in your relationship you need to work on. Can you relax at home, watch a bit of TV etc. Or do you feel he would judge you for that? I felt guilty about having a sit down etc. When I first was at home while my husband was working but now I just get on with it. We have a good relationship and he does not try to catch me out.
I think either arrange to see your friends elsewhere or just try try try to relax! Put some music on maybe so it drowns out your voices.
Good luck

There is a big difference between ‘ ‘do you not feel you could ask if he could go to the office?’ and ‘So when you ask him to go to the office what does he say?’

The latter (especially when accompanied with confused type faces) can come across impatiently and brusquely and I won’t lie, I dislike that style of posting. It makes me feel as if I am a naughty child being rebuked*

That's on you. It's not particularly brusque, it's just a question.

@wetsummersundays

I don’t think I do see it as being attacked though.

There is a big difference between ‘ ‘do you not feel you could ask if he could go to the office?’ and ‘So when you ask him to go to the office what does he say?’

The latter (especially when accompanied with type faces) can come across impatiently and brusquely and I won’t lie, I dislike that style of posting. It makes me feel as if I am a naughty child being rebuked. And this is why I’m trying to be clear it’s about how I feel. I feel as I do.

DP is good and kind and well meaning but personal space … doesn’t get it. Try to shave your legs over the bath arse in the air? Does he think I might need privacy? Nope And it frustrates me. I will concede I could be clearer but I did grow up in a house where any request for privacy was met with harrumphs and rolling eyes so I feel prudish when I ask for it now.

OP why does he not want to go into the office. You must have explored his reasons

@wetsummersundays I totally get it. I have been a SAHM for 16 years and once the children were in school full time I am used to being in the house all alone. As teenagers now, even in the holidays they are out so again I am alone as Dh is usually at work.

I think having become accustomed to that solitude when someone is then in the house and there is no break, no people leaving such as lockdown it can feel claustrophobic. Dh has the spare bedroom as an office and has been working up there apart from a handful of times when he went into the office.

I have been in your friend's situation though. My lovely friend was undergoing chemotherapy for breast cancer. Her Dh was working from home (long before lockdown) and my friend would schedule a visit between chemo appointments but also had to work them around feeling very poorly so our time was limited. Her Dh would come downstairs and take a break from work and sit in the room with us, joining in our conversations. It was difficult. In the end I would just collect her and bring her to my house at her request. He was doing it with every visitor and of course work were being very accommodating as he was caring for his sick wife. She was totally pissed off with it. He didn't understand that it was awkward for us as visitors.

The chemo put her into an early menopause, my other friend felt like she couldn't talk about her menopausal stuff as it wasn't something she wanted to discuss in front of the husband. It made our friend feel quite isolated at times.

I think this thread has been treated as AIBU rather than on the relationships board at times. I do not think you are being unreasonable to facilitate your friends feeling comfortable to chat with you in your home.

@wetsummersundays

I don’t think I do see it as being attacked though.

There is a big difference between ‘ ‘do you not feel you could ask if he could go to the office?’ and ‘So when you ask him to go to the office what does he say?’

The latter (especially when accompanied with type faces) can come across impatiently and brusquely and I won’t lie, I dislike that style of posting. It makes me feel as if I am a naughty child being rebuked. And this is why I’m trying to be clear it’s about how I feel. I feel as I do.

DP is good and kind and well meaning but personal space … doesn’t get it. Try to shave your legs over the bath arse in the air? Does he think I might need privacy? Nope And it frustrates me. I will concede I could be clearer but I did grow up in a house where any request for privacy was met with harrumphs and rolling eyes so I feel prudish when I ask for it now.

I know that you are not really receptive to practical problem-solving but any reason you can’t put a lock on the bathroom door? Your child is a baby but you can put a little bolt up high to address any worries about him/her locking themselves in when older.

OP, you really just need to say to DP that it isn't working for you, you NEED him to work from the office. Full stop. You NEED him to. 'Asking' him politely isn't getting you anywhere. You have to tell him you NEED the house to yourself, it bothers you, that you resent him being there, and you NEED him to go in. Just do it!

I know that you are not really receptive to practical problem-solving but any reason you can’t put a lock on the bathroom door? Your child is a baby but you can put a little bolt up high to address any worries about him/her locking themselves in when older

I won’t lie, I dislike that style of posting. It makes me feel as if I am a naughty child being rebuked

ISWYM...

I’m so with you OP sometimes you just need the place to yourself for a bit, even if he is shut away in the East Wing it’s just not the same, I totally get it, I wouldn’t like having my DH around 24/7 365 days a year as much as I adore him, he knows I need my space so because it’s something that would bother me, he accommodates it, it’s being considerate of your partner’s feelings and makes for a healthy relationship, he really should consider how it makes you feel and leave the house to you for a day or so. This happens to a lot of people when they retire and suddenly they are never apart, it can cause serious issues in a marriage.

OP, this might be completely wide of the mark but do you think that he is not giving you privacy and space on purpose? In a sort of passive-aggressive, digging his heels in kind of a way?

I think you said this is his house? And your name is not on the deeds? Apologies if I have misunderstood. It is possible that he thinks your wishes and needs are not important?

The problem is, when you bury what you need, the feelings don't go away. They just fester and get bigger and bigger. You cannot decide not to feel something. You can tell yourself that you don't mind never seeing your friends in your home, without your partner being present in the house, but you do mind.

I have a friend whose boyfriend moved in with her during lockdown. Every time I go and see her he is there. He takes over the conversation, interrupts with random comments, when my friend and I are talking, and generally hangs around for the entire time I am there. I only see her once a month or so, so it's not like I am always there. The whole dynamic between me and my friend is changed by the fact that he is always there. She has sent me a text asking if I want to come over this weekend and I have said I would love to see her but could we meet in a coffee shop or for lunch instead. My friendship is with her and not her partner and there are some things that I don't want to discuss in front of him.

I totally get what you mean, OP, and I don't get why you're getting such a hard time. I'm in a similar boat and I feel completely suffocated.

I've always worked at home because I freelance. My husband used to work in an office, and has only been working at home since the pandemic, and it's looking like it's going to be a permanent thing. We have separate offices and I keep my door shut, but I can hear his voice droning through the wall, can hear his feet stomping round the house - I'm just so aware of this constant presence. He likes us to have lunch together, which he spends moaning about his job, and he carries on the moaning over our evening meal.

And it's not just that he works at home: I am literally never ever alone in the house. He has no friends and no interests. He just watches TV all the time, and never goes anywhere. I have lots of friends and interests that take me out of the house, but I am also an introvert and I crave time in the house completely alone, without being aware of his constant presence in the house and being able to hear him tutting or sighing or stomping. If I have a door shut, he will always, without fail, find a reason to come into the room I'm in and then he leaves the door wide open when he goes back out. It feels deliberate - like I'm not allowed my own space and I have to be alert to him all the time.

Because I freelance, I'm fortunate that I can sometimes choose to take an afternoon off here and there, but now there is zero point to me doing this because it requires me tiptoeing around my own home and also keeping the dogs quiet because he's still working. If one of the dogs barks, he comes rushing out of his office to frown at me and snap 'what's going on?'

Another example: say the wifi is slow for example, he will bang into my room, frowning and demanding 'what are you streaming? Stop it immediately, I can't work' - like he thinks he's the boss of me or something - even though I'm never ever streaming anything.

I don't want to have friends over, because again, he's just 'there', wandering in and out, and neither my friends nor I can relax and have a good chat. It's the same when I'm on the phone - I feel on edge when I know he can hear me - not because I've anything to hide, but because I just want a silly chat with friends in private - but he's always telling me to take calls with him in the room and doesn't see the issue.

Honestly not having privacy even in the bathroom would drive me stark stare raving mad.

I'm sort of getting a vision of him being like a big sloppy goofy labrador that is constantly under your feet.

I will concede I could be clearer but I did grow up in a house where any request for privacy was met with harrumphs and rolling eyes so I feel prudish when I ask for it now.

So you grew up essentially being taught that your wants and needs weren't important and were a bit ridiculous - and unsurprisingly you've ended up with a partner who acts much the same.

I remember your last thread OP and based on that one and this one, I’m even more certain ow that your DH is a massive, controlling twat.

I’m not at all surprised to hear that he doesn’t give you any privacy generally. Nor am I surprised at the curious timing of his return to the office one day a week as soon as you’re back at work.

There are many, many red flags waving here. I just hope you’re okay.

I totally understand your point of view. He's giving you nothing.

I used to have 0 ability to maintain my boundaries and express my needs. I did a course in interpersonal effectiveness which really helped me with my communication style but if he's not even acknowledging that you are a human being in your own right, then I'm not sure how much you can expect things to change. He probably thinks the problem will go away in a few more weeks and so he doesn't need to do anything. Thoughtlessness or not, if you bring something to someone's attention and they throw your concerns away, that is deliberate and they should be held accountable for that.

I'm late to the party but I would be unequivocal about wanting some space for the next few weeks.
He can stay home every day when you are back in work but you want him in the office for a few days a week for the next few weeks.
It doesn't matter that it doesn't bother him, it bothers you. I doubt he is too dense to understand that. He simply doesn't want to acknowledge that he is being a dickhead.
Your home is primarily your home not his office, especially when he has an office to go to.

@category12

I will concede I could be clearer but I did grow up in a house where any request for privacy was met with harrumphs and rolling eyes so I feel prudish when I ask for it now.

So you grew up essentially being taught that your wants and needs weren't important and were a bit ridiculous - and unsurprisingly you've ended up with a partner who acts much the same.

This.

Put a lock on the bathroom door. If he won't drive safely, you drive or refuse to get in the car. Nicely but firmly.

I think the prickliness of your posts are coming from a common issue. Women, particularly ones from aggressive homes, can't be assertive or aggressive and have had those options removed. All that's left is passivity. But if you want your needs met, this leaks out of passive aggression. Which is where you are OP.

You need assertiveness training. But little steps first. Lock on the bathroom door.

I think recent posters are getting to the heart of the problem.

What would happen if you sit him down and tell him you really really need the house to yourself two days a week for the next few weeks, to recharge your batteries before the new term? And if he replies with the “but it doesn’t bother me” line you reply “but it does bother me, I need this for my mental health, and that matters.” If the outcome of that conversation is it becomes clear that he just doesn’t give a shit about your needs or your happiness, you’ve discovered what the real problem if, and will need to decide what to do about it. Good luck.

Does your bathroom door not have a lock OP? I’m sorry if you’ve already answered this but have you tried saying ‘I know it doesn’t bother you but it does me, and I really want the house to myself on X days, so I think you should go into the office on those days’. Have you actually spelt it out to him that whether it bothers him or not is irrelevant, and you want him to go out anyway?

@DotDotDotDot. — you too!! I know how you feel. I do understand how you feel OP , and this is why I work at a co work centre and not at home, even though we have lots of space, but I think there is probably more to it than how you are coming across on paper/screen . My H liked my friends coming round- but then would kind of casually ‘listen in’ (he used to comment on the conversation) or ‘drop in ‘ for 20 minutes. I also wonder if you feel awkward looking as if you are ‘doing nothing productive /having fun’ for a few hours . None of us know the actual dynamic within your marriage and hence can onlyvrespond based on what you say is an issue. One woman’s ‘can he be in another room it’s not an issue for me’ will be another woman’s— ‘he’s silently listening at the door to pick me up on comments I’ve made later’. I think the pandemic has seriously messed about with the dynamics in lots of marriages too. Personally I would say meet your friends in the park or at a cafe and explain H finds it hard to work with others around and you feel awkward if anyone mentions anything personal.

Full credit to you OP for staying with the thread and to keep coming back to answer people.

I am one of many that can't understand how you possibly think you can lose friendships over this, and can't understand why - unless you live in a studio apartment - it isn't possible for friends to come round and for your dp to work but I 100% acknowledge you keep coming back and haven't flounced off.
I - like many of us - found it weird when dh started working at home (I used to wfh for part of the week) and I was at home full time. I think most people had some adjusting to do, including physical things like creating a workspace somewhere where we can shut ourselves off from what is happening in another room. I realise not everyone has the space, although you haven't said that is the case for you.

I agree though with how insightful this is :

It makes sense though, that you perceive being asked questions to get you to elaborate on things as being attacked and thus is why you don't feel you can talk to your DH about things honestly if you feel that being vague and hiding how you really feel is the only way to communicate politely.

I think it might hit the nail on the head.

Hi OP, I know exactly how you feel and I think you’ve had some very weird responses here. This very issue has been a topic of discussion in my friendship group over the last year and everyone agrees (wives and husbands alike) that the majority of us need to have the house completely to ourselves every now and then, either to have friends over or to just be completely alone. It really isn’t too much to ask for him to go to the office a couple of days a week. My DH and I both worked fully from home during the first lockdown and it did eventually become a bit claustrophobic for both of us. We are now back to the office 2 days per week each and we try to take different days so we are giving each other as much space as possible. This give and take and compromise is normal in a normal relationship. The need for privacy in a relationship is also very normal. Some of us need more privacy than others. I don’t think a couple of days a week with the house to yourself if unreasonable. It wouldn’t be weird in my relationship.

You’ve described him as being thoughtless. To my mind ‘thoughtlessness’ is when it doesn’t naturally occur to him that you might have a particular need. But when you then tell him of your need and he still can’t (or won’t) understand it, well unless he’s not neurotypical, it seems to me to be selfish and uncaring, if not a little controlling.

I tend to agree with DappledThings post

*“The bit you need to add is saying that you need some space for your own mental health. That you aren't asking him to go to work out of awkwardness or out of consideration for him but that you need some time alone. That most people do and you are not able to get that at present. That not having it is causing you to feel miserable.

You have said you are conflict avoidant which seems to mean you can't say any of this without upsetting him but unless you take that risk then there isn't a way it is going to change.

And if after saying all that he just sits there like a lemon and still refuses to leave then you have bigger issues.”*

Best wishes

i think the prevuious thread basically indicated that its a big open plan studio. so no bedroom to go into etc

@burnoutbabe

i think the prevuious thread basically indicated that its a big open plan studio. so no bedroom to go into etc

That's not what I remember. Didn't the op have a bedroom converted to a play room, which could have been an office. I'm sure it had at least another bedroom too.