DH and women’s underwear

[Needanothername1234]

Feeling a bit sick and need someone to tell me if I’m being horrible.
My DH wears women’s knickers. I first found out when I discovered some close up photos of him wearing my underwear on his computer (which I occasionally used with his permission) This happened after we’d been together for about 2 years and had moved in together. He said that it was a little kink when he masturbated sometimes, no big deal, so I asked him not to because he’d ruin my underwear.

Subsequently I found some knickers in the house after I’d been away. I immediately assumed he was having an affair, so was relieved to discover that he’d bought himself more underwear so that he wouldn’t fuck mine up. We talked about it, and I told him I felt upset by his furtive behaviour, and did he want to wear them during sex? I thought that by incorporating them into our sex life it would make him feel less ashamed. So we did that occasionally, and he openly had a few pairs he would wear with me, and I thought that would be enough.

We are now married and have been together for 10 years. During that time we’ve been through some really hard experiences including infertility, and our sex life has dwindled to almost non-existence. This is partly due to my libido disappearing (perimenopause) but also because DH makes no attempt to have sex. I’ve told him many times that I want to have sex with him and be intimate, even if my lack of libido means that I rarely make the first move. He swears that he still fancies me, and when we do have sex he still seems to be keen.

Over the last week we’ve been sleeping separately (insomnia/snoring) and I noticed that he’d shaved all his pubic hair off. I jokingly said that he was using the spare room as an opportunity to live out his sexual fantasies without my oppressive presence, and he just laughed and said it was more comfortable in the hot weather. Anyway, I lost something a couple of days ago and asked if I could look through his drawers to see if it was mixed up with his stuff. I then found two drawers full of knickers, stockings, etc. When I asked him about it it became apparent that he has now replaced me with masturbation, and he wears this stuff all the time and regularly buys it. I feel sick. It feels like he’s cheating on me, but not even with another woman. I’ve been cast aside in favour of a load of nasty polyester. The secrecy makes me feel so sick.

We’ve talked about it a lot, and it seems as though he wants to wear it all the time. I have no problem with him wearing it in bed sometimes as a dirty sex thing, but am really repulsed by the idea of him shaving and wearing it day to day. I feel like a horrible intolerant person, but I don’t know if I can fancy him if he goes down this feminine route. It really turns me off.

I am getting hrt to try and deal with my libido, but it feels as though he’s already written off our sex life. He’s a wonderful kind man and we’ve been through so much and I love him dearly, but I’m really struggling with the way he’s just written me out of his sex life. It’s crazy that I feel jealous. How do I deal with this?

I almost could have written your post a few years ago OP, minus the loving him and wanting to have sex part.

ExH let me know early on he kind of liked occasionally wearing women's underwear. I didn't get it really but wasn't bothered that on a rare occasion he slept in them. Once we had sex. A huge turn on for him. Unfortunately the absolute opposite effect on me. I didn't get (and he didn't let on) the full extent of his fetish. It got more and more where he had more female underwear than male. He wore them nearly all the time and was wearing them out not just in the bedroom. He was putting them in the washing basket for me to wash like it was fine despite me firmly hinting that I didn't really like any of this. He ignored me. By this time we hardly had sex as I couldn't bring myself to. We slept apart, he moved out of the bedroom when I was pregnant and never moved back in. Always an excuse, giving my space, I snored, mattress gave him a bad back. 10 years he preferred to sleep on the sofa despite me making it clear at first that I really wasn't happy about it. He didn't care.

Then I found 2 lingerie style body suits and I'd had enough. These were hidden but I found them. I said get rid or I was finished with him. He threw everything away. He never moved back into the bedroom and we never had sex again.

Eventually I'd had enough as I had a libido, I just didn't want to have sex with him as the whole thing had turned me off and he never cared one bit about my feelings. We split. I looked in his work bag one dayan realised he'd been lying for who knows how long as he had underwear hidden in his bag. His fetish was more important to him than I ever was and he was just a liar and deeply ashamed of the whole thing. I also found a razor (don't get the shaving bit as I'd never known him to shave body hair before) and a couple of small sex toys. I also found a bit of kitchen roll with pink smeared on it which I can't be sure wasn't lipstick.

It's been nearly 3 years. He hasn't transitioned. No idea if he does more than just the underwear now I'm not around. But what I do know is it was more than just wanting to wear it in the bedroom, which is how I started. Once he thought I was OK with it, it got worse over the years. It wasn't until I discussed it with someone who asked if the underwear was from a pack of a brand I knew that I realised it wasn't. It was individual pairs of knickers, random brands. I have a strong feeling they may have come from ebay as he certainly wasn't going to these shops, none of which were in our city.

Sorry OP but you are kidding yourself. He has already said he would want to wear them daily but knows society doesn't accept it. Your engagement with it is going to look like acceptance and permission. I guarantee it will escalor he will just hide it better.

We were together for 18 years before I left. And part of me feels so naive and a fool for believing him that it was some mild thing, but I knew nothing about it back then.

Of course it's entirely up to you on what you want to do.

The first thing that came to mind is that his fetish/habit seems so self-absorbed.

With the photos on his pc and a secret drawer full of knickers, he clearly has been sending pictures of himself to people online. How do you feel about that?

You mentioned he has made a lot of sacrificing for you. How is that?

You implied about him not doing his fair share around the house. With just the two of you, why isn't he doing his fair share?

Ask yourself if you are really happy with him. What does he do that brings joy to your life and makes your life better?

Why are you changing to suit him ? It’s always you accepting it, accepting his secrecy.
Just leave, I would.

I think everyone has forgotten how digital cameras used to work pre cameraphone. You took photos, they filled up your digital card, so you dumped them onto your computer to free up space on the card again.

He took photos of himself, stuck them on the computer with all the other general photos on the card, and then didn’t do a good job of file management and cleaning up his desktop.

There was never any reason to suppose he had shared them with anyone. It was a couple of photos 8 years ago. Some of the posters on this thread are putting 2 and 2 together and coming up with 5.

I didn’t imply he didn’t do his fair share around the house. I made a throwaway jokey comment about the manner in which men explore their feminine side, but it seems I didn’t make it sufficiently clear I was joking.

He has sacrificed massively for me. Taking a job he didn’t want for many years to help me to go to university and get qualifications. Being the sole breadwinner working seven days a week and evenings for several years so that I could do an internship. Helping me deal with long-distance long-term care of a family member and supporting me through the subsequent bereavement.

This is not a selfish manipulative man. This is a man who is funny and clever and handsome and thoughtful who makes me laugh every day, who shares my interests and friends and brings me hot water bottles when I’m cold. He also has a failing - he wants to wear women’s underwear. But he’s agreed to only wear it in situations where I am happy for him to do so (in bed together, sometimes) and he says this is enough for him. He may be lying to me, or he may be lying to himself, or he may be telling the truth. No one on here can tell me what the outcome of this is going to be, even if they have direct experience of a similar situation themselves. And I don’t believe for a second that anyone would instantly divorce their very lovely husband for this without making some attempts to work through it.

At the moment I’m extremely angry with him, and I don’t trust him. We are talking about a lot of stuff in our relationship that is impacted by this and looking for ways to make this work for us, but I can honestly say that I am not making any compromises that I’m uncomfortable with. My boundaries haven’t changed to accommodate him. A lot of people on here are repulsed by the idea of their DH wearing lingerie for any reason. And that’s fine. But I don’t feel like that. I’m ok with sporadic use in the bedroom. But that’s all. That’s not me compromising or being manipulated. My feelings about it are different to yours.

I have a problem with trust after the cocaine abusing ex. My husband has been left in no doubt that I no longer trust him, and that I will not ever allow him to put me in a situation like this again. So I guess I’ll find out at some point whether he loves me enough to make our marriage work.

I think you have worked hard with you dh to find a workable compromise.
I really hope it works out for you.
What happens though if he "needs" the lingerie every time you are intimate together?
Kinks / fetishises tend to like an addiction and you need a bigger "hit" to get the same response over time.
You say you are neutral over him wearing lingerie in the bedroom sometimes. That's good in practice, I guess I feel it sounds like you are saying to him because it doesn't repulse you, it's OK.. But do you want something in your intimate relationship that only works for one of you?
What exactly is he changing for you... He has thrown away the secret stash as now he maybe thinking he doesn't need it as its out in the open between you and he'll get to wear it in the bedroom whenever he wants.
That's OK, if you arw happy with that.
But do you want to have sex without his props? And do you think he will too?

He’s not into young girls and their bras

No one has said he is; but if he is acting out in public then his behaviour is affecting other women - women shopping, and shop staff. You don't seem to be aware of that, so people pointed it out to you. You have consented to participate in his fetish; other women in public have not.

There are specialist shops that cater for cross dressers so why not use those?

‘Acting out in public’?
If and when the shopping trip happens there won’t be any acting out. We’ll look like a couple out shopping together, picking up some underwear. Have you never gone shopping with your DP for underwear? Why would the shop assistants or other customers think anything about it at all? If I’m buying stuff for myself I might ask his opinion. Or he might suggest stuff to me that he likes for me to wear. No one is going to know that he’s the one who’ll end up wearing it. He is deeply, deeply embarrassed about this. The last thing he’ll be doing is making a production out of it and drawing attention to himself.

We go shopping together occasionally for his boxer shorts, socks etc. No one looks at me and wondering why I’m hanging around in the men’s underwear section. Get a grip.

My first thought was that he sounds like he is an autogynepheliac.

Nothing wrong with that in itself but I think a lot of women (myself included) would find that one of the biggest dealbreakers possible in a (sexual) relationship. It’s completely normal that you don’t want to put up with this and tbh if I were in your shoes, I’d file for divorce. As pp have said, this fetish isn’t going away, if anything it’s escalating and you don’t have to stay in a marriage where this is going on.

I think you're being given a bit of a hard time here, OP.

From your posts, there's clearly a lot that's worth fighting for in your marriage, and I'm also of the mindset to give someone you love a chance, even multiple chances, if the thing they've done is not of an unforgivable nature.

I get that some PPs are worried for you because based on their experiences, the writing seems to be on the wall. But you know your husband and your marriage, and your own feelings, better than anyone else can. I've found your responses to be pretty balanced and calm, given how provoking it can be to have people repeatedly doom and gloom you and insist they know your situation better than you do.

As you said, no one knows what the outcome will be, but I'm hoping you and your DH are together and happy in the end, as it sounds like that's what you're hoping for too.

given how provoking it can be to have people repeatedly doom and gloom you and insist they know your situation better than you do.

There's little point posting on MN about something, unless you think there might be somebody who knows more than you do!

@TinselAngel That's true, and there's been a lot of good insights and advice, as the OP has acknowledged. It's more the way that a few times, OP has responded to specific concerns and points with reasons why she isn't ready to walk away yet, or that she isn't letting her boundaries be walked over etc, and those replies seem to have been brushed aside a bit in favour of continuing to assume a worst case scenario.

I just know that I would find that a bit frustrating.

People aren't posting doom and gloom. They are explaining how these situations can escalate, until your boundaries have been crossed.

And I don't need a grip. You aren't shopping for underwear for you, so whats the problem with using a specialist shop?

You'll just have to learn to accept it then. Good luck.

The underlying problem for me @Needanothername1234 is that is he wants to wear them a lot.

He wears this items as they give him a sexual kick, okay so what. BUT Why does he needs that sexual kick all the time? Why does he think he is entitled to have a sexual kick all the time? That is a sign it is taking over. He can’t just turn this off for you and unless you look at the reasons behind this I just can’t see it stopping. If you can save you marriage, and I’ve no idea if that is possible or not although I would have to defer to those on this thread who have been in similar situations, he needs to get help to work out why he think he is entitled to be exploring his kink outside the bedroom at the expense of your marriage.

If it turns him on it isn’t appropriate for him to do this in so many different situations. Would you want him accompanying you to a medical appointment in them? Getting kicks wearing them buying bread?

@crikeycrumbsblimey
No, I’ve already made it very clear on this thread that I’m only prepared to accept this as part of our sex life in the bedroom on an occasional basis.
Not sure why this isn’t getting through.
It’s beginning to feel as though other posters are just disregarding everything I’m saying in favour of a slightly hysterical narrative.

My ex husband was suddenly all into fetishes in his 40's was online the whole time on fetlife, took hundreds of photos of himself in latex and what have you, never took any photos of me.
I just couldn't touch him anymore. He left after I refused to have sex with him for 6 months.
Up until then we'd had a happy relationship always doing interesting things and we seemed to be on the same page. We'd been together for 20 years before all this started.
Suddenly he started talking differently in "fetlife speak" wanted to go out dressed up, was obssessed by the people on the site.
The only option was divorce, I just couldn't stick it.

It's true what the others say, this behaviour does escalate encouraged and egged on by others online. My ex started wearing latex underpants all the time then wanted to go out dressed up and then to fetish night clubs. It was all very gradual.
I came across several posts on there where others were calling me a vanilla wife and a hindrance to his fetish.
Be careful.

OP, please don’t go shopping for underwear with him.

Your feelings about perimenopause are bringing down your self-esteem and this shopping trip will do you no good at all. You aren’t feeling sexy and the agreement to the shopping trip is driven by guilt and desperation for your marriage. The shopping trip will be like play acting and ultimately leave you hollow, distanced and feeling much, much worse.

@Thelnebriati
You’re right of course. We should make 100 mile round trip to our local specialist cross dresser shop where I can feel uncomfortable, and he can spend vast sums on low quality XXXL polyester panties at five times what they would cost in a women’s shop.

That makes a lot more sense than us going together to our local high street lingerie department and choosing a few bits together, probably for both of us, before we nip in to the Tesco to grab something for dinner or maybe get a coffee, and maybe go to Homebase on the way home.

Let’s make sure we all let him know what a disgusting human being he is. Don’t let him visit normal shops where normal women will be going about their business. They don’t want to see him prancing round the lacy bra section, trilling at the top of his high-pitched voiced “Look at me! I’m a pretty lady!” What if a child sees him?!? Oh my god the horror of a man accompanying his wife into the knickers department. Society will never recover. BANISH HIM!!!

If he’s not getting women to participate in his fetish he can buy the underwear online?

There using ‘hysterical narrative’ there are women sharing their personal experiences with you.

What you do with the information is of course up to you.

There isn’t a hysterical narrative. Typo

[quote Needanothername1234]@crikeycrumbsblimey
No, I’ve already made it very clear on this thread that I’m only prepared to accept this as part of our sex life in the bedroom on an occasional basis.
Not sure why this isn’t getting through.
It’s beginning to feel as though other posters are just disregarding everything I’m saying in favour of a slightly hysterical narrative.[/quote]
OP I know very little about some of the issues raised here, but one thing does really stand out for me. You and he going on shopping trip to buy lingerie for him is (it seems to me) bringing his fetish way out of a bedroom setting and into an everyday part of life. That would worry me as it is blurring the boundaries you seem to want to set. I also think you are trying to control something that is actually out of your control. I hope it all works out OK for you.

But he wants to, whether you are willing to accept it or not, whether he does it or not, he wants to.

If you can’t explore the reasons behind this need to be hyper sexual why do you think it will go away?

I’ve spent the last few days reading all these posts, and reading the stories on the trans widows website and in all honestly, I don’t recognise my husband’s behaviour in them. So many of the men in these stories are dreadful abusers, the feminine fetish is a side note.

I’ve been aware of this fetish for the last 8 years. In that time the only escalation has been from him wearing them with me when we have sex, to him only wearing them to masturbate when he’s alone. He has expressed a desire to wear them more often, but I have expressed a desire to marry Ryan Gosling. It’s ok to have fantasies. It doesn’t follow that he will definitely be acting on them.

My gut feeling is that if someone wants to wear lingerie as part of his sexual experience, but isn’t able to have that experience with his wife anymore because they don’t have sex, then he’s going to still want to pursue it alone.

Given that we’ve been in lockdown for the last 18 months or whatever I think I’d have noticed if he was going to fetish nights in rubber stockings.

I’ve been on shopping trips for underwear before, back when we had a regular sex life. This isn’t a new thing.