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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

This isn't good is it? I'm kind of scared.

190 replies

Acatchasingitsowntail · 04/06/2021 01:09

Together on and off 28 years. Not married, no children. For reasons that would be outing I don't want to get into details about why we didnt marry or move in together, but we never felt the need to when young, and his financial/work situation made this difficult.

What I want to know is what you may think of these details I am going to write.

Some info:
He often misinterprets my words and questions - if I ask if he might want to talk/chat (when he might be busy reading etc) I am accused of 'accusing him', of making him out to be a bad person, or he says I am IMPLYING that he is ignoring me. All far off the mark.
I can say something like 'hey, you're quiet!" and he will often over react horribly, telling me I am implying he is 'up to something' or that I have an ulterior motive, such as being disappointed with him (I promise I am not!).
It isn't like paranoia, just a permanent defensiveness. He doesn't shout, but can be really imposing and unpleasant and it really knocks me off kilter.

For a long time now, he doesn't seem to want to converse with me, particularly about anything deep (feelings, politics, art, music, the world, stuff). Only really seems to talk to me about surface, trivial stuff. Never used to be this bad. It has become much worse in last 8 months. If I bring it up, in a non confrontational way, he is really pissed off with me and says I am criticising him (when I am emphatically not) or 'making him feel crazy'.

There's a lot of denial. About so much irrelevant stuff.
We have discussed this over time and he always says he will give it some thought, try to cut it out. I have been open, inviting him to explore it, I don't harass him, or make him feel bad. These are reactions to such odd things like taking rubbish out to bin, or about the shopping list, etc. If it involves anything deep or emotional the reaction is worse and more unpleasant/stressed.
It is as if the defensiveness has eclipsed him, as if he is always under attack or having to protect himself. It makes regular conversations really hard going sometimes.

If I say, 'hey that wasn't nice', or 'that kind of confuses/hurts me', or 'why did you do that?' he will state, emphatically, no. He doesn't ask why or what makes me say that. Just a constant 'no'. 'No it isn't'. 'No I didnt', etc. Over time this makes me feel that my opinions or feelings are not valued or heard.

He states things rather than shows them. For example, he might state that he is a warm person, but looks disapproving or annoyed whilst saying it. I find it really confusing and I am tired out with it.

He isn't physically violent but if he is angry he will storm out of a room over things that don't make sense, creating a violent atmosphere which really unnerves me. He can't seem to deal with small conflicts well, whereas I am open and able to talk. Sometimes his aggression is imposing and makes me feel nervous, afraid. Not that I think he would hurt me, but that he is angry enough to. I often feel he is a tight spring that holds violence it back. He can be quite snippy and passive aggressive when he feels wronged, which is often these days, and doesn't seem to hear me when I say it is harmful to me. He promises but it just happens again.

He says he shares a view of our future, wants similar things. Wants to live with me eventually, what have you. Except in daily life there is never any discussion, interest or movement towards that. We have a 14 year age gap (he is older) and met when I was 20. He will soon be reaching pension age, and says we might not be able to live together because it would affect his pension (I am self employed). This is true, but I am of the mind that at this point in our lives we could easily muck in together and just share the running of a home. It is like he has a batchelor mentality, but doesn't want to lose me.

Over the past few decades he has often fired me off suddenly and dumped me. Mostly when I was younger and less confident. Usually the result of his growing disengagement and me trying to discuss/fix it. Fuse got blown, off he'd go. He always saw himself as the victim and quite cruelly ejected me from his life. It was often sudden and devastating for me. A few years would pass and we would become chums again, then drift back together. The cycle begins again. The grief I have gone through in the past over this is immense. I often had to find a place to live when it happened as I had been living with him on his tenancy.

I am also a creative, and don't wish to buy a home, but I did want to eventually live together, share the cost, and choose somewhere lovely to live. I can afford to live and work where I like, but he still doesn't seem terribly motivated. Neve mentions making a will, etc. He lives in a horrible area and admits it is stressful but is happy for me to find a new place somewhere nice and 'tag along to visit'.

I do think he loves me very much, in his own way, and he has always been faithful and honest. But it isn't enough. I have altered a lot over the years, am still growing, and learning a great deal about my past choices. He doesn't seem to be on the same 'page', I guess.

I think I want to leave, create finality, and am happy to do so, but it is hard to break past habits...

I apologise for the length, please be gentle. A lot going on this year, lost my mum, lots of changes, etc.
What I want to know is your opinion of those details I have written. What is going on with a person who has these traits? Are we just on different planets now or does some of that qualify as abuse? It often feels like that. I feel really guilty writing this about him, because he is lovely, too. What a mess.

OP posts:
Acatchasingitsowntail · 06/06/2021 00:30

@Giantrooster

You describe your life and partner so insightful, op. But it's so chilling, your calm, I don't know how you reached that.

It seems a twisted half-incestuous relationship, I can't help but thinking of a parasite latching on to you when young and taking the place of... you. He has gnawed you empty, always in control of you.

I know this is of no use to you, but I cannot help posting, because I fear that he will still feel in control, that's why he is seemingly supportive. He is sure he can reel you in, not because he has always been able to, but because he is sure of his absolute dominance of you.

Don't let him support you on your way forward, don't let him know where you go. Please stop all contact, if you are going to do this for real, you can never go back to even speaking with him. Even though you feel you can, as a parasite he will latch on to you and break your determination again.

I'm sorry, I'm so gloomy but your story reads a psychological thriller, I so wish for you to break free and move forward Thanks.

This comment chilled me to the bone, but I sincerely appreciate you sharing it. In fact, this one almost stopped me dead in my tracks, because I can see exactly where you are coming from. I think this is the origin of my weird sense of dread. I am only now beginning to question why I have 'needed' his reassurance, for anything.

He hasn't actually eclipsed me or left me empty - knowing myself as I do........but you are right about the dominance. Absolutely. And that dominance has most likely created the self doubt and anxiety. I am aware of this, so it's a start.

For a long time I have considered my situation as symbolically jumping into the void, or leaping into an abyss. By that I mean something entirely positive, like a release from this endless pattern of cruelty. A new beginning, which is as terrifying as it is liberating. I have so much life and energy, and it only seems to irritate him. Perhaps he is disappointed that it can't be properly subdued?

I am giving this some thought, how to proceed in the safest and most beneficial way., as I move forward.

One thing: I am much less afraid, and a lot more aware of facing and embracing my fears. And these fears, I dare say, have kept me shackled all along. And I barely even know what they are.........your incest/parasite imagery made me feel extreme fear, and it is this that I need to stare in the face.

I also appreciate the poster who mentioned someone being there if I was ill or in need of help. I finally discussed this with my sister tonight and it felt good to get it out. When I am not prioritising him I do seem to relate to and get along with others so well. It is as if his influence over me buries my power and spark. So much to think about. Thank you:)

OP posts:
Acatchasingitsowntail · 06/06/2021 00:43

I apologise for going on and on Blush

But I really want to put this here, as I have only just thought about it. I am wondering if it may have some kind of connection to why I have been unable to cull this thing since it's difficult and painful early days.

Just prior to meeting him, a couple of friend and I were hitchhiking back from Glastonbury festival. Unfortunately we would up stuck in the back of a vehicle with a madman at the wheel, who, as well as almost speeding us off the road for 45 minutes, pulled a gun out of the glove box and held it at his GF's head for the duration.
By the time we exited the car, he'd laughed it off and asked us why we looked so shaken up. Nutter.

However, for a few weeks I was fairly shaken up. I was a tough cookie back then and barely anything bothered me, but this really set me on edge for awhile and I suffered my first panic attack.
And then he enters the scene, the knight in shining armour, took me under his wing and really helped me with the shock, etc.
A small inner voice warned me off him, that he was too full on, too intense....but within a few months I had moved into his place, and one by one, my friends were cancelled out. By the time I was 22 I barely knew anyone else and lived like a bit of a hermit. Not at all like who I had been before.

Now, did I come to depend upon him as a 'fixer' when he helped with my panic? I soon got over the panic attacks but may have then become somewhat dependent.
If anyone has advice on how to dismantle that particular 'schema' or weirdness, I would appreciate very much.

I must add that I do not perceive him as a safe haven nowadays, and havent since the early years of our relationship, but something may have stuck, something unconscious, perhaps.

Sorry this is so long!

OP posts:
iknowimcoming · 06/06/2021 01:25

Not sure if it's been suggested already but you might want to look at the freedom programme

Chocaholic9 · 06/06/2021 05:12

@Acatchasingitsowntail

I apologise for going on and on Blush

But I really want to put this here, as I have only just thought about it. I am wondering if it may have some kind of connection to why I have been unable to cull this thing since it's difficult and painful early days.

Just prior to meeting him, a couple of friend and I were hitchhiking back from Glastonbury festival. Unfortunately we would up stuck in the back of a vehicle with a madman at the wheel, who, as well as almost speeding us off the road for 45 minutes, pulled a gun out of the glove box and held it at his GF's head for the duration.
By the time we exited the car, he'd laughed it off and asked us why we looked so shaken up. Nutter.

However, for a few weeks I was fairly shaken up. I was a tough cookie back then and barely anything bothered me, but this really set me on edge for awhile and I suffered my first panic attack.
And then he enters the scene, the knight in shining armour, took me under his wing and really helped me with the shock, etc.
A small inner voice warned me off him, that he was too full on, too intense....but within a few months I had moved into his place, and one by one, my friends were cancelled out. By the time I was 22 I barely knew anyone else and lived like a bit of a hermit. Not at all like who I had been before.

Now, did I come to depend upon him as a 'fixer' when he helped with my panic? I soon got over the panic attacks but may have then become somewhat dependent.
If anyone has advice on how to dismantle that particular 'schema' or weirdness, I would appreciate very much.

I must add that I do not perceive him as a safe haven nowadays, and havent since the early years of our relationship, but something may have stuck, something unconscious, perhaps.

Sorry this is so long!

OP I recommend EMDR.
Wishingwell75 · 06/06/2021 10:33

I know it's a clunky, dramatic metaphor but it's impossible not to see the similarities between that terrifying 45mins in that car and the 28years you've spent with an invisible gun to your own head. Yes, your situation might initially seem to be less life threatening but you've spent long enough waiting for the other shoe to drop and find yourself out on your arse because your partner says it's so.
You don't mention what happened next but you must have been shocked if the girlfriend didn't get out of the car with you. As horrible as it sounds the best case scenario is that she was in on the "joke" and they thought they'd wind you all up. But whatever the true situation between them - it was very real for you and your friends and understandably a traumatic experience.

Because I only have the bare bones of both stories - (meaning the lift from hell and your relationship) it's easy to draw parallels; only you know the nuances, the good times between you and him. I do know that both situations could have ended about a million times worse; that you are lucky to be waking up to the reality of your circumstances now rather than in another ten years or so; in waking up at all. That you have so much going for you: you're very likeable, you have a creative talent that you actually can make an income from, a sister and close friends (even if not geographically close), money to get you started, I am assuming you are in good health(because you don't say otherwise) an area you really want to live in and most importantly an open heart that hasn't hardened or closed despite the cruelty you have endured.

Frankly OP, I am really excited for you!
I do think you should rethink the slow departure and just leave in one go, even if you can't go directly to Cumbria but maybe stay with your sister if possible or go and visit those friends.
Let's be honest, you're the one in control now and you can please yourself.

Lastly, you know how ridiculous it would sound if you had stayed in contact with the monster driving the car that day, yep, well that's how dangerous to you it will be to keep your DP (!) informed of any plans and indeed to keep in contact with him at all!
The very best of everything to you!

Estasala · 06/06/2021 11:39

From your updates he sounds like a horrible person devoid of empathy, and actually a bit scary.

Please leave quietly, but don't tell him your new address. Change your phone number.

Acatchasingitsowntail · 06/06/2021 12:52

What happened within a short time of vulnerability (panic and the car episode) seems to have been used to flatter and convince me of his importance in my life, and from then on I must have come to perceive him as someone I 'need' or have 'magical' connection to.

Awareness of this is vital. It feels like so much is shifting within me.

Thanks for the replies and recommendations, I will have a look!

OP posts:
Acatchasingitsowntail · 06/06/2021 14:39

Been reading some stuff recommended on this thread. Started with earliest from pages back - narc, devalue, hoover.
had never even heard of this stuff.
Can see enormous similarities, enough to make my head spin.

He once read all of my diaries, it was the most mortifying thing, and he never once apologised, he was looking for infidelities, of which there were none. But he found enough 'evidence' to go insane over it. At the time a friend made me pack a bag and go to say with her for a while.
He never apologised, just felt victimised. Christ. I am now really searching through time to discover why I put up with this.

I had nobody to truly compare his behaviour with. I think this sums a lot of it up, he sped into my life so fast, and so convincingly that I honestly just think I was too young and too open.

It is so odd to be reading stuff online that almost perfectly describes my life and I hadn't even heard of it!
Now I can see it, I certainly can't unsee it.
Gonna take time to process all of this. Slowly, I think, and carefully.

OP posts:
Carbara · 06/06/2021 14:57

I understand how interesting stuff about narcs is once you realise one has been destroying your life for their own pleasure, but don’t waste one more second on this bloke, you’ve thrown your entire life down the toilet, don’t waste any more of it.

RandomMess · 06/06/2021 15:42

He certainly has a view of himself that is not based in reality.

The victim, the amazing artist for whom life let him down and that's why he wasn't a success rather than not working hard enough and not building authentic relationships with others.

You seem entirely co-dependent.

YouGetUpNow · 06/06/2021 16:25

He keeps you wanting more by withdraw all the time... some sort of emotional vampire.

Yeah... just walk away and don’t look back. Clean slate.

Good luck in your new life OP.

Aspiringmatriarch · 06/06/2021 16:43

He keeps you wanting more by withdraw all the time...

I agree with this. He's unpredictable, which can be very addictive. I think it's called intermittent reward, there's research on it. I've definitely fallen into that trap before. The good thing is it sounds as if the 'rewards' are now so nonexistent that you've had a chance to step back and look at things more clearly. Be wary of him suddenly seeming really lovely and supportive when he feels you pulling away.

Acatchasingitsowntail · 06/06/2021 16:57

I wonder why I am able to perceive the totality of this now but not before, even though I've always thought I was intelligent, self aware and set good boundaries. Ha, not with him apparently. It is like having been inside with the enemy all along.
I did sense this, but a sort of felt human sympathy that did not allow me to see what I see now.

I agree with the above, that there's withdrawal and reward going on with him, definitely, I have always called this an 'austerity of care'.
I don't like to place people into diagnoses, but there's enough here to surprise me regardless.

I am definitely prepared for a love bomb session as he notices I am pulling away. I hope to god he's actually had enough, though.

I get the feeling nobody is convinced I am done with it, and I suppose after all these years that isn't surprising. To see this so clearly has allowed me to prioritise myself and to forgive myself, which was never really possible previously.
My friend called it 'having the courage to annihilate'. Give yourself permission, you know you want and need to. Yes indeed.

OP posts:
Aspiringmatriarch · 06/06/2021 17:06

I think sometimes you're just not ready until you're ready. Don't blame yourself for not seeing it, I think it's just a quirk of human nature that we can't see the people we love the way others would see them. Probably helpful at times, but not if you're with someone who is not basically a functioning and healthy, loving person.

takeabrolly · 06/06/2021 17:36

Op your story really resonates with me. I met my ex at a really vulnerable time in my life. He's much older and seemed to represent the security I needed. 30 years later we have separated and haven't spoken for over a year when out of the blue he made contact. I am very aware that he's shifting between being a victim and being nice and I can see how he's operating (a bit of distance is a wonderful thing). I find myself unable to go NC though and I don't know why. I don't think I'm getting anything out of this. My reason for telling you this is to say, don't be me. Cut off all contact. We are still tied through property that isn't sorted but you don't seem to have those links. Go and be free and live your best life!

Giantrooster · 06/06/2021 17:49

Please op, I know you need to understand and analyze. But as soon as you are a little bit ready break away.

Understand from afar, when you have read up on issues, tried to understand from what's online, please try to get a councellor to put things into perspective, helping you move forward. You can understand and recognize much from the internet, but if you shall be able to move on you need guidance and a helping hand in order not to go back or to repeat behavior with new people.

Acatchasingitsowntail · 06/06/2021 17:55

@takeabrolly

Op your story really resonates with me. I met my ex at a really vulnerable time in my life. He's much older and seemed to represent the security I needed. 30 years later we have separated and haven't spoken for over a year when out of the blue he made contact. I am very aware that he's shifting between being a victim and being nice and I can see how he's operating (a bit of distance is a wonderful thing). I find myself unable to go NC though and I don't know why. I don't think I'm getting anything out of this. My reason for telling you this is to say, don't be me. Cut off all contact. We are still tied through property that isn't sorted but you don't seem to have those links. Go and be free and live your best life!
Hi, I have BEEN you, for nearly 30 years.

Our longest separation was for an entire 2 years. He'd exploded over something fairly minimal and walked out on me. I'd even cried, hanging onto his coat, begging him not to go, to at least explain why. But no, off her went.
I was left distraught. For weeks I thought I was going insane, wondered if my mind was coming apart.

However, in time, with family and friends supporting my courage, I just got on with it and worked through the grief. Within 3 months I had started my own business, met some new friends and had quite a wonderful time discovering who I actually was.

After the years passed, I'd had a short LTR with a guy overseas online, was working hard and enjoying my life, when we eventually ended up chatting on the phone since one of our mutual friends had passed away.

That was all it took. He was back. And I went back to him. That old, easy, intimate friendship was just there, had a good laugh, he was so interested in how much I had changed.....ha.

Never think that a long distance heals this shit. It doesn't. It just endows them with shiny new armour and resolve. Nothing changes in that time. Nothing.

Best of luck, and thank you

OP posts:
Acatchasingitsowntail · 06/06/2021 17:57

short LDR, not LTR.

OP posts:
Acatchasingitsowntail · 06/06/2021 18:02

@Giantrooster

Please op, I know you need to understand and analyze. But as soon as you are a little bit ready break away.

Understand from afar, when you have read up on issues, tried to understand from what's online, please try to get a councellor to put things into perspective, helping you move forward. You can understand and recognize much from the internet, but if you shall be able to move on you need guidance and a helping hand in order not to go back or to repeat behavior with new people.

Thank you. Now, I would not have had patience to do this years ago. I am planning ringing my GP. I have two flats to enquire about and am terribly keen on one of them. I think it will continue to whizz around in my head over the next few days whether I like it or not, there are so many new realisations.......but I agree with you, and will proceed with caution. Wondering if I can pay for some short counselling.

And to update: I think he is ever so slightly noticing something. I am going with the flow and all is well. As I am not trying to reach him or communicate to any depth, he is just more or less hanging out in another room, passing the odd pleasantry ever so often.
But I can see that look in his eyes, his little sensor is whirring. I think he is beginning to notice something, but wont be able to place it.
Largely he seems very happy for me to be out of the way.

OP posts:
Giantrooster · 06/06/2021 18:13

Largely he seems very happy for me to be out of the way.

No, no, no this is (i think) his normal way of dominance... 'I don't care about you, indifferent' and you feel the need to please or fix or keep things on an even keel. Annd then your back where he wants you.

OP, if you can, don't make him realize you are changing, be as normal as possible and as soon as you are ready disappear. He will play you, even with your new realizations you are not far enough or strong enough to play this game yet.

Acatchasingitsowntail · 06/06/2021 18:20

@Giantrooster

Largely he seems very happy for me to be out of the way.

No, no, no this is (i think) his normal way of dominance... 'I don't care about you, indifferent' and you feel the need to please or fix or keep things on an even keel. Annd then your back where he wants you.

OP, if you can, don't make him realize you are changing, be as normal as possible and as soon as you are ready disappear. He will play you, even with your new realizations you are not far enough or strong enough to play this game yet.

This is what I am doing. The greater changes are within me, and im not sharing them, or reacting to anything. I actually have no wish to, which is good. He knows ive been sleeping badly lately so going with that as a reason for any alterations he might see in my behaviour. I really don't wish to have any further convo's with him about any of it. So im just bobbing along getting along with him.

Will be very careful x

OP posts:
Newestname001 · 06/06/2021 18:20

But I can see that look in his eyes, his little sensor is whirring. I think he is beginning to notice something, but wont be able to place it.

Be very careful, @Acatchasingitsowntail.

He has had decades of of practice in manipulating you and, it seems, no scruples. Don't leave around any unprotected devices or personal paperwork which might give him a sense of your plans. Check your devices are not electronically linked with his. Ensure the privacy settings on your smartphone (eg Location or Bluetooth) are switched off when you need total privacy.

Stay focused. 🌹

Giantrooster · 06/06/2021 18:20

Think of it this way, he has had 30 years of perfecting grooming you, shaping you, breaking you. You need to start realizing, break away, analyse, heel and down the line have therapy and even then you probably won't be strong enough to withstand his mind games which have been conditioning you most of your adult life.

Giantrooster · 06/06/2021 18:25

I think what many of us posters are trying to say, he is much more dangerous to you than you imagine. It's very chilling what he has done to another human being.

Peach01 · 06/06/2021 18:30

There seems to be a lot of negativity and it's a very long time to be off and on. At what point do you get tired of that?