He hesitated?

[stubbedtoe]

Basically this.

I've been in a classic "commitment phobe" relationship for two years and I finally gave him the "all or nothing" message.

I am not saying he wasn't committed in terms of dating other people and so on, but more in moving forward with major life commitments like moving in or buying a home.

He was always a good boyfriend, but he has an almost phobic reaction to serious commitment because he says in the past it's never worked out and he found it hard to leave so ended up miserable for years.

Initially, when I gave him the ultimatum, I cut off contact and within 36 hours he sent me a message to say he was so sorry, he really loved me, I was the love of his life and he wanted to spend the rest of his life with me. He even proposed and then started suggesting we look at houses together.

Then a couple of days later he seemed to second guess himself and asked for time and space away from each other so he could be sure his decision wasn't a knee-jerk reaction to the idea of losing me :(

I was devastated really by this. I felt a bit like surely you know if you love someone and want to be with them or not?

We are currently in "no contact", but he messaged me after 3 days to ask if I was okay and I didn't respond.

I am really confused here over whether or not I am being a big baby and maybe he is just being reasonable and taking time to think through a major life commitment.

OR

If a man loves you and wants to marry you, he bloody well knows it and doesn't need time and space to think about it.

What do you think? I am really confused over what to do when he comes back to me. He might come back and say he realises I am not the one (in which case no brainer) but if he comes back and says he wants to be with me and move forward, how do I react to that?

I feel a bit injured, ego wise and it's not exactly romantic.

It just shouldn't be this hard, I think you are getting some undeserved grief here. It sounds like you have been very patient and still it has boiled down to lose /lose. Don't get drawn into the sunken fallacy way of thinking, it's not ideal that this has taken 2 years to get to this but then again most of us have done bugger all for the last year anyway. Even if he comes back and says yes it doesn't sound that you could then be truly confident of him staying long term. He needs to work on himself and in the meantime you need to dust yourself down and carve a life without him which will probably bring you a partner who you are much more compatible with. Good luck x

I am so sorry I don't think he can give you what you want.
Something similar happened to my sister and she was with the guy for 6-10 years. When they broke up he met someone else within 3 months and within another 3 months he proposed to this new woman.
My sister was devesated for years but when she finally met her current husband she realised she was so much happier and he had actually done her a favour in the long run finally breaking up with her.
Your boyfriend is very comfortable with you and loves you but he is not acting like he wants to be with you with every fibre of his body.

You can be wonderfully compatible in some ways but then incompatible in others - he might never be able to commit in the way you want him to.

It doesn't mean he doesn't have genuine feelings for you or is commitment phobic - you are simply on different timetables.

I had this with my DH - he was just recently divorced when we met and wasn't sure if he wanted to ever get married again.

After we'd been dating a year and I was sure of my feelings I did lay out what my timetable was - I was in my mid 30s and I knew I wanted to have kids so there wasn't the luxury for me of waiting 'years' - I didn't make it a big drama and I was also resigned to the idea that if we weren't on that same path then we would have to split and while it might be sad it might just mean we weren't suited.

I said I definitely wanted to get married and I wanted to try for a child before my 40s, this was in the January and I said that by this time next year if we are not moving on to the next stage together, then I would have to move on on my own. I did stress how much I loved him and that it would be upsetting but that also there was no blame or shame on him if he simply didn't feel the same way.

Then I didn't mention it again. He proposed in late December - so took the whole year! We have been married 14 years now.

But I didn't make that ultimatum assuming I would have the outcome we did, I got myself into a place where I would have been sad but okay if it had gone the other way.

It doesn't sound like you really have come to terms with ending the relationship yourself if you need to. I think if you can get to a place where you are not angry with him if he cannot commit you'll get more closure.

I suspect this man is controlling the situation by keeping you permanently off-balance so he can take what he wants from the relationship without ever giving you what you need and deserve. It may not be conscious and deliberate manipulation, but whatever it is, it's clearly working for him because he keeps doing it. And you keep letting him, hoping this time he will change.

Have you noticed how none of it is ever his fault? It's always past lovers or you doing the wrong thing by him.

Enough is enough, now. It's been years; he's past 40 now and nothing is going to change. He'll talk the talk briefly but he'll never walk the walk. I think you're into damage limitation now and at risk of falling for the sunk costs fallacy (as in, I've spent years getting this far, I can't waste all that time and effort).

If you'd bought a dodgy car that turned out to need constant attention and was perpetually unreliable, you'd bin it and get a nice new one that met your needs, right? I think it's trade-in time for this relationship.

When are you going to start having some fun and why are you letting him spoil everything?

Sorry you are going through this OP, it sounds to me that you have been very patient but you can’t force it from him. It seems like he is just not ready for a real serious relationship and the commitment that goes with it and has a lot of work to do on himself first. You shouldn’t have to threaten to end things for him to agree to go on a mini break with you

It must be very exhausting for you but maybe it’s just not the right time for you and he isn’t in the right headspace to be able to give you what you need from a relationship

@AndeanMountainCat

Ditch him and look for someone else. It sounds painful, and life is too short for this nonsense.

Exactly this. Juvenile nonsense. Don’t waste any more time on a man who can’t make his mind up or sees you as one of many life options for him otherwise down the line you’ll regret throwing years at a man who was always a flake. I will never ever make that mistake again.

I’d be off OP

How are you going to feel I’m ten years time when you’re still babying this manchild?

It just struck me that this man may actually be carving out a FwB type of relationship with you while keeping you waiting for more. You've been surviving on crumbs for years now and that's not healthy.

Cabingirl, you should have given him 6 months, tops. ;)

This is really familiar, OP. Split up, get emotional begging emails, make promises, nothing happens. It's good you've had the discussions about the future but there's a lack of action from him with time drifting away. If you're hoping to have children then i'd say it's time to move away from this relationship.

I honestly do not know why you have persisted with this relationship, it has been so difficult right from the off. Relationships are not meant to be this hard.

Personally I would cut my losses and end it. Even if he comes back and says he wants to commit, I'd just be waiting for him to back off again. I would never trust him to commit to me, I'd always suspect that he was five minutes away from heading for the hills. I don't need that sort of instability in my life, I'd rather be single.

You just sound really incompatible.

Christ almighty OP - you are so deep in the fog of this nonsense you can't see the wood for the trees.

Really, none of this matters because you are very clearly not compatible at all. He is not ready and a few days to 'think it over' isn't going to fundamentally change him into the man who will give you what you want.

This whole situation screams that YOU also have issues, because you've been willing to put up with this for 2 WHOLE YEARS of your life, waiting months in between just trying to arrange a weekend away - this is really not normal at all. So why would you do that? There are no financial ties, no kids etc. So why would you keep waiting for months and months, waiting for someone to have therapy to 'fix' themselves. That's not how therapy works anyway - it's a journey that sometimes lasts years and years and it's not about fixing.

At best, this relationship is really quite toxic and you are both repressing your emotions and going through the motions of projecting and rejecting a future on loop. It sounds utterly exhausting.

From what you've said, there is no happy 'end point' where you walk off into the sunset with a committed stable future.

Walk away, get yourself some therapy to see why you've been willing to accept this relationship dynamic for 2 years+ and find someone who is on your wavelength.

Good luck x

Also, if I had a pound for every time I’ve seen a commitment-phobe man string a woman along for years saying things like “someday” or “I don’t know” or “let’s just be happy in the present” only for the relationship to eventually end and the guy marrying the next girl that he’s with almost instantly.

Get rid of him and his nonsense and find a guy who loves and respects you and actively wants nothing more than a future with you. This guy isn’t even giving you the minimal amount of respect and love and affection you deserve in a long term relationship. The endless indecision and self-indulgence and neuroticism would do my head in.

With all due respect, I think you need to stop wondering what he'll do and just end it for good. Don't feel guilt that you will have knocked him back because he's afraid you'll leave him. That's his issue to deal with. He is responsible for his commitment phobia, not you.

I dated a guy very similar to this. He would ask for a break so he could think about what he wanted, then would cave and be the one to call me after a day or two. He basically just wanted to keep me on the hook. I ended it permanently, and he ofc begged for another chance. But I was tired of playing games and felt so much better ending things on my terms rather than waiting for him to take action (either break up or commit). And the funny thing about getting a commitment phobe to commit is that you never really feel secure that this is what they want, that you're the one they want. It's a horrible way to live.

You need to worry about your future and your happiness. Unfortunately I don't see either of those including him.

I'm sorry, OP, but I don't buy the commitment-phobe bullshit. People are only "phobic" about committing to individuals they know they deep down that they don't want to spend the rest of their life with.

I joked with someone who asked me out for a drink that I was a commitment phobe. He laughed and said "Well, I am too, but it's only a drink!" So we went for a date, all casual, the evening flew by with us talking all night and getting on so well. 24 years later we have been married for 21 years and have 2 kids. When we met, both of us had been only into casual relationships as we are good judges of character, and knew exactly what we were looking for in a partner and don't take any messing or mind games from a partner either.

We were together for a year when he proposed out of the blue and I didn't hesitate to accept. He talked about a previous partner who wanted to get engaged, move in together, the lot, but he wasn't keen and labelled himself in his head as a commitment-phobe. He says in hindsight after meeting me that it was clearly just because he didn't want to settle down with HER. There was no flakiness or doubts where I was concerned whatsoever, and neither was there with me for him.

I do think life stages REALLY matter when it comes to relationships. If both partners have had previous serious relationships/marriages, kids etc and are in their 40s then it can make sense to be much more careful and pragmatic about living arrangements. I totally can understand those people later in life who want to keep separate houses and just have a regular partner. If both people are happy with that then all's good, isn't it?

But when one wants the whole settling down, traditional relationship with marriage and kids and the other puts it off, then it's usually down to this: either the man is in his early 40s, knows deep down that his partner isn't "the one" but thinks he's probably missed the boat now to find her so may as well toddle on like he is, with the relationship on a more casual, dating kind of thing (but with a bit of dramatic and deep conversation thrown in every now and again to attempt to convince her that he's serious about her)

Or, the woman is late 30s and concerned about her fertility and actually knows deep down that her partner isn't really the one but he is a decent man who professes to love her etc so she can't see anything wrong with trying to push the relationship onto the next level.

OP, you just both sound very mismatched with how you really feel, and what you really want.

Haven't read the full thread, but I'd bet you were a number of years younger than him and feeling the urge to settle down and have a baby.

I think you KNOW deep down that you should cut ties with him once and for all. No relationship should consist of actively PUTTING OFF going away with someone for the weekend - that's nuts! It should be the total opposite! Same for meeting family. You can't wait to introduce the love of your life to your family usually, you're so keen for them to meet.

I don't think you're the love of his life, sadly, no matter what crap he tells himself, and you.

Your boyfriend is very comfortable with you and loves you but he is not acting like he wants to be with you with every fibre of his body.

This. I wrote a whole waffly post when this perfect sentence says it all.

Time to ditch and move on.

Ok, you’ve said he’s 41, but you purposely haven’t said how old you are or mentioned if your future goals include having children, or is it just buying a house and taking holidays together?

If you do want a family, I think you’re probably wasting your time with this man. The last thing you need when you’re pregnant is a commitment phobe who leaves you high and dry!

@NewlyGranny

It just struck me that this man may actually be carving out a FwB type of relationship with you while keeping you waiting for more. You've been surviving on crumbs for years now and that's not healthy.

Cabingirl, you should have given him 6 months, tops. ;)

Lol! Possibly but we were having such an amazing fun and full relationship that I thought a year of enjoying myself wasn't a hardship.

In fact, my 'ultimatum' wasn't a cut off completely situation - in my head, I thought if he didn't want to 'move on to the next stage' then I'd downgrade him to a FwB level (the sex was great) while starting to date again. He really was a fantastic boyfriend - and I honestly think that if we had split we'd have stayed lifelong friends.

Actually, that's just struck me about the difference between that and the OP - she doesn't seem like she's having much fun now and I'm not sure that's likely to improve with all the stresses and strains which come with life/marriage usually anyway.

End the relationship. For your own self-respect.

OP, if he does come back and you do decide to give it another try, make sure he puts his money where his mouth is this time! Proper commitment or show him the door.

Not everyone wants that level of commitment and there is NOTHING wrong with that .
But they guy must feel like he's a gun to his head if anything ultimatums to people who don't want to commit never end well.

He is being sensible. You have only been in a relationship for 2 years! Why rush into marriage and buying a house together? Do you currently live together 24/7? If not, how do you know you’re compatible? You are really pushy.

41 year old commitment phobe, he needs to get a grip and you need to see that this is a waste of your time.

These commitment phone men are capable of commitment when they meet the right one...I've seen it happen time and again, they string someone along for years then when they meet the right woman they settle down very quickly. This sounds horrible but I think you're his for now girl as a lot of men don't like being alone.

Please don't waste your life waiting for him to decide, he probably will never give you what you want and will keep making empty promises.

You aren't compatible and your relationship has gone into a spiral of toxic behaviour. This is not how good, healthy relationships are conducted. I'm afraid that this one is a goner. End it and move on. When you are in a healthy relationship, you will look back at this and realize just how wrong it was.