Difficult family situation

[baldafrique]

Wondering if anyone can advise on a tricky and long-standing family situation that has been stressing me out for years...

When I was about 12 (I'm now 33!) I was told by my DM that my younger brother (then 10) had been diagnosed with Aspergers. This was due to me starting to ask why he was different - never had any friends at all, other kids constantly asking me what was "wrong with him" , realised I had been part of some assessment process for him. My DM blurted it out to me and told me to NEVER tell anyone and make sure I never mentioned it to my DF either as he would be angry she had told me. Since then, I've had a few chats with her about it and it turns out my parents decided to not ever tell my brother he has ASD as they didnt want him to feel "labelled". He went to mainstream school and did well academically and has a great job now and his own house but his social relationships have continued to be poor and he has never had a partner or anything. More recently, my DM has told me that she actually did press for my brother to be told but my DF "forbade it" and basically told her that if there was fall out from telling him then it would be her fault. Its since become REALLY obvious that my DF has Aspergers himself (my DM agrees) and is worse affected than my brother even. His behaviours have always been quite extreme and I've spent my life trying to work out why he isnt like other fathers in so many ways. My DM is completely controlled by it all - she constantly walks on eggshells but feels she can never pull him up on his behaviour as "he gets so nasty" (verbally) and also "I guess he cant help it anyway as he likely has ASD so what's the point". She doesnt dare mention the possibility of ASD to him as apparently he would go ballistic. I can well imagine this - the whole family tip toes around him and his peculiarities. He is very obsessional and controlling and anxious. But refuses to do anything about it at all.

The whole situation gets me down so much and I dont even know why. I think it's the way everyone in the family is constantly pussyfooting around someone who doesnt even have a formal diagnosis and would refuse to get one. I also feel so guilty knowing my DB has ASD when he doesnt know himself and guilty ever confiding in people about this (eg my DH) as I feel I'm betraying my DM who is in a shit position herself.

Any thoughts would be so welcome - I can see the woods for the trees here :(

A few times my friends have seen weird stuff (like if on holiday with us) and that was always really comforting, strangely

There are two separate issues here.

Firstly, your parents are responsible for their own lives, and as harsh as it is, your mum has made her choices, and it’s up to her how to live with those choices. You can’t make her decisions for her.

So I would just say that they’re unlikely to go to the wedding because your dad is always difficult about these things. It’s unlikely anyone would say anything to him about it, they would just nod and understand because every family has someone who is “difficult”.

As for your brother, his diagnosis is no longer your parents’ secret to keep. He’s an adult now and would be perfectly entitled to find out the truth about himself. He could even go for a diagnosis himself or alternatively what happens if he requests his medical notes one day and all this is revealed.

I would honestly tell him. Not because you feel he might change because of it, but because he has the right to know, and you are no longer responsible for keeping it secret.

Remember, if he does find out, it’s not just your parents he will cut off, he will cut you off as well because you’ve always known. So better to tell him first before he gets the chance to find out.

@OnlyInYourDreams
He has to have medicals with his work so it is a matter of time I think before he sees his notes. Re wedding I agree being honest with in laws about how DF is difficult is the best way - I find it quite embarrassing but I guess it's not my embarrassment to hold.

You could approach this backwards. Chat to your brother about how batshit your parents are and how they are unlikely to change, and brainstorm some strategies for accepting and dealing with them.
Once you are reasonably confident that neither of you would take any major steps with regards to your parents without first talking it through with the other - so at the very least you get a heads-up, THEN stage 2.

"Bro, you know the parents are weird and disfunctional, so I expect you'll be angry rather than surprised..."
And then talk him through the timeline of what you remember - who said what and when. So you might start with your memories of being involved in some assessment and then cover the talks you've had with your relatives in chronological order. So he gets to find stuff out at least in the same sequence as you did.
As part of this, there will be a point where you say, "I felt it would be useful for you to know this too, and told Mum I thought this, and she said" (what she did say) "and I feared" (whatever you feared) "and so I didn't say anything then".
At the end, talk him through why you changed your mind - what you think he might do with the information which will enrich his life, vs what you fear might happen with the parents.
Maybe have your aunt and/or DH there too because so he can confirm stuff with them.

Then ask him to think about this for a week or two before deciding what to do - talk it over with a third party, maybe someone at work.

I agree with you that as your brother is expected to survive your DF by ~30 years and so has a LOT more time to change, and as you and your DH get on with him, this should be brought up.
I also agree that it's something to approach with a lot of sensitivity and forethought.

It really is your best guess though as you know all the people concerned and we don't! Good luck.

It is quite possible, likely even, that your brother already knows about himself - it is not hard to figure out, especially if his job means he is familiar with the condition. Maybe he just doesn't feel the need to get a formal diagnosis.

@123344user I think something like that approach could work really well, thank you so much for your ideas

Somebody I worked with had behaviours and traits that are very common in Autistic people.

After about a year when he was having problems at work that were potentially going to get him managed out (well, more problems than usual, at any rate), I asked him 'Why not go to the thing and ask them if your being Autistic has anything to do with it?'.

We carried on talking, he looked into it, got officially rediagnosed (as a vague memory of an assessment as a child was outright denied by his mother when he asked her about it) and not only were his work problems sorted as he now had some degree of protection from legislation, he said it was much nicer for him to know that problems could be attributed to his Autism instead of 'Nobody likes me'.

I'd be very tempted to say to your DB that you know somebody who has been assessed as autistic as adults and they've found it helpful to understand some of their difficulties. You might find that it's crossed his mind more than once, especially as he sounds very aware.

As for your mother and father, well, they've made the decision to harm your brother. You don't have to.

@baldafrique, dysfunctional families thrive on secrecy and misplaced shame. Somewhere inside you, you instinctively know that honesty is the best policy in this. It's the years of browbeating by your DF that is preventing you telling your brother the truth and with that comes all the angst and worry of trying to find a solution without setting him off. You are scared of him. Everyone around him is bearing the brunt of that too and being forced to accommodate and enable his behaviour. But do you know what it's not your shame, it's your DFs and his problem to deal with.

My FOO has been decimated by my DMs promiscuity and manipulations. I finally got the courage to call her out on it in my forties. It was the most freeing action ever. If asked I tell the truth and no longer carry the shame of her behaviour. It didn't cure the dysfunction, it's bigger and more entrenched a problem for one person to cure but I don't have to tiptoe round the bullshit.

Tell people, tell your brother. It's not your DFs right to hide it so he continue hiding. Let your DF deal with it. It's his problem. You aren't losing anything because it's toxic already.

@Beancounter1
It is definitely possible. He may wonder why parents have never mentioned it to him. He definitely remembers the assessment as he remembered a few years ago us going there. Just didnt mention knowing what it was for. And obvs it was many years ago now like mid 90s.

What a terrible situation and how awful you have been put in this position, that was a terrible thing for your mother to do to you and your brother. Her first duty is to her children, not her abusive husband, and she has treated you both terribly. There are so many ways in which your brother will be struggling, probably many you aren't even aware of. Once he has a better chance of understanding himself, he will be able to manage all his issues a lot better and have greater self acceptance. There's no point dropping hints to him if he has Asperger's, he won't pick up on them. Directly factual communication will be best. I agree with what 123344user suggested. It sounds to me like your father might already know he's on the spectrum and fears that people will see it as a weakness. He sounds abusive though, not just ASD. It's terrible that your mother has made you carry this secret all these years, twisted even. It shouldn't be your responsibility to tell him, but I think you have to. Perhaps your mother told you so it would become your job rather than hers.

I also wondered if he might know about his diagnosis already. Or suspect it. I wouldn’t bring it up in relation to your dad being ‘odd’ because your dad sounds abusive. And you wouldn’t want your brother to think that he was like that.

Re in-laws, I agree. Just say ‘dad won’t come, he’s not really into socialising. Hopefully mum will though’. No big deal.

Secrets are toxic. Imagine the freedom of not having any. Nothing to hide.

@Novelusername
I think she regretted telling me as soon as she did - and it was after a hell of a lot of badgering by me about why my DB struggled with stuff. But at the same time I think it was kind of a relief for her that someone else knew (in addition to my auntie, who was also told not to tell anyone!). I think for years she convinced herself that is was right not to tell him, eg all that dont want to make him feel different or labelled (a load of crap, obviously) but later admitted she did want to tell him but DF was so so adamant that it was the wrong thing to do. I think they also got fuck all support after the diagnosis which obviously didnt help. Yeah DF definitely knows deep down he is on the autistic spectrum too but avoids anything difficult and just shuts down and refuses to discuss. A bit like refusing to come to the anniversary party or to discuss it. Just total refusal.

@SwanShaped It would be heaven. Secrets are hideous.

What a nightmare.

What has struck me most is how much pain and discomfort your father is causing all of those around him.

Your mother and brother, obviously.

You.

Your in-laws.

It'll get passed on to your children too, you know. You'll do your best to shield them - but you won't be able to stop it.

Your father is a huge problem. He may well have ASD - but he's horrifically, painfully controlling of anyone who falls in his path and is unable to escape.

I think the first step is to acknowledge the burden you are carrying. The damage he inflicts on you.

Then you can move on to thinking about the damage for your brother and mother.

You are still in the mode of trying to manage the damage.

You're thinking about strategies to look after your mother - manage the damage in their relationship. Which of course leads to you helping maintain his relationship with your mother and your relationship with them.

Ironically, all that managing actually helps maintain his really awful, damaging control of all of you.

So, actually, I think you need to start thinking, 'What will help me and my important relationships (husband, children)?'

Clearly, the lie you're being asked to keep about your brother is a massive source of stress for you.

So is making excuses for your father.

Test things.

Stop keeping secrets about him from you in-laws. See what happens.

I suspect that, for all the fall-out, it will be better for you to stop.

Likewise, the 'secret' about your brother.

Incidentally, that secret effectively separates you from your brother. And severs the relationship between your brother and his mother.

It effectively diverts all these relationships through concern fir your father's choices.

It's power and control.

No wonder it makes you feel stressed.

Your father comes first, his choices separate your birth family, and there is a constant threat of 'punishment' (of your mother) that keeps all of this in place.

It's horrible.

You poor thing.

20 years of that.

No wonder it's stressful.

I think it's amazing you're here, thinking things through. It's a remarkable step to take - seriously.

Good luck with whatever you do.

OP, my DS1 has ASD and is in his thirties, so I have some insight into the condition. One thing I would like to say is please make sure that your brother doesn’t jump to the conclusion that, if he and your Dad are both Autistic, then he is like your Dad. ASD presents quite differently in each person.

I wouldn’t want your brother to think that he must also have his Dad’s worst traits!

They really are. But you don’t have to play along. It will feel terrifying and like you’re unmoored when you start to change family patterns of behaviour. So just take it steady and so it bit by bit.

Perhaps I was being a bit hard on your mum, then. I imagine there would have been much less support and awareness back in the day. I just feel so bad for you and your brother. If he remembers the assessment he might know already, but maybe not. I think you need as much support as you can get so make sure you reach out to people who can help, professionals perhaps.

What thecatfromjapan said. Start with you. And your needs. Everything is just about your dad and you being responsible for holding it all together so that everyone can pretend to be happy families. Sounds like you bear a lot of the weight of your family’s difficulties.

I'm not sure you should tell your DB, or at least be mindful he could be very angry and upset that you have withheld it from him all these years. It's not unlikely he may have considered it himself anyway, as ASD is quite well known these days, and he could seek his own diagnosis if he wished (maybe he has?). Also he may have worked out his own strategies for coping with life, or read up on them? One of my nephews is possibly ASD but by the time his parents realised, wouldn't have cooperated with seeing anyone. They haven't told him he is but he made a joke about it, so is presumably aware of the possibility. He doesn't work in a related field. Another family member may also be ASD and I'm sure will have considered the possibility, but I would raise it with him. He understands himself very well.

Your DF is a different case. Everyone with autism is different but it sounds like other factors are at play with him. People don't need a label to notice odd behaviours. And a labell doesn't explain everything away.

I'm bemused that a 35th wedding party was organised for man who hates / fears social gatherings- why? Surely if a couple throw a party both should be wanting to? And why should anyone else be able to insist on them celebrating their own anniversary?

I think you should let all your (adult) family members hey on with their lives. Tell your bil your DF doesn't like social gatherings and won't accept the invitation - that's all you have to say. Presumably he's only inviting your parents out of politeness?

PS I was teaching in the 90s and it's true there was little awareness of autism or availability of support. My only knowledge then was of the more extreme kind where people may have little or no language skills and be seen as very definitely having distinct special needs, as opposed to being quirky, odd or a bit different. I taught children like that and none of understood what the issue was for them.

Why is it hush hush
It is this reason people need to be open and honest
We all talk about being accepting of illness and conditions yet here is yet another case "to be kept quiet" pretend all is ok.

Oh I just read the part DM shredded up the clinic diagnoses that's very strange
What Are they scared or afraid of exactly?
Unreal! To say the least

@Onelifeonly
I know! It was a total and utter mistake. So it was suggested by some extended family and he went along with it but said he didnt want to be part of the planning or organising, then nearer the time tried to cancel it (like a week before) but my mum told him it was too late as all the food was ordered and people invited so he was stuck really...so just didnt come and stayed upstairs. I think that was a turning point for her realising how bad his problems were really. It was actually their 25th anniversary so a big one. I said 35th to change a detail for the thread (anxiety!). He always said he would never walk me down the aisle or do a speech if I got married or even want to attend really and I used to find that pretty upsetting. So yeah he hates social events big time.

@cupoftea2021
I know! She had the clinic paperwork for ages (and lots of other stuff pertaining to the diagnosis, I guess the school stuff so he got support in class) and shredded it in case they died and my bro found it during a house clearance! I was like WHAT.

@thecatfromjapan Thank you, your post really touched me. I'm crying a few tears here, healthy tears. I completely agree, the sphere of control is huge, the whole family works around him and his difficulties and wants and needs. But this has all been enabled by my mother. It didnt need to happen. Esp with children. We were constantly told not to stress him out and not to expect much of him and not to make any demands of him and what not...constant "he cant help it".

I actually feel really angry towards my DM sometimes about all of this.