Does love come back/what do I do

[helplesshopeless]

Nc for this.

Advice needed please, I've created a huge mess and can't see a way out/what is for the best. This may be long.

I am married with a 3yo. DH has always had a nasty temper, I've suggested anger management counselling numerous times but to no avail. The last few years since having my child have been really difficult. He's generally spoken to me with contempt and disdain a lot of the time, with occasional temper flashes, arguments are always toxic, things could get very nasty (never physical). On a day to day basis we would be civil enough to eachother, but nasty looks and snappiness from him were definitely daily as well, with bigger flare ups fairly regularly. We have had happy family times too and we both dote on our child.

All of this treatment from my DH culminated in my withdrawing from him and ultimately having an affair the last few months, with someone who made me feel loved and cared for. It was mainly an emotional affair but there was a small amount of physical contact (we did not have sex). This is someone that I work with, so although we're wfh at the moment, he is in team zoom meetings etc.

My DH found everything out last week. He is angry but also devastated. I have never seen him so upset and it has shocked me that he cares that much about me. He has completely woken up to how he's been treating me and is committed to having anger management therapy and working on things with me. I obviously am ashamed of what I have done and there is no excuse for my behaviour, but he does recognise that his treatment of me took me to a place where I was open to someone else. I still can't believe I had an affair because it is so against my morals and I fully deserve to be judged for it.

We are working on things and will get relationship counselling. There's a lot of self esteem issues that my husband struggles with, especially since we had our child as he's felt like he's been stuck on the outside looking in, and he thinks this is why he's been treating me how he has. I do understand this and it makes sense, but it doesn't change how he's treated me in the past and how damaging I have found it.

My husband wants me to leave my work so there's no interaction with the other man. I totally understand his point but am reluctant to do this as I'd then feel trapped.

I want to get back to a happy place with my husband. I don't want to feel trapped with him. I don't know if I can find my way back to loving him, whether all of this is coming too late after years of awful treatment. I accept I have behaved in a disgusting way and deserve all of this fall out, and am so worried about the impact on our child and how I'd manage if we separate. I am also concerned about the impact on my husband if things don't work as he has been explaining how it will crush him and he'd never be able to trust anyone again if we don't manage to work through this.

I just don't know if my heart is in this anymore, I want to be able to be happy with him and love him and our family deserves for me to work on this and fully commit to getting back on track, but I have no idea if I'll ever get back to where I need to be.

I am ashamed to admit I still have feelings for the other guy. I could obviously never be with him anyway so that is irrelevant, but it's clouding my judgement. I need to hear from people who have learnt to love their husbands again. Is that a thing? Will we ever get there?

I still can't believe any of this is happening.

@Strawberriesandcreams - I totally know what you mean but I do think this is a bit different (giving OP the benefit of the doubt). Being around a very critical and angry woman is horrible, but being around a very angry man is terrifying in a whole different way. And I guess when it comes down to it, I don't think we can just say that relationships ending per se is bad, when the relationship is clearly as unhappy as this one is.

@helplesshopeless - I know what you mean about your child but even if you split up she will still have happy times and there's no reason why you can't still hang out as a three. Do you want her to grow up to think tiptoeing around Dad's moods and "faking it" in terms of happiness in order to keep the peace is the way to live?

Interesting about your friends. I like a lot of my friends' partners but there are certainly a couple I've seen a nastier side to - one of them in particular I've seen give my friend dressing downs about things in a really horrible way. If she told me she was fed up and leaving with her small baby, I'd be with her all the way!

He's always treated our child well and loves her to pieces, and is genuinely a good dad.

That may be so but how he treats you is her relationship model going into her future. Please don't do that to her.

And don't leave your job! That will also be her future modelling, to see that women are strong and independent even if the relationship breaks down.

We had another chat last night and he said that our child is so important that even if we didn't love eachother (although he says he does love me) we should stay together for them, and behave in a pleasant way together, to keep the family together and give a stable upbringing. I feel so selfish for disagreeing with that but surely that's no way to live! Seems to be a recipe for disaster to me.

our child is so important that even if we didn't love eachother (although he says he does love me) we should stay together for them, and behave in a pleasant way together, to keep the family together and give a stable upbringing
This is very holier-than-thou, isn't it?
So when he was venting his anger on you before, not behaving pleasantly, risking breaking the family apart and giving your child a very unstable upbringing, was that because your child wasn't important back then?

Yes, I did say something along those lines in response but then he rightly pointed out that I wasn't putting my child first when I had my affair

I think the way you're writing about him suggests that you are just going through the motions of trying to make things work. You talk about keeping up pretences, and "not giving him any emotion."

It's quite possible that you checked out emotionally years ago, and with good reason.

It's great that he is now keen to do differently, but he's like that with a gun to his head. He's also holding a gun to yours. I don't have a lot of hope for things once you both lose sight of this crisis situation.

Don't beat yourself up for the affair. Things had to come to a head one way or another. The other man is not a real solution, so don't be distracted by that red herring. He just helped you to visualise alternatives in life, and that's a good thing.

As the adult child of a mother who stayed for the sake of the children, please please please don't do that.

Good luck, OP

It's very clear from an outside perspective that your relationship is over.
Your ex is desperate to hang on to you and trying every trick in the book. Frankly, saying stay together to keep a stable home for a 3 yr old is absurd. Live another 15 years at least with an aggressive, abusive man who you have fallen out of love with?
Find your strength and put an end to the charade.

Well that didn't take long. So much for not throwing the OM in your face.

OP, if you stay you will be signing up for years of being beaten with that stick (verbally at least).

The numbness, especially around sex, is your body's way of protecting you. Because your soul would howl in pain if allowed.

We had another chat last night and he said that our child is so important that even if we didn't love eachother (although he says he does love me) we should stay together for them, and behave in a pleasant way together, to keep the family together and give a stable upbringing.

This is so manipulative it's unreal.

Staying in this relationship isn't your penance for having had an affair OP. You need to forgive yourself.

@helplesshopeless

Yes, I did say something along those lines in response but then he rightly pointed out that I wasn't putting my child first when I had my affair

It's not a game of Top Trumps. Your affair doesn't exonerate him from his shit behaviour. He doesn't get to blackmail you into staying by claiming the supposed moral high ground and making you out to be a bad parent if you leave. The claim that your child will be better off living in an intact family is totally bogus when the "intact" home is riddled with anger, shame, hate and disrespect.

His claim that he loves you is clearly nonsense, and being used to manipulate you by making it appear as if he is a better person than you, so that you feel ashamed. Presumably he knows you well enough to realise that that's a good tactic to use.

He's generally spoken to me with contempt and disdain a lot of the time, with occasional temper flashes, arguments are always toxic, things could get very nasty [...] nasty looks and snappiness from him were definitely daily as well, with bigger flare ups fairly regularly.
This is not love.

@helplesshopeless

We had another chat last night and he said that our child is so important that even if we didn't love eachother (although he says he does love me) we should stay together for them, and behave in a pleasant way together, to keep the family together and give a stable upbringing. I feel so selfish for disagreeing with that but surely that's no way to live! Seems to be a recipe for disaster to me.

Translation: I love so I've decided even if you don't love me, you have to stay and pretend or you're a shit selfish parent.

Wow. Cannot get my head round him actively wanting you to pretend all is well, carry on sleeping together, living together, being "pleasant" when he knows you want out. Can you hear how psychopathic this sounds? "Never mind your feelings, continue your wife function."

oh @helplesshopeless i recognise so much of this - i have been/am in a very similar situation. give yourself the time and space you need to feel your own feelings, not the ones he's saying you should have. i think the separation suggestion is a really good one

Have you spoke to the other man what will happen if you separate from your DH.
Is he married or single
Can you handle not seeing your child everyday when she will be going from house to house.
What will happen if your DH meets someone else and she is spending time with your child
So much to splitting up.
Do what is right for you.

You know what dear, walk away, walk far far away. If you were in love with this other man you'd have left the husband a long time ago, the fact you haven't speaks volumes. You did find someone to comfort and emotional support you but doubt you love that person. Love is complex and easily confused with other emotions, your head is all over the place in confusion and it can become dangerous for your mental health. What you do not love is your husband that is a fact, long will it be before you seek a new emotional crutch. You're an adult and you shouldn't play games, seek out happiness being a strong independent woman then find love, don't get into messes that leave you trapped and a mental wreck

How are you doing @helplesshopeless? Thinking of you

Please. Do not sell your soul to keep the status quo.

Deep inside you, you have known for a long time that your love for this man has died.

Be aware that he is emotionally manipulating you now. He is not listening to you. It is all about him trying to maintain the power in the relationship but all wrapped up in ‘reasonable’ arguments. The bit about he wants to try to reconcile but the relationship might be over by the time you want to try is a line my ExH tried on me. Take a step back and see how coercive that line is in itself.

Any decent man would give you the space you need. No pressure or timeline. The fact that you are scared to leave speaks volumes. I spent years in a relationship where l sacrificed myself in order to be part of a family unit. I now look at old photos and feel no happiness. Just a memory of me not really being there in an authentic way - a bit frozen, going through the motions.

I understand how difficult it is to see things clearly, to understand how bad it is, it takes time to unravel the years of toxic communication. Your counsellor will help but again it will take time to sort through your thoughts - be very very kind and gentle with yourself. Keep posting xx

I'm in a very similar position. Emotional affair but nothing happened with other guy. Past awful treatment and temper from dp. At least we're not married, you have my sympathies there. I am not sure that love can come back after mistreatment. I've been thinking about it for a long time now and I am fed up of worrying about what kind of mood dp is going to be in. He's ruined it imo. Same applies to you and your husband, if he hadn't treated you badly then you wouldn't have drifted away.
Definitely don't quit your job either. Keep your financial independence, you will most likely need it very soon.

Also read ‘Should l stay or should l go’ by Lundy Bancroft. Very useful self help book with clear practical exercises to do that will really help you separate the fog from the reality.

Thank you so much everyone for your messages. It's hard for me to find time alone to respond to them properly but I do read them all (repeatedly!). Thank you @TheThermalStair for checking up on me, that's so kind.

I don't have much time now to respond individually, but @Whatdirection I have downloaded that book!

I'm doing ok, had my first therapy session this morning which was helpful in the sense of validating my feelings, but not in terms of helping me reach a decision (can't really expect much from one 50min session I suppose!) Mainly consisted of me providing background to our relationship- I kept defending him and repeating that he isn't abusive, but she kept stopping me and saying that the examples I'd given were abuse, and she was appalled at how I'd been treated. So I'm going round in circles still!!

We had a big fight the other night which resulted in him saying he was filing divorce, and that he wanted 50% custody. That idea of losing 50% was heartbreaking. The next morning he was keen to work on things again and has promised he won't threaten divorce again like that. He is all over the place at the moment too, understandably after what I've done.

I'm still feeling absolutely smothered, don't get a single moment to myself as he is so keen to either discuss things, vent at me, or just be together.

Anyway, I'll try and respond in more detail to each of your recent comments tomorrow during work

He will always hold this against you Def don't give up your job. You only have one life. It was miserable with your husband and in a few years it probably will be again. Do what you want to do and not what you think you should do. You deserve to be happy

I'm still feeling absolutely smothered, don't get a single moment to myself as he is so keen to either discuss things, vent at me, or just be together.

This in itself tells you everything. It's all about what he wants.

He has absolutely no fucking interest in what is best for you or what you want. It's a very clear sign of his contempt and disdain for you and your needs.

He is utterly self centred. A relationship will never work with him unless you are prepared to do exactly as he wants all the time. You are not a person to him.

We had another chat last night and he said that our child is so important that even if we didn't love eachother (although he says he does love me) we should stay together for them, and behave in a pleasant way together, to keep the family together and give a stable upbringing

We had a big fight the other night which resulted in him saying he was filing divorce, and that he wanted 50% custody. That idea of losing 50% was heartbreaking.

Do you see how he is weaponising the children against you? That's not the action of a good father. That's his last roll of the dice to keep you in your place.

What's happening about the trial separation? It sounds like your desperately need some space to just decompress and think. Give permission to yourself to do that without feeling guilty about it. You are not responsible for his feelings.

I'm still feeling absolutely smothered, don't get a single moment to myself as he is so keen to either discuss things, vent at me, or just be together.
Earlier, you said "I don't think he's trying to manipulate me". Manipulation doesn't have to be a deliberate plan that someone has sat down and worked out. Manipulative people often just do what comes naturally to them. Some (not all) might not even be consciously aware of their manipulation. But this is manipulation. He can't stand the idea of you getting out of his grip and is staying as close as you as possible, getting in your head constantly, so that he has more influence over your behaviour and thoughts.

Threats make people panic, and panicked thinking is not logical. Realistically, a) what are the chances he even wants 50:50; b) what are the chances he'd get it and c) what would 50:50 actually mean for you and your child? What would it look like in another 5, 10 years' time?

My bf actually has his daughter 50:50 (having previously been the main carer). Both parents have lots of "quality time" with her and a few evenings for themselves. They broke up in the same circumstances as you when their dd was 4. Now it's 7 years later and this is the only arrangement their dd can remember; it's normal to her.

Earlier, you said "I don't think he's trying to manipulate me". Manipulation doesn't have to be a deliberate plan that someone has sat down and worked out. Manipulative people often just do what comes naturally to them. Some (not all) might not even be consciously aware of their manipulation. But this is manipulation. He can't stand the idea of you getting out of his grip and is staying as close as you as possible, getting in your head constantly, so that he has more influence over your behaviour and thoughts.

This is so accurate - he's not doing this in a spiteful or controlling way consciously I don't think, but he is definitely feeling heartbroken and desperate. Last night I said I didn't want any further discussions as needed to chill, but we ended up having a 90 min convo where he was desperately trying to convince me that I could still love him, we could have an amazing life together and have so much together that would be a total waste to throw away. He even said he feels like he needs to keep telling me this to stop me slipping away. It's so difficult to keep my own head straight when he's talking like this as I can definitely feel myself being persuaded by his logical arguments.

Do you see how he is weaponising the children against you? That's not the action of a good father. That's his last roll of the dice to keep you in your place

Yeah, I have no idea what his game was there, perhaps he was just being genuine in that he didn't want anything less than 50% if we didn't stay as a family.

What's happening about the trial separation? It sounds like your desperately need some space to just decompress and think

Don't think that's going to be happening 

This in itself tells you everything. It's all about what he wants. .He has absolutely no fucking interest in what is best for you or what you want. It's a very clear sign of his contempt and disdain for you and your needs

Yes we definitely have very opposite needs at the moment!!! It is just really unfortunate that I had my affair as that makes this even more difficult to navigate, he is obviously very very hurt and does need love and connection from me to try and heal, but I need space to work on the wider issues. Really struggling to navigate the disparities here.

@MoonshineWashingLine and @Peach1886 sorry to hear you're both in the same situation. This must be so common! What is happening with you both? Are you trying to work through things?

Any decent man would give you the space you need. No pressure or timeline. The fact that you are scared to leave speaks volumes. I spent years in a relationship where l sacrificed myself in order to be part of a family unit. I now look at old photos and feel no happiness. Just a memory of me not really being there in an authentic way - a bit frozen, going through the motions

So sorry to hear that you feel you've lost those years when you felt frozen. I have definitely been going through the motions in terms of interactions with my husband. But with our child/when we're all together there's still happy times, our child is such a bundle of happiness and energy that I kind of feed off that. So I don't feel like I've completely lost all joy in life. That's why I'm so confused about whether I can/should just keep going with status quo, esp if my husband does manage to turn his behaviour around.

understand how difficult it is to see things clearly, to understand how bad it is, it takes time to unravel the years of toxic communication. Your counsellor will help but again it will take time to sort through your thoughts - be very very kind and gentle with yourself. Keep posting xx

Thank you for that, I am very confused about whether I'm making mountains out of molehills but that is after years of squashing my feelings down and carrying on as normal. You are all really helping me though!